Here we go again .

[Shack Attack 0]

"If qualification is achieved, Crouch is adamant that England have to do better than their usual quarter-final placing. "We all believe we have the ability to go on and win it. That has to be the target," he said."

http://sport.independent.co.uk/football/comment/article3177048.ece

Now you would think that after the way our golden shower, sorry generation, have stumbled through qualifying that they would give this sort of stuff a rest for a while wouldn''t you? Especially as there''s still a small possibility that we might not qualify at all.

Here''s to seven long months of exclusive interviews telling us how it''s our destiny to win the whole damn thing regardless of the obvious flaws in our team. It''s almost enough to make me want Croatia to win......almost.

[Ivana_rubyatitz 6]

Ability is not the issue with England, it is more a question of how much commitment, desire, passion, guts and even basic interest they can generate.  Sounds a bit like another team closer to home (mind you the ability of one or two of them is also in question I suppose).

[Robert N. LiM 4,238]

I absolutely want Croatia to win. The best thing that could happen to that overrated, arrogant, complacent, overpaid bunch of idiots is that they should have to face up to how decidedly average they are. From Brian Barwick to Steve McClaren''s dental hygenist, they are an utter disgrace and I really hope they get what they deserve on Wednesday.

[San Miguel 0]

For me its all about attitude - we English are used to losing, used to missing penalties, and used to underacheving

look at Brazil - i know their ability counts for a lot but if you ever hear an interview with one of the players they are absolutely adamant they will win every single game, and they do. ok most think its Jesus that will make them win, but still.

its the same with the Germans - they see a penalty as an easy way to score, they know they will score, and they do score. We see a penalty and think ''oh no what if I miss, what will the press say, etc etc..''

basically what i''m saying is a bit of optimism is a good thing, and lets hope England make it through Wednesday and we do get 7 long months of anticipation. whatever you can say about England we never make it boring, and I''m hoping to be there is Switzerland and Austria cheering us on

COME ON ENGLAND

 

[blahblahblah 2]

They can give all the interviews they like about winning the thing, it will never happen.  The fact is that the world, the space-time continuum even, needs England to be beaten in the quarter-finals of every major tournament, in the same way that it needs gravity to work, rain to fall, the local dogs to crap in my garden, James Blunt to be number 1 everywhere despite nobody actually liking his music, and English batting collapses to happen with soul-destroying monotony.  It''s just the way things are, and you''ll never beat that strength of narrative.  Not even with the best paid players in the world.  That strength of narrative is the reason that Russia lost to Greece in the last minute, and it''s the reason that we''ll be beaten by Germany on penalties in the quarter-finals as usual.

[bobfleck 0]

[quote user="Pboro_Canary"]Ability is not the issue with England, it is more a question of how much commitment, desire, passion, guts and even basic interest they can generate.  Sounds a bit like another team closer to home (mind you the ability of one or two of them is also in question I suppose).[/quote]

 

I think it''s all about ability, or lack of it, personally. Watching us try to defend a one goal lead in Russia was pitiful - totally bereft of cool heads, incapable of keeping possession, embracing panicky, lump-it agricultural garbage the minute we were put under pressure. Part of me would truly not be that bothered if we stuff it up on Wednesday, and I think we just might.

[Inch High aka Inchy.. 405]

I think we the fans are at fault because we think that they are better than they really are. On the world stage at the moment the current England squad is probably slightly below the average. England expects and all that from a distincly average squad of players.

[Old Shuck 183]

I agree! We still need a result to qualify and Crouch is already saying how we can win it, have got the players to win it, how confident etc etc.

I cannot remember a event, Euro or World Cup-where we haven''t had all  this before it started, however, like Christmas, the confidence and the "we can win its!" seems to come earlier every tournament.

