Overrated / Underrated

Ulf Ottosson · January 7, 2008

Last few months

Underrated :

Dion Dublin - The man is our best player end of - whether it be Up front or at the back - we need to find a way to keep him at the club in the long term.

David Marshall - Leaving the Joe Lewis mess aside, he''s solved what was a real problem position for us last season. Plus he will only get better with time.

Overrated :

Big Dave - Currently his ability is being built up mainly because of the fact he''s not playing - there is a reason for that he''s not very good, if a striker can''t get a game in a team for can''t score toffee he must be rubbish.

Darel Russell - I''m not saying he''s awful but he''s not going to push us forward into a team pushing for promotion. There was a reason he left first time - he could''nt displace Holt or Mulyrne from the first team. Both players who get plenty of stick (wrongly!!) on this board

Gingerpele · January 8, 2008

how is big dave overrated?and i dont think dublin is mate, no one doubts his abitlity

sam · January 8, 2008

Underated: Doherty

Overated: Croft, Otsemobor, Fotheringham

Ivana_rubyatitz · January 8, 2008

[quote user="Ulf Ottosson"]

Darel Russell - I''m not saying he''s awful but he''s not going to push us forward into a team pushing for promotion. There was a reason he left first time - he could''nt displace Holt or Mulyrne from the first team. Both players who get plenty of stick (wrongly!!) on this board

[/quote]

Russell is not doing badly in my opinion. He may not be a Premiership star in the making but he is up to standard at this level. Don''t forget he was a regular at Stoke while they flirted with the playoffs throughout his time there. As for not being able to displace Holt when he left first time, well at that time Holt was awsome - he was at the height of his three lung days and was one of the best midfielders in the division. The criticism of Holt only came once we got up when his huff and puff style was shown up repeatedly by the more technically gifted Premiership stars. Russell would never have replaced Mulryne though as they are totally different sorts of player.

I think Darel has plenty to offer us at the moment.

nutty nigel · January 8, 2008

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

Duffman · January 8, 2008

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

What was the alternative ?

Burgandy · January 8, 2008

Overrated

- Huckerby

- Shackell

- Cureton

- Marshall (only young i know. he is good but still doesnt fill me with confidence)

- Ryan Jarvis, and Chris Martin (the fact they call themselves "professional footballers" mean they''re overrated!)

-J. Smith (when he was here. how he''s on chelseas books ill never know)

Underrated

- Croft

- Chadwick (unlucky with injuries however)

- Otsemobor (he is edworthys long awaited replacement imo)

- Gilks? (hasnt had a chance to show what hes made of.)

nutty nigel · January 8, 2008

[quote user="Duffman"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

What was the alternative ?

[/quote]

Bertrand LB, Camara LCB, Dublin CF.

2-0 up in 5 mins... game over... maybe [;)]

Seriously though Duffman, playing Dublin centre back was my biggest gripe at Grant. We always seemed to go 2-0 down and then he would stick him up front to try and salvage something from the game. It''s like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted. Dublin is still the best centre forward at the club and we have to score goals and preferably score first to win games.

ZLF · January 8, 2008

Over-rated

2007-2008 season dublin

Croft

Cureton

Under-rated

None

Syteanric · January 8, 2008

Overated: - David Marshall, if he was in the glare of the premiership he''d be a gibbering wreck by now for the panning the press would give him every week... Look at Paul Robinson as an example of what consistent Howlers can do for confidence.

Underrated: Fozzy! we are a worse team without him! he knows how to move and always plays a simple ball to keep play going.. theres a saying in football that your teams best player is the one u dont miss till he''s injured... our form without Fozzy compared to our form with backs that up.

jas :)

a1canary · January 8, 2008

[quote user="Ulf Ottosson"]

Last few months

Underrated :

... we need to find a way to keep him at the club in the long term.

[/quote]I take it you mean in a coaching capacity... Otherwise he''ll be playing into his 50s!

BlyBlyBabes · January 8, 2008

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

NCFC_Shaun · January 8, 2008

[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]

Over-rated

2007-2008 season dublin

[/quote]

yeh allright then... dublin is certainly not over rated..

nutty nigel · January 8, 2008

[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

[/quote]

I already explained why to Duffman and it had nothing to do with Doherty.

Have the papers arrived yet, Fawlty? [D]

Gingerpele · January 8, 2008

can u tell me why dublin is underrated? i have never heard anyone say anything bad about him, he is not overrated, he is rated just right

AND WHO OVERRATES RYAN JARVIS?

