Racial Abuse towards Ade Akinbiyi

[BES 0]

Was anyone sitting behind goal in N&P around row F seats, I was sitting with my 12 year old daughter, and when Ade Akinbiyi came close to goal,This guy shouted ''you Black Bast*rd'', we both could not believe it, did anyone else hear this?. Im glad I dont sit in that seat very often, we are normally in new stand, this man is disgusting, got home gone 7pm and still fuming, and extermely cross that I didnt complain to a ground steward.

[yaryello 0]

find that hard to believe after all that has happened recently with norwich and racist comments.im only sorry you and your daughter were exposed to that idiot behaviour bes

[The Original Yellow Fever 0]

I agree! I witnessed a similar scenario at the Gillingham game also In the N&P from "C" row although not directed at a player but shouted out in discussion with another person. I also did not let a steward know but have written to the club and explained the situation. i suggest that you would like to let the club know as well, it could be the same person!

[susie b 0]

I agree wholeheartedly with your disgust. There is no place for this here or anywhere else. However, I think I''m right in saying that, even if you report it to the club now, they will be unable to do anything about it. It is only possible to deal with if reported to a ground steward at the time of the incident. Perhaps, if there is a next time, you will talk to a steward straight away and hopefully the miscreant will be shown the nearest exit. That''s easier said than done sometimes, I suppose, as such an event might leave some people feeling shocked and a bit at a loss as to what to do for the best. Telling someone in authority, though, must be the way to go or these ignorant individuals will continue to be a blight on the game and on society in general. I hope this won''t ever happen again to you, BES, but I fear that it could happen to any of us at any time, so we must be ready to stick together and act accordingly.

[Bury Yellow 2]

I can understand your disgust BES especially as your 12 year old was with you. Would you have been equally upset if someone had called Holt a ''ginger b*****d''?

It is sad that after a tremendous afternoons entertainment you had to go home in that frame of mind and I hope that you don''t have to experience that sort of thing again.

Carrow Road must be one of the best grounds in the country for crowd behaviour. This is even more impressive when you think we also have growing reputation for creating an intimidating atmosphere for visiting teams. A great combination.

By the way, we all know what the referee was being called of course!

[BES 0]

Bury Belvior..yes I would have also been disgusted at calling Holt a ginger B*****d! it is also racist!! but calling the referee a wanker is not racist!! and yes perhaps he was, its racisism thats the question here not the referee..

[Helsinki canary 240]

I fully agree that there is no place at Carrow Road or NCFC for racial abuse, however the club and police must be consistent in its classification of racist abuse - I never heard major complaints when the "sad scottish B.....d", song was being aimed at Mr Burley, this issue needs to be levelled towards all nationalities not just skin colour.

[First Wizard 0]

BES: How on earth does calling Holt a ginger ba***ard constitute racism?, unless you read the Guardian that is!, I''m not with you my friend. No wonder your young companion is upset.

[MadDan 0]

I think you''ll find that race is rather different to nationality.

Nationality is interchangable and is determined by the whim of politicians rather than some supposed genetic difference.

Would have thought there was far more to be critical of "wee george " than that of his birth place.

Looks like he''ll be taking another club down a division

[Bury Yellow 2]

Absolutely Helsinki. There has to be consistency. Why haven''t the Cardiff supporters had any action taken against them for their anti English chants?

Anyhow, it''s not good that it happened but it is an extremely small minority at CR, now its onwards and upwards.

From my view from the Barclay, the River End even joined in with the chanting and made it a great atmosphere. Well done all.

[BES 0]

No, 1st Wizard, I do not read the Guardian! but after copious amounts of wine and it was way past my bedtime, let me rephrase myself...what I wanted to say... that if he was called a SCOTTISH ginger bastard..that is rasist..is that better? maybe I should not post after midnight!!

[olster 0]

I am sorry Bury but i think you are opening a can of worms here mate saying about cardiff

[deadly darren 0]

Maybe others should take note that there is no real difference between calling someone calling another Scottish, black or ginger. The only difference seems to be people''s perceptions of what they mean. It seems clear through reading the thread that people are not thinking for themesleves but just accepting what they read. I am not condoning racism, far from it, but maybe people should think twice before they refer to any foreign player as a useless foreign b*****d!
Also maybe people should think would there be the same ''outcry'' if it was a white player being called a useless white b*****d? I think not...

[MadDan 0]

Wizard, I would hardly think someone reading the Guardian is likely to mistake someone''s hair colour for a racial type.

Talking of nationalities in the constraint of racism is absurd as you can change nationality at the drop of a hat.

Try changing you skin pigmentation or the prejudices that go with it in the same fashion.

[deadly darren 0]

My point is that racism towards black people is considered so bad due to the effects that this prejudice had upon their lives. It was not just name calling and the like but there was actual discrimination in the country. Now the country has changed and if anything there now seems to be positive discimination as opposed to any real negative prejudice.

Racism is not also defined by just skin colour. Where there is racism/prejudice towards religious groups could they not just change their religion? Yes they could, but should they???

Any name calling is in principle wrong and is a type of prejudice but is there really any difference, as i have said earlier, between referring to someone as black, ginger, fat, thin, white in this day and age?

The only difference may be if there is the actual intent to cause the person distress by referring to them in such a way.

[BES 0]

well said darren....intelligent view..