What is also irritating is that the press, who have remorselessly and relentlessly crucified England ever since the 0-0 home draw with Macedonia will jump on the same bandwagon and have them lifting he trophy in glory before they even take off to get there-if we qualify-then, when we don''t, off they''ll go, another tabloid crusade into "whats wrong" with English football, accompanied by the likes of boring old soaks like Jimmy Greaves saying how it was "...with Alf..." and how its all the fault of the this, that, and the other, not like in "their day".

I am waiting for the squad to come out with all the usual other stuff like "morale in the squad has never been higher" and "this has to be the best England squad to enter a major tournament", as well as the claims and the sensationalism, like how Owen will be top scorer, Rooney will take Austria by storm and that Lampard is ready to  hit the goals that will "winnit"!

I think it really would be best if we didn''t qualify. Then a lot of people can take a long, hard look at themselves, the set up, attitudes, expectation and the whole culture of our international game, and why Scotland have players who seem 100 times more committed and supporters that put the very great majority of England fans to shame.

Anyway, given a choice between Norwich winning on Saturday and England qualifying, give me a Norwich win every time. Hell, give me a choice between us seeing off Coventry and England winning Euro 2008 then sorry, but its three points for Norwich for me every time!

Like the old time "magic" of FA Cup final day, something seems to have been lost from England and England games and I don''t think it''ll ever come back again.

[InLambertWeTrust! 0]

[quote user="San Miguel"]

 

ok most think its Jesus that will make them win, but still.

[/quote]

Are you telling me Jesus aint real? [:)]

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote user="C.T "][quote user="San Miguel"]

 

ok most think its Jesus that will make them win, but still.

[/quote]

Are you telling me Jesus aint real? [:)]

[/quote]That can''t be true, who delivers the christmas presents if Jesus doesn''t exist ?  At least that''s the name I heard when I was a kid, as whoever it was leaving a stocking in my room fell over last years'' toys...

[Ivana_rubyatitz 6]

[quote user="bobfleck"]

[quote user="Pboro_Canary"]Ability is not the issue with England, it is more a question of how much commitment, desire, passion, guts and even basic interest they can generate.  Sounds a bit like another team closer to home (mind you the ability of one or two of them is also in question I suppose).[/quote]

 

I think it''s all about ability, or lack of it, personally. Watching us try to defend a one goal lead in Russia was pitiful - totally bereft of cool heads, incapable of keeping possession, embracing panicky, lump-it agricultural garbage the minute we were put under pressure. Part of me would truly not be that bothered if we stuff it up on Wednesday, and I think we just might.

[/quote]

I take your point but frankly the likes of Gerrard, Owen, Lampard, Terry et al do have enough ability to get into pretty much any international side and perform to a consistently high standard at club level.  The poor tactics you refer to in Russia were as much down to a nugget of a manager and poor coaching it seems to me.  Interesting question is why players with the experience and talent we had on the pitch that day couldnt see what was happening and organise themselves to deal with the situation as well.

Guess we will have to agree to disagree.

[norwichsfinest 0]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]I absolutely want Croatia to win. The best thing that could happen to that overrated, arrogant, complacent, overpaid bunch of idiots is that they should have to face up to how decidedly average they are. From Brian Barwick to Steve McClaren''s dental hygenist, they are an utter disgrace and I really hope they get what they deserve on Wednesday.[/quote]

You are a moron. I do not want McClaren in the job as much as the next man. But for once lady luck has shined on us & having gone from a potential disaster of England not qualifying for a major tournament for the first time since 1994, we are now in control of our own fate. All the idiotic doomsayers like yourself do nothing more than to help convince everyone that we will fail to do so. I am going tomorrow & I will right behind the boys whether it''s the starting 11 I want or not, why? BECAUSE I AM ENGLISH & PROUD OF IT................. Also because it will really ruin quite my planned days on the lash watching England next summer in Austria!!!!!

So for once, doomsayers et all, shut up & get behind the bloody team!!!!!

[Indy_Bones 441]

[quote user="norwichsfinest"]So for once, doomsayers et all, shut up & get behind the bloody team!!!!![/quote]

We would - if we had a TEAM.

