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Hardhouse44

Right lets deal with a few points. Then onwards and upwards.

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Firstly to all those fans that have said we have no right to moan, gripe, grumble and generally show we are p1ssed off I say get real.

We pay our money, we listen to all the spin that comes from Carrow road and we take it all in the neck from work colleagues who are Ipswich fans. We are entitled to our 15 minute rant. We were crap, rubbish, garbage, dire and about a thousand other word that I can''t mention or be bothered to type.

To the other band of people who are constantly asking us if we are going to give up going to Carrow Road or telling us that we should, and that, that is the only way to get our point across I say tommy rot.

I personally go to football for many reason. I''ll list a few.

1. I have a few beers 2. The comaradry I share with my mates and son who come with me. 3. The excitement of knowing that while I''m sitting at work board out of my brain there is a game to go too at the weekend. 4. To see what the oppsition has to offer. 5. I love watching football of any sort. 6. Norwich are MY team always have been always will be. They belong to me and all the other people who go. Not to Delia, Grant or any other Board member. And nobody will drive me away from my club. Oh one more it’s nice to have a moan once in a while.

There is a million other tiny reasons I go to watch City that I can''t even explain, but they make the day the great event that it is. The result is, well it’s important but to me it''s not as important as all the other reasons I have listed.

Right this is starting to waffle on a bit so let see if I can''t wrap things up.

Sunday was PANTS. We played with no quality and we got what we deserved. We need to learn from it and move on.

2 home game coming up now against 2 very beatable teams. We should be looking for 6 points. If I am not much mistaken we still have the leagues top scorer one of the best wingers in the division and 4 decent defenders. (Dublin is included in that)

Yes we have the worst central midfield in the world but hey we have had that for ages and we still get the results at home if we apply ourselves.

We need to knuckle down and get stuck in. I want to see some bite from our boys in the next 2 games and I''m sure that is what Grant will be instilling in the team.

We are not a great football team far from it. But we are not in a league full of great football teams either. Far from it.

Anybody can beat anybody in this league and come Xmas I still think the league will be there for the taking by any team who invests wisely and battles hard.

We have lost to our bitter rivals. Thats all. We get another chance against them before the league is over and by then we will have a better idea of our fate this season.

I am looking forward to the game Saturday and I am sure that I am not sure what the game will be like. We could be crap we could be great or we could be average. I won''t know for myself unless I go and I won''t have any right to moan or bask in the glory either.

Lets keep it real and move on.

OTBC

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HH I think this is a brilliant post and very well put. I do not feel there is much more I can add, apart from my agreement. Well said [Y]

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First good post. As for quality, I think last weekend sums up our problems.

3 out of four defenders are more than adequate for the job but one lets the team down. Two goals were down to Docherty. The defence need someone in the middle who is going to communicate more - when Haynes scored his first - the header, both Shackel AND Drury had gone to close down one winger. Its Docs responsibility to yell at Shackell to leave it to Drury. This way you have a guy on the man at the front post a guy on the man at the back post and a player in the middle to cut out any balls that fall between or attack the front post and help there or at the back. The man out wide is only a problem should he pass Drury at which point Shackell then goes and closes him down. Its such a basic communication and organisation problem.

4-5-1 / 4-4-2 is not going to work it should be stopped. Unless players are going to move more to create more space and open up play to actually get Earny in then we should play 4-4-2. By playing 3 in the middle we get out flanked far to easily - two of the goals against us came from work down the flanks.

Grant needs to work on his substitutions, I would have taken off Robinson who was having a howler for Hughes who had been the better of the two players up to that point. He was all over the pitch tackling and actually passing the ball to our players unlike Robinson.

I think the priority for January is a central defender, whether that is one of our youngsters or a new player we are one defender short of a solid defence. We have a good enough midfield just not in that formation.

