Pinkun General Election thread (ID required)

[Hook's-Walk-Canary 217]

43 minutes ago, duke63 said:

Brexit was funded in part by Russia, Le Pen in France allegedly takes funds from Russia as do the hard line German right. And plenty of photos of Farage with his Russian friends. 
 

If these people have any control over these countries we are well and truly ****ed. 
 

People need to think very carefully about what, or indeed who, they are voting for. 

😃 Don't forget Trump and the Russia thing 🤪

[A Load of Squit 6,041]

Director of the Department of Information and Press at the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs

[Well b back 3,570]

Eight Reform UK candidates have made a wide range of offensive remarks online about women in the past, the BBC can reveal.

The remarks include disparaging comments about the murdered MP Jo Cox, former Prime Minister Theresa May, and a black reality TV contestant.

But don’t worry the Reform response was

He also said the party had had "an awful lot of candidates being stitched up in the most extraordinary way, with quotes taken out of context".

[dylanisabaddog 5,783]

18 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

I have a reporter who used to write for the Guardian living close to me. She says other senior Tories are involved in the betting scandal. She is to the left of Corbyn so I'm not sure whether to believe her or not 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/jun/21/rishi-sunak-tories-election-bet-inquiries

 

Reported in the Sunday Times today that one very senior Tory made a series of bets involving thousands of pounds. 

Edit. The person concerned is Nick Mason who is the Chief Data Officer. The Sunday Times is suggesting there are more involved but Mason allegedly placed multiple bets involving thousands of pounds. The report says that around 10 individuals places bets as long ago as April but they were followed by a large second wave of people more recently and they are thought to be friends and associates of the 'first wave'. 

It beggars belief that these people thought they could get away with it. 

Edited June 23 by dylanisabaddog

[dylanisabaddog 5,783]

Latest poll of polls which was updated on 20 June which is obviously before the betting scandal. Labour are worried that it's too good to be true and think around 25% of the electorate are either undecided or unsure. It's very noticeable how close the Lib Dems are to the Conservatives. 

After all the previous sleaze I doubt that the betting scandal will do any more than simply harden views. 

[Sheva 146]

13 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. You have written in support of an apologist for Putin by saying "we poked the bear". No one did any such thing. He invaded Ukraine because he wants their wheat. 

Not so long ago he sent agents to our country to kill a man and they were so clumsy they could easily have wiped out an entire City. 

If you choose to endorse the words of Farage don't expect me to step back from criticising you. You deserve it. 

Having lived, worked, built several successful  businesses, have family from Russian background, Ukrainian Patriots, Jewish, US, know the country from east/west-north/south, seen every development first hand in the last 30 years, I will say with a somewhat heavy heart that Farage’s comments carry a lot of truth.

I have 3 of my closest family fighting against Russia, numerous friends killed and injured, displaced, homes destroyed. 
 

This should never of happened, it didn’t start with the Russian invasion, but many years before. The poor people of Ukraine have been abused and used for decades, they are the supreme fighting nation and they are being used, by the western powers.
 

 

 

 

 

[Herman 10,946]

Russia have had Ukraine as a puppet state, like Belorus, for decades, funding and supporting very dodgy corrupt leaders so the rotten status quo, cold war type scenario carried on. The people of Ukraine saw a better way of life was possible and finally told the Russians to f off and had a revolution to turf the slags out. The dictator Putin didn't like this so invaded to force his rubbish way of life onto the Ukrainians.

In it's simplest terms Ukraine wanted to head west, Russia said no, you're staying east. Puppets and cowards like Farage are just repeating Putin's lies, similar to how Mosley and other scumbags across the world repeated Hitler's lies.

[Daz Sparks 1,539]

48 minutes ago, Herman said:

Russia have had Ukraine as a puppet state, like Belorus, for decades, funding and supporting very dodgy corrupt leaders so the rotten status quo, cold war type scenario carried on. The people of Ukraine saw a better way of life was possible and finally told the Russians to f off and had a revolution to turf the slags out. The dictator Putin didn't like this so invaded to force his rubbish way of life onto the Ukrainians.

In it's simplest terms Ukraine wanted to head west, Russia said no, you're staying east. Puppets and cowards like Farage are just repeating Putin's lies, similar to how Mosley and other scumbags across the world repeated Hitler's lies.

Sadly Herman, you are right, and even more worrying, is the fact that some people believe Farage in this country. They buy his snake oil the same as some Americans buy Trump's lies.

As rotten, corrupt, incompetent and downright p!ss poor as the Tories have been, especially this last 6-8 years, I would vote for them over Farage without hesitation. He is a cancer at the core of this country's politics, he has never once brought anything more to the table, than hate, division, anger and disruption. I sincerely hope Reform win such a small number of seats that they are no more than political tinnitus. (However, I fear that may not be the case.)

