Preferred starting XI

[Fen Canary 1,462]

Topic is fairly self explanatory, what would be everybody’s preferred starting 11 for the bulk of the season. Of course this can change here and there with tactical tweaks but mine would be 

GK: Gunn

RB: Aarons

CB: Hanley

CB: Omo

LB: Giannoulis 

RM: Nuñez

CM: Gibbs

CM: McLean

LM: Sara

FW: Pukki

FW: Sargent

 

The midfield may lack some genuine wingers but I feel Aaron’s and Giannoulis can bomb forward to compensate, and Onel or Sinani could be brought on if it needs changing up. Sargent being a nuisance can unsettle defences to create chances, while  Sara and Nuñez should have the quality at this level to feed Pukki.

Im interested to see how this compares to others ideas on getting the best out of the players currently on the books

[mrD66M 149]

****, can't remember when we last had a 4-4-2. Was it a Lambert formation?

 

[Fen Canary 1,462]

22 minutes ago, mrD66M said:

****, can't remember when we last had a 4-4-2. Was it a Lambert formation?

 

Probably, although that was never a flat 442, more of a diamond. If he were in charge now it would likely be labelled a 4-1-2-1-2 or something else equally as ludicrous. 
 

Edit: Mine would be more like a 4-1-3-2 if that’s how you want to look at it 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Fen Canary

[ged in the onion bag 964]

Gunn

Aarons. Omobamidele, Tomkinson, McCallum

Gibbs, 

Tzolis, Sara / Nunez, Cantwell (if still here?) Springett

Idah 

Subs from… McCracken, Hanley, Mumba, Pukki (if still here), Nunez / Sara, Sargent, Dickson-Peters, Sorensen. Rowe when fit, Kamara 

Ideally move on some of the rest and bring in some potential CDMs and a winger!

[Fen Canary 1,462]

1 hour ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Gunn

Aarons. Omobamidele, Tomkinson, McCallum

Gibbs, 

Tzolis, Sara / Nunez, Cantwell (if still here?) Springett

Idah 

Subs from… McCracken, Hanley, Mumba, Pukki (if still here), Nunez / Sara, Sargent, Dickson-Peters, Sorensen. Rowe when fit, Kamara 

Ideally move on some of the rest and bring in some potential CDMs and a winger!

That could just about pass for the under 23’s. I’m still not convinced Idah will get enough goals in the 2nd tier, although I’d like to be proved wrong

[Mackrel829 24]

Depends entirely on whether Wagner brings the wingers back in. The midfield is just so imbalanced at the moment. Countless centre midfield options but very few creative or wide options. With the personnel currently available, I think 5-3-2 makes most sense, but I don't think that's what we'll play.

Gunn

Aarons, Oma, Hanley, Gibson, Dimi

Nunez, McClean, Sara

Pukki, Sargent

[canarydan23 4,823]

7 hours ago, mrD66M said:

****, can't remember when we last had a 4-4-2. Was it a Lambert formation?

 

Smith did it a couple of times last season. We beat Everton, Watford and got a draw v Palace. He then bizarrely abandoned it and results went south again. I'm sure it was in part down to Idah getting injured but we could have stuck with it with Pukki n Sarge up front.

Another example of Smith's woeful tactical nous.

[Fen Canary 1,462]

1 hour ago, Mackrel829 said:

Depends entirely on whether Wagner brings the wingers back in. The midfield is just so imbalanced at the moment. Countless centre midfield options but very few creative or wide options. With the personnel currently available, I think 5-3-2 makes most sense, but I don't think that's what we'll play.

Gunn

Aarons, Oma, Hanley, Gibson, Dimi

Nunez, McClean, Sara

Pukki, Sargent

I can see the attraction there, it would certainly give the full backs more protection to push on. I just feel Gibbs has looked one of our better players this season so it would be a shame not to utilise him, whereas Gibson never fills me with confidence 

[Robert N. LiM 6,435]

I was encouraged by Kenny's performance yesterday and would use him as a double pivot with Gibbs (assuming Hayden never regains full fitness for us). I'd also want to try Pukki as a ten. Not ideal but the best way of getting him and Sargent in the side, I think (the other way is the 3-5-2 that someone mentioned above, which I have a lot of time for). So 4231 with the full backs providing the width (which was the most promising aspect of yesterday, I thought).

