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lappinitup

THE BOARD !

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While most fans I know are upbeat about the coming season, there are still rumblings of discontent  on here about the board. The main concerns are always regarding where money has gone. I don''t think there is one person who thinks that anything untoward is happening with money within the club but because NO-ONE on here has a clue regarding current finances at NCFC and so they hear a figure in one ear and another in the other ear , take one away and bingo NCFC have a surplus of ........££££

It''s just not that simple.

The board have a very difficult task of trying to balance the books or more precisely to reduce the deficit while at the same time spending enough on the team in trying to get promoted. Tricky to say the least.

If they throw money at new players and they don''t come off we stay where we are (or worse) but with more debt (and sooner or later someone is going to want their money back).

If they seem to be under-investing in the team and we stay where we are then they are heavily criticised for being un-ambitious.

I sometime wonder why they bother at all when it would be so easy to sell to a foreign investor as advocated by some but the reason they don''t is that they genuinly love this club as much as we do and they know that action would not be in the long term interests of NCFC.

Any suggestion that they don''t want premiership status is just plain crazy because as owners/shareholders they would make considerably more money by selling a successful premiership club than a struggling championship one.

I accept that they have made mistakes along the way and who does''nt, but to the people who criticise them for being un-ambitious I would remind them that this board has sanctioned the signings of two £3m strikers (who was the most expensive signing under Chase ?) And while they''ve got some things wrong, they''ve also got things right i.e play-off final, promotion and now Peter Grant who is like a breath of fresh air !

I consider myself lucky to support this club (I could have been born in Southampton or worse still Ipswich) cos for us the futures looking bright. Gonna miss the local derbys though after this year. 

I support  Norwich City Football Club. Not just parts of it.

 

 

 

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[quote user="lappinitup"]

While most fans I know are upbeat about the coming season, there are still rumblings of discontent  on here about the board. The main concerns are always regarding where money has gone. I don''t think there is one person who thinks that anything untoward is happening with money within the club but because NO-ONE on here has a clue regarding current finances at NCFC and so they hear a figure in one ear and another in the other ear , take one away and bingo NCFC have a surplus of ........££££

It''s just not that simple.

The board have a very difficult task of trying to balance the books or more precisely to reduce the deficit while at the same time spending enough on the team in trying to get promoted. Tricky to say the least.

If they throw money at new players and they don''t come off we stay where we are (or worse) but with more debt (and sooner or later someone is going to want their money back).

If they seem to be under-investing in the team and we stay where we are then they are heavily criticised for being un-ambitious.

I sometime wonder why they bother at all when it would be so easy to sell to a foreign investor as advocated by some but the reason they don''t is that they genuinly love this club as much as we do and they know that action would not be in the long term interests of NCFC.

Any suggestion that they don''t want premiership status is just plain crazy because as owners/shareholders they would make considerably more money by selling a successful premiership club than a struggling championship one.

I accept that they have made mistakes along the way and who does''nt, but to the people who criticise them for being un-ambitious I would remind them that this board has sanctioned the signings of two £3m strikers (who was the most expensive signing under Chase ?) And while they''ve got some things wrong, they''ve also got things right i.e play-off final, promotion and now Peter Grant who is like a breath of fresh air !

I consider myself lucky to support this club (I could have been born in Southampton or worse still Ipswich) cos for us the futures looking bright. Gonna miss the local derbys though after this year. 

I support  Norwich City Football Club. Not just parts of it.

 

 

 

[/quote]

Yep agree with you all the way "Lappinitup" must tell you about my encounter with a binner in Bulgaria sometime.[:)] arrdee.

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I am now really bored of the board. I have had interesting discussions with Mr Carrow amongst others on here. Mr. Carrow is my balance sheet guru [8-|][*] he understands more from the accounts than I do and yet not enough to convince me that the club doesn''t have ambition. It all boils down to opinion and trust levels and I am a lost cause because I have the thickest strongest yellowest greenest welding goggles through which I look at the club that I love.[8-|][8-|][8-|]

So now I want to look forward to the new season, look forward to the football. Peter Grant has won me over. I met him last season and I believe he is the real deal. The board appointed him, the boards critics use the fact that they went after Grant as a reason that they don''t show ambition and yet I can''t think of a more ambitious manager they could have appointed.

I don''t want to live in the past anymore, I dont want to discuss why we didn''t get Steve Howard and why we didn''t sign Ashton before the start of the Premiership season or any of the other old chestnuts that bounce around here all week every week.

