SACK THE BOARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Branston Pickle 3,651]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="1st Wizard"][quote user="Smudger"]

It is not quite as simple as that CHUMPY and if only you had an inkling of what being a real fan was all about then you would undoubtedly be able to see that you can''t just walk away from what is in the blood and what you love...

But hey ho you only go for an afternoons entertainment don''t you???

[/quote]

At least Mr Chimp and I go to the odd game, him probably more than me, thats what REAL FANS do mate, but then again, you don''t go do you?.

[/quote]

Oh dear.....I thought you were above this sort of back stabbing Wiz. Smudger may say some things which grate on the neutral/apologist... but as a "supporter" he is as much entitled to an opinion as anyone else. The club he refers to is the grass roots set up I thought the realists heralded...but if you are in with the monkeys now then you must expect to get your nuts squashed.......

[/quote]

...interesting - people are clearly entitled to have an opinion as long as it matches yours, or is from one of your cronies so that you can rally around them.  An interesting concept for a discussion forum - I thought the general idea was that people can share their views/opinions but seems I was mistaken.

[Buncey 1]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

I don`t go anymore either. I gave up my season-ticket of 15 years last season and most of my friends who i ran a City fanzine with for several years have done the same for this season. I went to a few away games but i will not give a penny of my money to people who would far rather spend it on a bit of land or a restaurant than the team.

 If some of you lot think that being a true supporter is all about turning up and clapping no matter what clowns are pulling on the yellow and green and no matter what the motives and policies are of those who hold power at the club we love then i really, genuinely, feel sorry for you. Presumably you were the ones wringing your hands at home whilst some of us got our hands dirty and got rid of Chase.

What you people are so keen to be blindly loyal to is a prudently run diversified Plc with four subsiduary companies-none of which have anything to do with football- run to make a profit and increase the value of the main shareholders stakes. Oh, and it also plays some football matches. The ground still sells out so where`s the problem? The people in charge are BUSINESS people, not football people and in a business sense NCFC is doing extremely well. It`s up to US to let them know that making a tidy profit each year and concentrating on infrastructure projects whilst the team spirals into decline is not good enough. Progress on the pitch for supporters is still by far the most important thing. Isn`t it.....???

[/quote]Here here, exactly how i felt after drawing to 10 man southend rock bottom of the championship at home on a cold boxing day. Why the hell do/did we clap idiots like hughes and robinson onto the pitch. Don''t give all that rubbish, they try hard. Think of all the top players who played here, came through the ranks, or grew their bones on the grass at carrow road, it''s a disgrace to them. To sell out for a hotel in the corner of the ground was a step too far for me, i don''t mind restraunts and all that but putting a hotel in that corner is ridiculous. We could easily have put a corner in there don''t give me all that cr@p about safety, how do man u and chelsea et al. do it then?Hopefully with the turners on board things will (and sort of are) change. At least we seem to be willing to splash some cash and Grant already seems to have judged the right players to bring in. Bringing cureton in is a BIG statement of intent. Smudger and you other downers seem to forget that although he''s 32, not scored many etc. that he bleeds yellow and green. And i value that well above how good he''s supposed to be. This weekend has turned out to be one of the most progressive ones for 3 years after all the down turns we''ve had. I''d rather have Cureton, Marshall + another striker and a midfielder/defender than Earnshaw. With 2m on board extra we will have a good squad come august. So keep faith with the board as this seems at the moment, the most postive board to conveen since our promotion season.

[Tumbleweed 106]

I''d be lying if I said I never get frustrated with events at CR. I''d be lying if I said I didn''t think twice often before getting into my car for a four hour drive for a home game. The times I feel depressed on the journey home make me wonder why I do it. The news of our only truly valuable playing asset disappoints, the fact we haven''t signed Fernando Torres or Thierry Henry in replacement is clear incompetence by the Board allowing them to go to overrated clubs resting on past glories. The failure last season disappointed me, relegation disappointed me, 9 years of Division One football did also, as did O''Neill walking, and tame FA Cup semi final defeats and dismal penalties in Cardiff.

But I still support my club, I look forward to the future. I may not be happy with aspects of what happens from time to time but frankly that''s life. I get disappoitned when my boss fails to give me his job and clearly doesn''t appreciate I''m far better than him, hell why shouldn''t I be running the entire company. I''m disappointed my car is old, my house isn''t very big and my kids squabble too much.