Gunn

Max Omo Hanley Dimi

The Mayor Gibbs

Nunez Pukki Sara

Sargent

[Indy 3,493]

Why so negative with the set up? I like the 4-2-3-1 system, with two deeper midfielders they should be able to cover the marauding fullbacks.

As for the team, it’s time to shake things up, Hanley along with others are too comfortable and I like the Wagner line that everyone is playing for their positions.

I would be a little cautious with the next game, Sorensen and others have been on the sidelines a while so need to be bought back with gentle hands.

I’d certainly start with:

Gunn

Aarons, Omobamdele, Gibson, McCullum 

Gibbs, Sara

Nunez, Cantwell, Hernandez

Sargent.

If he wanted to really shake it up I’d drop Gibson for Sorensen if fit enough.

[hogesar 10,935]

14 minutes ago, Indy said:

Why so negative with the set up? I like the 4-2-3-1 system, with two deeper midfielders they should be able to cover the marauding fullbacks.

As for the team, it’s time to shake things up, Hanley along with others are too comfortable and I like the Wagner line that everyone is playing for their positions.

I would be a little cautious with the next game, Sorensen and others have been on the sidelines a while so need to be bought back with gentle hands.

I’d certainly start with:

Gunn

Aarons, Omobamdele, Gibson, McCullum 

Gibbs, Sara

Nunez, Cantwell, Hernandez

Sargent.

If he wanted to really shake it up I’d drop Gibson for Sorensen if fit enough.

Don't mind this, but think Gianoullis done enough yesterday to start ahead of McCallum, Mclean needs to be next to Gibbs especially after being our best midfielder for another consecutive game yesterday. I'd pay Sara in the number 10 or Nunez and swap them if required - I assume Cantwell isn't getting near the team

[Robert N. LiM 6,435]

47 minutes ago, Indy said:

Gunn

Aarons, Omobamdele, Gibson, McCullum 

Gibbs, Sara

Nunez, Cantwell, Hernandez

Sargent.

I know it's not easy, but I would really hope that Wagner can find a way to get Pukki and Sargent in the same team. To my mind, if Pukki isn't in our first XI, something is wrong...

[Petriix 3,250]

There's not a great deal of difference between a CB who steps into midfield and a CDM who drops between the CBs, nor is there much between a number 10 and a second striker who drops deep.

The biggest issue we have is in the midfield and particularly in transitions. For me we're lacking creativity and cohesion and this stems from the wide players being to high: unable to link up play or support the fullbacks. 

In general I think our basic setup is far too attacking by default and we often end up with a huge hole in midfield. Teams can sit deep against us and know they will be afforded lots of opportunities to break, or they can press man for man knowing that we won't be able to pass through them. 

Then we compensate by all dropping deep and lack the attacking threat because we don't have midfielders comfortable receiving the ball in tight areas and moving it forwards. This is where we're missing Cantwell and Dowell of 20/21.

For me it has to be a double pivot behind a number 10. A flatter 4-5-1 or the 4-2-3-1 work fine, or a 3-5-2 as long as it has a solid central pair behind an attacking 8 in midfield with one of the strikers dropping deeper (rather than hitting the channels all the time). 

I really want to see Gibbs and McLean behind Cantwell, Sara and Nunez. Otherwise Dowell at 10 or even Pukki behind Sargent. If Cantwell is out then McLean is our next best option on the (narrow) left and Sorensen should play CDM.

Pukki absolutely has to play if fit. Omobamidele and Gibbs are the future so need as much game time as possible. I'd want Mumba and Tzolis back in the squad ASAP too. There are no circumstances in which Hernandez should be on the pitch ahead of Mumba. 

[sgncfc 1,345]

I've never seen Pukki and Sargent play well together and don't understand the clamour for them both to be shoe-horned into the side. They are very different players. They don't belong in the same side and by playing them together we reduce both of them.  I'd like Wagner to have the cohones to recognise that.