Since Grant came in last October he has signed 11 new players? And promises there''s more to come. It''s fresh and new, it''s exciting and it''s time to move on.

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

I am now really bored of the board. I have had interesting discussions with Mr Carrow amongst others on here. Mr. Carrow is my balance sheet guru [8-|][*] he understands more from the accounts than I do and yet not enough to convince me that the club doesn''t have ambition. It all boils down to opinion and trust levels and I am a lost cause because I have the thickest strongest yellowest greenest welding goggles through which I look at the club that I love.[8-|][8-|][8-|]

So now I want to look forward to the new season, look forward to the football. Peter Grant has won me over. I met him last season and I believe he is the real deal. The board appointed him, the boards critics use the fact that they went after Grant as a reason that they don''t show ambition and yet I can''t think of a more ambitious manager they could have appointed.

I don''t want to live in the past anymore, I dont want to discuss why we didn''t get Steve Howard and why we didn''t sign Ashton before the start of the Premiership season or any of the other old chestnuts that bounce around here all week every week.

Since Grant came in last October he has signed 11 new players? And promises there''s more to come. It''s fresh and new, it''s exciting and it''s time to move on.

[/quote]

Nutty.

Like it or not, all successful businesses/enterprises benchmark for success these days. That, by definition, involves referring to the past and to others.

Unfortunately (and uncomfortably?) for you the benchmark for the NCFC board can only be those boards of the South-Watling-Chase era. anything else would be shortchanging our clubs'' potential. Even to get on the ladder they would have to cause the club to achieve promotion in the next two years.

Yes, there is an element of freshness and newness about, but it''s not time to move on because nothing has been achieved yet in terms of performance - and that''s really all that matters in the end isn''t it?

I support our club passionately and wish Peter Grant good luck - however what separates us ''negative whingers'' most from many of the rest is that we are as passionate as most, but we also set high standards - and have the will to benchmark success.

If you have not read or seen a performance of  ''Billy Liar'' by Keith Waterhouse then may I commend it to you? For those interested, it  is a 1950''s semi-comical kitchen sink drama of a working-class 19 year old and his Walter Mitty like fantasies.

Yes I wish Peter Grant good luck.

And yes, I dream of promotion - just like all you positive types.

Unfortunately our NCFC board is hardly at the starting line yet, and hasn''t been for the vast part of the past 10-11 years.

One love.

OTBC 

 

 

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Lappinitup, an excellent post you are spot on with your points, the board can''t win whatever they do, i will be the first to admit that i have questioned the board in the past few weeks and i do believe we still need to spend some of the money we have, not all but some would be nice and i think that would give the fans that little boost they need.

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Bly - I am still bored of the board!

Look at the Wiz’s wonderful thread about the 1958/9 cup run you even contributed, it’s about football and footballers and the fans and the atmosphere. Special times and special memories for those who were lucky enough to be there. There’s no mention of the board on that thread. And then on the thread with Arrdees superb post about Charlie Billington your contribution is marvellous, all about football and footballers and the Barclay stand and the atmosphere, and again no mention of the board. Yet over the last 10 years there have been some equally good football and footballers and atmosphere but you never mention it. You mention superstars from the 50’s but never from the present day. I saw one of the best goals I have ever seen from Darren Huckerby last season. Ricardo, who has seen all the great players from Jimmy Hill to the present day rates Hucks a class apart. Why do you never mention the goals and the skills and the fans and the atmosphere from the present day Bly? I have some wonderful memories from the last 10 years to go with those from the more distant past. Iwan Roberts goal in Cardiff and the atmosphere in that fabulous stadium, beating Wolves in the playoff semi-finals, winning at Bradford and Barnsley and then that game against Stockport and the atmosphere in the ground as we heard the other results and finding out we secured a place in the play-offs. The Championship season, the excitement of Huckerby. Howabout Ashtons goals in the Premiership against Man. City and Newcastle. And Safri’s spectacular 40 yarder against Newcastle. And that second goal against Man.U. Huckerby broke down the left.. passed to Ashton.. who passed to McKenzie who volleyed into the net to ensure a famous victory. The Barclay stand was rocking that evening.. Were you there Bly? Do you have any recent memories to compare to the past as well as past memories to compare to the present?