It''s life. But if it got to the stage where my football club disgusts me it would have been time to bail out because it wouldn''t be worth it anymore. Big boys cope, little boys sulk. 

[br1tt3n 0]

Sack the board? What a ridiculous knee-jerk reaction.

Obviously you have a very short insight on the world of football. Why on earth do you think Earnshaw came here in the first place? It almost certain he only came to Norwich if there were a buy-out clause in the contract saying if we were not promoted, he could leave. There is nothing the board can do about these situations, apart from not signing the player at all. He was a Dean Ashton replacement, one with which we were all delighted. I am sure you would have called for the boards throats if we had not signed a Dean Ashton replacement.

Similar siutation with Newcastle and Michael Owen. Why on earth would the board pay £17mil for a player and put a release clause for £12mil in his contract. They wouldn''t, as its ridiculous looking at it from a business point of view. Its nigh on certain it was a player request, so he can possibly be snapped up by a bigger club when he is fit and banging in the goals.

 

 

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Tumbleweed"]

I''d be lying if I said I never get frustrated with events at CR. I''d be lying if I said I didn''t think twice often before getting into my car for a four hour drive for a home game. The times I feel depressed on the journey home make me wonder why I do it. The news of our only truly valuable playing asset disappoints, the fact we haven''t signed Fernando Torres or Thierry Henry in replacement is clear incompetence by the Board allowing them to go to overrated clubs resting on past glories. The failure last season disappointed me, relegation disappointed me, 9 years of Division One football did also, as did O''Neill walking, and tame FA Cup semi final defeats and dismal penalties in Cardiff.

But I still support my club, I look forward to the future. I may not be happy with aspects of what happens from time to time but frankly that''s life. I get disappoitned when my boss fails to give me his job and clearly doesn''t appreciate I''m far better than him, hell why shouldn''t I be running the entire company. I''m disappointed my car is old, my house isn''t very big and my kids squabble too much.

It''s life. But if it got to the stage where my football club disgusts me it would have been time to bail out because it wouldn''t be worth it anymore. Big boys cope, little boys sulk. 

[/quote]

Interesting post...but big boys wouldn''t whine about their boss...they get out there and make their own success. Big boys would also make it their business to achieve the big house/big car syndrome if it was their passion...they wouldn''t simply bemoan their fate and carry on with the same old.

Here lies the fundamental difference between those of us with some "get up and go"...and those who simply let life roll by. It is because I have always battered down doors to achieve my goals that I find it so frustrating watching others roll over....and why I do not accept the circus we have for a club in 2007 as "inevitable".

Two trains of thought and two psyches....and with such a diverse range of people the reason things get so petty on here so often. I fear many who spend much of their time glued to a computer screen are the very people who find it easy to accept "what is"....because in the virtual world they can be whatever they like...as long as it doesn''t conflict with reality.

Reality is where the future of our club lies...not in computer fantasy land where anything is theoretically possible at the press of a button. I fear too many modern fans on this forum live in this world and so have lost the ability to know what they want....simply because there isn''t that "button" to push to make everything alright again.

 

[Old Shuck 183]

"...It''s life. But if it got to the stage where my football club disgusts me it would have been time to bail out because it wouldn''t be worth it anymore. Big boys cope, little boys sulk..."

Tumbleweed.

Very true. At the end of the proverbial day, and, as much as I support them and have enjoy & will continue to enjoy going to matches-they are just my football club! Not my life, my wife, my family, friends, business, my reason for living...I think I''ll get worked up about a lot more things that have priority and real meaning in life before Norwich City become so important as to be a reason for politics and protest! 

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="br1tt3n"]

Sack the board? What a ridiculous knee-jerk reaction.

Obviously you have a very short insight on the world of football. Why on earth do you think Earnshaw came here in the first place? It almost certain he only came to Norwich if there were a buy-out clause in the contract saying if we were not promoted, he could leave. There is nothing the board can do about these situations, apart from not signing the player at all. He was a Dean Ashton replacement, one with which we were all delighted. I am sure you would have called for the boards throats if we had not signed a Dean Ashton replacement.

