The Investment Question

[The Voice of the Thorpe Area 0]

Forget the pro''s and con''s for foriegn investors, we all know what they are, the question alot are asking is ''why haven''t we got one?''

Well, No.1, how many Championship sides do? Leicester and QPR. QPR because they are a London based side, Leicester, well I''m not too sure about that one, and from what I''ve heard, there''s a growing concern there about Milan. But anyway...

As Doomcaster has stated, for once correctly, is that Championship investments are generally unappealing, because we are not in the rich land of the Chelski''s. It''s a struggle to get up there, and one that money doesn''t always guarantee success.

And to those who claim that there are investors out there, but Delia is stopping them. Well, she herself has said that she hashad no contact from anyone, foriegn or closer to home. Cullum, the one visable candidate has said he has no interest.

Some ask about Pearson, ex-Hull chairman, and why he''s chosen Huddersfield to target over us. Maybe something to do that Huddersfield is alot closer to his home and family than Norwich.

So please, give it a rest about this investment lark. It''s all what if''s and never will be''s. Wait until something REAL actually happens regarding investment, and until then, support the side!

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]And to those who claim that there are investors out there, but Delia is

stopping them. Well, she herself has said that she hashad no contact

from anyone, foriegn or closer to home. Cullum, the one visable

candidate has said he has no interest.[/quote]Thoroughly agree with your argument Thorpe, not only that, but I''d be willing to bet that Peter Cullum would have no interest while his name remains in the public domain.It''s on bet365 at 11/2 nutty.

[kdncfc 0]

I would have thought a championship club would have been a better investment than a prem club, it would be a bit like buying a house in need of renovation but making 30 grand profit after investing a few quid and a bit of hard graft, a prem club would command a lot more money to buy in the first place leaving less margin for profit. If a championship club gets promoted the turnover increases by 40 million overnight, enough to invest 30 million in players and recover your initial outlay.

[canary cherub 1]

[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote]And to those who claim that there are investors out there, but Delia is stopping them. Well, she herself has said that she hashad no contact from anyone, foriegn or closer to home. Cullum, the one visable candidate has said he has no interest.[/quote]

Thoroughly agree with your argument Thorpe, not only that, but I''d be willing to bet that Peter Cullum would have no interest while his name remains in the public domain.

It''s on bet365 at 11/2 nutty.
[/quote]

This relates to the point Keith Roads was trying to make at the AGM, ie. that claiming to be open to outside investment whilst simultaneously increasing their majority shareholding sends out a decidedly mixed message, to say the very least.

 

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]This relates to the point Keith Roads was trying to make at the AGM,

ie. that claiming to be open to outside investment whilst

simultaneously increasing their majority shareholding sends out

a decidedly mixed message, to say the very least.[/quote]That''s a fair point meg, I guess the ideal situation would be that no-one had more than 50%, as Watling requested.  Weren''t they converting loans to shares though, and isn''t there a tax benefit to the club in doing that ?

[Arthur Whittle 0]

Peason has been looking for months to invest in a championship club and approached a few but was tuned down. Hes only now trying his luck with hudds because the fans have asked him to try to buy the chairman out but he is refusing to sell, much to the disapoitment of the locals. Its got nothing to do with familys.

[Cluck 0]

Much to Smith''s annoyance the cat is well and truly out of the bag regarding her game plan....and she knows she can never put it back.

It''s purely a question of time now....

[GMF 736]

[quote user="mystic megson"]

[quote user="blahblahblah"][quote]And to those who claim that there are investors out there, but Delia is stopping them. Well, she herself has said that she hashad no contact from anyone, foriegn or closer to home. Cullum, the one visable candidate has said he has no interest.[/quote]

Thoroughly agree with your argument Thorpe, not only that, but I''d be willing to bet that Peter Cullum would have no interest while his name remains in the public domain.

It''s on bet365 at 11/2 nutty.
[/quote]

This relates to the point Keith Roads was trying to make at the AGM, ie. that claiming to be open to outside investment whilst simultaneously increasing their majority shareholding sends out a decidedly mixed message, to say the very least.

 

[/quote]

He was, of course, only partly right. There''s absolutely nothing stopping them from increasing the Authorised Share Captial by more than the 33,000 shares they did to say 1,000,000 or even 2,000,000, thereby giving anyone with the means to purchase more shares and give the Club a significant cash injection. 

This was the point Barry Skipper was driving at last week and, from what I''ve read so far, it seems that no one actually picked it up last night. 

