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Pyro Pete

Rail Seating survey from the club

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Thanks for posting. I'm disappointed they're not going for the River End as well but I suppose we need to increase capacity for that to happen 

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10 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

I'm disappointed they're not going for the River End as well

Yeah, I thought that too.

Still, if enough fans vote for it, it should help improve the atmosphere at the ground no end.

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Before it gets mentioned please don't think rail seats and safe standing increases capacity because it does not.

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36 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

Thanks for posting. I'm disappointed they're not going for the River End as well but I suppose we need to increase capacity for that to happen 

I’d go for the City Stand first and take it from there. 

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3 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

Before it gets mentioned please don't think rail seats and safe standing increases capacity because it does not.

And it costs a fortune to adapt the seating as well! Surely better to spend on the squad (or put towards expansion / replacement of the City stand)?

Or does it meet LYB's hidden criteria of ensuring support is always positive (doubtful because I am sure those standing will be just as grumpy as those that sit)!

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Well in the City Stand it's already on match-days got a plethora of sleepers, so them rails can be then fitted without much finance....

2 X British Rail Logo Vinyl Stickers Car Van Truck Taxi LorryDelia Smith 'falls asleep' during Newcastle v Norwich match with moment  captured on live TV - Chronicle Live

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26 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

And it costs a fortune to adapt the seating as well! Surely better to spend on the squad (or put towards expansion / replacement of the City stand)?

The lower Barclay has a capacity of about 3,000.

Celtic put in 3,000 rail seats in 2016 for a cost of £500,000.

The cost of ground expansion would be tens of millions.

How many players can be bought for £500k?

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1 minute ago, Pyro Pete said:

The lower Barclay has a capacity of about 3,000.

Celtic put in 3,000 rail seats in 2016 for a cost of £500,000.

The cost of ground expansion would be tens of millions.

How many players can be bought for £500k?

However ground expansion would generate additional revenue for decades, rail seating won’t.

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It's the City Stand that needs bleedin' sorting....Shame that the ideal opportunity to complete the task during lock downs that would have caused minimum disruption wasn't seized upon....

Yeah I know munny, munny, munny.....

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1 minute ago, Commonsense said:

However ground expansion would generate additional revenue for decades, rail seating won’t.

Actually it does. Seats need replacing. Rails don't. You get your money back in 10 years and will then be a small amount in profit. 

The strange thing is what @TIL 1010says above. German clubs operate on a 3 for 2 basis on safe standing. Not sure why we haven't followed that.

The attraction for me is that people who persistently stand can be rehomed if they don't stop

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4 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

However ground expansion would generate additional revenue for decades, rail seating won’t.

But we can't afford tens of millions for anything.

Soccerbot cost £750k. The new floodlights were £1million.

This is another comparatively small project that could make a big difference to the ground atmosphere.

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20 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

The strange thing is what @TIL 1010says above. German clubs operate on a 3 for 2 basis on safe standing. Not sure why we haven't followed that.

I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying rail seating does make it possible to increase capacity. I.e. 3 persons standing where 2 would have sat?

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32 minutes ago, Pyro Pete said:

The lower Barclay has a capacity of about 3,000.

Celtic put in 3,000 rail seats in 2016 for a cost of £500,000.

The cost of ground expansion would be tens of millions.

How many players can be bought for £500k?

A couple of Kennys.

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53 minutes ago, Pyro Pete said:

The lower Barclay has a capacity of about 3,000.

Celtic put in 3,000 rail seats in 2016 for a cost of £500,000.

The cost of ground expansion would be tens of millions.

How many players can be bought for £500k?

Pink'Un just said cost reported by the club is £1m. If put toward City Stand replacement only another £49m to go ...

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55 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

Actually it does. Seats need replacing. Rails don't. You get your money back in 10 years and will then be a small amount in profit. 

The strange thing is what @TIL 1010says above. German clubs operate on a 3 for 2 basis on safe standing. Not sure why we haven't followed that.

The attraction for me is that people who persistently stand can be rehomed if they don't stop

Er, Rails do need similar if not more maintenance to current seating.  The rails seating does have seats too (clue is in the name) and has a tipping mechanism just like seating but also has a locking mechanism that current seats don't have. Therefore if anything the maintenance costs will be more! 

Germany may operate different H&S, but in UK it is 1 for 1.

You may see from my "negativity" I am not a fan on Rail seating on a cost basis. Either go full hog on standing and remove all seating (just steward and police the areas better to make sure capacity is not breached), or leave with status quo on cost basis for me. 

As others are intimating, let's get City Stand replaced before we go to Rail seating - the likelihood is that if we introduced Rail seating it would have to be taken out for temporary measures whilst the City Stand was replaced. A long term strategy is needed here!

Edited by shefcanary
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58 minutes ago, dylanisabaddog said:

Actually it does. Seats need replacing. Rails don't. You get your money back in 10 years and will then be a small amount in profit. 

The strange thing is what @TIL 1010says above. German clubs operate on a 3 for 2 basis on safe standing. Not sure why we haven't followed that.

The attraction for me is that people who persistently stand can be rehomed if they don't stop

1 for 1 is the UK standard, not sure who exactly has decided that but the Safety Advisory Group wouldn't allow anything else.  Something also to bear in mind is that whatever % of the ground is replaced with rail seating also needs to be replicated in the away area - so there will also be rail seating installed in the South Stand.