Similar siutation with Newcastle and Michael Owen. Why on earth would the board pay £17mil for a player and put a release clause for £12mil in his contract. They wouldn''t, as its ridiculous looking at it from a business point of view. Its nigh on certain it was a player request, so he can possibly be snapped up by a bigger club when he is fit and banging in the goals.

 

 

[/quote]

Wrong yet again...

I had already made my stance against the board a couple of months earlier and stopped attending matches....

So why do you seem to think that Selling Ashton and signing Earnshaw for less than half the fee we received made me happy???

It may of made the wooly flock happy to see another £3.5million to £4million stashed away in Carrow Road coffers to never be seen again but it certainly did not make me happy!!!

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Fellas"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"]

I don`t go anymore either. I gave up my season-ticket of 15 years last season and most of my friends who i ran a City fanzine with for several years have done the same for this season. I went to a few away games but i will not give a penny of my money to people who would far rather spend it on a bit of land or a restaurant than the team.

 If some of you lot think that being a true supporter is all about turning up and clapping no matter what clowns are pulling on the yellow and green and no matter what the motives and policies are of those who hold power at the club we love then i really, genuinely, feel sorry for you. Presumably you were the ones wringing your hands at home whilst some of us got our hands dirty and got rid of Chase.

What you people are so keen to be blindly loyal to is a prudently run diversified Plc with four subsiduary companies-none of which have anything to do with football- run to make a profit and increase the value of the main shareholders stakes. Oh, and it also plays some football matches. The ground still sells out so where`s the problem? The people in charge are BUSINESS people, not football people and in a business sense NCFC is doing extremely well. It`s up to US to let them know that making a tidy profit each year and concentrating on infrastructure projects whilst the team spirals into decline is not good enough. Progress on the pitch for supporters is still by far the most important thing. Isn`t it.....???

[/quote]

Here here, exactly how i felt after drawing to 10 man southend rock bottom of the championship at home on a cold boxing day. Why the hell do/did we clap idiots like hughes and robinson onto the pitch. Don''t give all that rubbish, they try hard. Think of all the top players who played here, came through the ranks, or grew their bones on the grass at carrow road, it''s a disgrace to them. To sell out for a hotel in the corner of the ground was a step too far for me, i don''t mind restraunts and all that but putting a hotel in that corner is ridiculous. We could easily have put a corner in there don''t give me all that cr@p about safety, how do man u and chelsea et al. do it then?

Hopefully with the turners on board things will (and sort of are) change. At least we seem to be willing to splash some cash and Grant already seems to have judged the right players to bring in. Bringing cureton in is a BIG statement of intent. Smudger and you other downers seem to forget that although he''s 32, not scored many etc. that he bleeds yellow and green. And i value that well above how good he''s supposed to be. This weekend has turned out to be one of the most progressive ones for 3 years after all the down turns we''ve had. I''d rather have Cureton, Marshall + another striker and a midfielder/defender than Earnshaw. With 2m on board extra we will have a good squad come august. So keep faith with the board as this seems at the moment, the most postive board to conveen since our promotion season.
[/quote]

I do not seem to forget that at all.... I too wanted Cureton in but as back up to Eanshaw/Sharp/Eastwood.. Plus a target man like Porter or Riordan...

Truth is we are unlikely to have any of the other players mentioned here at Carrow Road come the start of the season and at best will have kept a squad together that is capable of finishing around about 16th again.... 

You may not be seeing us struggle against Southend on a cold winters night this season... but instead you will have the joys of watching us struggle against Scunthorpe, Barnsley, Colchester, Blackpool, Bristol City etc

Hope you enjoy!!!!  [:D]

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Cluck "][quote user="Tumbleweed"]

I''d be lying if I said I never get frustrated with events at CR. I''d be lying if I said I didn''t think twice often before getting into my car for a four hour drive for a home game. The times I feel depressed on the journey home make me wonder why I do it. The news of our only truly valuable playing asset disappoints, the fact we haven''t signed Fernando Torres or Thierry Henry in replacement is clear incompetence by the Board allowing them to go to overrated clubs resting on past glories. The failure last season disappointed me, relegation disappointed me, 9 years of Division One football did also, as did O''Neill walking, and tame FA Cup semi final defeats and dismal penalties in Cardiff.

