lets not get bitter........

[Dean Coneys boots 1,398]

Whilst our current plight is terrible and the board need to answer some very difficult questions...I feel the escalating vitriol shown to Delia is unfair and inkind. I have no doubt she has the best interests of the club at heart- regardless of what mistakes she has made. She may not have what is required to move us on...and that again is a seperate issue and may need tackling. But all this can be done without resorting to petty insults and unpleasantness. Yes we are angry and upset...but let us rise to the challenge of Kipling and ''keep our heads (and manners) when all around are losing theirs) ...please?

[dr livingstone 0]

the board deserve all the stick they get. they are incompetent they admit they have made mistakes this is not good enough.

when we won the championship and when we were in the prem she couldnt keep of the tv and radio. where is she hiding now.

come on delia lets be havin you.

[First Wizard 0]

No, lets!

I care too much for my club to let that damn pastry cook off the hook now..........lets drive her out[:@].

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="vicar in green and yellow"]Whilst our current plight is terrible and the board need to answer some very difficult questions...I feel the escalating vitriol shown to Delia is unfair and inkind. I have no doubt she has the best interests of the club at heart- regardless of what mistakes she has made. She may not have what is required to move us on...and that again is a seperate issue and may need tackling. But all this can be done without resorting to petty insults and unpleasantness. Yes we are angry and upset...but let us rise to the challenge of Kipling and ''keep our heads (and manners) when all around are losing theirs) ...please?[/quote]

All very laudable....but some of us have been where the growing majority now are for a very long time....and the time for pussy footing has passed.

I fear the fact that Smith being "a woman" brings about all manner of "gentlemanly" thoughts when it comes to dissent...but she is lurking in a male dominated world and must therefore accept what is coming her way....

Save your sermons for Sundays...or reading the last rites while we watch the club die on it''s feet....thanks to this "woman".........

[charlies dad 0]

With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.

[Rush 0]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

Very true................and what if Glen gets rid of all the dead wood and builds his own team for the future and we have to endure relegation first before things look up? How would we judge that?? Time is needed and we have indeed wasted 3 years under this board. Im in full support of Glen Roeder, but Im very nervous about the board and their support for this club the last few years............

OTBC

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

 

[lucky green trainers 0]

worthy sentiments.i''ll admit to being a board critic - because i want what''s best for NCFC.  i don''t enjoy keeping the pressure on them, but i see this as serving the best interest of NCFC as a fan.  ever since she announced the prudence with ambition club policy, i''ve been at odds with it.  delia is obviously the figurehead, and as such, is a focus.  however, i agree that for the most part - making it personal with unfair ridecule is taking it too far.  not all think like this though.certainly, football is an emotive subject - the preston chairman took the hint and resigned earlier this season, after coming back to his car post-match, and finding it covered in spit.hopefully, some better players will come in and roeder will help us climb off the bottom - i''d rather much just support than object.

[alex_ncfc 648]

Why do we keep getting posts of this ilk about being "unfair to Delia" and "unkind" and "ungrateful"? You want to know why?

Because she''s a bloody woman!

Just let it go, get a grip, and realise that she is doing our club no favours and no good whatsoever.

[Tumbleweed 106]

Tensions will obviously run high, but I am still not convinced by anybody that a simple change from Delia Smith to anybody else would necessarily be any better. I fully agree that mistakes have been made and investment on the pitch seems to have suffered. However I just wonder whether we would be any better off if more money had been made available- would we have had just more expensive donkeys or just more of them in number?

The key mistakes commonly recited are (i) holding on to NW for too long, (ii) putting PG in place and (iii) allegedley not making all funds available to the manager.

I think on (i) they are guilty as charged but lets not also forget that in the fickle world of football loyalty is often reported as sadly lacking and trusting a man who got us into the paly offs for the only time and promoted for the first time in 9 years was probably at least capable of being defended. So there are two sides to this one.

On item (ii) again, guilty as charged. But apparently PG was highly regarded at WH, was the only one who had a plan and no-one cand eny that when he took over he demonstrated a passion. So you see there is also a reason why one could understand why they might see that as a risk worth taking. It failed but we don''t know who else was a credible possibility.

On item (iii) I am not so sure. I don''t know what the budgets have been and I don''t know how much of the player sales proceeds have been eaten up in NW termination costs, agents fees, signing on fees etc. Then there are the salaries. So I don''t have the facts to judge.

