How can Grants statement not bother you?

[PhatCanary 0]

Sorry to keep going on about it BUT, All of you at the game saturday your manager of six weeks called you a disgrace, your  hard earned money you give the club pay his wages and he thinks your a disgrace, you turn up week in, week out in your thousands but you are a disgrace your disgraceful lack of singing and disgraceful pressure you put on the poor players cost us two points!!, just one question, do you guys supporting Mr Grants statement really think you are the reason for the result against Hull, and are your backs sore from all the people you obviously let walk all over you like Mr Grant is doing? I''m not trying to stir the brown stuff i really honestly wanted this club to fly under Grant but he has just kicked us all in the kp''s and i won''t just sit there and take it!!!

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Phatcanary9"]

Sorry to keep going on about it BUT, All of you at the game saturday your manager of six weeks called you a disgrace, your  hard earned money you give the club pay his wages and he thinks your a disgrace, you turn up week in, week out in your thousands but you are a disgrace your disgraceful lack of singing and disgraceful pressure you put on the poor players cost us two points!!, just one question, do you guys supporting Mr Grants statement really think you are the reason for the result against Hull, and are your backs sore from all the people you obviously let walk all over you like Mr Grant is doing? I''m not trying to stir the brown stuff i really honestly wanted this club to fly under Grant but he has just kicked us all in the kp''s and i won''t just sit there and take it!!!

[/quote]

Hey up Phat.....and an interesting point.

I honestly think that some people will take anything as read......and being told they are a disgrace makes them begin to question their own thinking. It''s an esteem thing.

Personally I don''t give a toss what he says.....because I was there and fully understood why the fans were on edge......I mean it''s not a particular rarity to see City ship a goal in the last minute is it?

No doubt he was peeved.....and maybe he was just looking for a scapegoat for his own disappointment. I can live with it......but he has lost my vote for NCFC Manager Of TheYear that''s for sure.

[mbncfc 1]

I agree Cluck. It was obviously a stupid thing to say. If only he had avoided the D word...

It is about context and not taking such things personally. If he took a look at some of the things said about him recently, he could probably strop out for months.

The only possible reaction is to show him he''s wrong, Prove it. Rise to it.

Who is the winning in sulking??

[Chris Meadows 0]

he didn''t call the fans a disgrace, he called the actions of the fans a disgrace.

[In Dubious Battle 0]

Couldn''t agree more with these posts. Anyone who thinks what grant said was ok should go to work tomorrow and tell every customer they see they''re a disgrace and see how long you keep your job for. He has effectively called every customer of ncfc a disgrace the only answer is a mass boycott of tuesday''s game.

[Chris Meadows 0]

how ignorant can some of you people be? he didn''t call us a disgrace, he said the lack of support was a disgrace. we''re called supporters for a reason, i wonder what we''re supposed to do?

[Chip20 69]

I agree with mbncfc; stop sulking and prove the guy wrong! Raise the rafters tonight and if the team doesn''t respond you''ve proved he''s talking out of the wrong orifice and he''ll not be able to use that excuse again.

[Marty 0]

[quote user="Chris Meadows"]how ignorant can some of you people be? he didn''t call us a disgrace, he said the lack of support was a disgrace. we''re called supporters for a reason, i wonder what we''re supposed to do?[/quote]

 

very good point, people really are taking this too personally. Do we all have to be so sensative? Do we really want a manager that that says everything that we want to hear just to please us, or one who speaks his mind?  I prefer calling a spade a spade if I can use that figure of speech nowadays!

[Ginja 26]

[quote user="Phatcanary9"]

Sorry to keep going on about it BUT, All of you at the game saturday your manager of six weeks called you a disgrace, your  hard earned money you give the club pay his wages and he thinks your a disgrace, you turn up week in, week out in your thousands but you are a disgrace your disgraceful lack of singing and disgraceful pressure you put on the poor players cost us two points!!, just one question, do you guys supporting Mr Grants statement really think you are the reason for the result against Hull, and are your backs sore from all the people you obviously let walk all over you like Mr Grant is doing? I''m not trying to stir the brown stuff i really honestly wanted this club to fly under Grant but he has just kicked us all in the kp''s and i won''t just sit there and take it!!!

