Season ticket prices 65+

[Inch High aka Inchy.. 405]

Best thread in months.

[dylanisabaddog 4,844]

6 minutes ago, Inch High aka Inchy.. said:

Best thread in months.

Me too🙄

 

Edited February 1, 2023 by dylanisabaddog

[daly 499]

Not every 80 year old plus is rolling in money

Walk through Norwich any day and the dozens of Coffee Bars, fast food shops, restaurants etc are full of 20’s to 40 year old 

Won’t  see many pensioners sitting there paying £10 for a coffee and a sandwich 

Like many on here I’ve worked from age 15 and paid taxes etc and never claimed a penny from social unlike many season ticket holders who know how to work the system 

Nice that NCFC  give up a small discount 

PS Would still go to CR even if they didn’t but would have to stop buying 3 bottles of Brandy a week

[Commonsense 608]

3 hours ago, ncfcstar said:

I didn't say they should have more of a discount, I questioned why a 65 year old should have a discount when a under 30 doesn't.

I don't really want to get into the debate, but the mere fact that you assume someone in their twenties is still living at home points to all the problems the older generation have left younger people to pick up whilst they've benefited from subsidies and handouts that someone under the age of 40 today could only dream of obtaining.  I bet not many of those benefiting from the 65+ discount were still 'living at home' when they were in their twenties, nor were they desperately trying to save tens of thousands of pounds for the privilege of having a mortgage.

Maybe because most of them were at work from the age of 16, rather than staying at school until 18 and then have 3 years at uni, often followed by a gap year!

[canarydan23 4,060]

15 minutes ago, daly said:

PS Would still go to CR even if they didn’t but would have to stop buying 3 bottles of Brandy a week

Then you might start making more sense on here.

[SwearyCanary 1,179]

39 minutes ago, daly said:

Not every 80 year old plus is rolling in money

Walk through Norwich any day and the dozens of Coffee Bars, fast food shops, restaurants etc are full of 20’s to 40 year old 

Won’t  see many pensioners sitting there paying £10 for a coffee and a sandwich 

Like many on here I’ve worked from age 15 and paid taxes etc and never claimed a penny from social unlike many season ticket holders who know how to work the system 

Nice that NCFC  give up a small discount 

PS Would still go to CR even if they didn’t but would have to stop buying 3 bottles of Brandy a week

Anyone on benefits that has enough to pay for a season ticket as well as pay their cost of living is a financial guru. I’m paid adequately in my opinion and above national average, but the season ticket is a luxury I have to budget for and make sacrifices. People ‘on the social’ that have one cannot be that many surely? 

[CANARYKING 634]

3 hours ago, ricardo said:

And got soaking wet when it rained. Great fun when I was that age but wouldn't be able to hack it now.

I would love to be able to transport back to the 1950's some of those who think life was so great then. They would be in for a real shock.

As for those who have worked to get themselves into a reasonably comfortable position when they retired, I think most have probably earned it the hard way, I know I have.

Try going to the loo at the bottom of the garden on a freezing morning, having a bath in front of a coal fire then having to empty it outside, no mobile phones, no internet, no Sky etc etc Having lived through that lot I enjoy my over 65 discount.

[Duncan Edwards 2,216]

1 hour ago, CANARYKING said:

Try going to the loo at the bottom of the garden on a freezing morning, having a bath in front of a coal fire then having to empty it outside, no mobile phones, no internet, no Sky etc etc Having lived through that lot I enjoy my over 65 discount.

Like a Hovis advert.

”bought my council house for £8k but blass me, them there morgidge rates in the 80s buh… then there were the pool tax… ware bin thrurt I tell yer. Now me gaff is fully paid off and I’ve got a nice pad in Borbruh (chairs Maggie) I’m deloited that I get a cheap season ticket to reward me for all are bin through. Dort even hatter pay to git the bus in neither! Lovely old job.” 😉

Edited February 1, 2023 by Duncan Edwards

[Big Vince 318]

10 hours ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

The paradox of modern society is the poor having to pay the rich to rent a house they are told they can’t afford even though the rental cost is usually hundreds more than the cost of a mortgage on the same property. Bonkers. 

I am sure all Norwich supporters are Labour, I mean this is all very Old Labour Let's Have Class Warfare Against The Rich.

[essex canary 490]

4 hours ago, TIL 1010 said:

McNally removed concessions for centre block seats in both the City Stand and South Stand as he described them as the best seats in the house like at theatres where you pay a premium price for such seats.

Can't really argue with that or maybe you can ?

They are the best seats in the house which makes it surprising that the padded seats in the City Stand with their cramped legroom are 50 % more albeit with a programne and coffee. The former should be hiked in price and the latter reduced in my opinion.