The sad fact is that we don''t, we have a bunch of overpaid, overhyped INDIVIDUALS, who regularly fail to meet the standards they set whilst playing on a weekly basis for their clubs.

Playing for your country should be one of, if not THE proudest moment a player can ever have, and instead we have this current shower who seem to care nothing about this, and instead are thinking far more about how to spend this weeks ridiculous salary, "Hmm, should I go for the new Mercedes and a £20k suit, or buy another house..." Life must be tough.

Frankly, I''d drop the majority of the current side, because their commitment, and often ability whilst playing for their Country is laughable.

Agreed that McLaren is a pretty poor coach who regularly selects half this crap, even after they''ve proven they can''t play together (E.g Lampard and Gerrard).

You have to feel sorry for the likes of Agbonlahor and Osman, who despite putting in 100% commitment, with goalscoring and skillful displays for their club sides, are being constantly overlooked in favour of the same group of players who constantly fail to perform to the required standard. Rooney has been garbage for England for years, Owen has lost a large chunk of his pace and simply sits near their area (much like Earnie did for us) demanding the ball to score but offering nothing back to the team, Lampard and Gerrard can''t play together, A.Cole and Robinson have been on shocking form, and even the likes of Emile Heskey have been getting called up...

Clueless management, fat-cat players, and disgraceful displays of favouritism despite recent form, are ruining our national team. You only have to look at our (NCFC) current performances, and we''ve got people organising protests clamouring to remove the people at the top, yet it seems that in the case of England, we''re happy to ignore all that, and will blithely go around before every major tournament, waving our flags, drinking copious amounts of lager, punching foreign supporters, and proclaiming that "This is our tournament", before promptly getting booted out at the quarters or earlier, and then rambling on about 1966.

In many ways our National Side is in far worse condition than we are as a club, because at least we can argue the fact that we don''t have a bunch of top players simply available to pick as we like, whereas England do, so what''s their excuse???

Personally, I''d dump McLaren, drop virtually the entire standard England first XI:

Robinson, A.Cole, Terry, Ferdinand, Beckham, Lampard, Gerrard, J.Cole, Owen, Rooney

as the vast majority of them simply aren''t playing well enough to justify their place.

Instead we''ll go for an up-and-coming team of people who want to play :

Green, Bridge, Campbell, Carragher, Richards, Bentley, Osman, Barry, M.Taylor, Agbonlahor, Crouch.

Less individual talent maybe, but the difference we''d likely to see in attitude would be incredible.

Just like many fans of ours are saying at the minute "Show some fight and commitment on the pitch, and we''ll give you our support from the terraces", well this should apply to the England side as well.

Rant over...

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="norwichsfinest"]

You are a moron. I do not want McClaren in the job as much as the next man. But for once lady luck has shined on us & having gone from a potential disaster of England not qualifying for a major tournament for the first time since 1994, we are now in control of our own fate. All the idiotic doomsayers like yourself do nothing more than to help convince everyone that we will fail to do so. I am going tomorrow & I will right behind the boys whether it''s the starting 11 I want or not, why? BECAUSE I AM ENGLISH & PROUD OF IT................. Also because it will really ruin quite my planned days on the lash watching England next summer in Austria!!!!!

So for once, doomsayers et all, shut up & get behind the bloody team!!!!!

[/quote]

I''m afraid Sir that it is you who are the moron.

For believing that it would be a potential disaster for us not to qualify when it might just trigger the sort of questions that need to be asked of the FA.

For believing that lady luck is normally against us. How many more times are we going to blame bad referees, poor management decisions, cheating foreigners, bad pitches and bad luck before we finally admit that we''re just not very good.

For believing that hoary old chestnut that anybody who is even vaguely critical of our national team has no pride in their country.

But most of all, for allowing this over rated, over paid, over hyped bunch of tossers to ruin your summer next year. Stay at home, invite your mates round, get a few beers in and watch it on the TV. You never know, if England fail to qualify there might actually be some decent football played rather than the one-dimensional, hoof it to Crouchy garbage that our lot churn out.

