Worthington or Grant

[Green and Yellow 0]

Now that the season is almost over it is time to ask the question  would we ,as a club, have been any worse off now, under Worthington if he had remained at the club?

[First Jedi 0]

We''d be relegated with Worthy. I''m with Grant - all the way! :)

[blahblahblah 2]

Given that half of the players seemed to have stopped working for Worthington, I''d say that we would have been worse off if he had stayed.   We might even have been relegated.  Grant needs more time to create his own team.

[Evil Monkey 52]

In terms of performances, we''re better off with Grant as he does seem to slowly be instilling a good footballing ethos... in terms of league position, probably no better than if we''d still had Worthy...The difference is the signings that Grant has made, such as Lappin, and showing that although not all of them have worked, he is at least looking to address key areas that Worthy seemed to overlook.Also, I wonder how Worthy would have coped with the Earnie injury?  Grant used it as an opporunity to blood a brilliant youngster, which has paid dividends... one can only imagine Worthy loaning in some unfit Premiership reserve player...

[John Boubepo 0]

I honestly believe we would have finished higher under Worthington, not much higher but higher all the same

[macdougalls perm 0]

Undoubtedly Grant!!

[nolegs 0]

daft question,without doubt Worthington would have seen us down.

[dr livingstone 0]

grant for me, worthy had his time.

[XXL16 0]

PG for sure. Under Worthy we will never see Eagle, Martin, Spillane and Renton in the first 16, also Shacks will play the reserves and we will see Doherty partner Dion on defence.

[nutty nigel 7,531]

I agree with Blah, JB and Dr. Livingstone in that I too think we would have finished higher under Worthington, but he has had his time and Grant needs more time to create his own side.

 

[nolegs 0]

[quote user="John Boubepo"]I honestly believe we would have finished higher under Worthington, not much higher but higher all the same
[/quote]It''s all about opinions,but I honestly can''t see what you are basing this one on.

[Syteanric 1]

Worthington had made too much of a fist of things by that stage.. he''d of taken us down... we might even already have been doomed.

jas :)

[Gingerpele 0]

ME

[Cluck 0]

With such great signings as Brown and Fotheringdick under his belt.....Grant shows us he is a great choice to take us nowhere.

So in essence...neither of them are remotely fit to sit in the managers chair in my view.

[GJP 79]

Difficult one, in some ways. I liked Nigel Worthington, I thought he was a good manager who wanted to play good football. Unfortunately he did start to lose his way and it was time for him to move on, but that happens to plenty of managers,

As for Grant...well he gives it the big talk but so far he hasn''t quite delivered. Fair enough he needs time to build his own team but there are aspects of his management I don''t like. I can''t help but feel he over does the ranting on the touchline, there''s a time and a place for it but he does it too much. You know sometimes you''d like to have your players nice and relaxed but focussed on the game, not being distracted by some Scotsman barking out things they probably already know.

Another thing I dislike about him is his habit for changing a winning team. He has done it so many times since he''s been here, pretty much everytime we win a game he changes the side/system for the next game. Even just putting in Martin for Dublin gave us less of a chance yesterday.

Also his team selections have been a bit dodgy over his time here, although there has been improvement in recent weeks.

At Nigel Worthingtons peak we were the best football side in this league, box to box we played the ball better than anyone. Can I see Peter Grant getting us playing that well? Nah, not at the moment.

We''ll have to see what happens after the summer but for me it''ll take a bit more than putting a youngster into the team, sending a couple more out on loan and promising to drop under-performing players to impress me.

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

I agree with Blah, JB and Dr. Livingstone in that I too think we would have finished higher under Worthington, but he has had his time and Grant needs more time to create his own side.

 

[/quote]

only JB actually said that!!! As for had his time - had his time then some matey....  Judge him on the teamn he built - his criteria!  well its ****.

I think we would be worse off under Worthy, had he stayed much longer I feel the atmosphere in the ground would have become unbearable - such as in the Burnley humiliation, and during his last few games at bloomfioeld road where he was hounded out for sending them plummetting towards division 2.

[ZLF 274]

Impossible to say - the rot seemed to have set in from the international break in early Sept and Worthy did not show any signs that he knew how to stop it.   On top of 18 months of floundering before I remain of the view that he had run his course as city manager and would not have turned things around.