[Syteanric 1]

 

 

ok but we have been in the premiership in the past 4 years.. lets look at teams in the  divisions below us.

Leeds, Bradford, Doncaster, Torquay, Huddersfield, Bury, Notts County. what makes them more appealing than norwich city? Im willing to bet (with the exception of Leeds who''s hand was forced by the administrators) that they all went out and Actively seeked investment...

Sitting there waiting for the phone to ring just wont work... you have to actively seek the buyers to make anything happen in this world.

 Its like buying a player.. do u think the manager of a club sits there and all of a sudden a player appears? i think not...

The board dont want to sell... end of.. they want to stay here until they have made such a fist of it that they cant get us out of it.. then will sell so some poor fool is left with the mess.... Robert chase all over again.

jas :)

[A Load of Squit 5,135]

[quote user="Arthur Whittle"]Peason has been looking for months to invest in a championship club and approached a few but was tuned down. Hes only now trying his luck with hudds because the fans have asked him to try to buy the chairman out but he is refusing to sell, much to the disapoitment of the locals. Its got nothing to do with familys.[/quote]

Seeing that you know him personally can you ask him if he''s tried us?

 

[nutty nigel 7,513]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]

It''s on bet365 at 11/2 nutty.
[/quote]

There are no odds on anything anywhere!!!!!!! why cant you get it????

web team..... anyone....... AAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH [:''(]

 

 

[The Judge 0]

Agree to a certain degree Thorpe. However its a fact that most businesses need investment to grow or progress, or sometimes just to be saved. In the vast majority of cases if investment is really wanted, those in current control go out and look for it. The line Doncaster and Smith keep coming out with about there not being a queue of people looking to invest is probably very true and not especially surprising if you are not actively seeking it.

This is my main concern for NCFC and my main critacism of the board. They keep complaining about the lack of finances, the need to pay off loans (which all of them are to pay back projects they instigated) etc etc. We all know (because they keep telling us) we are in financial do do and can''t compete in the league with the "richer" clubs. They also say they hold Premiership ambitions. They know as well as all of us that we are going to need significant investment to achieve this. Yet there are NO signs that they are looking to attract the necessary money needed. Releasing just 33,000 additional shares this year at the AGM,when they could have released over 100k proves this point - if it needed proving further.

This is the thing that really worries me, and the thing i would like an answer to - Why are they not actively seeking investment, what are they trying to achieve by not doing it, what are their concerns ?? - we can all come to our own varying conclusions on this, but the fact remains that if we get no new investment in this club in the short to medium term we WILL be going down sooner or later.

Perhaps Delia knows that an with an aggressive take over she can demand more for her shares, and the fact that she is converting her loans into shares, increasing her shareholding more and more - this is what she hopes for. Also less shares in total mean a higher price (see release of new shares above).We all know Worthington held on to the end to ensure he was paid off his full compensation (and who can blame him) - perhaps Delia is hoping for a similiar scenario....what ever the outcome in the years to come you can bet your bottom dollar that when Delia & MWJ do sell their shares they won''t be out of pocket over the period they have been involved with the club.

I''m not saying this is wrong (anybody in their position would do the same) but to keep spouting out that they have over £3m of their own money in to the club for no return is rubbish - they will get all off it back and more when they sell.

Only time will tell - i hope that our great club doesn''t suffer too much as a consequence.

 

 

[Mello Yello 2,282]

In Layman''s Terms.

The club don''t pursue or look for outside investment.......because they don''t really want to.

It is just excuses to keep hold of the reins and control of the club.....(in my opinion).

Have they got something to hide......Who Knows?

[T 190]

As far as I am aware they are not receiving any interest for their loans or dividends from their shares as one would normally for an investment so Delia would be right to say they have not received a return for their investment as you would from a normal financial investment.

Given the profits are now minimal at best and it looks as if the club is loss making going forward without the parachute payments then from a financial perspective the economic value of their shares is probably insignificant.

Another alternative to get a return would be to "asset strip" by shutting down the club and selling off the land but I suspect the site is worth less than the cost off paying off the debt and the players contracts.

The other alternative is selling to a new investor who would likely have to repay the money the shareholders have invested plus another 7 million a year to compete with the richest clubs in the division. The reality is that there are not many people who have at least 20 million free cash and who would want to invest in a loss making business. 

