set piece coach

[Ben_CANBC 2]

20 corners.. would expect at least one goal if you have some one that specializes coaching set pieces in the team. 

He talked a-lot about his time with England, and certainly has a pedigree but I don't see anything special about our corners or set plays in general. 

[Nexus_Canary 1,016]

Yeh our set pieces have been dire this season.

Perhaps over thought and just another layer of things for the players to have to deal with?

Sometimes the old "ping it into the maelstrom" approach works best rather than trying to short corner or fanny about with it 

[Robert N. LiM 4,226]

Worth saying again that our defensive set pieces have definitely improved - think we're second in the league on that metric. So that suggests he knows what he's doing there. I guess they're more about organisation, whereas in the attacking ones you do actually need someone with a head for goal...

[cambridgeshire canary 6,669]

Sacked in the morning..

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

2 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Sacked in the morning..

I do hope so. We’ve been worse attacking-wise this season and were pretty crap before!

Edited January 8, 2023 by Branston Pickle

[repman 633]

I think its roughly 3% of corners lead to a goal so that's 1 in 33. Sinani had a free header inside the 6 yard box so I'm not sure what more a set piece coach could've done in that scenario. I thought most of the deliveries were good and we won the first header on a good amount of them too.

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

2 minutes ago, repman said:

I think its roughly 3% of corners lead to a goal so that's 1 in 33. Sinani had a free header inside the 6 yard box so I'm not sure what more a set piece coach could've done in that scenario. I thought most of the deliveries were good and we won the first header on a good amount of them too.

I don’t think we are anywhere near close to that 3%, whether or not it is true.  But the general idea of corners is to create a threat, and possibly a goal from a second or third phase.  And with a ‘specialist’ in the role should we not be well ahead of the average?

[ridgeman 130]

It would be nice to see some variation in set pieces. 20 corners nearly every one dropped in the same place - how easy is that to defend. With a set piece coach you would expect to see variations with corners and free kicks but no. Should be better out there but it is all down to the Webber recruitment machine.

[repman 633]

5 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

I don’t think we are anywhere near close to that 3%, whether or not it is true.  But the general idea of corners is to create a threat, and possibly a goal from a second or third phase.  And with a ‘specialist’ in the role should we not be well ahead of the average?

A set piece coach will focus on 2 things

1. Delivery into the box - generally these have been good and into dangerous areas. We don't have De Bruyne so they won't be perfect but they're decent.

2. Winning the header/making 'first contact' - this can either be a shot or a flick on and today we did that plenty of times too.

What comes after that is either down to our players finishing or getting onto the flick on. We're also a small team, I think our centre backs are the only players who are 6ft+, that puts us at an immediate disadvantage against plenty of sides.

I think if you take both attacking and defending set pieces into account, this season we have gone from being a bad side from set pieces to an average one (bad at attacking, good at defending).

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

1 minute ago, repman said:

A set piece coach will focus on 2 things

1. Delivery into the box - generally these have been good and into dangerous areas. We don't have De Bruyne so they won't be perfect but they're decent.

2. Winning the header/making 'first contact' - this can either be a shot or a flick on and today we did that plenty of times too.

What comes after that is either down to our players finishing or getting onto the flick on. We're also a small team, I think our centre backs are the only players who are 6ft+, that puts us at an immediate disadvantage against plenty of sides.

I think if you take both attacking and defending set pieces into account, this season we have gone from being a bad side from set pieces to an average one (bad at attacking, good at defending).

I’m well aware of what coaches do.  But it is not good enough to be ‘average’.

[repman 633]

6 minutes ago, Branston Pickle said:

I’m well aware of what coaches do.  But it is not good enough to be ‘average’.

He can only work with what he's given, when he had Harry Maguire and John Stones he managed to outstrip that 3% by some margin. Like I said he has improved us from a bad set piece side to an average one, I'm sure he will look to keep that improvement up. Our best chance today was from a set piece.