I can’t contribute to those threads and comment on those players from the 50’s because, although I have heard of them, I never saw them play. I didn’t go to my first match until 1967. But I remember the football, the footballers and the atmosphere through the 60’s, 70’s 80’s 90’s to now. I remember Tommy Bryceland and Kevin Keelan were my first heroes. My first big memory was 40 years ago when we won 2-1 at Old Trafford in the FA Cup. Keelan, Stringer, Mullett, Lucas, Brown, Allcock, Kenning, Heath, Bryceland, Bolland, Anderson. United went on to win the League Championship and then became the first English team to win the European Cup. My first game at Carrow Road was the next round when we were beaten by Sheffield Wednesday. I remember queuing for hours for tickets and then being at the very front of the South Stand in a crowd of nearly 42,000. I don’t remember the board though. Nobody seemed interested in the board during all that excitement. But the next couple of seasons were dull. I still had my heroes, Keelan, Bryceland, and Hugh Curran. Lol Morgan was manager and he bought loads of players, some good and some rubbish. The good ones like Duncan Forbes and Ken Foggo stayed here long after Morgan was gone. The football was poor and the gates were low and there was discontent all around the club. It was then I found out what the board was. Zigger zigger zigger.. Watling is a… came the disgraceful chants from the Barclay Stand. Us kids had to ask what it was all about. The late great Geoffrey Watling was a hate figure and even though he helped save the club 10 years earlier the fans were unhappy. They wanted to know where all the money had gone, a recurring theme throughout my years as a fan. They were still bitter about selling Ron Davies and then we sold Hugh Curran. I loved Arrdees story about the Rolling Stones song when we signed Alan Black, it was just too early for me to remember. Anyway Watling survived and appointed Ron Saunders as manager. The football was even worse at first but in 1971 we started winning, everyone was suddenly happy and there was no more chanting against Mr Watling. People were bored of the board. We were successful again.

So there’s some of my memories to go along with some of yours. You can use the past to compare to the present but be careful because, like in the song, nostalgia can be a way of fishing the past from the dustbin, cleaning it up, painting over the bad bits and recycling it for more that it''s worth.

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Bly - I am still bored of the board!

Look at the Wiz’s wonderful thread about the 1958/9 cup run you even contributed, it’s about football and footballers and the fans and the atmosphere. Special times and special memories for those who were lucky enough to be there. There’s no mention of the board on that thread. And then on the thread with Arrdees superb post about Charlie Billington your contribution is marvellous, all about football and footballers and the Barclay stand and the atmosphere, and again no mention of the board. Yet over the last 10 years there have been some equally good football and footballers and atmosphere but you never mention it. You mention superstars from the 50’s but never from the present day. I saw one of the best goals I have ever seen from Darren Huckerby last season. Ricardo, who has seen all the great players from Jimmy Hill to the present day rates Hucks a class apart. Why do you never mention the goals and the skills and the fans and the atmosphere from the present day Bly? I have some wonderful memories from the last 10 years to go with those from the more distant past. Iwan Roberts goal in Cardiff and the atmosphere in that fabulous stadium, beating Wolves in the playoff semi-finals, winning at Bradford and Barnsley and then that game against Stockport and the atmosphere in the ground as we heard the other results and finding out we secured a place in the play-offs. The Championship season, the excitement of Huckerby. Howabout Ashtons goals in the Premiership against Man. City and Newcastle. And Safri’s spectacular 40 yarder against Newcastle. And that second goal against Man.U. Huckerby broke down the left.. passed to Ashton.. who passed to McKenzie who volleyed into the net to ensure a famous victory. The Barclay stand was rocking that evening.. Were you there Bly? Do you have any recent memories to compare to the past as well as past memories to compare to the present?

I can’t contribute to those threads and comment on those players from the 50’s because, although I have heard of them, I never saw them play. I didn’t go to my first match until 1967. But I remember the football, the footballers and the atmosphere through the 60’s, 70’s 80’s 90’s to now. I remember Tommy Bryceland and Kevin Keelan were my first heroes. My first big memory was 40 years ago when we won 2-1 at Old Trafford in the FA Cup. Keelan, Stringer, Mullett, Lucas, Brown, Allcock, Kenning, Heath, Bryceland, Bolland, Anderson. United went on to win the League Championship and then became the first English team to win the European Cup. My first game at Carrow Road was the next round when we were beaten by Sheffield Wednesday. I remember queuing for hours for tickets and then being at the very front of the South Stand in a crowd of nearly 42,000. I don’t remember the board though. Nobody seemed interested in the board during all that excitement. But the next couple of seasons were dull. I still had my heroes, Keelan, Bryceland, and Hugh Curran. Lol Morgan was manager and he bought loads of players, some good and some rubbish. The good ones like Duncan Forbes and Ken Foggo stayed here long after Morgan was gone. The football was poor and the gates were low and there was discontent all around the club. It was then I found out what the board was. Zigger zigger zigger.. Watling is a… came the disgraceful chants from the Barclay Stand. Us kids had to ask what it was all about. The late great Geoffrey Watling was a hate figure and even though he helped save the club 10 years earlier the fans were unhappy. They wanted to know where all the money had gone, a recurring theme throughout my years as a fan. They were still bitter about selling Ron Davies and then we sold Hugh Curran. I loved Arrdees story about the Rolling Stones song when we signed Alan Black, it was just too early for me to remember. Anyway Watling survived and appointed Ron Saunders as manager. The football was even worse at first but in 1971 we started winning, everyone was suddenly happy and there was no more chanting against Mr Watling. People were bored of the board. We were successful again.

