Rowe the new Cantwell

[Ulfotto 828]

I think it’s fair to say he’s been badly advised by his agent most likely. Probably the same person who told Rowe he would be playing in the Premier league already. 

Instead of trying to force a move by refusing to play in would have been better to rattle in a couple of goals against Oxford and remind everyone what he did at the start of last season rather than in the games against Leeds where he was comprehensively schooled by Archie Gray.

As people have already speculated if said move does not materialise he has burned bridges at Norwich and it’s something that will hang over him for the rest of his career.

[Hairy Canary 773]

Cantwell was supposed to be worth £20m for a short window and we ended up getting sweet FA. 
 

We need to learn from that and make sure the same doesn’t happen with Rowe. It’s not easy to stomach but  £7 or £8m is better than nothing.

A club our size can’t afford to lose two multi-million pound assets. Could set us back years

[horsefly 5,307]

27 minutes ago, ron obvious said:

One, very worrying, possibility occurs to me: that he sees his fellow players as a bunch of no hopers. It would (maybe) chime in with his sudden, auto-generated, passages of brilliant play, followed by spells of apathy & inertia. Almost as if he's saying "see? That's how much better I am than the rest of you dross".

Pure speculation, but it would explain his apparent near desperation to go ... somewhere ... anywhere ...

Since he came back from injury he has been at best very average. He might well find that he spends most of his time warming the benches at a bigger club.

[Olano 111]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

Is this just another case of Gen Z mental frailty?  It could be that he genuinely feels he isn't in a good mental space to play at the moment - that the speculation and uncertainty has affected him. 

So a lot of judgement on here about him - and I tend to agree with people who condemn his action today - but it really could be what we see in so many young people today, a lack of what some might call moral fibre - or if that sounds harsh, just genuinely getting too easily anxious about situations that to many look like weak mindedness.

Genuine or not? Who knows, but like with Cantwell, if you upset the fans by downing tools for whatever reason, then it is not a good look, when fans pay a lot of money to see you play - and you don't turn up.

 

Good post. Agree with every word you writhe here.

 

Also we don't know about his and his family economic safety. Perhaps he feels he need this new contract to have a good future for himself and his family?  And is afraid that a new injurie can destroy his future?

 

It's disappointing, but there are probably alot of caveats that we don't know.

 

What scares me is that Sargent and Gunn see this and want out as well

[lake district canary 4,875]

24 minutes ago, ron obvious said:

One, very worrying, possibility occurs to me: that he sees his fellow players as a bunch of no hopers. It would (maybe) chime in with his sudden, auto-generated, passages of brilliant play, followed by spells of apathy & inertia. Almost as if he's saying "see? That's how much better I am than the rest of you dross".

Pure speculation, but it would explain his apparent near desperation to go ... somewhere ... anywhere ...

It could be true. A similar kind of misthinking arrrogance that affected Cantwell too, maybe.

If a player thinks they are a better player than others in their squad, then they have two choices. Either they use that to better the team they play for, like Maddison, more lately Sara - or their other choice is to think the squad isn't good enough for them and lose their sense of what they should be doing in the present moment.

Maddison was a great example. Confident, brilliant, even arrogant - but never failed to give his best - and he's a top player now. Rowe probably falling into the same trap as Cantwell - wanting to be a top player, but not really knowing how to be one.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,476]

42 minutes ago, ron obvious said:

One, very worrying, possibility occurs to me: that he sees his fellow players as a bunch of no hopers. It would (maybe) chime in with his sudden, auto-generated, passages of brilliant play, followed by spells of apathy & inertia. Almost as if he's saying "see? That's how much better I am than the rest of you dross".

Pure speculation, but it would explain his apparent near desperation to go ... somewhere ... anywhere ...

 Not quite Ron, thoigh absolutely every player at every club everywhere has an acute sixth sense for who is the best, fastest, hardest and many other ests….

it is worth noting though that very few players who consider their career to be on a sharp upward trajectory accept ‘long-term projects’.