Pukki is a lone striker who runs the channels - he used to move to the near post when we had the ball wide but doesn't do that anymore (anyone know why?). His first touch is not as good as it used to be - no surprise as he gets older. His days are clearly numbered - good servant and all that, but time to move on.

Sargent is a lone striker who battles and grinds then shoots on sight. He's never had a decent first touch so doesn't rely on it to be effective. His physicality is part of what makes him effective - at this level. He would play better with Idah if we ever go two up front, but neither will ever score enough goals to get us promoted. But if Sargent plays, he must play as a central striker.

Any first team with Hernandez in it isn't going to finish in the top 6. Love him, but he isn't good enough.

It's time to start Omo and Tomkinson, protected by Gibbs and Maclean., preferably within a 3 at the back - I'd play Sorensen as the 3rd CB. We have to keep the back door shut to let the fullbacks go forward.

The creator and the 10 are the two biggest problem positions where we don't actually have players who are capable of playing there. I think we bought Nunez and Sara thinking they were those players, but they're clearly not. They are probably the best we have though.

So my eleven is

Gunn

Aarons, Omo, Tomkinson, Sorensen, McCallum

Gibbs, Maclean

Nunez

Sara

Sargent

 

 

[rock bus 1,103]

3 hours ago, Robert N. LiM said:

I was encouraged by Kenny's performance yesterday and would use him as a double pivot with Gibbs (assuming Hayden never regains full fitness for us). I'd also want to try Pukki as a ten. Not ideal but the best way of getting him and Sargent in the side, I think (the other way is the 3-5-2 that someone mentioned above, which I have a lot of time for). So 4231 with the full backs providing the width (which was the most promising aspect of yesterday, I thought).

Gunn

Max Omo Hanley Dimi

The Mayor Gibbs

Nunez Pukki Sara

Sargent

Id go with this for now but ideally I'd like a fully fit Hayden or a new CDM to replace Kenny.

Pukki is a clever player and can still make great runs in the position. If it isnt working in a game or when he tires can use Mclean, Dowell or Cantwell(?!?) to try something different.

Similarly if need pace in game replace Sara/Nunez with Hernandez or a recalled Mumba/Tzolis or if were really desperate Placheta.

[Robert N. LiM 6,435]

2 hours ago, Petriix said:

 

I really want to see Gibbs and McLean behind Cantwell, Sara and Nunez

Much as it pains me to say it we surely have to give up on Todd. Either his non-selection yesterday means he's already on his way, or it means a fourth coach in a row doesn't want to pick him. Would love to be be wrong, but he's done here, isn't he?

Otherwise agree with your analysis and selection from our current squad

Edited January 9, 2023 by Robert N. LiM
typos

[Indy 3,493]

5 hours ago, hogesar said:

Don't mind this, but think Gianoullis done enough yesterday to start ahead of McCallum, Mclean needs to be next to Gibbs especially after being our best midfielder for another consecutive game yesterday. I'd pay Sara in the number 10 or Nunez and swap them if required - I assume Cantwell isn't getting near the team

I certainly wouldn’t argue, both McLean & Giannoulis played well enough, I doubt we’ll see Cantwell back in a Norwich shirt so Sara in at 10 with McLean makes more sense, I just hoped we might persuade Cantwell to sign another year and get him back to his best.

But now it would be good to get a small fee and get him off the wages.

[Petriix 3,250]

2 hours ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Much as it pains me to say it we surely have to give up on Todd. Either his non-selection yesterday means he's already on his way, or it means a fourth coach in a row doesn't want to pick him. Would love to be be wrong, but he's done here, isn't he?

Otherwise agree with your analysis and selection from our current squad

There's a tiny hope that Wagner simply didn't have enough time with the squad so went with what was suggested by the existing staff. It's possible that Cantwell will get a fair chance to impress him before the weekend. Otherwise there might well be other factors which we aren't party to. However, in purely footballing terms, Todd is far better than most of the other midfielders in the squad. 

[Fen Canary 1,462]

6 hours ago, sgncfc said:

I've never seen Pukki and Sargent play well together and don't understand the clamour for them both to be shoe-horned into the side. They are very different players. They don't belong in the same side and by playing them together we reduce both of them.  I'd like Wagner to have the cohones to recognise that.

