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Making Plans

An indication of our ambition?

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21 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

He doesn’t score very many. Define quality 

So quality is defined as how many goals a player scores? Krul and Gunn are a bit sh1t then.

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2 hours ago, Google Bot said:

Better than what? It's barely been 24 hours since we played the final match of the season and you're saying we should be doing better in the transfer window(?!).

What we have had is links to Barnes, Willock, Ince (and a rb from Motherwell, Johnston, but he’s interesting sides in Europe) all decent Championship performers - and the type I would be saying we need, supplemented by others. It’s not that bad a start. 

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6 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

So quality is defined as how many goals a player scores? Krul and Gunn are a bit sh1t then.

Sympathise with the overall point, though in this case the chap is a striker so I’d say It’s fair enough metric 😌

 

IMG_7096.jpeg

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3 hours ago, KeiranShikari said:

I really hate how many Norwich fans have decided that Idah is a bust already. I'd understand it more if he'd spent a majority of his minutes playing in his natural position but he just hasn't. Smith got his best performances out of us last season with Idah up top as did Wagner this season.

Ashley Barnes makes a lot of sense to me. With 2 young strikers in Sargent and Idah we're probably looking for a rotation option with good leadership qualities for a couple of seasons. He's just come off the back of a promotion season where he played the best part of 2000 minutes so his legs clearly aren't gone. Seen some suggest that he's a clogger but that really isn't the case, he's sound technically. 

Despite the fact I'm not fan of Hernandez I can see the value of keeping somebody like him around. He's obviously a good personality and on his day he's electric. Giving him the benefit of the doubt he was one of our better performers under Wagner before the injuries/depression hit. We also have no other senior wingers so I would hope that the 2 or 3 we sign will be a lot better than his average.

If Idah is the answer I don’t know what the question is. He has all the physical attributes to be incredible but that’s a pipe dream when he doesn’t even have a first touch. 

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38 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

When people say "ambition" they always mean "money". Usually other people's.

Don’t worry about that…it goes much further. Plenty of posters on record demanding that the club ‘push the boat out’ - read “go into massive debt” - in the hope of scraping PL survival in recent times

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5 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Sympathise with the overall point, though in this case the chap is a striker so I’d say It’s fair enough metric 😌

 

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He’s just played 30 games in a season for the side comfortably the best side in our division. If it’s a choice between him or Idah / Sargent I’m picking Barnes every day of the week. 

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Remember those writing off Sargent this season, he's come good as will Idah, he's got the potential & talent it has to be nertured out of him.....give him time..as for Branes he might just be the character to help the development of the likes of Idah.......so if he comes great, just hope we address the weakness in our squad too.

Edited by Indy

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1 minute ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

He’s just played 30 games in a season for the side comfortably the best side in our division. If it’s a choice between him or Idah / Sargent I’m picking Barnes every day of the week. 

Not necessarily disagreeing especially having seen Idah play yesterday , 

Just meant that goals scored is usually an acceptable measure for strikers, more than for goalkeepers as in the counter example

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4 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

He scored 6 goals. Decent back up option but 33 yrs old so very little in the tank. Personally I am underwhelmed. 

That’s no surprise. We could sign Messi and you’d probably moan 

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2 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

That’s no surprise. We could sign Messi and you’d probably moan 

Yes his wages would ruin us and he’s also at the wrong end of a career to show the hunger we need. I think we need a decent 20 goal a season striker aged between 24-28. A 33 yr old journeyman from Burnley who doesn’t ever score that many might satisfy you but it leaves me cold. 

Edited by Dean Coneys boots

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9 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Yes his wages would ruin us and he’s also at the wrong end of a career to show the hunger we need. I think we need a decent 20 goal a season striker aged between 24-28. A 33 yr old journeyman from Burnley who doesn’t ever score that many might satisfy you but it leaves me cold. 

Ah yes, sorry, I forgot about the rule you can only sign one player. Otherwise, a) he’s not actually signed and b) you have an odd definition of journeyman, he’s had 2 clubs in the last 13 years.

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29 minutes ago, GenerationA47 said:

Not necessarily disagreeing especially having seen Idah play yesterday , 

Just meant that goals scored is usually an acceptable measure for strikers, more than for goalkeepers as in the counter example

Man Utd look a better side with Weghoust in that without him yet he’s not scored a goal. Sometimes workrate and making chances for others is enough. 

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Some people are never happy until they're complaining, and even then they're hacked off.

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It’s not all about marquee signings. This season we’ve lacked leadership, depth, balance, character. You’ve got to get the right blend. No point getting a Buendia if you haven’t got a Rupp. 

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3 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

A prickly, determined character who's done well for Burnley this season and would also be EXCELLENT for Sargent and Idah to learn from. Idah needs to be told how to use his physicality and to get a bit nasty now and again, Sargent will never be found lacking in effort but needs the fine-tuning so an experienced battle axe here would be grand for him. Not to mention, it's often said as a team we're a bit too nice. Barnes will certainly argue his corner and then some, and it might galvanise a few of the others.

Youth won't learn as well on its own, and Pukki's weakness for us was that the team moved away from him. Both Sargent and Idah have a healthy turn of pace but they're hardly nippy. But a proven aerial presence and fighter in the opposition penalty box is exactly what those two can learn from.

Why do you describe scoring 7 goals for a title winning side as ‘doing well’?

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Clappers are out in force tonight. So easily pleased and defensive of the lack of ambition. Little wonder the hierarchy get away with serving up dross. 

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3 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

Why do you describe scoring 7 goals for a title winning side as ‘doing well’?

As clearly his contribution goes far beyond putting the ball in the net, and Burnley's fans (who ultimately watch him week-in, week-out) appreciate it.

