Our fans pathetic.

[TIL 1010 4,722]

10 minutes ago, Lord Horn (again) said:

So we can all sing 'We all p*ss in a blue and white pot' like we did in the 60's - excellent idea 👍🏽

Potty Mouth M'Lud. 😂

[chicken 2,604]

1 hour ago, percy varco said:

Spot on. 
There is a massive disconnect with the club and fans. 
we have a Manager who appears to have been a compromise appointment who is struggling to get an identity. A Bean Counter who critcises the atmosphere. A smug DoF who thinks he is a legend in his own lunchtime. Owners who are now sadly outdated. 
Smith Out. 

I think there is equally, just a disconnect amongst groups of fans.

[Well b back 3,190]

I noticed yesterday that the atmosphere was very negative and noticed by at least 3 players, I know Angus was telling the Barclay to calm down when there were groans from a misplaced Byram pass. Another thing I found really strange was at goal number 1 you think the atmosphere will lift, yet we sing ‘ how s*** must you be, we scored a goal ‘, at goal 2 not a lot different and the same song sung. Then the atmosphere built when we cocked up and Gunn made the save. Suddenly plenty of singing for 10 minutes.

I hope that negative atmosphere was not because to many wanted to see us lose.

 

[By Hook or Ian crook 917]

1 hour ago, Commonsense said:

Maybe because it’s not our nickname, but it is theirs. Just a thought!

It’s only their nickname because the fans randomly started singing the song one day it’s an interesting story actually 

[By Hook or Ian crook 917]

3 minutes ago, Well b back said:

I noticed yesterday that the atmosphere was very negative and noticed by at least 3 players, I know Angus was telling the Barclay to calm down when there were groans from a misplaced Byram pass. Another thing I found really strange was at goal number 1 you think the atmosphere will lift, yet we sing ‘ how s*** must you be, we scored a goal ‘, at goal 2 not a lot different and the same song sung. Then the atmosphere built when we cocked up and Gunn made the save. Suddenly plenty of singing for 10 minutes.

I hope that negative atmosphere was not because to many wanted to see us lose.

 

I think that car crash of an interview the club put out from the financial director did not help one bit. Lots of people around me were saying “must of been our fault for not cheering enough” after each mistake. 

The style of football under Smith has not helped the atmosphere, not had the club going back on their word since the original appointment of Webber where it was said it would be open and transparent. There have been numerous mistakes made by the club since the first promotion to the premiership almost all of which can be traced back to a lack of accountability and a lack of fan engagement. As an example the BK8 fiasco. 

[......and Smith must score. 1,336]

1 hour ago, Well b back said:

I noticed yesterday that the atmosphere was very negative and noticed by at least 3 players, I know Angus was telling the Barclay to calm down when there were groans from a misplaced Byram pass. Another thing I found really strange was at goal number 1 you think the atmosphere will lift, yet we sing ‘ how s*** must you be, we scored a goal ‘, at goal 2 not a lot different and the same song sung. Then the atmosphere built when we cocked up and Gunn made the save. Suddenly plenty of singing for 10 minutes.

I hope that negative atmosphere was not because to many wanted to see us lose.

 

It stands to reason if the team produce unexciting football then the fans will respond likewise. I don't think the vast majority want to see us lose even if it means we jettison Smith & Co but we all want to visit Carrow Rd with anticipation not resignation.

The feeling yesterday was one of indifference even after we scored and until the team makes it an adventure rather than a chore to attend their football matches I'm afraid it's likely to continue.

[shefcanary 2,389]

1 hour ago, Well b back said:

I hope that negative atmosphere was not because to many wanted to see us lose.

Of course it ****ing was, you can't accuse the fans of being responsible for the poor showing on the pitch and expect the fans not to react against it. They want change and the club seemingly does not have its ears open to this.

The club has to do much, much more to win the fans round, not just expect Smith to turn it around on the pitch. Sending the FD out to gee up the crowd isn't the way, nor a quick film of Gunn thanking away fans for travelling in numbers as if that was unusual, isn't either.

This perception the fans will continue to turn up, renew season tickets etc.has to be put to bed by the club now. Their marketing team needs to work much harder, starting with putting Webber in a room with local media to discuss the position of the team, the reason behind recent recruitment failures and his personal position whilst giving fans hope for the future and something to buy in. Do that, it is as much a step change as anything on the pitch. If it fails, that should lead to personnel changes. The club executives are either up for the challenge or they should not be employed.

[hogesar 9,618]

Unfortunately we are learning we don't really have fans who will vocally support the team on the pitch come what may. That's slightly harsh actually,  the away fans have been superb for the most part.

But at home our fans were rubbish when we were 3 up against Coventry at home, when we won 3-2 against Bristol.

I dont normally like comparing but if you take Palace fans, they will make noise and sing regardless of if its Woy football or Viera football. They'll show discontent for sure but whilst the players are on the pitch they'll focus on supporting them.