Careers are short. Big money deals are a product of multiple circumstances and are often ephemeral. They are life-changing. 

Another year (or two) at Norwich isn’t. 

Parma 

Edited August 10, 2024 by Parma Ham's gone mouldy

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

Is this just another case of Gen Z mental frailty? 

Is this another case of lazy stereotyping with absolutely hard research, data or statistics to back it up?

If Gen Z is more mentally frail than previous generations, then why was the suicide rate almost twice as high in the early 80s? Presumably because regressive boomers wouldn't allow themselves to express emotions or be open and honest about their mental health problems or conditions, so they just slit their wrists instead.

Go on then, counter with something which supports the view that the young are more mentally frail now?

Edited August 10, 2024 by JonnyJonnyRowe

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

1 hour ago, Petriix said:

So maybe he's just a bit of a bell end. Let's not tar an entire generation with the same brush. 

I've promised myself that I won't be one of those guys who feels sad about getting old so takes it out on people who have much longer to live, which is what its really about. Every generation of oldipeeps seem to do this, seemingly forgetting that when they were young the elders did exactly the same by moaning about them.

[Big Vince 429]

Trouble is, the club is so painfully weak. They will pander to the player and try to be understanding instead of getting tough. They will look at the player in terms of his asset value and try to rehabilitate him, instead of sending him to train with the Under 20s for the next two years, before releasing him for nothing. So money then corrupts what should be the normal disciplinary procedure. A very sad indictment on modern day football. I implore everyone to give up professional football and look elsewhere for their rewards.

[Google Bot 3,993]

I've tried to point this out in the past, absolutely no surprise to see him rule himself out today:

Incredibly disappointed, though. 

[lake district canary 4,875]

Just now, JonnyJonnyRowe said:

I've promised myself that I won't be one of those guys who feels sad about getting old so takes it out on people who have much longer to live, which is what its really about. Every generation of oldipeeps seem to do this, seemingly forgetting that when they were young the elders did exactly the same by moaning about them.

That's genuinely laughable. Being older, in itself, is not a sad state to be in. Quite the opposite. Being older simply means you've seen more of life to know that the way things change is not always for the better. So yes, "oldipeeps" often bemoan  what the younger generation are like - it has always been so - but when you are in your dotage, you might look back and think your generation lived in much better circumstances than the present young'uns, which is what people who comment on gen z are generally talking about.

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

4 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

you might look back and think your generation lived in much better circumstances than the present young'uns, which is what people who comment on gen z are generally talking about.

Gen Z probably look at the older generations, quite rightfully, and say that it was them who f@cked it all up for them, so for the people who f@cked it all up for them to then essentially call them snowflakes, like you just did, is a massive slap in the chops.

[Unthink road 165]

21 minutes ago, JonnyJonnyRowe said:

Is this another case of lazy stereotyping with absolutely hard research, data or statistics to back it up?

If Gen Z is more mentally frail than previous generations, then why was the suicide rate almost twice as high in the early 80s? Presumably because regressive boomers wouldn't allow themselves to express emotions or be open and honest about their mental health problems or conditions, so they just slit their wrists instead.

Go on then, counter with something which supports the view that the young are more mentally frail now?

It is very sad that rates are if you say almost double since the 80's. Do you think this could be down to aspirations? Exposure to social media? 

My children and grandchildren work as hard as I did, but I was fortunate to live in an era when a house was very affordable. The choices my wife and I had when younger I feel allowed more freedom. I think it is sad when we compare generations, normally the the former shapes the current. 

I don't know if I would have achieved what I have if I was born 40 years later. 

[lake district canary 4,875]

11 minutes ago, JonnyJonnyRowe said:

Gen Z probably look at the older generations, quite rightfully, and say that it was them who f@cked it all up for them, so for the people who f@cked it all up for them to then essentially call them snowflakes, like you just did, is a massive slap in the chops.

Yeah, like the thousands, millions of my parent's generation who fought and of whom many died fighting for the freedom that the west has had for the last 80 years. So be careful before you slander previous generations.