You'll not find many messages saying he's no good at this level. If anything, they're saying he's returned back to old form after an indifferent spell.

Message from Ashley Barnes - (uptheclarets.com)

Barnes parting gift - (uptheclarets.com)

Ashley Barnes (footymad.net)



 

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3 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Clappers are out in force tonight. So easily pleased and defensive of the lack of ambition. Little wonder the hierarchy get away with serving up dross. 

Or - put another, more realistic, way - people who won’t judge our entire transfer window before it’s even open/before we have signed any players are out in force tonight.

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46 minutes ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

Man Utd look a better side with Weghoust in that without him yet he’s not scored a goal. Sometimes workrate and making chances for others is enough. 

Exactly, Kevin Davies was never hyper-prolific at Bolton but he was superb at leading a line, being an unholy nuisance to opposition defenders and getting other attacking players into the game whilst releasing the pressure on his own defence.

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Can’t really get on board with Barnes he doesn’t score goals as he played his whole career with his back to goal.

Plus it seems like he’s being lined up for “vibes”. If so then why effectively release Hugill  who was basically doing that role.

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I couldn't believe how easily the Blackpool forwards sliced through us with movement, pace and no lack of technique. As Adrian Forbes said, Stephen Dobbie had done his homework and knew exactly how to set his team up. C J Hamilton and Morgan Rogers  were excellent and put our bumbling forwards to shame.  Perhaps the Sporting Director should ask Blackpool to name their price?

Come to think of it Dobbie at 40 years old would be a welcome new manager should said Sporting Director decide to ask his old Huddersfield mate that 1 win in 11 games with zero goals in  last FIVE home games is not acceptable.

To think that Blackpool had been relegated as well. As they say........'you honestly couldn't make it up'!!

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13 minutes ago, yellowrider120 said:

I couldn't believe how easily the Blackpool forwards sliced through us with movement, pace and no lack of technique. As Adrian Forbes said, Stephen Dobbie had done his homework and knew exactly how to set his team up. C J Hamilton and Morgan Rogers  were excellent and put our bumbling forwards to shame.  Perhaps the Sporting Director should ask Blackpool to name their price?

Come to think of it Dobbie at 40 years old would be a welcome new manager should said Sporting Director decide to ask his old Huddersfield mate that 1 win in 11 games with zero goals in  last FIVE home games is not acceptable.

To think that Blackpool had been relegated as well. As they say........'you honestly couldn't make it up'!!

So you think a manager with good players in Hamilton and Rogers, given a full season and all his tactical nous you described is a target for us. Who finished above them. With managerial change. 

Our season was poor. It ended terribly, but we are not Blackpool, we are not relegated and, honestly, getting Dobbie in would be more laughable than anything 

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6 hours ago, Making Plans said:

Extended contracts to Hernandez & Idah, neither of which pull up many trees on a regular basis.

Reported interest in a 33 year old striker who if bought would hardly be a signing for the future given that future is next season.

Sorry, but we seriously need to do better than that.

A lot better.

Hernandez agreed 

idah, despite a complete air shot yesterday is still young and could come good

Barnes, could be a good squad player similar to Rhodes 

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Making Plans said:

As for spending money we don't have, we hardly went on a wild spending spree when we had some and what we did spend was mostly wasted on players who were/are not good enough and are now worth less than we paid for them.

We call this 'cognitive dissonance'. You want us to show 'ambition' by spending loads of money. Then you complain that spending loads of money somehow doesn't count because it didn't work out.

It's your very idea of 'ambition' that's led us down this particular rabbit hole in which what you call 'hardly... a wild spending spree' was the club blowing more money than it's ever spent before, breaking the transfer record three times in one window and committing every penny of the guaranteed income on future contractual payments. We have the highest wage bill in the Championship precisely because the club showed this misguided 'ambition' rather than pragmatically building on the previous hard work.

Ambition gave us the 4-3-3, loaned in Billy Gilmour, Sacked Farke and ultimately led us to the state we're in right now: one win in 11, bottom half of the Championship, our best players all gone. Ambition gambled everything on a flawed plan and lost; the repercussions of which might linger for years, if not decades to come.

Ambition...

 

Edited by Petriix
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30 minutes ago, Petriix said:

We call this 'cognitive dissonance'. You want us to show 'ambition' by spending loads of money. Then you complain that spending loads of money somehow doesn't count because it didn't work out.

It's your very idea of 'ambition' that's led us down this particular rabbit hole in which what you call 'hardly... a wild spending spree' was the club blowing more money than it's ever spent before, breaking the transfer record three times in one window and committing every penny of the guaranteed income on future contractual payments. We have the highest wage bill in the Championship precisely because the club showed this misguided 'ambition' rather than pragmatically building on the previous hard work.

Ambition gave us the 4-3-3, loaned in Billy Gilmour, Sacked Farke and ultimately led us to the state we're in right now: one win in 11, bottom half of the Championship, our best players all gone. Ambition gambled everything on a flawed plan and lost; the repercussions of which might linger for years, if not decades to come.

Ambition...

 

But we didn’t even give it a go. 

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There's no evidence Idah is going to "come good". Send him on loan and we'll see. If he's anywhere near the first team next season then I think the OP has a point. 

Hernandez has been our best (at times only) attacking outlet this season, and would have a lot more assists if the finishing had been better. Give the guy a break. 

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7 hours ago, Mello Yello said:

image.jpeg.844eef715fff5df1eb069bbb8a798452.jpeg...It's all this lots fault...bunch of demanding entitled...Stu's right!...

Are those the ones supporting the team  through thick and thin, or the ones who boycott games when we’re not winning? 

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