Isn't it a shame

[Wings 0]

...that the Evening News instead of asking pertinent questions about the reasons for the total failure of Peter Grant and his team, is wasting time on speaking with the creators of what is essentially a joke.

A newspaper with unrivaled access as all at Archant enjoy should be reflecting the mood of their readers. At this time, they should be looking at Peter Grant and asking why the failures of the team are occuring and most importantly what the team are doing about it. Are there extra training sessions going on? Is training being adapted to cover weaknesses that the management have identified? What are we doing about the vacant coaches position (as it''s quite obvious we need some new ideas and a new voice)? They should be asking the questions we as their readers want answered.

Instead, we''re treated to the ridiculous article interviewing the two creators of the muppets video; who obviously have far too much time on their hands and the bog standard "X player says we should do more Y". This is, in my view, nothing better than propaganda, designed to distract fans away from the real issues that Archant fail to face and thus the club never need to answer.

[blahblahblah 2]

I suppose that this animation is a better use of Thorndykes'' time and energy than running public disorder / hate campaigns and generally fouling up the atmosphere at Carrow Road with bile.  It concerns me that someone who has made a name for themselves out of hating a public figure, and who is still mocking people who are trying to do right by the club, is almost becoming a local celeb though.  What next for him ?  Interview with Anglia News ?  Thrilling.Whether or not it''s newsworthy -  doubtful, it''s human interest I suppose.  Is the article taking up space that could be used for hard questions for the club ?  It''s arguable that there''s time and space for both.  I doubt it''ll be on the back page of the evening news tonight, if it is, there''s something wrong.

[Wings 0]

It''s actually page 3 of the Evening News.

[blahblahblah 2]

I suppose it has to be somewhere.  I''d have put it next to Births Deaths and Marriages.  Slow news day in norfolk I guess.

[Syteanric 1]

[quote user="blahblahblah"]I suppose that this animation is a better use of Thorndykes'' time and energy than running public disorder / hate campaigns and generally fouling up the atmosphere at Carrow Road with bile. 
[/quote]

 

you have absolutley no idea about the Worthy out protests at all do you? Had you of looked on the website at the time you would of seen that it was not a hate campaign against Worthington... and it was hardly public Disorder as all protests were planned with Police consent and everyone acted fullwy with the police instructions.

 

but then your probably thought worthy was doing a "good" job at the time?

jas :)

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]you have absolutley no idea about the Worthy out protests at all do

you? Had you of looked on the website at the time you would of seen

that it was not a hate campaign against Worthington..[/quote]We aren''t going to agree here jas, I was a regular contributor to that site, and I was quite shocked at what was allowed to pass as "criticism" of the incumbent manager.  Let''s just say that we see things differently and leave it there.

[jetstream 0]

Blah - re Thorny and the WO campaign:1. ''running public disorder / hate campaigns''When/where was this ''public disorder''? I seem to remember some peaceful marches from the swimming pool to the outside of the ground, some car stickers and some red cards being printed, and a website. Oh and some chants inside the ground. Oh, and the peaceful meeting at St Andrew''s Hall.I do not remember any arrests, police horse charges or the like.I also seem to remember you congratulating Mark (on this very forum) on the way the campaign had been conducted, after Mr Worthington had been sacked.2. ''generally fouling up the atmosphere at Carrow Road with bile''I think that''s a tad hypocritical from yourself considering the ''bile'' you used to post in favour of Mr Worthington on the messageboard on the Worthy Out site. Yes, there were harsh words said against him (not all to my liking) but you were equally culpable of using  hateful language on there and adding to the ''foul'' atmosphere. I''d also add that the WO campaign never organised any demos inside the ground apart from the ''red card'' at the Burnley game.It seems that in your eyes the Club or the incumbent manager (whoever that may be) can do no wrong.

[nutty nigel 7,506]

Here we go opening up old wounds again.

But then again they never really closed did they. They still fester.

Public Order Offences? I don''t remember many really. Only a few scuffles outside the ground.

Hate campaign? Most definitely.