[Unthink road 165]

2 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Yeah, like the thousands, millions of my parent's generation who fought and of whom many died fighting for the freedom that the west has had for the last 80 years. So be careful before you slander previous generations.

I feel this is every generation blames each other. We all had family who fought in the wars, they were so brave. But they were a product of the time. They are inspiring, but the world has changed. We cannot blame our children for the world that we created. To do so is damaging. If they had been born in the same era as the people who experienced the wars, I'm sure they would obliged. 

In football terms, is Rowe any different from players in the past that wish a move and displayed no loyalty? It used to happen years ago in football, you just didn't hear about it openly. 

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

Yeah, like the thousands, millions of my parent's generation who fought and of whom many died fighting for the freedom that the west has had for the last 80 years. So be careful before you slander previous generations.

Its the boomers they have a problem with pal, not people who are now 100 years old.

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

2 hours ago, Unthink road said:

It is very sad that rates are if you say almost double since the 80's. Do you think this could be down to aspirations? Exposure to social media? 

My children and grandchildren work as hard as I did, but I was fortunate to live in an era when a house was very affordable. The choices my wife and I had when younger I feel allowed more freedom. I think it is sad when we compare generations, normally the the former shapes the current. 

I don't know if I would have achieved what I have if I was born 40 years later. 

I didn't say they have doubled since the 80s, I said they were almost double in the 80s. 

[mastoola 204]

3 hours ago, Parma Ham's gone mouldy said:

 Not quite Ron, thoigh absolutely every player at every club everywhere has an acute sixth sense for who is the best, fastest, hardest and many other ests….

it is worth noting though that very few players who consider their career to be on a sharp upward trajectory accept ‘long-term projects’.

Careers are short. Big money deals are a product of multiple circumstances and are often ephemeral. They are life-changing. 

Another year (or two) at Norwich isn’t. 

Parma 

The problem with the youth of today is they want instant results and not prepared to work for it for the long term game.  i have a daughter who is talented above and all she wants its results today and if its not on insta or ticktok its a failure in her eyes. They need to learn that life is a long time game. This is not a problem with football but a problem with the generation that wants instant gratification .

Edited August 11, 2024 by mastoola

[mannings bandy legs 444]

15 hours ago, horsefly said:

Since he came back from injury he has been at best very average. He might well find that he spends most of his time warming the benches at a bigger club.

...but considerably more wealthy. Better cars,better watches,bigger houses...or perhaps i'm being too cynical!

[horsefly 5,307]

19 minutes ago, mannings bandy legs said:

...but considerably more wealthy. Better cars,better watches,bigger houses...or perhaps i'm being too cynical!

I doubt you are.

[lake district canary 4,875]

13 hours ago, JonnyJonnyRowe said:

Its the boomers they have a problem with pal, not people who are now 100 years old.

Are, so it is the boomers fault. I see. Good old blame culture. I don't blame young people for the way they are - like all of us, they are just trying to make sense of the world they live in. 

What does disappoint me though, is when I see young talent being wasted. In football it is often down to bad advice, poor agents, or the people around them influencing them badly, or just maybe the lack of a good mentor at their club. 

First Cantwell, now Rowe, maybe even to a certain extent to Idah......so is the culture at Norwich too molly coddling, too soft, too much ego massaging rather than showing the harsh realities of football?  

I hope Hoff will be as strong as Farke in that respect - a no nonsense approach when it comes to egos. Rowe, for whatever reason has been a plank, in one go has ruined his reputation at a club that nurtured him. Just like Cantwell, although the Cantwell saga was more long drawn out.

So Rowe the new Cantwell? Yes, very much so. Like Cantwell, the sooner he goes to another club, the better.

[horsefly 5,307]

Did Cantwell ever turn up on a match day and refuse to play?

[cambridgeshire canary 7,909]

9 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Are, so it is the boomers fault. I see. Good old blame culture. I don't blame young people for the way they are - like all of us, they are just trying to make sense of the world they live in. 