Does any other Club operate any part of their ground without concessionary prices? Seems unfair to me that over 65s can't benefit from concessions in these areas if they like their seats and neighbours etc. That feels like the real anti-loyalty issue here. Over 75 concessions are ridoculous both in that context and thst if anything under 25 or student categories ought to be a relative priority.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

11 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

By the way, there are lots of people under 65 who can't afford football. 

There are lots of people over 65 who can't afford football too.

[Commonsense 608]

16 minutes ago, Big Vince said:

I am sure all Norwich supporters are Labour, I mean this is all very Old Labour Let's Have Class Warfare Against The Rich.

I’m not sure you’d know anything about Norwich supporters.

Mind the gap!

[canarydan23 4,060]

45 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

There are lots of people over 65 who can't afford football too.

Very true, but as more than 70% of our nation's wealth is held by those aged 65+, what rationale is there for subsidising their season tickets? And bus passes? And triple locked pensions?

It will change over the years, we've already seen it with the TV licence. You can't continue to expect objectively poorer generations to continue to subsidise the lifestyles of their richer elders.

Especially when those richer elders rage when young people buy a coffee instead of making their own. Or have the temerity to own a Netflix account.

[daly 499]

4 hours ago, canarydan23 said:

Then you might start making more sense on here.

The Brandy was a joke

Not all pensioners are rolling in it, also the benefactors of their wealth through inflation etc are going to be their children

 

[NFN FC 1,118]

7 hours ago, daly said:

The Brandy was a joke

Not all pensioners are rolling in it, also the benefactors of their wealth through inflation etc are going to be their children

 

Their children being around the 65 mark when the parents pop their clogs 

[daly 499]

30 minutes ago, NFN FC said:

Their children being around the 65 mark when the parents pop their clogs 

Terrible they should have to wait that long

[ncfcstar 287]

13 hours ago, Commonsense said:

Maybe because most of them were at work from the age of 16, rather than staying at school until 18 and then have 3 years at uni, often followed by a gap year!

What a stupid comment.  I'm pretty sure it is someone of the 65+ age group who wholly encouraged people to stay in education beyond 16 - for various reasons, including trying to think of ways to improve earnings so younger people could prop up the generations that had already benefited from £££ being put into their pockets when they get to their dotage.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

10 hours ago, canarydan23 said:

Very true, but as more than 70% of our nation's wealth is held by those aged 65+, what rationale is there for subsidising their season tickets? And bus passes? And triple locked pensions?

Of course it is, they've paid their mortgages off.

You'd certainly hope that after 25 years of paying a mortgage your net worth is higher than it was when you were 30 wouldn't you.

Disposable income is perhaps the best metric to use and that is the age bracket with the highest amount of disposable income in 2020/21 was the 45-54 age group and the lowest was found in those aged 85+ due to erosion of real spending power, which is why the triple lock is important.

As for the bus pass thing, it brings numerous economic and social benefits, and you'd find empty buses running all over the place from 10am to 4pm if you took it away, and then the withdrawal of the services, if you actually think that taking those away would see your peak time fares reduce then that's just a bit silly. The free bus passes are about social inclusion and every £1 spent on free bus subsidies is believed to generate £2.87 of knock on benefits, not least in health and wellbeing (would you rather pay more for their healthcare?) but also serves to bus people to volunteering opportunities so is important for the third sector, reduces highway congestion, is better for the environment, 

Its not very joined up thinking if you begrudge busing around 80 year olds for free. Would you rather pay more for your car insurance when they are all forced to try and keep driving and start crashing into people when they have strokes or heart attacks at the wheel, and happier to sit in traffic longer when millions more cars make the roads become more congested, happier to see more potholes appear, happy to pay more for their healthcare when those unable to drive are stuck indoors going backwards physically and mentally? Want it to become even more difficult to find a parking space? More streets to go permit only?

Or do you reckon the odd free bus trip isn't all that much of a big deal? Reckon its better to encourage elderly people to get on a bus to visit their elderly friends, or better for society if they just sit and rot in their living rooms in a pit of misery, loneliness and despair? 

You'll be old one day. And when you get there you will point out that you worked and paid taxes for 42 years, during which a sliver of your taxes helped to pay for the bus travel of older people in society. You won't be taking anything from the taxpayer that you didn't give to other people in your taxes. 

It is your mentality that has seen this country fall apart at the seams. You'd rather save the £1 out of some ill judged notion of 'fairness' than save the £2.87 down the line. Well if there is a demographic with a large proportion of people with significant disposable income and plenty of time to spend it, then lets definitely bus as many of them as possible into the city centre so they spend some of it supporting retail jobs yeah?