For the time being I would play this formation:

Gallacher

Colin, Dublin, Shackel, Drury

McVeigh, Safri, Etuhu, Eagle

Huckerby, Earnshaw

Subs: Docherty, Robinson, Thorne, Hughes.

Obviously if Chadwick/Croft are fit they come in for McVeigh and Eagle with Chadwick down the left.

In all honesty the score line flattered Ipswich who were not as good as the win suggests, their forwards are pretty useless as they squandered some good oppertunities. Otherwise it was not a good game to watch.

Finally - why has no one said anything about the referee who got nearly every single decision wrong? He didn''t book the player for the challenge on Chadwick which was outrageous and offered no protection for Earnshaw who was fouled all game long. When he tried to bite back a little, ie turn the defender or just lean into him a little, both legal moves, a foul was given against him. Shocking.

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I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

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[quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

The problem I have with this the board are fans thing is it is like trying to be friends with your work force. It rarely works. We need to remember that it is a business and that is the way the board run it. If you had the money to spend like Delia would you spend more? I guess half would and half would''nt. In this world of big takeovers it is easy to say come and get us but then hey Delia has been great. I don''t know whether the fact that the board are fans is good or bad.

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[quote user="Hardhouse44"][quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

The problem I have with this the board are fans thing is it is like trying to be friends with your work force. It rarely works. We need to remember that it is a business and that is the way the board run it. If you had the money to spend like Delia would you spend more? I guess half would and half would''nt. In this world of big takeovers it is easy to say come and get us but then hey Delia has been great. I don''t know whether the fact that the board are fans is good or bad.

[/quote]

That is definitely a problem in my view. I don''t have a problem with having some fans on the board, but for the owners of the club, it''s not always a good thing. Also, they''re just too damn nice/soft - we need someone to come in with a bit of a ruthless streak. To change the image of the club. This is my theory: Why do you think Norwich always bottle it on the big occasion, whether it be losing *very* important penalty shootouts, to getting hammered 6-0 when they need to win to stay up, etc? It''s because this nice image that the board portray does IMO spread throughout the entire club, from board level, through manager and coaching, and down to the players. We need to be more ruthless and have a bit of arrogance in there, else we will never get anywhere.

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10Bryceland - OK the board are fans and I acknowledge and thank the hard work, time and money that Delia and MWJ have put into the club, the trouble is there are big questions about where the money has gone which have not been satisfactorily answered.

As a shareholder I find out, via another poster, that the AGM has been moved, absolutely shocking if it is true. The club are happy to bombard me with post and e-mails encouraging me to spend my hard earned cash, but I have heard absolutely nothing regarding the AGM - And therein lies the problem the club were happy to harnass the "feelgood factor" following Cardiff and our promotion to the Prem, making bold statements such as "onwards and upwards", Europen Football in five years etc, now things have gone awry we get "prudence with ambition", spin and silence, the board are in serious danger of undoing all their good work and losing the goodwill of the fans.

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[quote user="Sons of Boadicea"]

10Bryceland - OK the board are fans and I acknowledge and thank the hard work, time and money that Delia and MWJ have put into the club, the trouble is there are big questions about where the money has gone which have not been satisfactorily answered.

As a shareholder I find out, via another poster, that the AGM has been moved, absolutely shocking if it is true. The club are happy to bombard me with post and e-mails encouraging me to spend my hard earned cash, but I have heard absolutely nothing regarding the AGM - And therein lies the problem the club were happy to harnass the "feelgood factor" following Cardiff and our promotion to the Prem, making bold statements such as "onwards and upwards", Europen Football in five years etc, now things have gone awry we get "prudence with ambition", spin and silence, the board are in serious danger of undoing all their good work and losing the goodwill of the fans.

[/quote]

Great comments and a fair insight as to the issues which really trouble me. It''s fine for some avid supporters to gloss over the behaviour of the board and declare total loyalty....but at which point do we sit up and say ''hang on a minute''? For me to consider giving up my treasured season ticket....it has to be very serious....and I think the state of things at Carrow Road are just that....''very serious''. Transparent my a**e.....Things have never been so opaque in my 40 odd years as a supporter....and we are being taken for mugs.