Accordingly, like it or not, Delia is quite right from financial perspective that you would be an idiot to invest in a championship football club. This view is also supported by Callum''s reported comments about carrying him away in a white coat if he ever considered it. 

[Cluck 0]

Mello Yello (The Original)

In Layman''s Terms.

The club don''t pursue or look for outside investment.......because they don''t really want to.

It is just excuses to keep hold of the reins and control of the club.....(in my opinion).

Have they got something to hide......Who Knows?

 

In a nutshell......It''s Delia''s trainset and no-one else gets to play with it unless she says so....

She is likely to leave in tears every bit as reviled as Chase.

 

[10 Bryceland 0]

I may be being simplistic but is it only the board who can seek outside investment?  Surely there are enough posters here, who believe that we can get outside investment, to band together with these so far un-named investors and make a serious bid for the club.  If the club is so attractive to outsiders who is going to be brave enough to contact them and organise the revolution then?

No-one!  I thought not.  The reality of the black hole that is football finance is far stronger than hot air and rhetoric, no matter how satisfying and cheap.

 

[Mello Yello 2,282]

[quote user="10 Bryceland"]

I may be being simplistic but is it only the board who can seek outside investment?  Surely there are enough posters here, who believe that we can get outside investment, to band together with these so far un-named investors and make a serious bid for the club.  If the club is so attractive to outsiders who is going to be brave enough to contact them and organise the revolution then?

No-one!  I thought not.  The reality of the black hole that is football finance is far stronger than hot air and rhetoric, no matter how satisfying and cheap.

 

[/quote]

I may do that as I''m absolutely minted! Thing is......I''m not a fading Celebrideeeeeeeeee!

[T 190]

10 B - good suggestion - given the reported business contacts of some here and the time some spend on here why don''t they spend their time researching the rich lists and businessmen in the area to see who has at least 20 million of free cash who is willing to put their hard earned cash into the loss making world of championship football. callum has been contacted and said not interested so why not look for others as you suggest. If they could come up with someone with sheds loads of cash who is genuinely cares about the football club then I would be happy to join the call for change. Delia has indicated that she would be willing to sell out to the right investor but is happy to stay so why should she look? Why don''t the people who want to get rid of her look for new investors as you suggest?

[T 190]

10 B - as I said on another post I think you are spot on. Just had a look at the times rich list and I understand that the turners are the 6th richest in east anglia and 263rd nationally. I''d agree with other posters who have suggested that the turners don''t have the free cash to make a dramatic change and take the club to the premiership. If they are the 6th richest in the area and don''t have the free cash to make a dramatic change and a championship football clubs are a poor financial investment then it is hardly surprsing that there is not a queue of investors who are genuinely interested in taking the club forward as other seem to suggest.

[hotdog99 0]

 

If you are reading this your too close to the computer screen and its bad for your eyes...........................

[The Judge 0]

[quote user="T"]10 B - good suggestion - given the reported business contacts of some here and the time some spend on here why don''t they spend their time researching the rich lists and businessmen in the area to see who has at least 20 million of free cash who is willing to put their hard earned cash into the loss making world of championship football. callum has been contacted and said not interested so why not look for others as you suggest. If they could come up with someone with sheds loads of cash who is genuinely cares about the football club then I would be happy to join the call for change. Delia has indicated that she would be willing to sell out to the right investor but is happy to stay so why should she look? Why don''t the people who want to get rid of her look for new investors as you suggest?[/quote]

Why should she look ?????? - because the club is going down the toilet thats why - and she hasn''t got the money to put it right.

The Turners have but why should they put more money in when they haven''t got ultimate control of where it is spent.

[HappyhammerAndy 0]

More takeovers of championship sides WILL DEFINITELY occur in the next 2 years.

[AmericanCityFan 0]

I don''t know much about Peter Cullum or the Turner''s, but I understand that it would be difficult for them to buy out Delia''s shares because so much of their money is wrapped up in their businesses. I was wondering if it was possible for them to do some kind of Norwich City promotion, such as every Norwich fan who signs up for Cullum''s insurance getting 5% of their bill donated to the club. Didn''t know if anything like this was possible.

Also, we seem to have a lot of dead weight in our playing squad and the wages are slowing is down. This is one of the main reasons we need a new manager - to get rid of the highly paid underperforming players that have been pulling is down. Duffy will most likely keep the same lineup in tact, thus keeping us in the rut we are in. Since the board are going to offer no assistance, there are things a manager can do to raise some funds for himself.