[/quote]Dosn''t bother me because I know I''ve been a good fan and it didnt apply to me. I know I don''t have to answer to grant as a fan and I can see the point in his arguement. Plus may I point out that he did not call us a disgrace he said its a disgrace that crowd did not give a better support and I thoroughly agree. You''ve completely taken what hes said out of context and made a mountain out of a mole hill and so has the media. I certainly won''t be sitting there taking it either though I''ll be standing up (until Im told to sit down) and cheering the team on showing Grant I''m not one of the sulkers and boo boys.The big question is Why are you making such a big fuss over it? the only reason I can think of is the truth hurts.

[JC 0]

Calling the lack of support a disgrace IS calling the fans a disgrace, so will people please stop trying to apologise for it by trying to claim it is somehow different.  If I walked into your workplace, looked at your work and called it a disgrace, how would you take it?  If I told Peter Grant that I found Saturday a disgrace, would he take it to mean I was calling him a disgrace?  Of course he would!

My real concern, when you look objectively (rather than discussing the published words of this boards very own witchfinder general) was Peters assertion that we were somehow a class above Hull, outplayed them and deserved to win.  I am afraid the game I saw was between two teams EQUALLY lacking in momentum, ideas and flair, and neither truly deserved to win. 

Lets shout and scream tonight, and if we get stuffed and play bad football, please can we collectively make sure that Grant and the board know that what he said was unacceptable.

On a seperate point, if Darren Huckerby, the biggest signing at this club for decades, is allowed to leave without a decent deal being offered, then that is an utter disgrace, and will mean me not renewing my season ticket.  I hope that if enough of us say it, then it will back the board into a corner.  At the moment they are clearly stalling in the hope that Celtic come in, so they can say ''not our fault''.

 

 

[quote user="Chris Meadows"]how ignorant can some of you people be? he didn''t call us a disgrace, he said the lack of support was a disgrace. we''re called supporters for a reason, i wonder what we''re supposed to do?[/quote]

[JC 0]

Or perhaps the majority are sick of trying to urge on rubbish,  unlike the herded sheep in some areas of the ground?

[quote user="UEA Canary"][quote user="Phatcanary9"]

Sorry to keep going on about it BUT, All of you at the game saturday your manager of six weeks called you a disgrace, your  hard earned money you give the club pay his wages and he thinks your a disgrace, you turn up week in, week out in your thousands but you are a disgrace your disgraceful lack of singing and disgraceful pressure you put on the poor players cost us two points!!, just one question, do you guys supporting Mr Grants statement really think you are the reason for the result against Hull, and are your backs sore from all the people you obviously let walk all over you like Mr Grant is doing? I''m not trying to stir the brown stuff i really honestly wanted this club to fly under Grant but he has just kicked us all in the kp''s and i won''t just sit there and take it!!!

[/quote]

Dosn''t bother me because I know I''ve been a good fan and it didnt apply to me. I know I don''t have to answer to grant as a fan and I can see the point in his arguement. Plus may I point out that he did not call us a disgrace he said its a disgrace that crowd did not give a better support and I thoroughly agree. You''ve completely taken what hes said out of context and made a mountain out of a mole hill and so has the media. I certainly won''t be sitting there taking it either though I''ll be standing up (until Im told to sit down) and cheering the team on showing Grant I''m not one of the sulkers and boo boys.

The big question is Why are you making such a big fuss over it? the only reason I can think of is the truth hurts.
[/quote]

[allways travelling 0]

I can understand grant having a go at the fans providing he his doing his job in the correct manner.But judging by the team selections and positioning  of personel and general play he is coming up very short in my opinion.I think this is why a number of fans took this so personally if we had been performing well its different but for him to try and lay the blame at the fans door is very childish and deserves the fans reaction he has got.I am over my rant now and want to forget all whats happened after all its only city who i care about. lets hope tonights game does become a cauldron and we get a result then something positive might come out of it and we can all put it behind us.