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Couldn''t agree more that you, me and the rest of the faithful are being told what the board think we want to hear. I have been a season ticket holder for over 20 years myself and have never had my faith tested so much as in these dark days.

I would go as far to say that the whole supporting Norwich experience was far better under Chase than it is now. Yes we flirted with bankruptcy but at least Chase realised that a certain standard of football was required nay expected.

Is there an out right answer to our dilemma. I doubt it. We are not a good football team. We have made many mistakes. Most of them have been bad buy''s by Worthy. We are left with his legacy. Grant is not my choice for manager or even the style of manager I like. However he has inherited many poor players. We have a handful of quality guys but we have a shed load of dross.

Our faith will have to hold for the time being. January will be telling in two ways. 1) The amount of fund available to Grant will indicate once and for all I think the boards ambition to get out of this league. Given that the parachute payment end this year and than every year we stay here we fall deeper into debt and further in to the mire. 2) Assuming that grant receives a respectable war chest, what can he as and inexperienced low profile manager do with it.

Results will have to be our guide from then on as to how we as fans view our board. Can they be toppled/ replaced?) I guess if you can get rid of Saddam you can get rid of anybody. Only kidding but you know what I mean. Nothing is for ever.

OTBC

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[quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

     In terms of finances unfortunately we can speculate till the cows come home but none of us really know the situation. The accounts dont make things much clearer-remember the 7.5million profit which was an "accounting quirk" (still entirely unexplained)? There are plenty of ways a good accountancy company can portray a situation in a very different light to how it actually is (write-downs against the value of fixed assets,exceptional income etc.).

     The real question is why,during the most financial lucrative period of the clubs history, it cannot seem to compete with clubs with smaller crowds and no parachute payments? A thread recently compared Stoke`s first 11 to ours and it was generally agreed that on paper they were at least on a par-they have crowds 10,000 lower than ours and none of the Prem millions we have enjoyed. Cardiff are very similar and look at the players they have splashed out on in recent times-and they are being linked with several high-profile players in a bid to secure promotion. Ipswich have twice our debt but seem to be more succesful in the loan market,have stated they have money to spend in January and carry a squad far bigger than ours. Are these clubs playing by different rules to us? Surely in this league the costs of running a club are generally similar? Before someone spouts off about wages,we have one of the smallest squads in the division and most of the high earners have left. If the costs of running NCFC are so much higher than every other club, are people not at least a little curious as to why?

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

     In terms of finances unfortunately we can speculate till the cows come home but none of us really know the situation. The accounts dont make things much clearer-remember the 7.5million profit which was an "accounting quirk" (still entirely unexplained)? There are plenty of ways a good accountancy company can portray a situation in a very different light to how it actually is (write-downs against the value of fixed assets,exceptional income etc.).

     The real question is why,during the most financial lucrative period of the clubs history, it cannot seem to compete with clubs with smaller crowds and no parachute payments? A thread recently compared Stoke`s first 11 to ours and it was generally agreed that on paper they were at least on a par-they have crowds 10,000 lower than ours and none of the Prem millions we have enjoyed. Cardiff are very similar and look at the players they have splashed out on in recent times-and they are being linked with several high-profile players in a bid to secure promotion. Ipswich have twice our debt but seem to be more succesful in the loan market,have stated they have money to spend in January and carry a squad far bigger than ours. Are these clubs playing by different rules to us? Surely in this league the costs of running a club are generally similar? Before someone spouts off about wages,we have one of the smallest squads in the division and most of the high earners have left. If the costs of running NCFC are so much higher than every other club, are people not at least a little curious as to why?