So there’s some of my memories to go along with some of yours. You can use the past to compare to the present but be careful because, like in the song, nostalgia can be a way of fishing the past from the dustbin, cleaning it up, painting over the bad bits and recycling it for more that it''s worth.

[/quote]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

 

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blyblybabes wrote

''''Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

 

Bly. That was the whole point of this thread. I can fully understand where nutty is coming from and I totally see your point as well. From my point of view, so much has been made of the boards inefficiencies because results on the pitch have been poor to say the least. If we had retained our premiership status then I think the smudgers and the arthur whittles of this world would never have materialised (apart from moaning about this or that player). But because results have been so poor over the last three years these lads have become icons to people on this board who have to blame someone when results don''t go our way. The easy escape route is to blame THE BOARD. In any business, boardrooms employ managers, assist. managers etc. profesional people to run the business on their behalf and they rely on these people to to the job for them. If they fail it''s because they''ve chosen the wrong people. At the time they obviously think they''ve got it right.

This time I think they''ve got it right.

Like you nutty I''m bored with ''''the board''''

So Peter grant lets get a few wins under our belts and lets get the doubters ''ABOARD''

 

 

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[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

[/quote]

Nutty.

You are expert at responding to selected parts of posts whilst ignoring the subject or central theme.

The NCFC board are doing a fabulous job compared with those of the 20''s, 30''s and 40''s of keeping our club in the second tier of English football. There we are, I''ve said it.. How about that? Happier? You see what I am writing about is benchmarking success. And it is the period of the late 1950''s to 1995 demonstrates what is possible - a measure of our clubs potential.

By the way, you must be proud of the recent contributions of Attack the Barclay 2nd half who is on an often rather irrational pro-NCFC board campaign in a style I have heard characterised as resembling Nutty''s aggresive alter ego. He''s building up quite a portfolio.

One love.

OTBC

 

 

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[quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

[/quote]

I believe the answer Nutty, although many of us may not wish to admit it ( even to ourselves ), is that fans and society in general have changed. Today, the demand for satisfaction is more immediate. I want what I want now. I don''t even believe it''s about the last ten years. If the television channel doesn''t give the required satisfaction level today or, more importantly, even if it does, the remote control allows us to get other momentary satisfaction in short bursts. Many say they will be "satisfied" if Norwich are competing in the top six of the Championship. I don''t believe that will satisfy most even if it''s achieved. You make some good points Nutty about some good things occurring during the past decade but in today''s world of "I want it when I want it and I want it now", those thoughts, I''m afraid, ring hollow for many.

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Well lets hope you are right lappinitup. We have signed a number of new players with more to come ?, the board (Sorry Nutty[:D]) are making the right noises about ambition. At a personal level I want to see Norwich City playing at the highest level, and I think the board (Sorry Nutty [:D]) do to. As has been posted before boards, managers and players come and go, it is us fans that remain the constant and I think it is reseonable that they demand a return on their emotional and financial support. Much has been made of the money put in by investors, and I thank them for it, but step back and think how much time, money and effort fans have put into the club, particurlary those who have been following Norwich City for a number of years, and I would suggest their investment in relation to their wealth is comparable to any investor. I was talking to a fellow season ticket holder last night and we both came to the conclusion that even if we were playing in the Conference we would still go to watch our team, we would not accept the situation but we would still support the club, not sure that there is anything wrong in that.

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[quote user="lappinitup"]

 If we had retained our premiership status then I think the smudgers and the arthur whittles of this world would never have materialised (apart from moaning about this or that player).

[/quote]

Not quite, Whittle & Smudger are the childeren of the Chase era protests when it became OK to knock and moan about the running of the club rather than what happened on the pitch. But you are so right in everything else on this thread. All this negativity around the board is so depressing & boring. Most supporters seem genuinely enthused about the prospects for this season, as supporters for any club with 11 new players would be. It may all turn sour by Christmas as it will for most clubs - but is what it is all about, the triumph of hope over experience.