I'm not sure I want old Mr. Jenkins trying to drive his rust bucket to the Norfok and Norwich to see a specialist about his cataracts, not when I'm driving around with kids in the back of my car. 

ps. The free bus pass is linked to state pension age, which is 66 not 65, and will be 67 in a few years. 

Edited February 2, 2023 by TeemuVanBasten

[canarydan23 4,060]

3 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Of course it is, they've paid their mortgages off.

So don't give them a bus pass if they're sitting in a half a million pound house that they own outright?

You see, what you've done is read what you want to read and then argued against a notion no one is proposing.

Benefits should be targeted. Increasingly they are; child benefit was a universal benefit up until 2013 when it became means tested. There was a little bit of uproar but not a huge amount as people thought, fair enough (though it should have been done on household income rather than the income of an individual due to the obvious disparity that can create). And that is a cut that largely affects Millennials and Gen X. But whenever universal benefits for those 65+ are questioned there is uproar; teachers, firefighters, train drivers, council workers, all being told they are greedy for wanting their wage to keep up with inflation but suggest that boomers might have to swallow a below inflation rise in their pension? Gawd no. Entitled much?

If there are pensioners doing voluntary roles that depend on the bus, empower charities to issue free bus passes to those volunteers. If you reach pension age and are in a council house or social housing, you're eligible. If you fail your medical driving assessment when you reach 70, or any of the subsequent ones after, the doctor can sign you off for a free bus pass.

There are plenty of relatively straightforward and inexpensive ways to get these bus passes to those who need it without having to give it to people on gold-plated, final salary pensions.

Similarly, they can adopt a similar mechanism to child benefit for those people on mega private pensions or those pensioners earning a bundle from renting property so that the state are not forking out close to £10k a year to people earning five times that from other means. I'm not advocating for a cliff edge, but when your retirement income is above £xx.xx then the state pension starts to taper down until your retirement income is above £yy.yy then you don't get anything.

I'd proffer that it is your mentality that has the country fall apart at the seems [sic]. This idea that "I've paid in so I get to take out" is why we pour so much money into the bank accounts of wealthy old people. We need a more "to each according to one's needs" attitude towards tax. Yes, it means some people will pay in inordinate amounts of tax and get very little back, but to those people, society has evidently served them very well and their taxation is the cost of that service. I'm sure it's certainly one they would pay again should they get a rerun of the game of life.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

16 hours ago, nutty nigel said:

What disability concessions? Or do you mean the free bus passes the disabled get.

I have a disabled persons railcard, save one third on most train fares. 

Don't care who I upset by using it, and I'm not short on cash.

That will wind a few people up, dylanisabaddog will be spitting feathers next time he has to buy a train ticket. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

14 minutes ago, canarydan23 said:

So don't give them a bus pass if they're sitting in a half a million pound house that they own outright?

Benefits should be targeted.

So we should exist in a society where people should work hard all of their life to pay off their mortgage and then effectively be forced into selling their house and downsize when they retire so they can afford to get to hospital appointments. Half a million is an arbitrary figure plucked out of thin air I presume, why have you chosen a figure which is almost double the average UK house price?

Jeremy Hunt would love to have a pint with you. 

As for "benefits should be targeted", they are. The free bus has a substantial economic net benefit, that's why the Tory's haven't scrapped it. As I said, lets continue to bus as many of the wealthier pensioners into the city centre as possible, so Marks and Spencers and Hotter Shoes can keep supporting retail jobs during the week when everybody younger is working their 9-5. Your brilliant idea is to only bus the poor pensioners to the shops? Genius. Cut off your nose to spite your face, save a quid and lose a few. 

Edited February 2, 2023 by TeemuVanBasten

[Greavsy 2,412]

9 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

that's why the Tory's haven't scrapped it

Nothing to do with it being a vote winner amongst a certain age group then...... 

[nutty nigel 7,506]

14 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

I have a disabled persons railcard, save one third on most train fares. 

Don't care who I upset by using it, and I'm not short on cash.

That will wind a few people up, dylanisabaddog will be spitting feathers next time he has to buy a train ticket. 

If you lived in London you may qualify for a freedom pass on rail travel. You wouldn't find people jealous of the reason you got it...

[canarydan23 4,060]

2 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

So we should exist in a society where people should work hard all of their life to pay off their mortgage and then effectively be forced into selling their house and downsize when they retire so they can afford to get to hospital appointments. Half a million is an arbitrary figure plucked out of thin air I presume, why have you chosen a figure which is almost double the average UK house price?

Jeremy Hunt would love to have a pint with you. 

As for "benefits should be targeted", they are. The free bus has a substantial economic net benefit, that's why the Tory's haven't scrapped it. As I said, lets continue to bus as many of the wealthier pensioners into the city centre as possible, so Marks and Spencers and Hotter Shoes can keep supporting retail jobs during the week when everybody younger is working their 9-5. Your brilliant idea is to only bus the poor pensioners to the shops? Genius. 