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1 hour ago, shefcanary said:

Er, Rails do need similar if not more maintenance to current seating.  The rails seating does have seats too (clue is in the name) and has a tipping mechanism just like seating but also has a locking mechanism that current seats don't have. Therefore if anything the maintenance costs will be more! 

Germany may operate different H&S, but in UK it is 1 for 1.

You may see from my "negativity" I am not a fan on Rail seating on a cost basis. Either go full hog on standing and remove all seating (just steward and police the areas better to make sure capacity is not breached), or leave with status quo on cost basis for me. 

As others are intimating, let's get City Stand replaced before we go to Rail seating - the likelihood is that if we introduced Rail seating it would have to be taken out for temporary measures whilst the City Stand was replaced. A long term strategy is needed here!

The maintenance cost is based on reports of the German system. 

I agree with you about a long term strategy and that's been discussed many times before. We don't need it in the Championship and we can't stay in the Premier League. The justification for it is to enable us to catch another generation. I'm glad it's not my decision. Damned if you do and damned if you don't. 

Edited by dylanisabaddog
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4 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

Actually it does. Seats need replacing. Rails don't. You get your money back in 10 years and will then be a small amount in profit. 

The strange thing is what @TIL 1010says above. German clubs operate on a 3 for 2 basis on safe standing. Not sure why we haven't followed that.

The attraction for me is that people who persistently stand can be rehomed if they don't stop

You still have a seat with this type arrangement. Said seat (if faulty) needs to be repaired / replaced in either option (standard seating as now or this 'rail seating' fing).   

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Will throw a no onto this survey.

More as a middle finger to those that want it than a care on my part.

Sorry not sorry.

 

For reference it's more a fu at the attitude of people who seem to dictate that to support I have to stand and sing for 90 minutes.

If I want to sit down in my seat checking the other results while listening to radio Norfolk I will thank you very much.

Edited by Nexus_Canary

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I believe atmosphere has a large impact on the display on the pitch, and also believe that standing generates a greater atmosphere. 

So linking the two, an investment in Safe Standing is also investing in performances. 

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5 minutes ago, greendoor said:

I believe atmosphere has a large impact on the display on the pitch, and also believe that standing generates a greater atmosphere. 

So linking the two, an investment in Safe Standing is also investing in performances. 

Dean Smith and Shakey back then please. 

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16 minutes ago, greendoor said:

I believe atmosphere has a large impact on the display on the pitch, and also believe that standing generates a greater atmosphere. 

So linking the two, an investment in Safe Standing is also investing in performances. 

You can belileve that, but there is a mass of evidence that shows otherwise.

 

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6 hours ago, Mello Yello said:

It's the City Stand that needs bleedin' sorting....Shame that the ideal opportunity to complete the task during lock downs that would have caused minimum disruption wasn't seized upon....

Yeah I know munny, munny, munny.....

With hindsight there must be a lot of clubs bigger and wealthier than ours who wish they'd used the lockdown period to carry out new ground improvements. As far as I remember no club did.

 

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What on earth the club will learn from that indepth survey i have no idea,

Name,Supporter No,e-mail address, where do you sit and a simple yes or no.

Edited by TIL 1010

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4 minutes ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

With hindsight there must be a lot of clubs bigger and wealthier than ours who wish they'd used the lockdown period to carry out new ground improvements. As far as I remember no club did.

 

I don't know if the majority of Fulham's fine new stand was under construction during the lock-downs? Anyway if they do decide in the future corridors of power at Carra to upgrade or totally demolish and rebuild the City Stand, then hopefully the majority of the work will be done during the close season.....Maybe even use shipping containers to construct the new City Stand like the World cup Stadium 974 in Qatar?....It'd be innovative and unique and may require less finances than bricks and mortar, steel etc?....

Just a thought?.....

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11 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

I don't know if the majority of Fulham's fine new stand was under construction during the lock-downs? Anyway if they do decide in the future corridors of power at Carra to upgrade or totally demolish and rebuild the City Stand, then hopefully the majority of the work will be done during the close season.....Maybe even use shipping containers to construct the new City Stand like the World cup Stadium 974 in Qatar?....It'd be innovative and unique and may require less finances than bricks and mortar, steel etc?....

Just a thought?.....

Fulham's Riverside Stand:

Initial planning permission: 2013                   Detailed planning permission: March 2018

Demolition: Summer 2019                      Lower tier open: August 2022                 Opened fully: Not yet

Doesn't quite fit into the covid window, does it?

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3 minutes ago, NewNestCarrow said:

Fulham's Riverside Stand:

Initial planning permission: 2013                   Detailed planning permission: March 2018

Demolition: Summer 2019                      Lower tier open: August 2022                 Opened fully: Not yet

Doesn't quite fit into the covid window, does it?

don't know if the majority of Fulham's fine new stand was under construction during the lock-downs? Anyway if they do decide in the future corridors of power at Carra to upgrade or totally demolish and rebuild the City Stand, then hopefully the majority of the work will be done during the close season.....Maybe even use shipping containers to construct the new City Stand like the World cup Stadium 974 in Qatar?....It'd be innovative and unique and may require less finances than bricks and mortar, steel etc?....

Just a thought?.....

Read the highlight....

Anyway what are your thoughts on the new City Stand being constructed using shipping containers?....

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I don't see how this will generate a better atmosphere, it's no different to the people who stand up anyway and still occupy the same space their seat takes up.

If you think it's gonna replicate the packed in, shoulder to shoulder swaying and surging of the old Barclay, then you're sadly mistaken.

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