Stephen Hawkings Football Boots · January 8, 2008

Overrated:

Cureton, Martin

Underrated:

Otsemobor

I never have liked Chris Martin, I felt everyone was getting carried away when he came into the first team. And for him to be linked with Man Utd was a joke

Bovril · January 8, 2008

a good topic this one, and im basing this like the post says ''over the past few months'' and not years gone by

Over-rated:

Cureton - without a doubt for me, yes he works hard and he wants to play for this club but he simply hasnt got the quality im afraid, this year he has really struggled with some pretty basic scoring chances, which if thats what you mainly get paid for in your career is pretty shocking im afraid

Shackell - though many people are now starting to see this one.. he seemed to play well with taylor and likes to get stuck in but some of his passing and decision making is average at times, he''s not our worse player (far from it) but too over-hyped for m

Pattison - controversial this one, but everytime ive seen a game that he''s been playin in he''s had a shocker!, clearly he had a good game at palace by all accounts but is he really as marvellous as roeder rants on about?! time will tell i guess

Under-rated:

Im struggling with this one, as we tend to be optimists as fans and it doesnt take a lot for us to appreciate a halve decent player but..

Fotheringham - it seems when we play without him, were a much poorer side.. mainly passing wise, so perhaps he gets a nod

Mo Camara - yes he mad that glaring mistake at colchester, but other then that he''s been rock solid imo and has been great cover for drury.. its normally the full-backs that are under-appreciated, so he''s a mention for mo.

The Fans - to get 24,000+.. practically sell-outs when your team is playing poor/average compared with expectations, and your lingering near the bottom of the league deserves huge credit, how many other teams would do that in this league?

BigFish · January 8, 2008

[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

[/quote]

Remind us all of the stats on that again? I thought Nutty N had that the other way round.

1st Wizard · January 8, 2008

Over rated - JAMIE CURETON

CHRIS MARTIN

JAMIE CURETON

DAVID STRIHAVKA

JAMIE CURETON

Under rated - Russell

Fozzie

Doherty

nutty nigel · January 8, 2008

[quote user="BigFish"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

[/quote]

Remind us all of the stats on that again? I thought Nutty N had that the other way round.

[/quote]

You won''t get an answer BigFish, I expect he''s enjoying breakfast on the Orient Express [;)]

D''oliveira made a hundred [D]

Anyway, if I may answer for ''The Major'' :-

15 games with Doc at centre back we got 18 points and conceded 15 goals.

11 games without Doc at centre back we got 10 points and conceded 19 goals.

Getting back to my original point, does anyone else agree we would probably have won on Saturday if Dublin had started at centre forward? Surely he would have taken some of those chances.

BlyBlyBabes · January 8, 2008

[quote user="BigFish"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

[/quote]

Remind us all of the stats on that again? I thought Nutty N had that the other way round.

[/quote]

Happy to.

For those who could stay until the end of the argument, Nigel''s stats showed that so far this season:

(a) we have conceded less goals with Doherty and Shackell in central defence (1.11 to 1.28), but

(b) we have secured more points with Taylor and Shackell in defence (1.42 to 1.22)

I say Nigel''s stats because his defence of Doherty was that way inclined - and quite frankly I didn''t have the time to cross-check them.

This ''debate'' related to my assertion that there was a body of respected opinion that Shackell seemed to play better with Taylor alongside him than Doherty.

My simple point in the whole matter is that it is effective football (i.e points/match earned) which counts in the end. Not how many goals we concede or how many goals we score.

So within the narrow confines of this very limited analysis, it is clear that we could well be better off with a central defensive pairing of Taylor + Shackell rather than Doherty + Shackell.

We all know that Nigel has been using his stats for some time now on this board to show that Doherty is our best central defender.

Unfortunately he chose the wrong criterion - it''s points/match which counts rather than goals conceded/match.

I just state the facts and abjure triumphalism!!!!!!! [:D][:D][:D]

Who said hypocrite. Own up!!

OTBC

Mister Chops · January 8, 2008

[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="BigFish"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Overated - Dublin in defence!

Underated - Dublin up front!!

Don''t do it again Glen............. please!

[/quote]

Why? So there''ll be more space for Doherty?

And we get more points/match without Doherty.

Ineffable.

OTBC

[/quote]

Remind us all of the stats on that again? I thought Nutty N had that the other way round.

[/quote]

Happy to.

For those who could stay until the end of the argument, Nigel''s stats showed that so far this season:

(a) we have conceded less goals with Doherty and Shackell in central defence (1.11 to 1.28), but

(b) we have secured more points with Taylor and Shackell in defence (1.42 to 1.22)

[/quote]

Um - which has precisely what with Dublin''s record at the back?

nutty nigel · January 8, 2008