[mbncfc 1]

[quote user="JC"]

Calling the lack of support a disgrace IS calling the fans a disgrace, so will people please stop trying to apologise for it by trying to claim it is somehow different.  If I walked into your workplace, looked at your work and called it a disgrace, how would you take it?  If I told Peter Grant that I found Saturday a disgrace, would he take it to mean I was calling him a disgrace?  Of course he would!

[/quote]

But I disagree with this. If someone came along and said that of my work, I''d probably question what they know about it, and then make sure that the next time a comparable situation arises, that I prove how dam good my work is.

And if you told PG that Saturday was a disgrace, he''d probably try to argue it out with you as to the whos and whys, and you''d both agree to disagree. I cannot for one moment think PG would walk away from that conversation and think ''He''s just called me a disgrace...''

But that''s what has been expressed by so many on here, both sides of that coin. I think I''m right, and I''m sure many disagree... [|-)] It really depends how you wont to take it. It says more about you than PG.

[7rew 0]

Don''t bother me - I wasn''t there on saturday, as i live 200 miles away.Also I agree with him - I could hear the crowd on the radio listening to the commentry and their attitude stank. They are turning carrow road into another away match.we all know there are grounds - notably wolves where if you can hang on for long enough 30mins - 1 hour without conceeding the fans will turn on their team and you will probably win - we are becoming that ground, it is disgraceful.

[ronbol ronbol 0]

[quote user="Marty"]

[quote user="Chris Meadows"]how ignorant can some of you people be? he didn''t call us a disgrace, he said the lack of support was a disgrace. we''re called supporters for a reason, i wonder what we''re supposed to do?[/quote]

 

very good point, people really are taking this too personally. Do we all have to be so sensative? Do we really want a manager that that says everything that we want to hear just to please us, or one who speaks his mind?  I prefer calling a spade a spade if I can use that figure of speech nowadays!

[/quote]works both way, when grant says he is not going to play players out of position and then does..........well that says everything about the guy.................

[Hardhouse44 261]

That''s like saying I didn''t call you fat I just said you look fat. All boils down to the same thing. Grant said we were responsible in some part for the teams performance against Hull. So all we need to do each week is sing our bo11ocks off and we will win the league and FA cup. No: sound ridiculous doesn''t it. After all that would mean we the fans could directly effect the teams performance as and when we liked. Which would mean that the club would have to pay us. Come on lets call a spade a spade. Grant didn''t like the fact that we thought the game and his team were crap. Well hard luck son cos that’s what they were. And what’s more I think it was down to his bad tactics and the fact that while people of Safri''s quality sit on the bench cos his face don''t fit we have to$$ers like Robinson are on the pitch to make the god awful silly pass that grant says is our fault in the first place. And our most attacking player has to play out of position to accommodate a kid that isn’t good enough to start the match yet.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Hardhouse44"]

That''s like saying I didn''t call you fat I just said you look fat. All boils down to the same thing. Grant said we were responsible in some part for the teams performance against Hull. So all we need to do each week is sing our bo11ocks off and we will win the league and FA cup. No: sound ridiculous doesn''t it. After all that would mean we the fans could directly effect the teams performance as and when we liked. Which would mean that the club would have to pay us. Come on lets call a spade a spade. Grant didn''t like the fact that we thought the game and his team were crap. Well hard luck son cos that’s what they were. And what’s more I think it was down to his bad tactics and the fact that while people of Safri''s quality sit on the bench cos his face don''t fit we have to$$ers like Robinson are on the pitch to make the god awful silly pass that grant says is our fault in the first place. And our most attacking player has to play out of position to accommodate a kid that isn’t good enough to start the match yet.

[/quote]

Have to agree Hardhouse....although he can say what he likes as far as I''m concerned. Those of us unfortunate enough to sit through that crap know full well whose fault it was......and our conscience is clear.

Sadly the Delia Smithism about us being the 12th man has gone to some supporters'' heads. It was just spin to make us feel important and put bums on seats. We really aren''t what we like to think we are......so we had better get used to the idea pretty quickly. Fans spending money equals club income..... that''s all we are.