 

[blahblahblah 2]

Public disorder - fair point, that was a little strong, the marches were well organised.  I stand by the phrase hate campaign on the basis that is what it was.  A single-issue campaign to remove someone from their job, it sure as hell wasn''t done out of love.  I don''t know what you''d call people putting Worthy Out posters up on the major routes from his house to Carrow Road and Colney to make sure he sees them, but I didn''t consider that very friendly.[quote]but you were equally culpable of using  hateful language on there[/quote]I strongly dispute that, in fact a couple of times I attempted to act as peacemaker between Outers that were having disputes between each other !  But neither of us can prove our points, as the site no longer exists, so there''s no point arguing about it now.[quote]It seems that in your eyes the Club or the incumbent manager (whoever that may be) can do no wrong.[/quote]See my thread on speculating to accumulate, comparing our player wage / turnover ratio and indeed player wages against the Championship average, and then tell me if you think I still think that.

[jetstream 0]

OK, Blah, fair enough. I just thought it was worth correcting that impression about public disorder (and I see Nigel mentions a few ''scuffles'' - really? I must have missed those).I think putting up ''Worthy Out'' posters and car stickers etc (in general) was a legitimate tactic.It''s a bit difficult for a single issue campaign to remove a football manager from his job not to be personal, though I agree that in retrospect some of the language used was at times OTT and ''hateful''.Point taken about the accounts thread btw.

[nutty nigel 7,506]

Jetstream - Outside the Barclay I witnessed these scuffles twice. One was far more serious than the other and the police were involved. I do not know or care if they were started by protesters or protesters against the protesters.

I do not make stuff up to post on here. That''s how the hate campaign gathered pace, people making stuff up, anything in fact, to try to discredit the manager. Surely our results, league position and away record were sufficient things to protest about.

 

[ca 1]

[quote user="Wings"]

Instead, we''re treated to the ridiculous article interviewing the two creators of the muppets video; who obviously have far too much time on their hands and the bog standard "X player says we should do more Y". This is, in my view, nothing better than propaganda, designed to distract fans away from the real issues that Archant fail to face and thus the club never need to answer.

[/quote]

What people do in there spare time is up to them, maybe they thought we needed some light hearted relief to make us laugh in these troubled times.

It made me laugh [:D]

[Cluck 0]

Well...while the many were about lynching a hapless manager...I looked at the real source of the problem...Delia and her Disciples. Sadly it''s taken this long for others to see through the mist and allowed another loser to fill the boots Worthington left behind.

Now we''re broke through abyssmal business practices....have the worst team on the pitch I ever remember....have another clown for a manager on yet another long contract....are in real danger of plunging down the leagues....and possess the most lilly livered "supporters" outside of Ilikewearinggirlsdressesville.

Bring back the 14000 real fans who actually knew why they were going to see a football match....and if they didn''t see what pleased them, knew what to do about it.

[Stevie Wonder 0]

[quote user="Wings"]

...that the Evening News instead of asking pertinent questions about the reasons for the total failure of Peter Grant and his team, is wasting time on speaking with the creators of what is essentially a joke.

A newspaper with unrivaled access as all at Archant enjoy should be reflecting the mood of their readers. At this time, they should be looking at Peter Grant and asking why the failures of the team are occuring and most importantly what the team are doing about it. Are there extra training sessions going on? Is training being adapted to cover weaknesses that the management have identified? What are we doing about the vacant coaches position (as it''s quite obvious we need some new ideas and a new voice)? They should be asking the questions we as their readers want answered.

Instead, we''re treated to the ridiculous article interviewing the two creators of the muppets video; who obviously have far too much time on their hands and the bog standard "X player says we should do more Y". This is, in my view, nothing better than propaganda, designed to distract fans away from the real issues that Archant fail to face and thus the club never need to answer.

[/quote]

Suggest you read Chris Lacey''s reports on Wolves game in Monday''s EDP. He absolutely slaughtered the team - amongst his comments was something along the lines of "you will not see a worse performance by any team in this division this season". Some of the comments this week have been the strongest I have ever seen in the local press and deservedly so to!

[Stevie Wonder 0]

[quote user="Wings"]

...that the Evening News instead of asking pertinent questions about the reasons for the total failure of Peter Grant and his team, is wasting time on speaking with the creators of what is essentially a joke.