However lets hypothesise that double the money had been made available to PG than he was actually given. Would this have made any difference? I would wager probbaly not. The problems were the motivation of the team, the lack of a first team coach after Hunter left and lack of tactical nous. We could have had several multiples of Peter Thornes or Andy Hughes or Carl Robinsons or John Hartsons or Kevin Lisbies etc none of whom would have made us any better. Or we could have had one or two highly paid "names" just here for the money. Signings must be intelligently made, not just signings for the sake of signings.

Let us also not forget that earnshaw, francis,svensson  and etuhu all left of their own volition (maybe exacerbated by how they got on with their managers here) and safri got sacked and seemed to fall foul of PG. Little the Board could have done in any of this.

No, my solution is slightly different:

(1) get a strong football man in as CEO who can give direction to the Board when required, consider or even demand the financing required and ensure its spent in the right way, spending money on players not hotels.

(2) pressurise DS and MWJ to dilute their shareholding and write into the constitution that no one can have more than 24.9% of the sahres so that absolute power is not vested in single hands

There is no guarantee the Turners will put in any money at all. I wouldn''t sanction any such move against the current owners without some guarantee of additional funding or a benefactor coming in (and one who will not asset strip and move the club to the ring road somewhere).

But just because my solution is different doesn''t mean that those who believe their own solution is right should not do what they feel they want to do. I would just suggest that there must be some contingency plan based on hard facts and intentions should they get their wish.

Bottom line: I just want us to survive this season and then start to move ahead at last.

 

 

 

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

[/quote]

With Hindsight, as our Board reguarly do, it is obvious the Board are the ones behind the problems at city.  Many times Worthington brought just how financially strangled he was to the fore.  We just ignored it due to Delia helping save the club many years back.  Even the ''winning lottery ticket'' Darren Huckerby signing was managed not with the boards help but in spite of them.  Unfortunatly if you do not live within 10 miles of the city your investment is not welcome.

Time for the Turners to show their hand - should this be why they got onboard, or us to actively seek new investment.  Like most other clubs.

As for poor out of his depth Peter Grant - his inexperience, along with minimal funds has destroyed our squad in a way even Hamilton couldnt manage.  And he didnt even apply for the job... unbeleivable.

[As my login causes problems [ :o) ] 0]

Tumbleweed I don''t think when we''ve posted in the same thread before that we have agreed, but Today I think you are spot on.

I have long advocated that the major weaknesses in the current regime are exactly what was criticised at the end of the Chase regime (too much power in one place) exacerbated by a naivity in running a football club that was made worse by overpromoting an inexperienced solicitor.

Clearly we need an experienced footballing CEO more than we ever needed an experienced football manager, and that is consistently overlooked.  We could run through his mistakes or his ineffectualness on various points, but that has been done before, now we need a quick fix, and that means replacement. He has to go and a new experience man/woman brought in.

On investment why should we want to remove Delia and MWJs money?  If they will only leave their investment whilst they are in control (which I suspect might be the case having talked to MWJ in the past) then we may have to face them "taking their ball" home with them.  Otherwise what we need is new investment alongside them and a fair and democratic Board.

At the moment with their dominance we have two puppet directors that they have appointed in Munby and Doncaster.  That these two hold two key posts is even worse.  To argue that everyone has only one vote is so ridiculous in this circumstance that I fail to understand why they even say it, let alone why anyone would believe it.  We have three minority directors who have invested in the Turners and Foulger.  I fear they have been nicely sidelined to the extent that they like Skipper before them will eventually just sell on to the next in line.

It is this desire to keep control that bothers me far more than the peception of lack of investment. As the two go hand in hand it is the grip of control that prevents us getting the investment we want, and dare I say need.

 

[Mister Chops 7]

[quote user="vicar in green and yellow"]Whilst our current plight is terrible and the board need to answer some very difficult questions...I feel the escalating vitriol shown to Delia is unfair and inkind. I have no doubt she has the best interests of the club at heart- regardless of what mistakes she has made. She may not have what is required to move us on...and that again is a seperate issue and may need tackling. But all this can be done without resorting to petty insults and unpleasantness. Yes we are angry and upset...but let us rise to the challenge of Kipling and ''keep our heads (and manners) when all around are losing theirs) ...please?[/quote]Smith has made herself the self-styled figurehead of the club, for better or worse.  It was her who blundered onto the pitch after a glass of wine too many and made the infamous speech which is all a lot of fans of other teams across the country now remember us for.  When things were going well, she was like a pig in the smelly stuff.Now, I understand from the AGM, fans who go to the away games and get the coach from the ground have to use an overflow car park because the club car park is reserved for patrons of her restaurant.  IF you want a metaphor for what she has done for the club, and for what the club has done for her, keep this in mind.This is a Football Club!  Always, and especially at a time like this, when we''re fighting for everything, scrapping for even a point against other poor sides, the board should serve the club.  With Smith''s regime, the club is serving the board, and this is just not acceptable.