[/quote]

I can''t answer every aspect but surely the fact that Stoke and Cardiff are better than us is because they bought/brought in better players than Worthington. He got so much crap in that he destroyed the team from the inside out. Neither of their squads cost more than ours but the players are better. Any link with high profile players is due to Cardiff league position. Because the got in good players on the cheap to start with.

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It''s history now, but in assessing Worthy''s signings we need to take into account the players he wanted but didn''t get because the  negotiating process broke down.  I can''t think of a single instance when there was serious competition for a signature (as opposed to agents trying to start an auction) where we came out on top - apart from Hucks of course, and that was only thanks to an offer the board couldn''t refuse from an outside source.

To take a recent case in point, Steve Howard is no footballing genius but he''s banging them in on a regular basis at Derby and they are mounting a realistic challenge for a top six finish.  Worthy wanted him but the board baulked at a million quid.  He only signed the players that the board would let him have.

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Hang on I thought it was well documented that the board would have given the £1m for Howard but Worthington himself said he wasn''t worth it.

 

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[quote user="Hardhouse44"]

Hang on I thought it was well documented that the board would have given the £1m for Howard but Worthington himself said he wasn''t worth it.

 

[/quote]

"Well documented" it isn''t - tried to check it out in the Archive but couldn''t find anything.  My recollection is that Worthy said it was a lot of money, not that he wasn''t worth it.  I struggle to imagine our board poised to sign the deal and Worthy rushing in to stay their hand . . . I could be mistaken however.

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[quote user="mystic megson"][quote user="Hardhouse44"]

Hang on I thought it was well documented that the board would have given the £1m for Howard but Worthington himself said he wasn''t worth it.

 

[/quote]

"Well documented" it isn''t - tried to check it out in the Archive but couldn''t find anything.  My recollection is that Worthy said it was a lot of money, not that he wasn''t worth it.  I struggle to imagine our board poised to sign the deal and Worthy rushing in to stay their hand . . . I could be mistaken however.

[/quote]

My vague recollection of this was that in ND''s column he stated that there was £1m available for Howard, but that it was agreed that he wasn''t worth the money.

I don''t remember it saying who''s decision it was, so I presume the rest is fare game for speculation... we''re all right!

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I recall Munby saying that the money was there for Howard to be signed if the manager wanted. The manager decided that he was not worth the price, that is his opinion (one I happen to agree with) and his judgement call to make.   I am told that there was more than the £1m available for transfers and a significant proportion of that remains.

Regurgitating and reanalysing Nigels signings remains a pointless exercise as does apportioning blame between nigel and the board. 

The cash has been spend on loans, financing ground improvements, agents fees and funding increases.  As always the real winners from our promotion was not the club but the players,  most who have or are taking the money and running.   The club are under no obligation to tell us what the detailed financial situation is and on balance it is better that they dont.

There is apparently a residue available for squad improvements but it is not £5-£10m many hope, although I understand it does goes well into 7 figures.  Within this climate I would look to keep all the current squad until the end of the season and target 2-3 players during Jan who would walk into the strating line up,  increasing quality and competition and hopefully giving the squad fresh impetus.

PGs challenge is how to strengthen the squad in terms of numbers,  improve its overall  ability as well as lowering the average age within that tight budget. No easy task.

 

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ZLF - I have an interest in what is happening at Derby County as they are my "second team". To me £1M for Howard is a bargain, not only because he has scored 8 goals so far (only three fewer than Earnie who cost 3.5 times as much) but his all round play and the amount of hard work he puts in. I would have thought he would have been an ideal foil for Earnie. I accept we need to be prudent, but you can be too prudent!!

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

     In terms of finances unfortunately we can speculate till the cows come home but none of us really know the situation. The accounts dont make things much clearer-remember the 7.5million profit which was an "accounting quirk" (still entirely unexplained)? There are plenty of ways a good accountancy company can portray a situation in a very different light to how it actually is (write-downs against the value of fixed assets,exceptional income etc.).

