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PockthorpePete

Relegation from the PL

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On 13/02/2023 at 21:00, PockthorpePete said:

Who did I think - S'oton, B'mouth and Forest

Who do I want - Everton, Leeds and WHU

The latter are now only one point from the relegation zone, And Leicester City who have announced pre-tax losses of £92.5m for the year up to 31 May 2022 are only two points above. Why can't we record such losses ? It has been pointed out to me that the collective fans IQ of the Championship would drop dramatically if it is the above named trio of clubs.

 

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..... conspiracy theorist here, the Premiership and their backers do not want small Clubs, with no money in their League. 

Rule changes over the years have only served the biggest Clubs, VAR and refereeing decisions have reinforced that agenda, we've been victim to that on numerous occasions. 

Everton have been 'bailed out' often from seemingly impossible positions,  Sheffield Utd were relegated despite their protests over West Ham's 'acquisition' of Tevez and Macherano mid season..... I wonder if it would have happened the other way around?

I'm convinced that, eventually, the Premiership will shut the door on promotion and relegation, once they've 'acquired' the bigger Clubs to maximize sponsorship deals........ we are not invited to that party......

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3 hours ago, splendidrush said:

..... conspiracy theorist here, the Premiership and their backers do not want small Clubs, with no money in their League. 

Rule changes over the years have only served the biggest Clubs, VAR and refereeing decisions have reinforced that agenda, we've been victim to that on numerous occasions. 

Everton have been 'bailed out' often from seemingly impossible positions,  Sheffield Utd were relegated despite their protests over West Ham's 'acquisition' of Tevez and Macherano mid season..... I wonder if it would have happened the other way around?

I'm convinced that, eventually, the Premiership will shut the door on promotion and relegation, once they've 'acquired' the bigger Clubs to maximize sponsorship deals........ we are not invited to that party......

How hilariously true and sad that statement is!

Maybe someone ought to get the ol history book out and point out  that we are a Premier League OG.
Although so are Leeds and Ipswich so maybe they have a point.

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Would cancelling promotion to PL be such a bad thing, let them get on with their corruption.  

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I think the bottom 3 is already sorted. Everton also have some tough fixtures coming up, plus have played a game more.

If it isn't Everton then I fancy Leeds.

 

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I hope Forest get relegated as that sort of spending shouldn't be rewarded and seen as 'the way' to becoming succesful.

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7 minutes ago, king canary said:

I hope Forest get relegated as that sort of spending shouldn't be rewarded and seen as 'the way' to becoming succesful.

Don’t think they had much choice

my 3 - Leeds soton Bournemouth 

dyche has enough about him to save Everton 

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15 minutes ago, king canary said:

I hope Forest get relegated as that sort of spending shouldn't be rewarded and seen as 'the way' to becoming succesful.

Sadly this is the case, and I can't see it changing.

Personally I think Bournemouth, Leicester, and Everton coming down would be best for us, those club might all implode.  

Interms of my heart, I would love to see Everton, Leeds, and Wet spam come down, but I think Leeds and West Ham will blow the league away

Edited by Newtopia

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4 minutes ago, Yobocop said:

Don’t think they had much choice

Did someone put a gun to their owners head and demand they sign 30 players for around £200m?

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The pleasing thing for me is that 'established' clubs like WHU, Southampton and Everton could be relegated whilst the likes of Fulham and Brentford are challenging for European football.

 

Edited by Capt. Pants
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43 minutes ago, king canary said:

I hope Forest get relegated as that sort of spending shouldn't be rewarded and seen as 'the way' to becoming succesful.

I largely agree but TBF they also stuck with Cooper when they had a dreadful start, so I can’t 100% want them to go down.

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29 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

The pleasing thing for me is that 'established' clubs like WHU, Southampton and Everton could be relegated whilst the likes of Fulham and Brentford are challenging for European football.