The problem is you've got the club who aren't doing themselves any favours alongside what is becoming a pretty entitled fanbase. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,513]

1 hour ago, By Hook or Ian crook said:

I think that car crash of an interview the club put out from the financial director did not help one bit. Lots of people around me were saying “must of been our fault for not cheering enough” after each mistake. 

The style of football under Smith has not helped the atmosphere, not had the club going back on their word since the original appointment of Webber where it was said it would be open and transparent. There have been numerous mistakes made by the club since the first promotion to the premiership almost all of which can be traced back to a lack of accountability and a lack of fan engagement. As an example the BK8 fiasco. 

I find the recurrence of this really interesting. Is it because they really don't believe that the crowd mood affects performance or that they simply don't care whether it negatively impacts performance?

Edited October 30, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[hogesar 9,618]

6 minutes ago, shefcanary said:

Of course it ****ing was, you can't accuse the fans of being responsible for the poor showing on the pitch and expect the fans not to react against it. They want change and the club seemingly does not have its ears open to this.

The club has to do much, much more to win the fans round, not just expect Smith to turn it around on the pitch. Sending the FD out to gee up the crowd isn't the way, nor a quick film of Gunn thanking away fans for travelling in numbers as if that was unusual, isn't either.

This perception the fans will continue to turn up, renew season tickets etc.has to be put to bed by the club now. Their marketing team needs to work much harder, starting with putting Webber in a room with local media to discuss the position of the team, the reason behind recent recruitment failures and his personal position whilst giving fans hope for the future and something to buy in. Do that, it is as much a step change as anything on the pitch. If it fails, that should lead to personnel changes. The club executives are either up for the challenge or they should not be employed.

No chance Webber comes out to discuss recruitment failings midway through a promotion push.

If Sargent scores 20 goals this season, Rashica moves on for the price we paid and some nutcase of a club buys Tzolis from us and we turn a profit on him next summer then his recruitment talk would be hugely different.

Equally if Sara and Nunez are key to our promotion this season.

There are far too many variables still in play for it to make any sense for Webber to come out mid-season talking about recruitment.

[nutty nigel 7,512]

1 hour ago, shefcanary said:

Of course it ****ing was, you can't accuse the fans of being responsible for the poor showing on the pitch and expect the fans not to react against it. They want change and the club seemingly does not have its ears open to this.

The club has to do much, much more to win the fans round, not just expect Smith to turn it around on the pitch. Sending the FD out to gee up the crowd isn't the way, nor a quick film of Gunn thanking away fans for travelling in numbers as if that was unusual, isn't either.

This perception the fans will continue to turn up, renew season tickets etc.has to be put to bed by the club now. Their marketing team needs to work much harder, starting with putting Webber in a room with local media to discuss the position of the team, the reason behind recent recruitment failures and his personal position whilst giving fans hope for the future and something to buy in. Do that, it is as much a step change as anything on the pitch. If it fails, that should lead to personnel changes. The club executives are either up for the challenge or they should not be employed.

Start playing well and winning games all this other crap will be forgotten about. Supporters in the stands aren't really interested in corporate governance or any other off the pitch stuff. It's about the football, always has been and always will be.

Edited October 30, 2022 by nutty nigel

[essex canary 492]

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

 

The problem is you've got the club who aren't doing themselves any favours alongside what is becoming a pretty entitled fanbase. 

The £2.9 million Senior Management Pay bill would service 100 people on average Norfolk wages or the first team squad at numerous Clubs at League One level yet in the PL our admission charges were 7 places higher than our pitch performance. Who exactly is displaying the entitlement?

 

[hogesar 9,618]

2 minutes ago, essex canary said:

The £2.9 million Senior Management Pay bill would service 100 people on average Norfolk wages or the first team squad at numerous Clubs at League One level yet in the PL our admission charges were 7 places higher than our pitch performance. Who exactly is displaying the entitlement?

 

I don't know too many fans who have scouted and spent £9 million of the clubs money in order to attain the club £100m in parachute payments.

[canarybubbles 1,915]

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

Unfortunately we are learning we don't really have fans who will vocally support the team on the pitch come what may. That's slightly harsh actually,  the away fans have been superb for the most part.

But at home our fans were rubbish when we were 3 up against Coventry at home, when we won 3-2 against Bristol.

I dont normally like comparing but if you take Palace fans, they will make noise and sing regardless of if its Woy football or Viera football. They'll show discontent for sure but whilst the players are on the pitch they'll focus on supporting them.

The problem is you've got the club who aren't doing themselves any favours alongside what is becoming a pretty entitled fanbase. 

I can't agree with you regarding the fans being entitled either, Hogesar. The fans have high expectations, which seems reasonable considering we scored 94 and 97 points in our last two Championship seasons, but high expectations are not the same as a sense of entitlement.