     The real question is why,during the most financial lucrative period of the clubs history, it cannot seem to compete with clubs with smaller crowds and no parachute payments? A thread recently compared Stoke`s first 11 to ours and it was generally agreed that on paper they were at least on a par-they have crowds 10,000 lower than ours and none of the Prem millions we have enjoyed. Cardiff are very similar and look at the players they have splashed out on in recent times-and they are being linked with several high-profile players in a bid to secure promotion. Ipswich have twice our debt but seem to be more succesful in the loan market,have stated they have money to spend in January and carry a squad far bigger than ours. Are these clubs playing by different rules to us? Surely in this league the costs of running a club are generally similar? Before someone spouts off about wages,we have one of the smallest squads in the division and most of the high earners have left. If the costs of running NCFC are so much higher than every other club, are people not at least a little curious as to why?

[/quote]

Stoke have had some brilliant loan signings in Diou and Hendry. Russel having regular football has shown what we all believed he could be, but he wanted more than that - he wanted recognition and in a team where you have to fight to be the best he didn''t settle well. Cardiff is a different matter, small gates maybe, but untill recently anyway they had a multi-millionaire as a chairman. You don''t have to look far to find evidence of how that helps clubs!

Having said that there is only really one player I would take from their team and put straight into ours and that is Chopra. The other players are experienced players that know this division but nothing particularily special. And from what I can tell most are around the 30 mark in age other than Chopra and a youngster played for the first time against QPR. The problem with Dave Jones is that he is fantastic at getting teams to the premiership but pretty woeful at keeping them there and it could easily be argued that the Wolves team were better than most that go up and failed to stay there in a season that on paper looks a lot easier than the current climate. Chelsea with Ranieri still at the helm for example.

Football is a funny game, at the end of the day what is on paper is on paper but it will never be 100% reliable. We have bigger gates - not nessisarily more fans mind you but we don''t obviously have other factors like and incredibly wealthy owner (Jorbichan anyone?) and then there is the location factor, Hendrie and Diou from Villa and Liverpool, Stoke is considerably closer to the two. What we should be doing is going in for some of the London players. I hear that Niklas Jensen at Fulham wants to leave them in favour of first team football. Grant knows the guys behind the scenes at West Ham. Give it some time and I think you will see what the differences are.

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SOB I dont disagree that Howard could not have done us a good job nor that he would not have been value for money - I said he woud have been a good signining in the summer when most were bemoaning his age.  As for Earnies value he could be with is 3.5 times longer due to his age. 

However when we  only have a limited budget spending £1m when you still need midfielders and defenders to strengthen too , spending half your budget on your third priority position makes howard less attractive 

Not subsequently spending the money was the problem..

 

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      Shortly after the Howard situation occurred there was an interview with Worthington in the local press titled something like "Worthy-City must pay the going rate" where he basically bemoaned the fact that the club had not signed him. I think the board said something like there was 1 million in the kitty but they would not spend that on a 30 year old. Any links web team?

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[quote user="chicken"][quote user="Mr.Carrow"][quote user="10Bryceland"]

I agree in all major respects except one, I still see the board as fans like the rest of us.  We could have a worse board and they are more open and approachable than most.  I believe they Have put their money where their mouth is and all this piteous whining about ''where has the premiership money gone'' is a load of hogwash that ignores the economic reality of actually running a league football club.

Having said that, on the pitch we lack bottle and leadership.  Its time to give youth a chance.  Even with a good run from here on in we have still dropped too many points to be serious challengers.  Lets give the youngsters some experience and hope that the door doesn''t stop revolving in January as the under achievers go and Grants cavalry arrives.

I feel better already, OTBC.

[/quote]

     In terms of finances unfortunately we can speculate till the cows come home but none of us really know the situation. The accounts dont make things much clearer-remember the 7.5million profit which was an "accounting quirk" (still entirely unexplained)? There are plenty of ways a good accountancy company can portray a situation in a very different light to how it actually is (write-downs against the value of fixed assets,exceptional income etc.).