But I still support my club, I look forward to the future. I may not be happy with aspects of what happens from time to time but frankly that''s life. I get disappoitned when my boss fails to give me his job and clearly doesn''t appreciate I''m far better than him, hell why shouldn''t I be running the entire company. I''m disappointed my car is old, my house isn''t very big and my kids squabble too much.

It''s life. But if it got to the stage where my football club disgusts me it would have been time to bail out because it wouldn''t be worth it anymore. Big boys cope, little boys sulk. 

[/quote]

Interesting post...but big boys wouldn''t whine about their boss...they get out there and make their own success. Big boys would also make it their business to achieve the big house/big car syndrome if it was their passion...they wouldn''t simply bemoan their fate and carry on with the same old.

Here lies the fundamental difference between those of us with some "get up and go"...and those who simply let life roll by. It is because I have always battered down doors to achieve my goals that I find it so frustrating watching others roll over....and why I do not accept the circus we have for a club in 2007 as "inevitable".

Two trains of thought and two psyches....and with such a diverse range of people the reason things get so petty on here so often. I fear many who spend much of their time glued to a computer screen are the very people who find it easy to accept "what is"....because in the virtual world they can be whatever they like...as long as it doesn''t conflict with reality.

Reality is where the future of our club lies...not in computer fantasy land where anything is theoretically possible at the press of a button. I fear too many modern fans on this forum live in this world and so have lost the ability to know what they want....simply because there isn''t that "button" to push to make everything alright again.

 

[/quote]

Spot on Cluck...

It is like when redundancy happens at a firm...

You get the @ss-lickers trying to hang on to their awful jobs that have been whinging about for years for dear life... and on the other hand you get people who as soon as the word VOLUNTARY REDUNDANCY is mentioned are yeah I''m up for a bit of that...

Just think what I could do with the time and the cash...

I could have a holiday, I could start up my own business etc etc etc

I tell you... the letter I have on my desk at the moment you would just not believe!!!

[FramCanary 0]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[/quote]

Spot on FRAM... but don''t expect many to listen...

It is like talking to a brick wall on here!!!

[Ginja 26]

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

[/quote]

I won''t comment on the finacial side as I don''t have enough knowlege on the matter but currently IMHO the finances are not dire, we are in debt but I suspect the debt is well managed and I am happy with that.

[quote user="FramCanary"]

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

[/quote]

How can you say that? Lappin and Fotheringham were peanuts, Cureton is undisclosed fee and Marshall is an excellent keeper well worth the money although an exact figure I don''t know I believe in the region of £800k plus add ons. Plus half of theses players haven''t even played a game, while Lappin is progressing well, the jury is still out on Fotheringham for me.

[quote user="FramCanary"]

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake.

[/quote]

Yeh because a big fan base mean we definatly should be in the premiership, I''m afraid no club has the right to success it comes from hard work and perseverance. There is no quick fix to Norwich and "sacking" the board will not give us immediate success in fact it will most likely do damage in the short and possibly the long term.

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

[/quote]I''m afraid I don''t see the shambles, clearly you need some perspective, Leeds for instance....? I must agree though where is the passion? all I see is inner hatred and ridicule, the more you and others insult other fans with differing opinions, the more likely we will resist the few people seeking to gut the club.

[Mello Yello 2,289]

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[/quote]

Careful Fram......Folk will insinuate that you have a ''pump action patella'' that has inconsistent and erratic spasms - every time you state negatives concerning ''those who can ne''er do wrong''........and question the finest Chief Exec, a club could wish for.[8-|]

Good post Fram........[Y]  

[Mr.Carrow 376]

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[/quote]

Good post FramCanary, as per usual once a few facts come into play which shed a more realistic light on the current boards tenure the thread is allowed to die. Don`t forget in recent years the club have also been recieving instalments on the £6.2million TaylorWoodrow land deal, £1.1million from the hotel and had G.Watlings £1.5million written off. And in this period we have watched as the squad has got progressively smaller and weaker and ended up flirting with relegation.

But apparently if you don`t go along with the "blind faith" brigade you will be rounded on by the pack as Smudger and Cluck have been. Quite surreal IMO.

[mbncfc 1]

Nah, just a bit bored of a debate which will never get closer to a resolution.

It is amazing what we all consider facts to be. The F-word gets bandied around a lot on here, sadly not usually attaching itself to anything which can be called such.

But there we go, which is what we do if we get bored of these things...