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[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

[/quote]

The NCFC board are doing a fabulous job compared with those of the 20''s, 30''s and 40''s of keeping our club in the second tier of English football. There we are, I''ve said it.. How about that? Happier? You see what I am writing about is benchmarking success. And it is the period of the late 1950''s to 1995 demonstrates what is possible - a measure of our clubs potential.

[/quote]

Go on then BlyBlyBlades answer me this oh king of benchmarking if that really was a golden age:

1) How many trophies were won?

2) How many times were we relegated?

3) How many star players were sold to balance the books?

4) What were the average attendences, season ticket holder numbers etc?

5) How much of their money did the board invest?

Truth is Dave Stringer assembled a very special but unique team & Mike Walker temporarily took this forward but this could have been a once in a lifetime freak of nature rather than any kind of benchmark.

OTBC

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[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

[/quote]

The NCFC board are doing a fabulous job compared with those of the 20''s, 30''s and 40''s of keeping our club in the second tier of English football. There we are, I''ve said it.. How about that? Happier? You see what I am writing about is benchmarking success. And it is the period of the late 1950''s to 1995 demonstrates what is possible - a measure of our clubs potential.

[/quote]

Go on then BlyBlyBlades answer me this oh king of benchmarking if that really was a golden age:

1) How many trophies were won?

2) How many times were we relegated?

3) How many star players were sold to balance the books?

4) What were the average attendences, season ticket holder numbers etc?

5) How much of their money did the board invest?

Truth is Dave Stringer assembled a very special but unique team & Mike Walker temporarily took this forward but this could have been a once in a lifetime freak of nature rather than any kind of benchmark.

OTBC

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[quote user="YankeeCanary"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"]

Yes, Nutty. Wonderful stuff from the heart, but it''s on the wrong thread.

What does this have to do with this thread and my post?

The bottom line is results.

And this board is missing the benchmarks by a mile. Regretably.

OTBC

[/quote]

Possibly the reason you don''t think this has anything to do with your post is that you seem to want to pick and choose which parts of the past you want to use for your benchmark Bly. If your post was about using the past to measure the present then my post would be relavent.

It seems to me that the only thing that matters to you over the last 10 years is our league position. Yet back in the 50''s and 60''s you appreciated the things I still enjoy now, the excitement, the football, the footballers and the atmosphere.

Why is that?

[/quote]

I believe the answer Nutty, although many of us may not wish to admit it ( even to ourselves ), is that fans and society in general have changed. Today, the demand for satisfaction is more immediate. I want what I want now. I don''t even believe it''s about the last ten years. If the television channel doesn''t give the required satisfaction level today or, more importantly, even if it does, the remote control allows us to get other momentary satisfaction in short bursts. Many say they will be "satisfied" if Norwich are competing in the top six of the Championship. I don''t believe that will satisfy most even if it''s achieved. You make some good points Nutty about some good things occurring during the past decade but in today''s world of "I want it when I want it and I want it now", those thoughts, I''m afraid, ring hollow for many.

[/quote]

In the 50s,60s and 70s we slowly bettered ourselves as a decent club and the 80s and early 90s we set a standard only for chase to take that away. I think imo the reason people remember those days as great because it was all new to us. Ive had some great memories over the last 10yrs [albeit not the last 3 or so] but the constant disapointment and failure to hold on and continue to give us great times outweighs the good times so my memories of the last decade are somewhat overshadowed. In a nutshell i suppose Your right Yankee. Ive tasted it and i want more and it doesnt help when the board state the same and not deliever.

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I enjoyed your post about about those great names from the 60''s and 70''s Nutty. Yes you are right that we should try to concentrate on all the positives of the here and now and not keep dragging up the past. I don''t think Bly is being negative when he complains about the present board. The problem is exactly as Arthur Whittle commented. We gradually improved through the 60''s and seventies and after a long period in the top division in the 80''s and 90''s we came to believe that this was our natural right. Unfortunately we fell out of the big league at just the wrong time when the money was coming in.

A lot of supporters who were youngsters during our great period are now in their late 30''s and 40''s and so it is natural for them to see our position as one of decline. I think Smudger is one of these people so I don''t blame him for his present attitude. We all base our opinions of Norwich City''s position in the football hierachy on our own experiences so I am not surprised that we don''t all think the same. Personally I see us as lower Prem or upper Championship but that doesn''t stop me hankering after the glory days.