     The real question is why,during the most financial lucrative period of the clubs history, it cannot seem to compete with clubs with smaller crowds and no parachute payments? A thread recently compared Stoke`s first 11 to ours and it was generally agreed that on paper they were at least on a par-they have crowds 10,000 lower than ours and none of the Prem millions we have enjoyed. Cardiff are very similar and look at the players they have splashed out on in recent times-and they are being linked with several high-profile players in a bid to secure promotion. Ipswich have twice our debt but seem to be more succesful in the loan market,have stated they have money to spend in January and carry a squad far bigger than ours. Are these clubs playing by different rules to us? Surely in this league the costs of running a club are generally similar? Before someone spouts off about wages,we have one of the smallest squads in the division and most of the high earners have left. If the costs of running NCFC are so much higher than every other club, are people not at least a little curious as to why?

[/quote]

Stoke have had some brilliant loan signings in Diou and Hendry. Russel having regular football has shown what we all believed he could be, but he wanted more than that - he wanted recognition and in a team where you have to fight to be the best he didn''t settle well. Cardiff is a different matter, small gates maybe, but untill recently anyway they had a multi-millionaire as a chairman. You don''t have to look far to find evidence of how that helps clubs!

Having said that there is only really one player I would take from their team and put straight into ours and that is Chopra. The other players are experienced players that know this division but nothing particularily special. And from what I can tell most are around the 30 mark in age other than Chopra and a youngster played for the first time against QPR. The problem with Dave Jones is that he is fantastic at getting teams to the premiership but pretty woeful at keeping them there and it could easily be argued that the Wolves team were better than most that go up and failed to stay there in a season that on paper looks a lot easier than the current climate. Chelsea with Ranieri still at the helm for example.

Football is a funny game, at the end of the day what is on paper is on paper but it will never be 100% reliable. We have bigger gates - not nessisarily more fans mind you but we don''t obviously have other factors like and incredibly wealthy owner (Jorbichan anyone?) and then there is the location factor, Hendrie and Diou from Villa and Liverpool, Stoke is considerably closer to the two. What we should be doing is going in for some of the London players. I hear that Niklas Jensen at Fulham wants to leave them in favour of first team football. Grant knows the guys behind the scenes at West Ham. Give it some time and I think you will see what the differences are.

[/quote]

   Hmmmm, so Cardiff have a multi-millionaire chairman chicken? Havent we got a multi-millionairess owner?

    Your presumption about City`s location counting against us in the loan market of course COULD be true. Or it could be that we were not prepared to pay their wages, or that they took one look at our wafer thin squad and thought "no chance". Whatever, with the board facing increasing criticism dont you think if they had pursued such players only to be turned down despite their best efforts, they would come out and say so?

   As for your point about Chopra, i think most Cardiff fans would look at our team,wish they could have Huckerby and Earnshaw and dismiss the rest as average as you have theirs.

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Norwich City under Delia Smith have become an ''unfashionable'' club.....almost a laughing stock.

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place. Under the current leadership we have lost the plot and lost our esteem.

Only by getting back our hunger and desire are we again going to lure decent players here. It isn''t the place that''s doing the damage....it''s the image of  little old Norwich going nowhere. That in itself will scare off any ambitious player looking for success.

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[quote user="cluckaduck"]

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place.

[/quote]

Clucky, name them. Please!

Not because I don''t think they exist, but I just can''t remember any.

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[quote user="Mook"][quote user="cluckaduck"]

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place.

[/quote]

Clucky, name them. Please!

Not because I don''t think they exist, but I just can''t remember any.

[/quote]

Umm, Martin Peters?

 

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[quote user="Mook"][quote user="cluckaduck"]

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place.

[/quote]

Clucky, name them. Please!