What does disappoint me though, is when I see young talent being wasted. In football it is often down to bad advice, poor agents, or the people around them influencing them badly, or just maybe the lack of a good mentor at their club. 

First Cantwell, now Rowe, maybe even to a certain extent to Idah......so is the culture at Norwich too molly coddling, too soft, too much ego massaging rather than showing the harsh realities of football?  

I hope Hoff will be as strong as Farke in that respect - a no nonsense approach when it comes to egos. Rowe, for whatever reason has been a plank, in one go has ruined his reputation at a club that nurtured him. Just like Cantwell, although the Cantwell saga was more long drawn out.

So Rowe the new Cantwell? Yes, very much so. Like Cantwell, the sooner he goes to another club, the better.

It's never going to end.

[JonnyJonnyRowe 1,036]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

Are, so it is the boomers fault. I see. Good old blame culture. I don't blame young people for the way they are - like all of us, they are just trying to make sense of the world they live in. 

What does disappoint me though, is when I see young talent being wasted. In football it is often down to bad advice, poor agents, or the people around them influencing them badly, or just maybe the lack of a good mentor at their club. 

First Cantwell, now Rowe, maybe even to a certain extent to Idah......so is the culture at Norwich too molly coddling, too soft, too much ego massaging rather than showing the harsh realities of football?  

I hope Hoff will be as strong as Farke in that respect - a no nonsense approach when it comes to egos. Rowe, for whatever reason has been a plank, in one go has ruined his reputation at a club that nurtured him. Just like Cantwell, although the Cantwell saga was more long drawn out.

So Rowe the new Cantwell? Yes, very much so. Like Cantwell, the sooner he goes to another club, the better.

I don't think Rowe is the new Cantwell at all.

Do you realise just how big Marseille are, and why he'd try and force a move through rather than being stuck in this dreadful spiral of decline at a skint selling club with no chance whatsoever of promotion in the near future? 

I'm actually beginning to change my mind about Idah and Rowe and accept that they are desperate to leave because we're a massively unambitious club which is seemingly making no quick progress towards regime chance, which is set for a prolonged period of mid-table Championship mediocrity following a failed attempt to do what no other club has managed in recent history and entirely self-fund Premier League survival, and they don't want to stagnate here.

What is the message you have for them then exactly? Stay here and play 200 games like Max Aarons so you can go backwards towards the end of your tenure and can earn yourself a move to Bournemouth to be a rotation player in a series of successive relegation battles? 

If he had any sense he'd actually see that Max Aarons should have forced a move when the giants were sniffing around, rather than stay too long and regress, I bet some of our youngsters including AO have recognised that.

Marseille are a massive massive club, sleeping giants, with a billionaire owner who are making some very impressive signings. Its bang out of order refusing to play 20 mins before a game, he deserves a two week fine, but this is the second biggest club in France we are talking about, a club that has had the likes of Deschamps, Desailly, Ribery, Blanc, Waddle, and Drogba wearing their shirt.

They get by far the biggest attendances in France, much larger than PSGs, average 60,799 last year. They've done something that Arsenal and Tottenham have never managed, which is to win the Champions League.

And you are comparing the move with Cantwell's semi-retirement in Scotland? Ridiculous.

He's going about this all the wrong way, undoubtedly, but its an incredible move for the lad if it happens.

Edited August 11, 2024 by JonnyJonnyRowe

[canarycop 232]

Agree on your point but we have brought him up through his footballing education. Respect should be given by Jonny Rowe to us. He is an England u21 who I believe will earn full caps in the future. We have helped put him in that position. That means we call the shots on the valuation or he stays put. £15 m plus add ons or a player seems about right. Sick of the tail wagging the dog. Not how it should be

[percy varco 254]

21 hours ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Given the number of middle aged and older men on here absolutely losing it over a very predictable poor start to the season, I'm not sure it's the best time to talk about the supposed mental frailty of gen Z

Or the right time to be generalising about your perception of the age of the posters on here. 
your words are devisive just as much.