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Bradwell canary

expectations too high?

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Fact is we are sitting number five in a play off position.

Our manager is not popular according to the local press, and comments on this board.

But three of the related sides are in the top six, 

So is the manager doing such a bad job? or are expectation just too high?

We are not watching the flowing football we were used to under Farke, and are grinding out some results, so should we wait until more toward the seasons end before we judge him.

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13 minutes ago, Bradwell canary said:

Fact is we are sitting number five in a play off position.

Our manager is not popular according to the local press, and comments on this board.

But three of the related sides are in the top six, 

So is the manager doing such a bad job? or are expectation just too high?

We are not watching the flowing football we were used to under Farke, and are grinding out some results, so should we wait until more toward the seasons end before we judge him.

Performances are poor, points haul down on what it should be. We were joint favourites to win this league but don’t look the part to date. 

To have any chance of automatic promotion we can probably only afford 4/5 more defeats, it ain’t looking good. 
 

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57 minutes ago, Bradwell canary said:

Fact is we are sitting number five in a play off position.

Our manager is not popular according to the local press, and comments on this board.

But three of the related sides are in the top six, 

So is the manager doing such a bad job? or are expectation just too high?

We are not watching the flowing football we were used to under Farke, and are grinding out some results, so should we wait until more toward the seasons end before we judge him.

I think anyone who has expectations that aren’t Norwich in the top 2 sides come the end of may/June has expectations that are too low. Especially given the squad at our disposal. Anything less would be a failure in my view. We have multiple players in the squad who’ve won this league twice with us so we know they are more than capable, add to that the outlay on new players, the fact the league this year look very poor and there is really no excuses for me. 
 

On a personal level regardless of the level Norwich plays at I always have high standards of how I wish to watch football to be played. Norwich have a long history of playing a style of football that I enjoy which is attractive passing football. I actually have far far more tolerance for failure when attempting excellent than I do for failure when playing it safe. 

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59 minutes ago, Bradwell canary said:

Fact is we are sitting number five in a play off position.

Our manager is not popular according to the local press, and comments on this board.

But three of the related sides are in the top six, 

So is the manager doing such a bad job? or are expectation just too high?

We are not watching the flowing football we were used to under Farke, and are grinding out some results, so should we wait until more toward the seasons end before we judge him.

Also I would make the following points, 

1) it’s not just Farke we watched play good football. Alex Neil got a team playing really good football at this level. Paul Lamberts side for me was even more enjoyable to watch than Farke’s. Worthy (other than final season), Walker, Brown all put out sides that were good to watch. 


2) We aren’t grinding our results against sides that I would call the top sides in the league. We are having to grind out results against teams far worse than us with much less at their disposal. Add to that games which in previous years would be ground out 1-0 wins are turning into 1-2 defeats such as Borough. 
 

For me the football product on the pitch doesn’t match the identity of the team I know is in there. 

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This debate rages on and on. My thoughts are like the original poster I feel we are on par or just over par this season.

The argument that we should be top two we have higher quality players etc.. Is not something I 100% agree with we have lots of good championship players but lack any players who are obviously premier league players in waiting. The squad hasn’t changed much since last year when we finished dead last in the premier league conceding well over 2 goals a game. To scars of last season will take awhile to get over. You cannot just flick a switch.

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It's arrogance really. A lot of fans expect us to win the league at a canter. It's disrespectful to the other teams. If you look back you'll see many of the same people claimed exactly the same things under Farke. Until we were winning and went top. Winning football is always viewed as good football. If not then it's never criticised.

The football has been in and out. Pragmatic with good spells but no more than 20/30 mins per game. Those good spells are what we're capable of. Just need to make those spells longer.

There's also the point that since the pandemic people have moaned non stop about all kinds of stuff. 

Count your blessings and cheer up! 😂

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Forget where we are in the league or what other clubs are doing

We've got 32 pts from 63 on offer at almost the mid way stage.we've droppd roughly half the points available to us

In a league of such poor quality and inconsistency , that is dreadful.

We should have had the team to raise above that mediocrity, just as Burnley are looking like they're about to do.

This 'should' have been one of the more straightfirward promotions in our history, yet we're oncourse to be scraping a 6th place playoff place at best, forget a 85-90 pt + haul that gets automatic promotion

Already lost 7 this season , more than we lost in the whole of our last 2 seasons in this league, including reprehensible home defeats to preston luton and boro

...and have only beaten 1 ? team in the top 10 in the league???

2 wins in the last 10

#SmithOut

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12 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

It's arrogance really. A lot of fans expect us to win the league at a canter. It's disrespectful to the other teams. If you look back you'll see many of the same people claimed exactly the same things under Farke. Until we were winning and went top. Winning football is always viewed as good football. If not then it's never criticised.

The football has been in and out. Pragmatic with good spells but no more than 20/30 mins per game. Those good spells are what we're capable of. Just need to make those spells longer.

There's also the point that since the pandemic people have moaned non stop about all kinds of stuff. 

Count your blessings and cheer up! 😂

Those good spells are what we're capable of. Just need to make those spells longer.👍

There's also the point that since the pandemic people have moaned non stop about all kinds of stuff. 

Count your blessings and cheer up! 😂

Exactly this cheer up. Thank your lucky stars your not supporting Argentina .🤣👍🤫.

🇧🇷 ok👍

Edited by Mengo
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I couldn't disagree more. We sacked probably the best head coach we will have in my lifetime based upon the expectation that we should be surviving in the Premier League. If 5th in the Championship after a run of 2 wins in 10 is 'par' then expectations are certainly significantly lower for Smith than they were for Farke.