[7rew 0]

[quote user="Hardhouse44"]

That''s like saying I didn''t call you fat I just said you look fat. All boils down to the same thing. Grant said we were responsible in some part for the teams performance against Hull. So all we need to do each week is sing our bo11ocks off and we will win the league and FA cup. No: sound ridiculous doesn''t it. [/quote]

That idea is like saying - if we somehow signed Petr Cech, who plays his bo11ocks off every weak, we still wouldn''t win league and fa cup.

Grant was right to try Hux out of position, he looks good enough to play on the right to me and should have enough experience to cope - whereas it would be stupid to play eagle out of position.

If grant does it again then it is folly - we slate him for trying adn slated worthy for not trying.

[ZLF 271]

No - Grants statement about the fans/attitude/finale performance being disgraceful does not bother.  I have and will continue to be called worse and I am safe with the knowledge that my association with this club is for good and will always be honourable.  My opinion is that its an attempt to deflect attention, create a siege mentality to motivate his players and improve an atmosphere which has been quiet.   

What worries me more is the statement that the performance on sat was acceptable - now that bothers me.

On top of that there is the possible team breaks (public finger pointing at Robbo for failing to hoof it).  The club remains an unhappy one and that bothers me.

January remains the key spell for this club - and PG and we should bear that in mind.

[Chunky Canary 0]

You are dead right JC; I wish people would stop playing semantics, whichever way you look at it he was calling fans a disgrace.

[Hardhouse44 261]

[quote user="7rew"][quote user="Hardhouse44"]

That''s like saying I didn''t call you fat I just said you look fat. All boils down to the same thing. Grant said we were responsible in some part for the teams performance against Hull. So all we need to do each week is sing our bo11ocks off and we will win the league and FA cup. No: sound ridiculous doesn''t it. [/quote]

That idea is like saying - if we somehow signed Petr Cech, who plays his bo11ocks off every weak, we still wouldn''t win league and fa cup.

Grant was right to try Hux out of position, he looks good enough to play on the right to me and should have enough experience to cope - whereas it would be stupid to play eagle out of position.

If grant does it again then it is folly - we slate him for trying adn slated worthy for not trying.

[/quote]

Never had a reply that is so weird. Don''t get the Petr Cech thing at all. And as for playing Hux out of position the facts are plain. Huckerby on his day, electrical match winner capable of give any defence trouble. Eagle'' boy that isn''t good enough yet to play at this level. Should Earnshaw have enough experience to cover as centre back. Play your best players in their best positions to get the best out of them. Eagle was lightweight and static on the ball. He is unable as far as I can see to beat a full back. Yes couple of nice crosses but as we play with only one midget up front I wouldn''t trade that for Hux''s running from his natural position at pace with the ball at his feet. I have no interest in watching kids that are not up to the job for the sake of it. Finally you must now expect eagle to be dropped as you say that for hux''s to be played out of position again would be folly and you said yourself that Eagle out of position would be stupid.

[Little Canary 0]

I agree with grant, i dont go that often to games but i have definetly noticed that our fans arent as loud as we once were and i have beeen saying this for a while, and anyway rather then keep arguin with him cant everyone just stick with him and go to the match and make us proud.

[Herb 0]

[quote user="cluckaduck"]

We really aren''t what we like to think we are......

[/quote]Well you evidently aren''t.I pity the poor sods who sit near you on matchdays, must be a right barrel of laughs. (thats assuming you actually attend more than a couple of games a season)If you don''t think a crowd can affect the performance of a team then I would suggest you''ve nott been watching football very long.

[Cluck 0]

[quote user="Herb"][quote user="cluckaduck"]

We really aren''t what we like to think we are......

[/quote]

Well you evidently aren''t.
I pity the poor sods who sit near you on matchdays, must be a right barrel of laughs. (thats assuming you actually attend more than a couple of games a season)
If you don''t think a crowd can affect the performance of a team then I would suggest you''ve nott been watching football very long.
[/quote]

 

Ha ha ha ....silly Billy Herbie.....You do make me laugh.