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

1 minute ago, repman said:

He can only work with what he's given, when he had Harry Maguire and John Stones he managed to outstrip that 3% by some margin. Like I said he has improved us from a bad set piece side to an average one, I'm sure he will look to keep that improvement up. Our best chance today was from a set piece.

You do seem very easily pleased.

[mannings bandy legs 385]

31 minutes ago, repman said:

I think its roughly 3% of corners lead to a goal so that's 1 in 33. Sinani had a free header inside the 6 yard box so I'm not sure what more a set piece coach could've done in that scenario. I thought most of the deliveries were good and we won the first header on a good amount of them too.

Silk purse from sows ear comes to mind. Never going to happen. Relieve him of his duties. Not really his fault. Player's are not good enough.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

We have good delivery. We just have very poor technical attacking headers of the ball.

Even Sargent does not make very good runs and is ‘noisy’ which makes it easy for referees to give free kicks against. 

MacLean makes good runs though doesn’t finish especially well. 

We are poor in terms of personnel. Our corner deliveries from Sara, then Dowell, then Nunez are actually a very decent standard. 
 

Parma  

[Indy 3,283]

4 minutes ago, Parma Ham's gone mouldy said:

We have good delivery. We just have very poor technical attacking headers of the ball.

Even Sargent does not make very good runs and is ‘noisy’ which makes it easy for referees to give free kicks against. 

MacLean makes good runs though doesn’t finish especially well. 

We are poor in terms of personnel. Our corner deliveries from Sara, then Dowell, then Nunez are actually a very decent standard. 
 

Parma  

As I posted elsewhere Parma, if you watch the Wagner taking coaching video there’s lots of players practicing corners and all they’re doing is chipping it into a big net in the 6 yard line! Nothing special about that a set piece coach should be looking to have four or five variations of each set play, then call the changes during the game, especially if the one way isn’t working!

[Harry53 207]

1 hour ago, Ben_CANBC said:

20 corners.. would expect at least one goal if you have some one that specializes coaching set pieces in the team. 

He talked a-lot about his time with England, and certainly has a pedigree but I don't see anything special about our corners or set plays in general. 

What a joke of an appointment.  Get him out and save some money. 

[Badger 2,405]

1. We have the best record of defending corners in the division.

2. Our attacking record is average

3. Sacking the coach would cost us tens of thousands of pounds.

This in a side whose lack of physical presence is widely acknowledged.

Overall, sacking the set piece coach seems a pretty dumb idea.

https://www.whoscored.com/Regions/252/Tournaments/7/Seasons/9141/Stages/21050/TeamStatistics/England-Championship-2022-2023

 

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Badger
Removed duplicate

[The Real Buh 3,423]

1 hour ago, Ben_CANBC said:

20 corners.. would expect at least one goal if you have some one that specializes coaching set pieces in the team. 

He talked a-lot about his time with England, and certainly has a pedigree but I don't see anything special about our corners or set plays in general. 

Somebody’s getting a payrise 

[Badger 2,405]

1 hour ago, Branston Pickle said:

I don’t think we are anywhere near close to that 3%, whether or not it is true.  But the general idea of corners is to create a threat, and possibly a goal from a second or third phase.  And with a ‘specialist’ in the role should we not be well ahead of the average?

We are well ahead of the average defensively - in fact the best. (See above).

I know the figures are slightly out-of-date but the analysis of corners in "The Numbers Game," described by Moneyball's Billy Beane as "a must read," provides some interesting facts:

1.Only 1 in 5 corners leads to a shot on goal.

2. 89% of these shots produced from corners are unsuccessful - they are not good chances.

3. The 3% figure seems high - I don't know where it comes from, I'm sure it's a good source though. The books data suggests that a corner is worth 0.022 goals. This would suggest a goal about every 50 corners. 