A newspaper with unrivaled access as all at Archant enjoy should be reflecting the mood of their readers. At this time, they should be looking at Peter Grant and asking why the failures of the team are occuring and most importantly what the team are doing about it. Are there extra training sessions going on? Is training being adapted to cover weaknesses that the management have identified? What are we doing about the vacant coaches position (as it''s quite obvious we need some new ideas and a new voice)? They should be asking the questions we as their readers want answered.

Instead, we''re treated to the ridiculous article interviewing the two creators of the muppets video; who obviously have far too much time on their hands and the bog standard "X player says we should do more Y". This is, in my view, nothing better than propaganda, designed to distract fans away from the real issues that Archant fail to face and thus the club never need to answer.

[/quote]

Suggest you read Chris Lacey''s reports on Wolves game in Monday''s EDP. He absolutely slaughtered the team - amongst his comments was something along the lines of "you will not see a worse performance by any team in this division this season". Some of the comments this week have been the strongest I have ever seen in the local press and deservedly so to!

[Wings 0]

[quote user="cityangel"][quote user="Wings"]

Instead, we''re treated to the ridiculous article interviewing the two creators of the muppets video; who obviously have far too much time on their hands and the bog standard "X player says we should do more Y". This is, in my view, nothing better than propaganda, designed to distract fans away from the real issues that Archant fail to face and thus the club never need to answer.

[/quote]

What people do in there spare time is up to them, maybe they thought we needed some light hearted relief to make us laugh in these troubled times.

It made me laugh [:D]

[/quote]Thanks to CA for providing an excellent example of how the majority seem to have missed my point. My main criticism and point of discussion is levied not at the creators of the video (I enjoyed it too), but at Archant and the Evening News for essentially avoiding the far bigger issues in exchange for articles on this and repetitive interviews with players. How many times have players been trotted out to say exactly what Lee Croft is saying in today''s articles?Let''s leave discussions on Thorny/Fatty and move on to more relevant discussions about how Archant are not asking the pertinent questions that really need answers.

[ca 1]

Sorry maybe I did miss your point Wings.

Why dont you email the editor of the EEN and ask him why the paper isnt putting pressure on the club to answer the questions the fans want answered and enclose a list of your questions. But they did allocate a whole page last night to letters about the problems at the club so that people could have their say.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Jetstream - Outside the Barclay I witnessed these scuffles twice. One was far more serious than the other and the police were involved. I do not know or care if they were started by protesters or protesters against the protesters.

I do not make stuff up to post on here. That''s how the hate campaign gathered pace, people making stuff up, anything in fact, to try to discredit the manager. Surely our results, league position and away record were sufficient things to protest about.

 

[/quote]

Not enough for the inept board to sack him for however, until it was too late.  You may well also find that his home form wasnt that great when he was finally sacked.  It was probably still a lot better than Peter Grant''s home form however.

[nutty nigel 7,506]

[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

Jetstream - Outside the Barclay I witnessed these scuffles twice. One was far more serious than the other and the police were involved. I do not know or care if they were started by protesters or protesters against the protesters.

I do not make stuff up to post on here. That''s how the hate campaign gathered pace, people making stuff up, anything in fact, to try to discredit the manager. Surely our results, league position and away record were sufficient things to protest about.

 

[/quote]

Not enough for the inept board to sack him for however, until it was too late.  You may well also find that his home form wasnt that great when he was finally sacked.  It was probably still a lot better than Peter Grant''s home form however.

[/quote]

So you wanted more disorder and a more hateful hate campaign! Why doesn''t that surprise me [:|]

 

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]but at Archant and the Evening News for essentially avoiding the far

bigger issues in exchange for articles on this and repetitive

interviews with players.[/quote]If the bigger issues involve cash-flow, and why the club aren''t providing enough to allow the managers to be competitive over the last couple of seasons, I don''t think anyone''s really interested, if my thread from this morning is anything to go by.  It slid to page 2 with only 30 responses.I''d just like to see Thorny rip the piss out of Ipswich for a change.  We do only hate Wolves and Ipswich, don''t we ?

[Thorny 0]

I did that with the My Little Pony badge last season? I''ll post that up here this evening if you want?

Also Fatty, who is currently in hospital, did the "Down Town" clip last season.