Things have not changed significantly under PG as yet - we are still frustratingly underperforming and hugely inconsistent;   despite peoples moans about players I remain convinced we do have the hard core of a promotion winning squad - if only the drive and desire was there to compete week in week out.  That remains lacking and PG seems no closer to unlocking that one that Worthy did.

Are we better off?  A tentative yes for me,  not because I think PGis a better manager but the club needed a change.   The only glimmer of hope is that the winter transfer window showed that the new man has idenified what needs changing,  whether he can change it with what is needed to gain promotion is another matter;   my long term expectations are that PG will build a squad in his image which will progress us towards the play offs better than we have seen for the last two season;  but it will take a third manager to give us an extra push to get us promoted again.  I just think that is the cycle we are in.

There is your challenge PG - prove me wrong.

[John Boubepo 0]

[quote user="nolegs"][quote user="John Boubepo"]I honestly believe we would have finished higher under Worthington, not much higher but higher all the same[/quote]It''s all about opinions,but I honestly can''t see what you are basing this one on.[/quote]On this one I agree with Cluck, neither Worthington or Grant should have been given the job, Worthington was no better than average and Grant has yet to convince me he is any better than Worthington, not unless you listen to Grants waffle of course, then he''s better than big Phil Scolari

[Smudger 0]

[quote user="Cluck "]

With such great signings as Brown and Fotheringdick under his belt.....Grant shows us he is a great choice to take us nowhere.

So in essence...neither of them are remotely fit to sit in the managers chair in my view.

[/quote]

Couldn''t agree more Cluck...

Joe Royale, Paul Simpson, Ian Dowie, Steve Tilson, Mike Newell... There were many better candidates to take this fine club forwards...

Even Paul Ince, or is he just another dirty ex-manc not worth spitting on in many peoples eyes???  oh isn''t Roy Keane doing well at Sunderland???

[macdougalls perm 0]

Cluck wrote "Fotheringdick" - very clever, I see what you did there, lol[:D].

[nutty nigel 7,531]

[quote user="Citizen Journalist Foghorn"][quote user="nutty nigel"]

I agree with Blah, JB and Dr. Livingstone in that I too think we would have finished higher under Worthington, but he has had his time and Grant needs more time to create his own side.

 

[/quote]

only JB actually said that!!! As for had his time - had his time then some matey....  Judge him on the teamn he built - his criteria!  well its ****.

I think we would be worse off under Worthy, had he stayed much longer I feel the atmosphere in the ground would have become unbearable - such as in the Burnley humiliation, and during his last few games at bloomfioeld road where he was hounded out for sending them plummetting towards division 2.

[/quote]

JB said he thought we would finish higher under Worthy and I agreed. Dr. Livingstone said Worthy had had his time and I agree with that too. Blah said Grant needs more time to create his own side which I also agree with.

Trouble with you is that as soon as you see Worthy''s name on here the "red mist" comes down and you just go into rant mode!

Oh, and why I think we would have finished higher this season is because Worthingtons 4 complete seasons in this division we finished 6th, 8th, 1st and 9th.

If you wanted him out because of Blackpool then why didn''t you hound him out when he sent us soaring towards the premiership?

Like I said countless times to you CJF, I believed that Worthingtons time was up. Poor performances and our dreadful away record were the reasons. However I can still recognise his achievements at our club without bitterness.

 

[ricky knight 0]

The idea of outing Worthy was to make things better but there is no difference in my book. Grant has done nout his record is very average results wise, if he has the same sort of results in his 2nd season, people will be screaming for his head. I personally feel with Worthy we would probably been in about the same position, so at the moment Grant is a sideway step imo. 

[Citizen Journalist Foghorn 0]

[quote user="nutty nigel"]

Oh, and why I think we would have finished higher this season is because Worthingtons 4 complete seasons in this division we finished 6th, 8th, 1st and 9th.

If you wanted him out because of Blackpool then why didn''t you hound him out when he sent us soaring towards the premiership?

Like I said countless times to you CJF, I believed that Worthingtons time was up. Poor performances and our dreadful away record were the reasons. However I can still recognise his achievements at our club without bitterness.

[/quote]

I''m sure in future I will remember the good times that he gave us.  But while we are still feeling the after effects of his disastrous last two seasons, the appalling state of the squad since his expensive sacking I have not got too many good words for this simpleton.

I would put money on him failing at his next club.