 

I’m very envious. Had we spent wisely we too could have been in this position. All that hard work leading up to the last PL tilt seems like a bit of a waste - though I appreciate the infrastructure is now miles better from where we were so that’s a positive. I just can’t fathom how both Brentford and Fulham got it so right when we were all travelling companions only a few seasons ago. Such a missed opportunity.

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28 minutes ago, Danke bitte said:

I’m very envious. Had we spent wisely we too could have been in this position. All that hard work leading up to the last PL tilt seems like a bit of a waste - though I appreciate the infrastructure is now miles better from where we were so that’s a positive. I just can’t fathom how both Brentford and Fulham got it so right when we were all travelling companions only a few seasons ago. Such a missed opportunity.

Fulham did blow it the first two times, they just have the finance that those errors don't wreck them.

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2 hours ago, Danke bitte said:

I’m very envious. Had we spent wisely we too could have been in this position. All that hard work leading up to the last PL tilt seems like a bit of a waste - though I appreciate the infrastructure is now miles better from where we were so that’s a positive. I just can’t fathom how both Brentford and Fulham got it so right when we were all travelling companions only a few seasons ago. Such a missed opportunity.

I  think the reality is Brentford are a one-off, in that to expect to emulate them instead of the over 30 or so clubs of similar size to us is a little difficult to do.

Fulham got it wrong as many times as us, spending much bigger money in the process, to then seemingly correct it this time.

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1 hour ago, hogesar said:

I  think the reality is Brentford are a one-off, in that to expect to emulate them instead of the over 30 or so clubs of similar size to us is a little difficult to do.

Fulham got it wrong as many times as us, spending much bigger money in the process, to then seemingly correct it this time.

I understand. Just a bit jarring to have been to Griffin Park, watched us beat them then a few seasons later see them knocking on the door for European football. Such is envy. But there we go, some interesting times ahead with Norwich though so let’s see. 

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4 hours ago, king canary said:

Fulham did blow it the first two times, they just have the finance that those errors don't wreck them.

Hanging on to Mitrovic was massive for them. They've also cleverly upgraded their squad and now have a very good coach.

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12 hours ago, king canary said:

Did someone put a gun to their owners head and demand they sign 30 players for around £200m?

No but equally I don’t think you’re allowed to play with 7 players 

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18 hours ago, splendidrush said:

..... conspiracy theorist here, the Premiership and their backers do not want small Clubs, with no money in their League. 

Rule changes over the years have only served the biggest Clubs, VAR and refereeing decisions have reinforced that agenda, we've been victim to that on numerous occasions. 

Everton have been 'bailed out' often from seemingly impossible positions,  Sheffield Utd were relegated despite their protests over West Ham's 'acquisition' of Tevez and Macherano mid season..... I wonder if it would have happened the other way around?

I'm convinced that, eventually, the Premiership will shut the door on promotion and relegation, once they've 'acquired' the bigger Clubs to maximize sponsorship deals........ we are not invited to that party......

There is a bit of a contradiction there. If rules are being bent to help the bigger clubs then why close the door to promotion ?

What does happen is the top 6 (at any time) will play in Europe and thus earn them extra money. Enough to keep them in that top group, which gives them European money which gets them into Europe etc etc..... That is where the closed shop exists. The so dalled Champion League. Same few as winners ever year.

The rest of the PL should threaten to throw them out.  A closed league of around 6 would so lose it's appeal. They need the others more than the others need them. As it stands removing the top six from the PL and replacing them with the top six Championship clubs would see a far healthy game.  If there were no entry into the Champions league there would be no imbalance of income other than what stadium size, deft player trading etc would bring, as before.

Any gardener will tell you, that you regularly have to prune bushes, shrubs, trees down to cut away the ugly growth. That time has come.

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5 hours ago, PockthorpePete said:

There is a bit of a contradiction there. If rules are being bent to help the bigger clubs then why close the door to promotion ?

What does happen is the top 6 (at any time) will play in Europe and thus earn them extra money. Enough to keep them in that top group, which gives them European money which gets them into Europe etc etc..... That is where the closed shop exists. The so dalled Champion League. Same few as winners ever year.