If and when Norwich do up their game, which is possible over the next 4 games (16 points imho), then such creations will be created of how the players are performing well. (We haven''t seen much of that over the past few seasons where we have had a sustained run)

As for the Worthy Out comments, I''ve no comment and just see it as a childish comments having to drag up the past (from someone who confessed he goes to very few games at the time!) due to his also confessed hatred off myself during those days. I have no need to drag that up and he has distracted from the issue of fans pointing out, which BBB himself said we should of done during that era of Norwich, should have been making issues about - the board. Instead he has to ruin the point Wings was trying to make in his opinion. Dragging up the past is very shallow with regards to a simple animation getting into the press. Tough, like it or not BBB, it is there and you have to deal with your issues which you are obviously still bugging you. As said, I refuse to reply to any of his comments about the WO days as they are now history.

For the record, we did this for fun for the fans mainly on the official message board and in hope that others would pick up and spread. This happened but has gone further than we had imagined. We were approached by Archant and agreed to do a quick interview and have photos taken. I cannot see why that can be such an issue. Many fans have liked it but it people such as BBB who loved to get their knives out at the earliest point. We thought it would receive around 100 views or so but extremely surprised and happy that it has gone past 8000.  (beating my previous best of 3000+ for last season Earnshaw clip - no comment about that, eh BBB?)

I rest my case. We''re happy with it and glad more Norwich fans have seen this and hopefully understand the message we are putting out through that. As stated, more are planned but depends on how well the club are doing! Watch this space...

[As my login causes problems [ :o) ] 0]

I had forgotten BBB from the old WO board, silly me, but see that your ability to divert arguments from the intended path remains.

To agree with Wings to a degree, there is a weakness in local journalism that the construction of an animation that cannot be seen within a newspaper is worthy of an article when other more important matters (football and social) are ignored.

It was perfect the clip should have been put on the Pink Un website as that is its intended medium, and it is amusingly poking fun at the current state of affairs at the Club, both on and off the pitch.

The analogy with the two old timers in still coming to watch the show, despite its obvious failings is perfect to what we are going through at Carrow Road.

I for one found it enormous fun, very clever, and a better way of getting a point of view across than BBB, Wings or I ever could.  So thankyou Fatty and Thorney and lets have more please

[Thorny 0]

I did in fact mean 10 points (not 16!)

[blahblahblah 2]

Agreed Thorny, the past is the past.  I certainly don''t hate you - I don''t know you, just disagree with your handling of things that are dead and buried.  The fact is that I''m only aware of the muppet thing and Worthy Out, both of these things knocking the club.  If you''ve done more, it would be good to see it.  Sorry to hear that Fatty is in hospital, hope he gets well soon.

[blahblahblah 2]

[quote]

I did in fact mean 10 points[/quote]I dunno, I think 16 points from the next 4 games would be great !  We''ll lose to Bristol City though.

[First Wizard 0]

[quote user="Thorny"]I did in fact mean 10 points (not 16!)[/quote]

Despite past ''disagreements'' with you Thorny, I must thank you for the brilliant ''Muppets'' cartoon............and so Python''s Terry Gilliam with it!. TGs a hero of mine, so many thanks.

And no, I didn''t forget Fatty.................I''ve already thanked him.

A classic piece of work, be proud of it.

[Thorny 0]

The Pythons etc have a lot to answer and partly influenced in such animations. The plain and simple things without being vulger. The likes of The Clangers, Muppets, Michael Bentines "Potty Time" and so on should never be forgotten in this age of advanced graphics.

I''ll have to have a word with Fatty regarding "Down Town" as he was going to resync it with a new technique I''d generated. His original had a flaw where the sound would run ahead of the animation. He''ll be more than happy for others to see it. The badges I have found....

Anyway, forget the past, enjoy the muppets and the message inside it.

 

[ca 1]

[quote user="1st Wizard"]

[quote user="Thorny"]I did in fact mean 10 points (not 16!)[/quote]

Despite past ''disagreements'' with you Thorny, I must thank you for the brilliant ''Muppets'' cartoon............and so Python''s Terry Gilliam with it!. TGs a hero of mine, so many thanks.

And no, I didn''t forget Fatty.................I''ve already thanked him.

A classic piece of work, be proud of it.

[/quote]

 

Yes, be very proud, as I said further up, it had me in stitches [:)]