[HappyhammerAndy 0]

Tumbleweed - Grant was very respected at West Ham but that was as a coach and a number two to Pardew. His track record for being in charge was an unknown quantity. Your people must have seen something in him that they liked? Perhaps, it was the size of the salary that they agreed with him? Good luck to you with the relegation fight.

[charlies dad 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

It has nothing to do with scapegoats. That would imply that nothing is wrong. Quite clearly that is nonsense. something is very wrong indded. As wrong as it can be. I never beleived that saccking worthington was the be all and end all, the pontification before it finally happened proved this to be correct. and who appointed the totally hapless Grant?  The blame has to be shared amongst the board (mostly), the managers (partly) and the players (partly). I for one am not prepared to let the people briinging Norwich City football Club to its knees off the hook.  

 

[/quote]

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="charlies dad"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

It has nothing to do with scapegoats. That would imply that nothing is wrong. Quite clearly that is nonsense. something is very wrong indded. As wrong as it can be. I never beleived that saccking worthington was the be all and end all, the pontification before it finally happened proved this to be correct. and who appointed the totally hapless Grant?  The blame has to be shared amongst the board (mostly), the managers (partly) and the players (partly). I for one am not prepared to let the people briinging Norwich City football Club to its knees off the hook.  

 

[/quote][/quote]

So just to clarify this, what''s important to you right now is that we don''t let the people responsible for our position off the hook?

 

[BlyBlyBabes 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

[/quote]

Out goes Chase, in comes Smith.

OTBC

 

[nutty nigel 7,509]

[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

[/quote]

Out goes Chase, in comes Smith.

OTBC

 

[/quote]

Exactly.

 

[charlies dad 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="charlies dad"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

 

 

 

So you do admit they are responsible? Thats a start.

 

It has nothing to do with scapegoats. That would imply that nothing is wrong. Quite clearly that is nonsense. something is very wrong indded. As wrong as it can be. I never beleived that saccking worthington was the be all and end all, the pontification before it finally happened proved this to be correct. and who appointed the totally hapless Grant?  The blame has to be shared amongst the board (mostly), the managers (partly) and the players (partly). I for one am not prepared to let the people briinging Norwich City football Club to its knees off the hook.  

 

[/quote][/quote]

So just to clarify this, what''s important to you right now is that we don''t let the people responsible for our position off the hook?

 

[/quote]

[charlies dad 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="charlies dad"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

[quote user="charlies dad"]With the mounting anger surrounding the city, and it is there, you can feel it. Vitriol is unavoidable. This situation is completely untenable, and has been allowed to stagnate for 3 years now. Football is a passionate subject, and passions are aroused, particularly when one loves ones football club as the people of Norfolk and beyond do, with an almost irrational fervour. Saturday hurt, as did tuesday as do the dozens of other similar bad days at the office we have endured. Nothing is being done to arrest the decline, the board and a few other supporters appear to prefer infighting to addressing the problems. fiHuman nature dictates  that this will only antagonise already inflamed opinion, and the longer the situation worsens, the more vitriolic things will get. It goes hand in hand with a feeling of helplessness. If you think its bad now, wait until May.[/quote]

After all the other times have we got the scapegoat right this time CD? Why should I trust the mass hysteria on here? The baying mob have been wrong so many times in the past, how do we know they''ve got it right this time? Is the grass always greener? Out goes Holt in comes Hughes. Out goes Worthy in comes Grant. Out goes Etuhu in comes Russell. Out goes Doherty? Out goes Smith?? What comes in and what makes you believe it''s better?

 

 

 

So you do admit they are responsible? Thats a start.

 

It has nothing to do with scapegoats. That would imply that nothing is wrong. Quite clearly that is nonsense. something is very wrong indded. As wrong as it can be. I never beleived that saccking worthington was the be all and end all, the pontification before it finally happened proved this to be correct. and who appointed the totally hapless Grant?  The blame has to be shared amongst the board (mostly), the managers (partly) and the players (partly). I for one am not prepared to let the people briinging Norwich City football Club to its knees off the hook.  

 

[/quote][/quote]

So just to clarify this, what''s important to you right now is that we don''t let the people responsible for our position off the hook?

 

[/quote]