The rest of the PL should threaten to throw them out.  A closed league of around 6 would so lose it's appeal. They need the others more than the others need them. As it stands removing the top six from the PL and replacing them with the top six Championship clubs would see a far healthy game.  If there were no entry into the Champions league there would be no imbalance of income other than what stadium size, deft player trading etc would bring, as before.

Any gardener will tell you, that you regularly have to prune bushes, shrubs, trees down to cut away the ugly growth. That time has come.

Interesting take, the rules are being bent to help the bigger Clubs..... until they've positioned themselves to maximize profits,  Clubs like Sunderland, Derby and Sheffield Wednesday would generate greater profits for the Premiership than Bournemouth, Watford or ourselves, it's all about population density. 

The Premiership has to keep the top six happy, they've tried to jump ship once, they'll try it again, count on it.

If the Premiership 'threw them out' Sky and all the other major sponsors would be gone too, the money would leave the Premiership overnight and the mercenaries currently making a living at all the remaining Clubs would leave like rats from a sinking ship, so many Clubs could go to the wall financially it's hard to see how it would make for a 'healthier game'..... like I said,  conspiracy theorist. 

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14 hours ago, Capt. Pants said:

Hanging on to Mitrovic was massive for them. They've also cleverly upgraded their squad and now have a very good coach.

Whereas we sold our best player and brought in a load of dross! 
 

The key was keeping Mitrivic for me like we should have kept Buendia but no we sold him to buy absolute garbage 

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11 minutes ago, TheBaldOne66 said:

Whereas we sold our best player and brought in a load of dross! 
 

The key was keeping Mitrivic for me like we should have kept Buendia but no we sold him to buy absolute garbage 

Buendia did not want to stay……

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1 hour ago, Newtopia said:

Buendia did not want to stay……

If we had matched Villa’s wage offer then he might have done. Bottom line for recent seasons is that self funding doesn’t cut it at the top level. We needed new ownership 5-10 years ago and have paid a heavy price for sentimentality, having allowed our owners (like our managers) to overstay their welcome. Hopefully the penny has now dropped- hence Attanasio on horizon. But without proper funding expect to decline. You can’t play in a global league with national level funding

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Just now, Dean Coneys boots said:

If we had matched Villa’s wage offer then he might have done. Bottom line for recent seasons is that self funding doesn’t cut it at the top level. We needed new ownership 5-10 years ago and have paid a heavy price for sentimentality, having allowed our owners (like our managers) to overstay their welcome. Hopefully the penny has now dropped- hence Attanasio on horizon. But without proper funding expect to decline. You can’t play in a global league with national level funding

How have we allowed the owners to stay? We can't force a sale, nor were there any fan led efforts to buy them out...

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1 hour ago, cornish sam said:

How have we allowed the owners to stay? We can't force a sale, nor were there any fan led efforts to buy them out...

Someone has to come in who will donate money to the club, I suspect if someone came along and offered free money the current owners would sell.  

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1 hour ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

If we had matched Villa’s wage offer then he might have done.

And he might not.


It’s very often not just about money. He might have wanted to live somewhere bigger, a better chance to play in Europe, get the attention of the national team, play with better players…. There are many reasons why even if we could/did offer more why it wouldn’t have been successful.

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3 hours ago, TheBaldOne66 said:

Whereas we sold our best player and brought in a load of dross! 
 

The key was keeping Mitrivic for me like we should have kept Buendia but no we sold him to buy absolute garbage 

I don't know if Mitrovic wanted out, I suspect he's on one hell of a salary plus he can live in or close to London. I'm sure he could have got a move to a 'bigger' club had we wanted one, but he's still there at the moment.

 

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Oh goody we're doing the Buendia argument again.

We didn't have to sell, we chose to. Whether Buendia would have remained as effective if we'd refused to sell him we'll never know. We do know that our efforts to replace him failed miserably. 

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