[Mr.Carrow 376]

[quote user="mbncfc"]

Nah, just a bit bored of a debate which will never get closer to a resolution.

It is amazing what we all consider facts to be. The F-word gets bandied around a lot on here, sadly not usually attaching itself to anything which can be called such.

But there we go, which is what we do if we get bored of these things...

[/quote]

Well i guess if people are not prepared to take the figures in the fully audited accounts, or stated in public by representatives of the club at face value then to some people there are obviously no such things as a facts. I`m bored too. Bored of trying to "debate" with people who have strong opinions based on little other than emotion who can only accept those facts which back up there own argument, and studiously ignore those that don`t.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[/quote]

Good post FramCanary, as per usual once a few facts come into play which shed a more realistic light on the current boards tenure the thread is allowed to die. Don`t forget in recent years the club have also been recieving instalments on the £6.2million TaylorWoodrow land deal, £1.1million from the hotel and had G.Watlings £1.5million written off. And in this period we have watched as the squad has got progressively smaller and weaker and ended up flirting with relegation.

But apparently if you don`t go along with the "blind faith" brigade you will be rounded on by the pack as Smudger and Cluck have been. Quite surreal IMO.

[/quote]

 

He he he.  As you might be able to tell Mr. C...they are very easy to draw out and show their true colours beautifully....and yellow is certainly dominant!.

Anger management required on the whole I''d say.....but not until I''ve gotten bored with them.......[:)]

 

[FramCanary 0]

Why is it - that it was no surprise to learn that Grant was unaware of the outrageously small ''escape clause'' in Earnshaw''s contract or that negotiations over his departure were at an advanced stage, until he received a phone call late on Wednesday night to say that the player was about to undertake a medical at Derby prior to signing a contract. Indeed Grant (reading between the lines in today''s EDP) is incensed at the way in which the board have handled the whole affair. He effectively states that he was trying to sign Sharp or Eastwood to partner Earnshaw, and that he intended to acquire Cureton as back-up for Earnie. He now admits that his transfer plan needs a complete re-think.

QUITE UNBELIEVABLE - that a professional football club can be run like this.

Clearly, the escape clause in Etuhu''s contract (thought to be £1.5m - although Grant will be as in the dark over this as us!) will be activated shortly, and yet another key player will be gone.

ENDLESS MISTAKES & A TENURE OF FAILURE, TIME FOR A CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MisterCarrow 0]

The other Mr Carrow has shown up.

I hope people won''t get us mixed up.

[nutty nigel 7,528]

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Why is it - that it was no surprise to learn that Grant was unaware of the outrageously small ''escape clause'' in Earnshaw''s contract or that negotiations over his departure were at an advanced stage, until he received a phone call late on Wednesday night to say that the player was about to undertake a medical at Derby prior to signing a contract. Indeed Grant (reading between the lines in today''s EDP) is incensed at the way in which the board have handled the whole affair. He effectively states that he was trying to sign Sharp or Eastwood to partner Earnshaw, and that he intended to acquire Cureton as back-up for Earnie. He now admits that his transfer plan needs a complete re-think.

QUITE UNBELIEVABLE - that a professional football club can be run like this.

Clearly, the escape clause in Etuhu''s contract (thought to be £1.5m - although Grant will be as in the dark over this as us!) will be activated shortly, and yet another key player will be gone.

ENDLESS MISTAKES & A TENURE OF FAILURE, TIME FOR A CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[/quote]

 Does "reading between the lines" and "effectively states" really warrant such a rant?

Quoting the actual text this is what Grant did state:-

Speculation had been mounting over Earnshaw''s future, but Grant admitted he was surprised when Derby called. "I didn''t think we would lose Earnie, I genuinely thought, where would he go in the Premier League," said Grant. "Is it somebody who was there last year or one of the new boys?"

This would suggest that Grant knew of the clause but didn’t think anyone in the Premier League would activate it. But then Grant says so many things sometimes because on the same day he says:-

"Earnie has come right out of the blue," he said. "We got an offer on Wednesday, but it set alarm bells ringing in my mind - obviously someone was selling him behind my back. "I think the way things moved as quickly and Earnie ending up having the medical as quickly, you can sense that it had obviously been going on, which is the modern day game, unfortunately. It''s disappointing in the respect of the way it happened."