[GenerationA47 746]

Hi, just wanted to suggest that if it sometimes seems incomprehensible that there''s a difference of perception of abuse on a racial basis & other kinds, then we have our recent ancestors to thank! It was educated Englishmen (like the slave-owner & philosopher John Locke) and other Europeans who first advocated the idea that other peoples were so different, they required a new social/legal category and must be treated differently from -and inferior to- ''whites''. This was convenient because it permitted slaving, territorial acquisition and what we would today call atrocities in relation to these inferior races, to the lasting benefit of the empires & individuals concerned...

So ''we'' invented race & racism, instilled this concept of difference in the subjected peoples, and nurtured it through ''our'' consequent treatment of various other races, through 1930s gas chambers, late 20thC British discrimination and race crime, right down to today''s ''anti-PC'' notions of anti-white discrimination. Unsurprisingly, as a result it''s also shaped the minorities'' own self-perceptions. This basic idea will be hard to get rid of! We can''t wish it away overnight, much as it may suit our psychological (and/or political) needs to pretend racism''s only an issue with the loony left.

The situation''s further complicated by nominally separate issues like immigration, national identity, poverty etc. The upshot is that when you call Akinbiyi a black b******, it''s not understood amongst honest, English-speaking adults as referring to his physical differences alone (as certain other abuse would, e.g. against thin people like myself), but also to all that it represents, especially the historically cruelly unequal relationship between blacks and whites and its repercussions. The same goes for abuse of other groups of people who we''ve systematically categorised & treated seriously negatively for centuries on the basis of cosmetic differences. Two short words capture all that background meaning, just like "Binner scum" is so satisfying because it means so much, without having to think about the detailed issues every time you shout it at the Scum. (Who however, indeed constitute an inferior species and must be treated as such. The difference there is we''ve never colonised, enslaved or otherwise deprived them of their human rights, however much they might laughably complain they have ''rights'' to the role Pride of Anglia, and not be drubbed twice by a clearly better side.

It''s surprising if people genuinely think society is now so tolerant that these issues are generally irrelevant; apparently they''ve somehow been sheltered from national media reports of race crimes, or the rise of the pathetic BNP in the North, or even meeting ordinary people like I know who''re more than willing in private (white-only) contexts to admit or even boast of their racist beliefs. So good for those that recognise it & stand up against it, even at the football.

[Bury Yellow 2]

....... and now a look at the weather!

[silver fox 0]

Before we get too carried away with different nationalities etc the answer is fairly simple in that if you feel offended by what is being shouted then report it to a steward. I am sure they have been given guidelines as to what is acceptable football banter and what is clearly racially motivated chanting. I know some of these people can be intimidating but the only way to get them removed from the ground is to report it. I pride myself that 99% of true Norwich supporters would never racially abuse any player, but unfortunately we live in a society where there are a minority of morons who do.

[First Wizard 0]

Mad Dan: For your information, I''ve suffered from discrimination/abuse, even at Carrow Road for years I''m ashamed to say, because I have a pronounced limp whilst walking. Do I come on these boards claiming racial or any other kind of discrimination?, no I damn well don''t!, until now. But I don''t see notice''s inside the ground condeming it!. And there are 6 million disabled people living in the UK!.

I get on with my life, and put it down to ignorance. I just don''t bleat about it or wear my disability on my sleeve like a badge. If someone is racist, its very unlikley racist laws will curtail those beliefs, in fact I would suggest one sided laws would only enhance that persons belief''s further!.

I know of people who claim they are anti racist, but are quite prepeared to laugh at the sight of someone limping!. And they go to Carrow Road!.

Get on with life its too short anyway.

End of rant.

[BES 0]

Wizard..subject Racial Abuse towards Ade Akinbiyi....What have I started? I was just complaining about an ingorant man behind me, but looks like ive started another debate, we all have issues in different ways, we are all different, some fat some thin, disfigured, ect ect, and we should not judge or comment on other people, you are correct in saying it is ignorance, we are a very unkind race, and yes people have 2 deal with it the best way they can, but maybe you talking about this, the very people who laughed at you are reading this and feel ashamed? but I very much doubt this, these people are a very small minority, and we are the good guys who can hold are heads up high, but one things for sure if I sit near this disgusting individual again I will report him, sorry if I have hit a nerve with you..

[cambscanary 0]

Take it you didn''t say anything then no???

In order for these type of numpties to realise that behaviour such as what has been described is unacceptable, they need to be told.

Saying nothing does nothing!

[BES 0]

Agree!!! I should have spoken to the steward..easy when the matter has passed, to say what if..should have said...wish i...if only..was on the spot and could kick myself that i didnt and quite unusual because im quite outspoken, regardless of company or place...but as said in earlier posts, i will if I see or hear anything like that again...in fact I will personally escort him 2 the steward..ok..and I hope if anyone else hears this man being racist again they will also act?

[First Wizard 0]

I would be 100% behind you BES, well in fact miles behind you, if you pointed out this pond life to a steward. But as I''m a devote coward, I''d make sure the moron does''nt see you do this. Yes, I know thats a pathetic excuse for non involvement, and I do feel a little ashamed about it. But I''d hate your good principles to be the cause of even more trouble for you. Sorry, I''m not being very positive or helpful am I?. And don''t worry about hitting a nerve, you missed!.

[BES 0]

Dont worry Wizard, we are all guilty...and im sure you are not a "coward" really, we all need to speak our mind, I do have this person seat number, but not sure if this seat is a season ticket holder or seat for sale, so best not post it...that my nice side...