I know the board have a difficult job to keep finances on an even keel but I have some sympathy with Mr. Carrow because he is correct that the accounts show we have made an enormous amount of money over the last 6 years in transfer dealings. It''s a difficult call but I would really like to see the board spend a bit of that before its too late.

And yes Nutty, I have seen all the great City players since 1953, Jimmy Hill, Tommy Bryceland, Colin Suggett Martin Peters, Fash, Reeves, Bellamy and all and would argue with anyone that Darren Huckerby on his day is the most exciting player I have ever seen in the yellow and green. You younger fans should savour him while he''s here because you will probably never see his like again.

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Just think what misery it must be to a Forest fan - in the time we were "improving" they were winning trophies (like two Euro Cups) or Leeds being in the Champions League........get real, wake up and smell the coffee nothing lasts forever or guarantees success. That is just how it is (unless you want to support Man U).

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[quote user="BigFish"][quote user="lappinitup"]

 If we had retained our premiership status then I think the smudgers and the arthur whittles of this world would never have materialised (apart from moaning about this or that player).

[/quote]

Not quite, Whittle & Smudger are the childeren of the Chase era protests when it became OK to knock and moan about the running of the club rather than what happened on the pitch. But you are so right in everything else on this thread. All this negativity around the board is so depressing & boring. Most supporters seem genuinely enthused about the prospects for this season, as supporters for any club with 11 new players would be. It may all turn sour by Christmas as it will for most clubs - but is what it is all about, the triumph of hope over experience.

[/quote]

Maybe so, but we don''t have 11 yet.

Maybe Leicester is your other club?

[:)]

One love.

OTBC

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Bly - I make no secret of the fact that I’m not the brightest floodlight on the pylon so you are going to have to explain what you are trying to say about me and Attack The Barclay 2nd Half. Surprisingly I’m not happier you said what you did about the boards in the 20‘, 30‘s and 40‘s. I am unhappy that you keep missing the point. Was Jimmy Hills 35/40 yard rocket against Mansfield of Port Vale really better than Safris against Newcastle? Was the club really in a better position when Hill scored that goal than it was when Safri scored his. Which of the two would you honestly benchmark for the future.

Bigfish seems to have the same ideas as me about this. I don’t see that the board are doing any better or any worse than other boards from any period that I have known. Benchmarking success is all very well but you have to be sure you are crediting that success in the right places. A board of directors never had a successful season yet but football teams do. The part the board play in this is very minimal. They appoint the manager and allocate as much funding as possible to back him. I see no difference in the strategies of any of the boards since I understood what a board was. The criticisms of this board are the same criticisms that were levelled at the other boards over the last 50 years. They all sold our best strikers right through from Ron Davies to Rob Earnshaw. They all appeared to make more money selling players than they spent buying. I see no real difference in the strategies of any of them.

So what made us successful? Well this may surprise you but it was the players. Now I believe the biggest factor of our success in the early 70’s was Kevin Keelan. We had quite possibly the best (and certainly in the top 3) goalkeeper in the country playing for us. Of course Keelan was signed for 6,500 by Ron Ashman who I have never seen you mention to be benchmarked and it was after an unremarkable season where we finished 11th in the second tier and certainly not a season which is in the list that you use to benchmark success.

Of course just having a top goalkeeper isn’t enough, so looking back I guess the Duncan Forbes and David Stringer were a huge influence. Forbes was signed from Colchester United for 10,000 by Lol Morgan a much derided manager who I certainly never seen you mention to be benchmarked and it was during another unremarkable season where we finished 13th in the second tier. David Stringer was a player who joined the club in his late teens, I think when Ashman was manager.

I could go through all the players like this, they are all similar stories. Terry Anderson, Doug Livermore, Graham Paddon, Kenny Foggo, David Cross, Peter Sylvester, Jim Bone, Geoff Butler. They are all players signed in much the same way we sign players now.

Ron Saunders was appointed manager by the board, and he sorted the wheat from the chaff, had the sense to keep the likes of Keelan, Forbes, Stringer, Anderson and Foggo and added the rest. We then got promotion, didn’t spend any money, finally brought in Hockey, Suggett and Mellor but only after selling Jim Bone. We just managed to stay up that first season, but only by the skin of our teeth. From the perspective of the board there’s very little difference between what happened 1971/3 to what happened in 2003/5. It’s just that the team won the important game in 1973.

That’s why I am bored of the board Bly. It’s footballers that make a difference.