Not because I don''t think they exist, but I just can''t remember any.

[/quote]

Martin Peters, Ted MacDougall, Phil Boyer, Peter Morris, Mick McGuire, Graham Paddon, Jimmy Neighbour, Viv Busby, David Jones, Kevin Reeves, John Deehan, Chris Woods, Dave Watson, David Williams, Joe Royle, Robert Fleck, Martin O''neill, Mick Channon, Age Hareide, Asa Hartford, Mark Bowen, Ian Butterworth, Bryan Gunn, Mike Phelan, Trevor Putney, Andy linighan, Mike Milligan, Jon Polston, Jon Newsome. David Phillips, Ian Crook, Tomas Helveg, Matthias Jonson etc............

Not all were successes but all were top players who came to Norwich and all could have gone to other Premiership (or old First Division) clubs but chose us.  There are over 20 internationals listed above and I''m sure I''ve forgotten many others.

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[quote user="CambridgeCanary"][quote user="Mook"][quote user="cluckaduck"]

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place.

[/quote]

Clucky, name them. Please!

Not because I don''t think they exist, but I just can''t remember any.

[/quote]

Martin Peters, Ted MacDougall, Phil Boyer, Peter Morris, Mick McGuire, Graham Paddon, Jimmy Neighbour, Viv Busby, David Jones, Kevin Reeves, John Deehan, Chris Woods, Dave Watson, David Williams, Joe Royle, Robert Fleck, Martin O''neill, Mick Channon, Age Hareide, Asa Hartford, Mark Bowen, Ian Butterworth, Bryan Gunn, Mike Phelan, Trevor Putney, Andy linighan, Mike Milligan, Jon Polston, Jon Newsome. David Phillips, Ian Crook, Tomas Helveg, Matthias Jonson etc............

Not all were successes but all were top players who came to Norwich and all could have gone to other Premiership (or old First Division) clubs but chose us.  There are over 20 internationals listed above and I''m sure I''ve forgotten many others.

[/quote]

Thank you Cambridge Canary......perfectly put and there are many more besides such as Andy Townsend, Steve Bruce la de da de da.........Mook......where is your argument?

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[quote user="CambridgeCanary"][quote user="Mook"][quote user="cluckaduck"]

Under Bondie...Brown and Stringer, plenty of top players readily came to Norfolk and loved the place.

[/quote]

Clucky, name them. Please!

Not because I don''t think they exist, but I just can''t remember any.

[/quote]

Martin Peters, Ted MacDougall, Phil Boyer, Peter Morris, Mick McGuire, Graham Paddon, Jimmy Neighbour, Viv Busby, David Jones, Kevin Reeves, John Deehan, Chris Woods, Dave Watson, David Williams, Joe Royle, Robert Fleck, Martin O''neill, Mick Channon, Age Hareide, Asa Hartford, Mark Bowen, Ian Butterworth, Bryan Gunn, Mike Phelan, Trevor Putney, Andy linighan, Mike Milligan, Jon Polston, Jon Newsome. David Phillips, Ian Crook, Tomas Helveg, Matthias Jonson etc............

Not all were successes but all were top players who came to Norwich and all could have gone to other Premiership (or old First Division) clubs but chose us.  There are over 20 internationals listed above and I''m sure I''ve forgotten many others.

[/quote]

Thank you Cambridge Canary......perfectly put and there are many more besides such as Andy Townsend, Steve Bruce la de da de da.........Mook......where is your argument?

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[quote user="Mr.Carrow"]      Shortly after the Howard situation occurred there was an interview with Worthington in the local press titled something like "Worthy-City must pay the going rate" where he basically bemoaned the fact that the club had not signed him. I think the board said something like there was 1 million in the kitty but they would not spend that on a 30 year old. Any links web team?[/quote]

If anyone is still interested, see ''Championship Chat'' by David Cuffley at the end of September entitled "Statement provides fuel for protesters".

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