4. Given the number of counter-attacks arising from corners, the goal value of the is close to zero. It is likely that much of the work the set piece coach will do on offensive corners is actually defensive - to try to minimise the goals against scored from corners!

 

 

[The Real Buh 3,423]

Just now, Badger said:

We are well ahead of the average defensively - in fact the best. (See above).

I know the figures are slightly out-of-date but the analysis of corners in "The Numbers Game," described by Moneyball's Billy Beane as "a must read," provides some interesting facts:

1.Only 1 in 5 corners leads to a shot on goal.

2. 89% of these shots produced from corners are unsuccessful - they are not good chances.

3. The 3% figure seems high - I don't know where it comes from, I'm sure it's a good source though. The books data suggests that a corner is worth 0.022 goals. This would suggest a goal about every 50 corners. 

4. Given the number of counter-attacks arising from corners, the goal value of the is close to zero. It is likely that much of the work the set piece coach will do on offensive corners is actually defensive - to try to minimise the goals against scored from corners!

 

 

Statistics are killing us.

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

Stats can be misleading, and this is proven in those tables, which simply don’t take any context into consideration, but no one is doubting we are defending them reasonably well.  It’s from open play where we seem to be making costly errors time and again.

But we can see with our own eyes how predictable our attacking set pieces are and don’t need to see any table to back it up.  If we are paying a full time set piece coach, being ‘average’ is simply not good enough.

Edited January 8, 2023 by Branston Pickle

[Mello Yello 2,273]

Thought Kenny played well and I was fortunate to avoid the blustery torrential downpour by sitting in row T in the South Stand....

Back to my ST padded pew in the City Stand next home game....Ah...Variety is the spice of life....Isn't it.....

Anyway, what's this thread about again?.... 

[Van wink 2,994]

We needed the big practice net on the pitch for them to cross in to, the only net we had any chance of hitting!

[Coneys Knee 940]

2 hours ago, Ben_CANBC said:

20 corners.. would expect at least one goal if you have some one that specializes coaching set pieces in the team. 

He talked a-lot about his time with England, and certainly has a pedigree but I don't see anything special about our corners or set plays in general. 

I think “to expect” a goal from 20 corners is a bit strong, but I would expect to see some variate and a bit guile, invention and imagination, rather than just pumping them and hoping for the best, as a minimum for a club with a specific set piece coach.

vary it up a bit at the very least.

[Van wink 2,994]

4 minutes ago, Mello Yello said:

Thought Kenny played well and I was fortunate to avoid the blustery torrential downpour by sitting in row T in the South Stand....

Back to my ST padded pew in the City Stand next home game....Ah...Variety is the spice of life....Isn't it.....

Anyway, what's this thread about again?.... 

Kenny was my MOTM, kept positions well and is going to be key to the way we want to play.

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

….as if by magic, Stevenage show what can be done with a set piece corner to knock Villa out; I don’t think we’ve ever done a move like that in 40+ years of going to games!

Edited January 8, 2023 by Branston Pickle

[The Real Buh 3,423]

Just now, Branston Pickle said:

….as if by magic, Stevenage show what can be done with a set piece corner to knock Villa out.

I wonder if they’ve got a set piece coach 🤔

[Badger 2,405]

14 hours ago, The Real Buh said:

Statistics are killing us.

Facts certainly make things harder for people who rely on pure BS. 😃

[Branston Pickle 3,632]

7 minutes ago, Badger said:

Facts certainly make things harder for people who rely on pure BS. 😃

Stats are only facts when taken in context and can easily lead to mistaken assumptions.

No one has said we are poor at defending set pieces - and tbh I don’t think we ever have been. But we are poor at taking them and have been for several years - there’s been very little discernible improvement this season.

Edited January 9, 2023 by Branston Pickle

[Badger 2,405]

Just now, Branston Pickle said:

Facts are only facts when taken in context.

Obviously.

And the facts in context in this case are that the OP is talking nonsense.