Ricardo - I agree with much of your post and it’s good to see you are coming out of your sulk about selling players[;)] I got over it a lot quicker, we should be used to it shouldn’t we? You are spot on about the status of the club when we begin supporting them having a bearing on our tolerance of poor seasons. My daughter only started going after we got relegated in 1995 and she is more tolerant of the situation we are in now than my son who started going in 1983. It must be difficult for fans of your generation to tolerate how rubbish we are lately in the FA Cup.

Yankee - I agree totally with what your points about the changes in attitudes and society although I don’t think it’s all for the worse. Results have always been important. When City lose the disappointment is always the overriding emotion but when the disappointment fades we should be able to realise that the result isn’t the be all and end all. Take the game against Man.C. in 2005. The disappointment of Robbie Fowlers 90th minute winner was all we could feel as we went home, real disappointment because we had been 2 goals to the good. But as the dark clouds of disappointment lifted the real lasting memory from the game surely has to be that wonderful goal that Dean Ashton chipped over David James. I would suggest that anyone whose abiding memory of that game was the disappointment in the result or Delia’s rant at half-time couldn’t have been in the ground that night.

Oh and Bly - I think Lappinitup is referring to the 11 players at the club that have been brought here by Peter Grant.

 

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The big difference between this Board and that of the 50''s and 60''s is inheritance. Prior to the arrival of Watling the club was a sleepy little backwater...but with endeavour and ambition by the time Chase eventually got hounded out we were amongst the elite in the country with a string of exciting seasons and success behind us.

Smith however inherited a club with a good recent history and has miraculously taken it backwards...soon to return to the sleepy backwater of old. Insufficient funds pumped in to ensure continuity and an unhealthy obsession with "off the field activities" such as catering have seen to that. Championship football suits her personal career needs nicely....and so she remains a "big fish in a small pond"....a place where losers feel comfortable.

If that''s progress then rub me down with a damp flannel.........  

 

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[quote user="BigFish"]Just think what misery it must be to a Forest fan - in the time we were "improving" they were winning trophies (like two Euro Cups) or Leeds being in the Champions League........get real, wake up and smell the coffee nothing lasts forever or guarantees success. That is just how it is (unless you want to support Man U).[/quote]

You are dead right Big Fish nothing lasts forever but imo you can either sit back and except that and live with those great memories or you can stand up and try to make those wonderful times reality again. Its always worth ago mate.

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[quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="BigFish"][quote user="lappinitup"]

 If we had retained our premiership status then I think the smudgers and the arthur whittles of this world would never have materialised (apart from moaning about this or that player).

[/quote]

Not quite, Whittle & Smudger are the childeren of the Chase era protests when it became OK to knock and moan about the running of the club rather than what happened on the pitch. But you are so right in everything else on this thread. All this negativity around the board is so depressing & boring. Most supporters seem genuinely enthused about the prospects for this season, as supporters for any club with 11 new players would be. It may all turn sour by Christmas as it will for most clubs - but is what it is all about, the triumph of hope over experience.

[/quote]

Maybe so, but we don''t have 11 yet.

Maybe Leicester is your other club?

[:)]

One love.

OTBC

[/quote]

Looks like eleven to me BlyBlyBlades - Otsemobor, Gilks, Cureton, Brellier, Marshall, Strihavka, Smith, Chadwick, Lappin, Brown, Fotheringham......!

I think NuttyNigel has put my views better than I could myself!!

OTBC

 

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[quote user="BigFish"][quote user="BlyBlyBabes"][quote user="BigFish"][quote user="lappinitup"]

 If we had retained our premiership status then I think the smudgers and the arthur whittles of this world would never have materialised (apart from moaning about this or that player).

[/quote]

Not quite, Whittle & Smudger are the childeren of the Chase era protests when it became OK to knock and moan about the running of the club rather than what happened on the pitch. But you are so right in everything else on this thread. All this negativity around the board is so depressing & boring. Most supporters seem genuinely enthused about the prospects for this season, as supporters for any club with 11 new players would be. It may all turn sour by Christmas as it will for most clubs - but is what it is all about, the triumph of hope over experience.

[/quote]

Maybe so, but we don''t have 11 yet.

Maybe Leicester is your other club?

[:)]

One love.

OTBC

[/quote]

Looks like eleven to me BlyBlyBlades - Otsemobor, Gilks, Cureton, Brellier, Marshall, Strihavka, Smith, Chadwick, Lappin, Brown, Fotheringham......!

I think NuttyNigel has put my views better than I could myself!!