Really, though, it's not so much about league position as it is about progress. By any objective measure Smith has taken us backwards. Farke had a plan which he diligently worked at instilling throughout the playing squad. We could all see what he was trying to achieve and, by this stage in his second season, it was delivering both results and entertainment. With Smith we have none of those things. He's only just stopped trying to play 4-3-3 but still hasn't fixed the fundamental defensive deficiencies in midfield, aside from a couple of games where we stopped the rot. And, such is the scattergun approach, none of us know who will be playing in what system.

Ultimately the club either gets promoted this season or releases half the squad and attempts to rebuild. When we got promoted with our record points total two seasons ago, the latter scenario was unthinkable. To go from that high to the current incoherent dross is a significant failure. So, no, expectations are not 'too high' at all.

Edited by Petriix
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5 minutes ago, Petriix said:

Ultimately the club either gets promoted this season or releases half the squad and attempts to rebuild.

This is half the problem though isn’t it we don’t win promotion half the squad goes or are released.

We win promotion the same players go plus another set of players who aren’t good enough for the premier league.

I would imagine a difficult dressing room to motivate.

Plus someone has just said above “this should be one of our more straightforward promotion” OMG promotion is never straightforward and should never be taken for granted.

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8 minutes ago, Petriix said:

Really, though, it's not so much about league position as it is about progress.

That's where I am too, but that said if we went on a run of games and took second position I'd change my tune quick fast!

We've gone up as winners from this league twice, only to fall behind the runners up when in the prem league.  I have such low confidence in Smith's approach and ability here but I can appreciate the sentiment to give it more time on the basis that we're not failing, but still in a state of transformation.

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Agree that expectations are too high. I do think people have forgotten how difficult it usually is for relegated teams to come back up, as Farke did it twice with relative ease (albeit with an Emi-shaped creative force in it). @Google Bot's comment that we're in a state of transformation holds very true indeed.

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8 minutes ago, Ulfotto said:

This is half the problem though isn’t it we don’t win promotion half the squad goes or are released.

We win promotion the same players go plus another set of players who aren’t good enough for the premier league.

I would imagine a difficult dressing room to motivate.

Plus someone has just said above “this should be one of our more straightforward promotion” OMG promotion is never straightforward and should never be taken for granted.

I’d rather take the risk at going up and being able to attract better players and potential more investment from Attanasio, than I would not going up and having to struggle to attract players of adequate quality to replace them. 
 

If we went up and needed 10 players Webber should view that as a personal challenge to do better with his recruitment than he did the last time. Although I won’t hold my breath on that at least he would have the chance to prove it. 

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58 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

It's arrogance really. A lot of fans expect us to win the league at a canter. It's disrespectful to the other teams. If you look back you'll see many of the same people claimed exactly the same things under Farke. Until we were winning and went top. Winning football is always viewed as good football. If not then it's never criticised.

The football has been in and out. Pragmatic with good spells but no more than 20/30 mins per game. Those good spells are what we're capable of. Just need to make those spells longer.

There's also the point that since the pandemic people have moaned non stop about all kinds of stuff. 

Count your blessings and cheer up! 😂

I think you’re confusing the confidence from people that our squad can do better than it is under the current manager with arrogance. I’m 100% confident we have the players to get promotion from this league, it’s not arrogant to suggest it’s capable of better than we are being shown, that’s just a realistic level of criticism given the squad, experience and the money spent on said squad. At this level we are a big fish and perhaps our supports haven’t adjusted to that yet? 
 

I would imagine a better quality manager than Smith could walk this league with this squad. As others have said we have regressed under Smith not progressed. Our squad appears to of regressed particularly in fitness since the Farke era, as I’ve said in other posts before a minimum expectation for a pro footballer should be to be able to run your socks off for 90 mins. The way we fell off a cliff after 35 mins against Middlesbrough was very concerning to me. 
 

All that being said, Smith does come across as a nice guy and if he is given more time to turn it around I’ll be happy to eat my own hat if proven wrong at the end of the season. I do think my hat will be somewhat safe though and he’ll be gone before the season is out. 

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24 minutes ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

I think you’re confusing the confidence from people that our squad can do better than it is under the current manager with arrogance. I’m 100% confident we have the players to get promotion from this league, it’s not arrogant to suggest it’s capable of better than we are being shown, that’s just a realistic level of criticism given the squad, experience and the money spent on said squad. At this level we are a big fish and perhaps our supports haven’t adjusted to that yet? 
 

I would imagine a better quality manager than Smith could walk this league with this squad. As others have said we have regressed under Smith not progressed. Our squad appears to of regressed particularly in fitness since the Farke era, as I’ve said in other posts before a minimum expectation for a pro footballer should be to be able to run your socks off for 90 mins. The way we fell off a cliff after 35 mins against Middlesbrough was very concerning to me. 
 

All that being said, Smith does come across as a nice guy and if he is given more time to turn it around I’ll be happy to eat my own hat if proven wrong at the end of the season. I do think my hat will be somewhat safe though and he’ll be gone before the season is out. 

That's fair enough. If he doesn't get more out of them I'm sure he'll soon be gone. I'm not as sure as you that we have the players to win the league. But I hope you're right. I think the midfield has plenty of improvement in there but I'm not sure the defence has. Perhaps when Omobamidele gets fit? We'll see.

 But the championship is littered with clubs whose fans thought they'd walk this league when they were relegated. 

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