[Show Me What You Gooot! 0]

I say form a Championship-based England team and give them the chance to qualify for the 2010 World Cup.

[whoareyou? 0]

[quote user="Pboro_Canary"][quote user="bobfleck"]

[quote user="Pboro_Canary"]Ability is not the issue with England, it is more a question of how much commitment, desire, passion, guts and even basic interest they can generate.  Sounds a bit like another team closer to home (mind you the ability of one or two of them is also in question I suppose).[/quote]

 

I think it''s all about ability, or lack of it, personally. Watching us try to defend a one goal lead in Russia was pitiful - totally bereft of cool heads, incapable of keeping possession, embracing panicky, lump-it agricultural garbage the minute we were put under pressure. Part of me would truly not be that bothered if we stuff it up on Wednesday, and I think we just might.

[/quote]

I take your point but frankly the likes of Gerrard, Owen, Lampard, Terry et al do have enough ability to get into pretty much any international side and perform to a consistently high standard at club level.  The poor tactics you refer to in Russia were as much down to a nugget of a manager and poor coaching it seems to me.  Interesting question is why players with the experience and talent we had on the pitch that day couldnt see what was happening and organise themselves to deal with the situation as well.

Guess we will have to agree to disagree.

[/quote]

I take issue with the highlighted point. I doubt any of them are good enough to get into most top european international sides bar perhaps Rooney and Owen. Gerrard, Lampard, Terry, Cole etc seem more interested in what watches they are wearing or what cars they are driving than sweating their guts out for their national side.

[Shack Attack 0]

[quote user="paint_me_yellow"]

I say form a Championship-based England team and give them the chance to qualify for the 2010 World Cup.

[/quote]

They wouldn''t qualify, simple as that.

It''s not the lack of commitment that is the problem with the England team, it''s the lack of intelligence and technical ability. The style of football used by the vast majority of teams in The Premiership is simply not compatible with international football, picking Championship players would just highlight that problem even further.

[Syteanric 1]

[quote user="paint_me_yellow"]

I say form a Championship-based England team and give them the chance to qualify for the 2010 World Cup.

[/quote]

Republic of Ireland under Jack Charlton were "england B" Townsend, Cascarino, and one or 2 others.. about as Irish as Pele

jas :)

[NCFC_Shaun 0]

if england loose. its likely maclaren will be sacked and we may have a chance to get mourinho ... allthough i would much rather us get through of course ...

[Robert N. LiM 4,238]

[quote user="norwichsfinest"]

[quote user="Robert N. LiM"]I absolutely want Croatia to win. The best thing that could happen to that overrated, arrogant, complacent, overpaid bunch of idiots is that they should have to face up to how decidedly average they are. From Brian Barwick to Steve McClaren''s dental hygenist, they are an utter disgrace and I really hope they get what they deserve on Wednesday.[/quote]

You are a moron. I do not want McClaren in the job as much as the next man. But for once lady luck has shined on us & having gone from a potential disaster of England not qualifying for a major tournament for the first time since 1994, we are now in control of our own fate. All the idiotic doomsayers like yourself do nothing more than to help convince everyone that we will fail to do so. I am going tomorrow & I will right behind the boys whether it''s the starting 11 I want or not, why? BECAUSE I AM ENGLISH & PROUD OF IT................. Also because it will really ruin quite my planned days on the lash watching England next summer in Austria!!!!!

So for once, doomsayers et all, shut up & get behind the bloody team!!!!!

[/quote]

Thanks. I disagree with you. That doesn''t make me, or you, a moron.

I would reply to your post but Indy Bones and Shack Attack have already done so eloquently. All I will say is that I am English and proud of some aspects of being English. I am not proud of our football team, quite the opposite, and feel that England not qualifying would be by far the best outcome if we want a national side that''s ever going to look like winning something.

I hope you enjoy the game.