Next?...........................[|-)]

[a1canary 0]

[quote user="Hardhouse44"]

That''s like saying I didn''t call you fat I just said you look fat. All boils down to the same thing. Grant said we were responsible in some part for the teams performance against Hull. So all we need to do each week is sing our bo11ocks off and we will win the league and FA cup. No: sound ridiculous doesn''t it. After all that would mean we the fans could directly effect the teams performance as and when we liked. Which would mean that the club would have to pay us. Come on lets call a spade a spade. Grant didn''t like the fact that we thought the game and his team were crap. Well hard luck son cos that’s what they were. And what’s more I think it was down to his bad tactics and the fact that while people of Safri''s quality sit on the bench cos his face don''t fit we have to$$ers like Robinson are on the pitch to make the god awful silly pass that grant says is our fault in the first place. And our most attacking player has to play out of position to accommodate a kid that isn’t good enough to start the match yet.

[/quote]The reference is to actions, not someone''s appearances - your comparison is irrelevant. The actions are a disgrace, not the perpetrators. And that''s perfectly reasonable. Have you ever done anything stupid? Of course you have. But ARE you stupid? Of course not. I don''t see what the problem is. He''s entitled to his opinion and so are we. He was upset, so were we. Let''s move on.Cluck said it was an esteem thing - i quite agree. Those without it get hysterical about things like this.

[chicken 0]

"Couldn''t agree more with these posts. Anyone who thinks what grant said was ok should go to work tomorrow and tell every customer they see they''re a disgrace and see how long you keep your job for.

He has effectively called every customer of ncfc a disgrace the only answer is a mass boycott of tuesday''s game."

If your comparing it to customer care its very much like a customer repeatedly coming into your store and buying your product on a regular basis and still moaning about it. The choice is there - buy it or don''t buy it.

Only it may seem to some from the outside, and believe me it does - just ask any of the visiting fans - that some sections of the crowd at Carrow Road seem to think that they pay their money to moan and take out their frustration and completely forget about the product.

If we were to use this as a serious argument though you would have to admit that there arnt many industries where the production line is cheered on (well hopefully anyway) by the people buying into their product. You see it is a cyclic thing and not as straight forward as buying.

In my opinion its a reflection on modern British society, everybody thinks they are owed something for yesterday (not literal sense for those that care to read its other meaning). They think they can pay £20 turn up and have happiness jolity and a 5-0 win handed to them on a red silk cushion. If there is any one thing that has been a constant in Norwich City''s history, and that is hard work and graft on both the side of the players, and on the fans.

By this I mean we have never been a super ritch club but have managed to do well on good decisions and careful planning, always - never have we solely relied on money itself to bring in quality. Francis, Ashton etc are good examples of bargin buys. Down the years we have had many, Steve Bruce, Rule Fox plus developing some cracking youngsters which is much harder to do in the current climate.

I don''t think that the fans are a disgrace and nor does Grant. I mean at most you could be forgiven for reading that the fans were a disgrace for the last fifteen minutes and nothing more. But what he actually said that the lack of support behind the team, the lack of noise which he had seen as a player here - was a disgrace. So in actuality the lack of the fans presence was a disgrace.

And as people keep banging on all the time on here the fans are the 12th player yet what Grant is saying here is that for the last fifteen minutes if the fans were a player he would have substituted them. To be honest why can''t he criticise a lack of support, something he has inherited from a predesessor that didnt even manage to get half of what Grant has out of this side.

Etuhu looks like the player that was promised to us, Hughes looks better (note I didn''t say top quality), Eagle has been given chances, Dion immense. Why shouldn''t he ask for more support and try to shake some of the more vocal people out of the habbits they adopted last season?

But know, the Norwich Fans are unfallable, anybody would think that we have suddenly become some American deep south evangelical church or something (no insult intended Yankee).

[HappyhammerAndy 0]

"The only possible reaction is to show him he''s wrong, Prove it. Rise to it."

Perhaps the above was exactly what he was trying to do? Relieve the team of any pressures and take the flak himself?