OTBC

 

[/quote]

11 that grant has signed then....   Out of the above, Brown and Chadwick are injury prone, Fozzy needs to improve dramatically and Lappin looks solid at this level.  The rest I will reserve judgement on.

Suffice to say the signings of Brown Chadwick Lappin and Fotheringham have not - so far - had any impact on results or our league position.

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[quote user="Cluck "]

The big difference between this Board and that of the 50''s and 60''s is inheritance. Prior to the arrival of Watling the club was a sleepy little backwater...but with endeavour and ambition by the time Chase eventually got hounded out we were amongst the elite in the country with a string of exciting seasons and success behind us.

Smith however inherited a club with a good recent history and has miraculously taken it backwards...soon to return to the sleepy backwater of old. Insufficient funds pumped in to ensure continuity and an unhealthy obsession with "off the field activities" such as catering have seen to that. Championship football suits her personal career needs nicely....and so she remains a "big fish in a small pond"....a place where losers feel comfortable.

If that''s progress then rub me down with a damp flannel.........  

[/quote]

Emm yes, you are sort of right here Cluck, except the inheritance was that the club was stoney broke, had sold every player that anyone else could possibly want and going down the toilet faster than you could say "Leeds United".

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[quote user="BigFish"][quote user="Cluck "]

The big difference between this Board and that of the 50''s and 60''s is inheritance. Prior to the arrival of Watling the club was a sleepy little backwater...but with endeavour and ambition by the time Chase eventually got hounded out we were amongst the elite in the country with a string of exciting seasons and success behind us.

Smith however inherited a club with a good recent history and has miraculously taken it backwards...soon to return to the sleepy backwater of old. Insufficient funds pumped in to ensure continuity and an unhealthy obsession with "off the field activities" such as catering have seen to that. Championship football suits her personal career needs nicely....and so she remains a "big fish in a small pond"....a place where losers feel comfortable.

If that''s progress then rub me down with a damp flannel.........  

[/quote]

Emm yes, you are sort of right here Cluck, except the inheritance was that the club was stoney broke, had sold every player that anyone else could possibly want and going down the toilet faster than you could say "Leeds United".

[/quote]

Having lived through the Chase debacle and being in business myself I can assure you that the realities of doing a "Leeds" is far wide of the mark. There were financial difficulties which had they been addressed professionally at the time would not have impeded progress. In the hands of a novice Board however the panic button was pressed and so the "legend" of  "Delia the Saviour" was born.

Every business from Sainsbury''s to ICI have blips in their progress...but they don''t capitulate and run away. This is why we are where we are because "fear" ruled the roost and ambition was reduced to mere "survival".

 

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[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="BigFish"][quote user="Cluck "]

The big difference between this Board and that of the 50''s and 60''s is inheritance. Prior to the arrival of Watling the club was a sleepy little backwater...but with endeavour and ambition by the time Chase eventually got hounded out we were amongst the elite in the country with a string of exciting seasons and success behind us.

Smith however inherited a club with a good recent history and has miraculously taken it backwards...soon to return to the sleepy backwater of old. Insufficient funds pumped in to ensure continuity and an unhealthy obsession with "off the field activities" such as catering have seen to that. Championship football suits her personal career needs nicely....and so she remains a "big fish in a small pond"....a place where losers feel comfortable.

If that''s progress then rub me down with a damp flannel.........  

[/quote]

Emm yes, you are sort of right here Cluck, except the inheritance was that the club was stoney broke, had sold every player that anyone else could possibly want and going down the toilet faster than you could say "Leeds United".

[/quote]

Having lived through the Chase debacle and being in business myself I can assure you that the realities of doing a "Leeds" is far wide of the mark. There were financial difficulties which had they been addressed professionally at the time would not have impeded progress. In the hands of a novice Board however the panic button was pressed and so the "legend" of  "Delia the Saviour" was born.

Every business from Sainsbury''s to ICI have blips in their progress...but they don''t capitulate and run away. This is why we are where we are because "fear" ruled the roost and ambition was reduced to mere "survival".

 

[/quote]

Sainsburys & ICI have buildings, plant, machinary and other assets. NCFC had sold everything it could bar the ground. What was this famous legacy? Shirt buttons? Are you really saying that businesses don''t go bust? Would you want NCFC to go the way of Rover for example or into a voluntary arrangement like that Ipswich went into? Don''t really see them pulling up any trees next season.

Please apply your business experience to thought of how this ambition could be funded and share it with us all (and before you start don''t say with the transfer profits because you know and I know that money isn''t there).

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