Edited June 23 by Daz Sparks

[Naturalcynic 817]

58 minutes ago, Daz Sparks said:

Sadly Herman, you are right, and even more worrying, is the fact that some people believe Farage in this country. They buy his snake oil the same as some Americans buy Trump's lies.

As rotten, corrupt, incompetent and downright p!ss poor as the Tories have been, especially this last 6-8 years, I would vote for them over Farage without hesitation. He is a cancer at the core of this country's politics, he has never once brought anything more to the table, than hate, division, anger and disruption. I sincerely hope Reform win such a small number of seats that they are no more than political tinnitus. (However, I fear that may not be the case.)

They’ll get two or three at most, and probably none.

[Naturalcynic 817]

Following Farage’s Russia comments there have been a few posts suggesting that he’s being, and always has been, a useful idiot for Putin, and that may well be the case, although I suspect he’s doing that unwittingly rather than anything more sinister.  But it seems to me that there are plenty of other useful idiots who happily support causes designed to weaken and break up the West, not least the pro-Palestinian, anti-Israeli Hamas apologists who march on our streets every weekend. 

Edited June 23 by Naturalcynic

[A Load of Squit 6,041]

Now that the Tories have had a campaign boot from their sponsorship with www.BeGambleaware.og do you think they'll be able to win back all of their losses?

It's not been much fun for them.

[Barbe bleu 990]

3 hours ago, Herman said:

In it's simplest terms Ukraine wanted to head west, Russia said no, you're staying east. 

True i think.

The west was incredibly naive though.  We thought that we could court the Ukraine and that Russia would not respond (despite all the evidence that it would). 

There is  no excuse for the invasion, but we should ask ourselves it it was wise to make ourselves appear weak (historically low defence spending, bery obviously no appetite for expeditionary intervention) and reliant (decommissioning of  nuclear power, German ex chancellor on the board of Russian gas company, too little diversification in gas supply). 

 

[littleyellowbirdie 3,046]

2 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

Following Farage’s Russia comments there have been a few posts suggesting that he’s being, and always has been, a useful idiot for Putin, and that may well be the case, although I suspect he’s doing that unwittingly rather than anything more sinister.  But it seems to me that there are plenty of other useful idiots who happily support causes designed to weaken and break up the West, not least the pro-Palestinian, anti-Israeli Hamas apologists who march on our streets every weekend. 

I think in some respects Johnson may have been a useful idiot in that he unwittingly furthered what Putin considered to be Russian interests. When it came to an active threat from Russia, though, Johnson was right at the forefront of ensuring we got behind Ukraine in resisting the Russian invasion.

By speaking up for Russia Farage is going further than can reasonably be considered as simply being a useful idiot. Farage actively uses the undocumented migration issue to foment political instability in our own country while also cheerleading Russia, the very nation that intentionally foments instability in the regions from which most of them originate.

Farage belongs in the same bracket as Trump and Corbyn in my world view; I can actually point out one or two individual ideas from all of them I'd support, but they all cross red lines in certain areas that make them active threats.

 

Edited June 23 by littleyellowbirdie

[Herman 10,946]

58 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

True i think.

The west was incredibly naive though.  We thought that we could court the Ukraine and that Russia would not respond (despite all the evidence that it would). 

There is  no excuse for the invasion, but we should ask ourselves it it was wise to make ourselves appear weak (historically low defence spending, bery obviously no appetite for expeditionary intervention) and reliant (decommissioning of  nuclear power, German ex chancellor on the board of Russian gas company, too little diversification in gas supply). 

 

You're increasingly sounding like the defence lawyer of a divorced abusive man. 

And no a lot of the courting of Putin was clearly not a good idea. Some of it was for good long term relations, some of it was for pure greed and power. 

[ricardo 7,843]

2 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

  But it seems to me that there are plenty of other useful idiots who happily support causes designed to weaken and break up the West, not least the pro-Palestinian, anti-Israeli Hamas apologists who march on our streets every weekend. 

Yes but these are the "good" idiots😉

[Barbe bleu 990]

26 minutes ago, Herman said:

You're increasingly sounding like the defence lawyer of a divorced abusive man. 

And no a lot of the courting of Putin was clearly not a good idea. Some of it was for good long term relations, some of it was for pure greed and power. 

I don't know from this post if you agree with me or not. Or who this 'divorced abusive man' is in the scenario you describe.

Can we agree that the 'collective west' sent out the wrong message to tyrants when it cut defence spending at the same time as moving away from international intervention?

What about us being reliant on Russia, in retrospect was that a bit daft?