I must say I disagree with this, mainly because I’ve never actually seen them play up top together, Sargent has always been shunted onto the wing to allow Pukki to play as a lone striker.

Also I believe having two strikers who have different strengths is a good thing. The guile of Pukki making clever runs and latching on to through balls, along with the physicality and energy of Sargent would be a nightmare for defences at this level in my opinion.

The problem with only playing a single striker in my opinion is that it limits the way you can play. Without a Buendia or even the Cantwell of a couple of years ago to unlock defences more often than not out attacks simply fizzle out into nothing as we’re not able to mix it up

[sgncfc 1,345]

But they both play down the middle.. If you play them both as strikers neither will be able to play their natural game. One has to drop or move wide and in either case you completely negate their strength.

[NFN FC 1,142]

                       Gunn

Aarons Andy O Tomkinson Dimi

             Gibbs        Mayor

Bali             S.American       Todd/Argos 

                     Sarge 

[Fen Canary 1,462]

1 hour ago, sgncfc said:

But they both play down the middle.. If you play them both as strikers neither will be able to play their natural game. One has to drop or move wide and in either case you completely negate their strength.

Strikers have played down the middle together for years, the big man/little man partnership was always the holy grail as it were. Just because it’s currently out of fashion doesn’t mean those two couldn’t form a decent partnership in my opinion

[Commonsense 828]

20 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

Topic is fairly self explanatory, what would be everybody’s preferred starting 11 for the bulk of the season. Of course this can change here and there with tactical tweaks but mine would be 

GK: Gunn

RB: Aarons

CB: Hanley

CB: Omo

LB: Giannoulis 

RM: Nuñez

CM: Gibbs

CM: McLean

LM: Sara

FW: Pukki

FW: Sargent

 

The midfield may lack some genuine wingers but I feel Aaron’s and Giannoulis can bomb forward to compensate, and Onel or Sinani could be brought on if it needs changing up. Sargent being a nuisance can unsettle defences to create chances, while  Sara and Nuñez should have the quality at this level to feed Pukki.

Im interested to see how this compares to others ideas on getting the best out of the players currently on the books

TBH that’s not a bad line up. Given the existing resources, I think it’s the best formation you can come up with. It obviously relies on Giannoulis doing some defending as well as bombing forward but overall I quite like it. ( Assuming that’s it for Cantwell now!)

[Commonsense 828]

19 hours ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Gunn

Aarons. Omobamidele, Tomkinson, McCallum

Gibbs, 

Tzolis, Sara / Nunez, Cantwell (if still here?) Springett

Idah 

Subs from… McCracken, Hanley, Mumba, Pukki (if still here), Nunez / Sara, Sargent, Dickson-Peters, Sorensen. Rowe when fit, Kamara 

Ideally move on some of the rest and bring in some potential CDMs and a winger!

Are you so desperate to play Ipswich again that you want us to go down to League 1 to meet them?

[Fen Canary 1,462]

34 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

TBH that’s not a bad line up. Given the existing resources, I think it’s the best formation you can come up with. It obviously relies on Giannoulis doing some defending as well as bombing forward but overall I quite like it. ( Assuming that’s it for Cantwell now!)

I’ve assumed Cantwell is off, although even if he stays on current form I wouldn’t be picking him. Unless he starts playing as he was during the last promotion season I just can’t see who he deserves to displace in the team

[Skip 3]

                                       Gunn

Max        Omobamidele   Tomkinson      McCallum   

                           Gibbs        Mclean/(new Signing)

     Nunez                     Sara                     Cantwell

                                    Sarge         

[sgncfc 1,345]

On 09/01/2023 at 20:53, Fen Canary said:

Strikers have played down the middle together for years, the big man/little man partnership was always the holy grail as it were. Just because it’s currently out of fashion doesn’t mean those two couldn’t form a decent partnership in my opinion

There's a reason it's "currently out of fashion".

[CANARYKING 719]

Sorry Nunez should not be there

[Yellow Green Army 252]

Gunn

Aarons Hanley Omobamidele Giannoulis

Gibbs McClean

Sargent Idah Sara

Pukki

[SwindonCanary 457]

I'm sure our manager will pick a team to win the match