And he goes on to say:-

"Unfortunately it is not just this club - all 92 clubs, even the smallest clubs, there will be the same thing: permission to speak at x, y and z amount of money."
And while the clause has worked against Grant this time, he admits he used it to City''s benefit in January when Simon Lappin joined City from St Mirrren.
"We used it with Simon Lappin because we knew he had it and we had information that he had a buy-out in his contract - that is the nature of the beast, although pre-warning is not a bad thing."

Grant say’s so many things every time he talks that it can get confusing but I can find no mention of Sharp or Eastwood or where he said his transfer plans need a complete re-think. Can you point me to those bits Fram?

 

[James Kent 0]

I think you''re find that he is talking about agents not board.

[Branston Pickle 3,651]

[quote user="Jim Kent"]I think you''re find that he is talking about agents not board.[/quote]

I think if anyone reads PG''s actual comments, it is indeed clear he is talking about agents - not the board - having pretty much done the deal behind the club''s back, he suggests this was how the clause came out as it is in an agent''s interest as he gets more money. 

At the end of the day, we can''t really complain too much as I''m damn sure we would take advantage of such things if the show was on the other foot - indeed, PG actually says we did with the Lappin transfer; of course this was a different league financially but the principle is surely the same as we took advantage of the situation.

[mbncfc 1]

[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="mbncfc"]

Nah, just a bit bored of a debate which will never get closer to a resolution.

It is amazing what we all consider facts to be. The F-word gets bandied around a lot on here, sadly not usually attaching itself to anything which can be called such.

But there we go, which is what we do if we get bored of these things...

[/quote]

Well i guess if people are not prepared to take the figures in the fully audited accounts, or stated in public by representatives of the club at face value then to some people there are obviously no such things as a facts. I`m bored too. Bored of trying to "debate" with people who have strong opinions based on little other than emotion who can only accept those facts which back up there own argument, and studiously ignore those that don`t.

[/quote]

Thank you for that.

In Fram''s post there are many statements of fact with plenty of emotional content and not many figures. I agree with you Mr Carrow, that people should really just stick to the statistics. Which, of course, by this logic prove the board should be sacked.

Personally, I''m just enjoying the rumour mill at the moment. Is that wrong, or is that part of the point?

Or should I get continually annoyed at the fact we''re £19.2m in debt?

I, I, I don''t believe it...

[Mr.Carrow 376]

mbncfc, there are plenty of figures in Fram`s post- nearly all of which come from the accounts or have been stated by club representatives. My last post was a general comment on the attitude of alot of people on here, not you specifically, so don`t take it personally. If people want to ignore the mis-management of the club over the last few years it is entirely up to them but it won`t make the reality of it go away.

I`m enjoying the current developments too. Maybe the pressure applied by passionate supporters for the club to get back to focussing on improving a weak and failing squad rather than infrastructure is starting to have an affect? I certainly hope so, but i hope the pressure will continue to be applied despite the barrage of petty abuse it is usually met with on these boards.

[mbncfc 1]

All good Mr.Carrow. Sorry I took it personally.

However, although I have no problems with the numbers quoted, I also think there are a lot of opinions made, which should not be confused with facts. I don''t agree with them, but of course many do.

As for Eadie and O''Neill, I remember at the time plenty of people who would''ve called for the Board''s heads if they sold our then-considered ''prime assets'' as a result of previous Chase fire sales. The backlash then would have been far greater than that given to us by hindsight.

[quote user="FramCanary"]

Hardly ''knee-jerk''. Our ''Prudence with ambition'' approach failed to keep us in the Premier League & actually saw net debt rise over the same/subsequent period.

Last season we saw the sale of key players (Green & Mckenzie) for reasonable fees & collected a second instalment of £7.1m parachute monies. Just recently we have received a 600k ''grant'' from the Premier League, a £2m loan from Smiths friends and then rake in a knock-down £3.5m for Earshaw. Further ''add-on'' monies are coming in from West Ham (should they maintain PL status) for Ashton & Green - and yet we remain in dire-straits financially.

If the press/message boards are correct, we also seem to be paying over the odds for the sort of players coming in.

It is hardly surprising that the sort of ''quality'' player that Grant is after is not interested in joining a club in this sort of mess.