I'm not defending putin if that is your charge.   Not even close to it.  Rather I'm making the point  that in the real world you must learn and do real world things .

Edited June 23 by Barbe bleu

[PurpleCanary 6,196]

Getting back to this election, it is a rather frightening lesson in how mad conspiracy theories can be formulated and be superficially plausible.

If one listed all that has happened since Sunak called the election the idea that he and several other high-profile Tories are actually long-term sleepers agents planted decades ago by Labour would not just be believable but verging on the only rational explanation.

Plainly not. It is just wholesale incompetence. But my point is that most conspiracy theories are built on much less than  Sunakgate could be, with just a few random "facts" which are then erroneously linked, and accepted as gospel by the gullible and the brainless. I say this based on the amusing experience of once having been the subject of one such patent idiocy.

[TheGunnShow 7,081]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

Getting back to this election, it is a rather frightening lesson in how mad conspiracy theories can be formulated and be superficially plausible.

If one listed all that has happened since Sunak called the election the idea that he and several other high-profile Tories are actually long-term sleepers agents planted decades ago by Labour would not just be believable but verging on the only rational explanation.

Plainly not. It is just wholesale incompetence. But my point is that most conspiracy theories are built on much less than  Sunakgate could be, with just a few random "facts" which are then erroneously linked, and accepted as gospel by the gullible and the brainless. I say this based on the amusing experience of once having been the subject of one such patent idiocy.

As a general rule, if it can be attributed to incompetence as well as malice, it's more likely that it's incompetence first. Considering this shower, I'm hard-pushed to see malice in it.

[Barbe bleu 990]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

I say this based on the amusing experience of once having been the subject of one such patent idiocy.

Did someone call you bill?

[dylanisabaddog 5,783]

[Yellow Fever 4,316]

Can SKS use the otherwise unused Rwanda flights to deport and exile all these un-British Tory betting cheaters. No need to worry about their human rights or ECHR - they already waived all appeals to that.

Edited June 23 by Yellow Fever

[Naturalcynic 817]

16 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Can SKS use the otherwise unused Rwanda flights to deport and exile all these un-British Tory betting cheaters. No need to worry about their human rights or ECHR - they already waived all appeals to that.

No.  As every economic migrant ne’er do well ends up doing time at our expense in a British prison, they can do likewise.

[PurpleCanary 6,196]

1 hour ago, Barbe bleu said:

Did someone call you bill?

Ha! No, they called me Joe Ferrari, at that time the club's PR...

[sonyc 6,059]

11 hours ago, Daz Sparks said:

Sadly Herman, you are right, and even more worrying, is the fact that some people believe Farage in this country. They buy his snake oil the same as some Americans buy Trump's lies.

As rotten, corrupt, incompetent and downright p!ss poor as the Tories have been, especially this last 6-8 years, I would vote for them over Farage without hesitation. He is a cancer at the core of this country's politics, he has never once brought anything more to the table, than hate, division, anger and disruption. I sincerely hope Reform win such a small number of seats that they are no more than political tinnitus. (However, I fear that may not be the case.)

Eric Idle thinks much the same as you Daz.

Pretty strong stuff in his post on X.

I won't ever forget his presence and influence in the Brexit vote. He effectively spearheaded a terrible (ultimately successful but dishonest) campaign and people like Johnson saw his chance for personal stardom.

Farage is a destroyer and has no noble cause. Arguably he split the Tory party through Brexit and will continue to split the Tory vote again at the GE  He's a big influence in changing the national 'narrative' because, like all populists, he pitches person A against person B and makes everything sound so simplistic, every problem so one-sided and every solution so straightforward. A very dangerous fellow because life isn't like that. 

https://x.com/EricIdle/status/1804787908370444516?t=SdgMsL0liGvBA-_Tq1kpig&s=19

 

 

Edited June 23 by sonyc

[Barbe bleu 990]

2 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Ha! No, they called me Joe Ferrari, at that time the club's PR...

Can you get me tickets for next year's play off final then?

[Well b back 3,570]

O dear, no wonder Sunak didn’t suspend them, they wouldn’t have any candidates left.

The gambling regulator’s inquiries into bets placed on the timing of the general election involve more people than those publicly named so far

[littleyellowbirdie 3,046]

Conservative MPs who didn't think there'd be questions about them betting on the date of the election just shouldn't be MPs; it's unbelievably idiotic.

Having said that, if there aren't MPs charged then there's going to be an almighty storm over how the timing of the investigation will have affected the election.

[Nik Vawn 342]

James Clevey’s beard looks very “ just for men”

[Nik Vawn 342]

5 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

 

[Herman 10,946]

7 hours ago, Nik Vawn said:

James Clevey’s beard looks very “ just for men”