Only selected elements of your quote because you are completely wrong about Child Benefit, it is a universal benefit and not means tested, which just seem to suggest that you've not done your research, e.g. on the substantial net benefit to the wider economy. Cut off your nose to spite your face, save a quid and lose a few. 

A lot of assumptions there. Who's to say wealthy pensioners who currently bus there way into town will stop going if they have to drive or use a taxi? Options which also come with economic benefits, I hasten to add. Giving a free bus pass to people who can afford other means could be damaging to the taxi, automotive and car park sectors.

And yes, half a million was an arbitrary figure plucked out of thin air to make a point. But you don't really believe people who own them would need to sell them to pay a bus fare (or even a taxi fare) to get to hospital. Ask yourself why you're having to make a point that you know is ridiculous, it might lead you somewhere.

And Child Benefit is "universal" in name only. I'm assuming from your post your not aware of the High Income Child Benefit Charge? Once one person in a household earns over £60,000, they have to either opt out of them or their partner receiving child benefit, or else pay it all back through a Self Assessment tax return. A muddled policy which basically involves the government giving an amount with one hand and taking that exact amount away with the other.

And the fact that the amount you have to pay back increases as your income between £50,099 and £60,000 rises is the definition of means tested, despite what the government will tell you. If you've swallowed that it's a universal, non-means tested benefit, I've a bridge to sell you.

[Greavsy 2,412]

1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

If you lived in London you may qualify for a freedom pass on rail travel. You wouldn't find people jealous of the reason you got it...

And if my aunt had........ You know the rest. 

[nutty nigel 7,506]

1 minute ago, Greavsy said:

And if my aunt had........ You know the rest. 

If your aunt hadn't had siblings...

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

35 minutes ago, canarydan23 said:

Who's to say wealthy pensioners who currently bus there way into town will stop going if they have to drive or use a taxi? Options which also come with economic benefits, I hasten to add. Giving a free bus pass to people who can afford other means could be damaging to the taxi, automotive and car park sectors.

Yes that's just what Norwich needs isn't it, more congestion. Our city centre was definitely designed hundreds of years ago with that in mind. 

I'll completely disregard the result of analysis commissioned a few years back and carried out by KPMG which showed that every £1 spent on subsidised bus travel brought about £2.57 of net economic benefit because some bloke on the forum said "wot bout taxi's".

At least you can stop pretending to give a flying f*ck about the environment now. Moron. You can have the last word, but I won't bother to read it.

On 10/01/2023 at 22:29, canarydan23 said:

It is about consideration for others, yes. When I cycle to work, I take up about 20% of the road space a car does and beyond the odd fart, emit 100% less CO2.

So for every 100 people who commute by bike, that's 500 less cars, meaning those who do drive get there quicker.

You want to implement measures that would inevitably push some of those people off their bikes and into their cars (the vast majority of bike commuters have cars too). Big fan of longer wait times in polluting traffic jams are you? And you want to do so because of a combination of fictional people you've made up and the actions of a minority of inconsiderate cyclists.

It's not about consideration for others, it's about you wanting something based on a fallacy.

On 16/07/2019 at 11:33, canarydan23 said:

At the end of the day, your railing against people who are choosing to either keep fit, reduce congestion (bikes take up less space than cars), benefit the environment or a bit of all three because they occasionally hold up traffic.

Edited February 2, 2023 by TeemuVanBasten

[Greavsy 2,412]

8 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

If your aunt hadn't had siblings...

Fair play, that's actually quite good. 

 

[essex canary 490]

17 hours ago, Greavsy said:

is that like XG? 

Something like that. It means the Scottish Government miss the chances rather than Westminster and they effectively bribe them to stay in the Union albeit that many of them would prefer to take their chances with Europe.

Bring it on for the regions of England. It would be worth taking the risk to free us from the preposterous Westminster bidding processes.

[canarydan23 4,060]

45 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Yes that's just what Norwich needs isn't it, more congestion. Our city centre was definitely designed hundreds of years ago with that in mind. 

I'll completely disregard the result of analysis commissioned a few years back and carried out by KPMG which showed that every £1 spent on subsidised bus travel brought about £2.57 of net economic benefit because some bloke on the forum said "wot bout taxi's".

At least you can stop pretending to give a flying f*ck about the environment now. Moron. You can have the last word, but I won't bother to read it.

There's the TvB we know and love, muddled logic and poorly constructed arguments that lead to the inevitable angsty anger. We should stop now before you start crying into my DMs again. 

Edited February 2, 2023 by canarydan23