It is a terrible shame that (despite being in the top 2 or 3 best supported sides in the division) we are an average side being run by an inept board making mistake after mistake after mistake. In the early days the new board inherited £6m of net debt and took the decision not to cash in on combined offers of £13.5m from Spurs & Bolton for O''Neill & Eadie (noted by the board in the Accounts) - only to then under-sell several players & miss out on significant levels of income. Ten years on, and we find ourselves £20m in debt, despite the sort of income levels we cold have only dreamed about years ago.

Surely everyone can see what a complete shambles of a club it is. Where is the passion of our once great supporter base. To use the words of Bobby Robson (sorry - I feel sick after typing his name!) some of the supporters of this club a ''zombies''. Controlled by Smith, with an inability to think for themselves.

Think back over the past 10 years - exclude the brief success achieved by Worthy & Huckerby(living legend) & what you see is an embarassing period riddled with errors. ''Knee-jerk'' - you are having a laugh!.

[/quote]

[FramCanary 0]

None of us (not even Huckerby) would mind if we sold one (sometimes two) of our better players each year, as long as:

1) They were sold at top value.

2) An adequate replacement with scope to improve/develop into an equally capable player, had been purchased at the same time.

3) That any such sale would prove to have little effect on overall team ability, so that we maintained the drive to achieve success on the field of play.

Not so long ago we were without the support of wealthy owners & their friends, and had not received the extensive riches on offer to clubs who reach the Premier league in this current era. Player sales were a necessity in keeping us self-sufficient. As history tells us, when managed correctly a medium sized club can lose the occasional player to the wealthy ''vultures'' & still compete at the highest level.

Our inept Board of Directors made it clea that with the £2m of investment from Smith''s friends - NO Players would need to be sold!!!!!!!!!!

We now find that 3 of our best players have/are being sold - a situation which is angering both Grant and one of his senior & most influential players. In addition, the Club captain has also (on 2 occasions in the past year) been quoted by the press as being unhappy with the imbalance of quality going out against that coming in.

How unbelievable it is - that Chase was hounded from office after bringing us the most successful period in the club''s history. He left us £6m in debt, but with player values way in excess of this, & other assets which have been extremely beneficial to the curent Board. These clowns have resided over a period of under-achievement on the pitch, and yet some people are still trying to suggest that they have done nothing wrong.

The club is being run by a bunch of idiots who have achieved nothing but failure. They WASTED the chance of medium to long term financial & on-field success & clearly do not share the ambitions of Grant and many of the players and supporters. They are a disgrace - simple as that!.

[Dr Terrible 0]

Get em out before we go down!

[MightyYellows50 0]

And bring in who?????

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="MightyYellows50"]And bring in who?????[/quote]

Who cares???

Roland Rat and Kevin the Gerbil would quite fankly do a much better job I''m sure.... yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhh Rat Rappin!!!!  [:P]

[mr carra 0]

I really cannot believe the witless ignorance displayed by so-called "supporters" on here.

Take this from Fram Canary:

"These clowns have resided over a period of under-achievement on the pitch, and yet some people are still trying to suggest that they have done nothing wrong."

I would rather suggest we have witnessed a period of over-achievement on the pitch.  We are a club with mid-Championship level resources and yet in the last 10 tears have had a playoff final and a Championship-winning side.  That, frankly, is punching above our weight.

They are failures, apparently, because we are not an established Premiership club.  But these critical fans consistently produce no realistic ideas as to what we could do better.  They moan about the clauses in Earnshaw & Etuhu''s contracts as incompetent, ignoring teh fact that without those clauses players of such quality would never have come to the club.  In which case, of course, those very same whingers would have been on here castigating the board for that!

The truth, which is painful but still has to be faced, is that we spent pretty much all the money we had (and more, hence the increased debt) on footballers in a bid to establish ourselves in the Prem.  And it still wasn''t enough, because the costs of top level football are so extraordinarily high these days.  Players and rich clubs have ALL the power these days, to an unprecedented extent, and clubs like ours to not have the freedom some seem to think in making deals.  If you want to attract players you have to let them get their terms - because if you don''t someone else will (unless of course they are no good, in which case you don''t want them, anyway).

Now unless these whining toads are prepared to throw in tens of millions of their own money I fail to see what they are contributing to help the club go forward (let''s have a boycott and force the club to increase its debt - that will help!!!!)