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

[quote user="ricky knight"]The idea of outing Worthy was to make things better but there is no difference in my book. Grant has done nout his record is very average results wise, if he has the same sort of results in his 2nd season, people will be screaming for his head. I personally feel with Worthy we would probably been in about the same position, so at the moment Grant is a sideway step imo. [/quote]

Oh you have just got to be kidding! Yes, a lot of performances and results have been average with Grant (and also a couple of bad ones) - but to actually come on here and say that ''I personally feel with Worthy we would probably have been in about the same position'' is madness! 

If Worthless had not been sacked after the Burnley embarrassment, and he was still here now, then we would definitely be in the drop zone or perhaps even bottom.

Look at some of the dross that Grant has been unfortunate enough to inherit: Gallacher, Thorne, McVeigh, Robinson (to start with), Doherty, even Drury''s been poor this season at times. I would actually go as far as to thank Grant for steering us away from it, because with the aforementioned players plus Hughes and the inconsistent Etuhu and Safri, he has had one HELL of a job on his hands this year!

The summer is absolutely key to the future of this club and if Grant AND the Board can make some big decisions in who goes, who stays and who comes in, then next season is going to be very, very interesting [:P].

[Green and Yellow 0]

In reply to bigmarkcanary. Is the embarrassment of the Burnley game for Worthington the same embarrassment as the Colchester game for Grant?

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

[quote user="Grumpy "]In reply to bigmarkcanary. Is the embarrassment of the Burnley game for Worthington the same embarrassment as the Colchester game for Grant?[/quote]

 

No it isn''t Grumpy. The Burnley game was the absolute last straw (should have gone months before that though) after about two years of bad decisions and, although yes we scored, I don''t think we turned up for much of it. I sit in the front row of the Lower Barclay and to see some of those goals fly in, along with watching possibly the worst home performance of the season, it was very embarrassing and painful.

At Col U, I feel it was a bit of a different story. The first half was pretty much even, I think. The second half though, well, serious questions have to be asked over what players stay or go - not whether Grant should be sacked, or anything like that. Not very many teams at all have gone to Layer Road this season and got something, that''s a fact. When Cureton put them in front, I just couldn''t see us getting back into it sadly.

I hope that answers your question.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Grumpy "]In reply to bigmarkcanary. Is the embarrassment of the Burnley game for Worthington the same embarrassment as the Colchester game for Grant?[/quote]

Wa hey!  Excellent question for those Shrekies who are following the new man with the same fervour as they did Worthington (until they decided they didn''t like him anymore). 

The bloke is a no hoper....and it doesn''t matter how long you give him to prove otherwise.  If he has any success at all he''ll be off to where the bigger job is faster than you can say Jimmy.  If he fails he''ll just join the scrap heap of other Delia Smith appointees....while we fans end up holding the sickly baby.

His tactics are rubbish...his signings are rubbish...and his raport with the fans lamentable. Not too dissimilar to Worthington, Hamilton and Rioch before him.  Just expect more of the same and you won''t be disappointed. 

[mbncfc 1]

[quote user="Cluck "]

[quote user="Grumpy "]In reply to bigmarkcanary. Is the embarrassment of the Burnley game for Worthington the same embarrassment as the Colchester game for Grant?[/quote]

Wa hey!  Excellent question for those Shrekies who are following the new man with the same fervour as they did Worthington (until they decided they didn''t like him anymore). 

The bloke is a no hoper....and it doesn''t matter how long you give him to prove otherwise.  If he has any success at all he''ll be off to where the bigger job is faster than you can say Jimmy.  If he fails he''ll just join the scrap heap of other Delia Smith appointees....while we fans end up holding the sickly baby.

His tactics are rubbish...his signings are rubbish...and his raport with the fans lamentable. Not too dissimilar to Worthington, Hamilton and Rioch before him.  Just expect more of the same and you won''t be disappointed. 

[/quote]

I bet you''re glad Clock''s on your side Grumpy, eh?! [:P] [O]

[lucky green trainers 0]

we seem to be winning more games away under grant than worthy, as well as having the usual no-shows, but on the negative side - FCR is no more, mind you - it was already weakened under worthy. 

[Bigmarkcanary 0]

[quote user="lucky green trainers"]we seem to be winning more games away under grant than worthy, as well as having the usual no-shows, but on the negative side - FCR is no more, mind you - it was already weakened under worthy. 


[/quote]

Yep, I agree with all of that - especially the first dozen words [Y]