[TIL 1010 4,722]

On 30/10/2022 at 11:32, nutty nigel said:

Yes where are the flags?

You would hope it's still a covid issue or a club issue. I'd hate to think it's "we only wave them when we're winning". Because that's not what support is about.

**I say that as a fan who loves the flags and the atmosphere they help create. Not as a flag critic.

No covid issues at The Nest this afternoon Nutty as flags everywhere at the girls game, mind you they lost 4-1.

Edited October 31, 2022 by TIL 1010

[East Rider 548]

2 hours ago, hogesar said:

Unfortunately we are learning we don't really have fans who will vocally support the team on the pitch come what may. That's slightly harsh actually,  the away fans have been superb for the most part.

Agreed. The home support is generally terrible, (thank god for the snake pit and  Barclay at times) and I don't feel it's due to entitlement, though it may play a part to some degree.

Our season tickets are expensive, the demographic of our support is older than it use to be, the younger element are unable to afford season tickets and many of the older element simply do not join in the encouragement of the team, no matter what's happening on the pitch.

Even when we beat Manchester city a few seasons ago, many around me just sat with arms folded, quite incredible. But not unusual. Some of us try and start a chant in the river end and the vast majority will simply not join in

We need an injection of younger support (16 -35) in our fan base and this will only come when we increase our capacity and reduce the cost of tickets for this age group

Yet again yesterday, there were about 1000 seats unsold. Tickets are available but perhaps an incentive is needed again. That and some excitement on the pitch would help.

Getting the flags out would help. 

But yes, the atmosphere at home at the moment is pretty poor.

 

 

[chicken 2,604]

11 minutes ago, East Rider said:

Agreed. The home support is generally terrible, (thank god for the snake pit and  Barclay at times) and I don't feel it's due to entitlement, though it may play a part to some degree.

Our season tickets are expensive, the demographic of our support is older than it use to be, the younger element are unable to afford season tickets and many of the older element simply do not join in the encouragement of the team, no matter what's happening on the pitch.

Even when we beat Manchester city a few seasons ago, many around me just sat with arms folded, quite incredible. But not unusual. Some of us try and start a chant in the river end and the vast majority will simply not join in

We need an injection of younger support (16 -35) in our fan base and this will only come when we increase our capacity and reduce the cost of tickets for this age group

Yet again yesterday, there were about 1000 seats unsold. Tickets are available but perhaps an incentive is needed again. That and some excitement on the pitch would help.

Getting the flags out would help. 

But yes, the atmosphere at home at the moment is pretty poor.

 

 

This seems a fair reflection... though I think there are a fair number of folks in their 40's that happily join in chants etc.

In regards to the season tickets... they are not unreasonably expensive but I do get what you are saying. People do have less expendable income at the moment. People also have less free time as a result - people tend to be working more unsociable hours or 2 jobs etc to make ends meet.

To that extent perhaps some folks don't appreciate the relative privilege it is to be able to go to games. Perhaps the club do not value quite how much a privilege it is to still have so many season ticket holders?

I said before, on another thread, I do wonder if the fans have more of a hangover than the players/coaches. Thinking about it now, perhaps it also has a lot to do with the pandemic and disrupted seasons and seeing us now is compared to 2020-21 or 2018-19. I do think people forget that we hoped to challenge for the top six that first season, as in, sneak in for a play off run. No one started that season expecting us to win it, especially not as convincing as we did.

There does seem to be an element that does believe we should be "dominating" this league as it is "poor" and any decent side should be walking it. For as long as I can remember, that has always been the championship/division 1. Teams that win it tend to be well organised and solid as a team, OR, they have quality rarely seen at this level.

I think it's fair to say that with Huckerby we saw that quality. With Lambert, Wes and Holt we saw the organisation blended with top championship quality, but not proven quality it has to be said. Farke with Pukki, Buendia especially, had that quality. We now have to find what it is again. Unearthing a Buendia is not easy - turning a (initial) £1.5m player into one valued at over £30m is not an every day occurance.

The truth lies somewhere in-between and I think there is more than simply one disconnect. When you get an atmosphere like this amongst fans, it causes division.

Having also travelled to see games there is no doubt in my mind that the away fans are generally more supportive, or at least they will start that way before throwing in the towel towards the end of a game if they aren't happy with what's on show. I think as a result, as we saw at times under Farke, we have certainly played with more confidence away from home compared to at Carrow Road.

I do think there is some entitlement woven into some of the most bitter responses you see here and elsewhere on social media. We've often criticised other teams fans for being the same, and I see little difference with some of our own. 

[hogesar 9,618]

1 hour ago, canarybubbles said:

I can't agree with you regarding the fans being entitled either, Hogesar. The fans have high expectations, which seems reasonable considering we scored 94 and 97 points in our last two Championship seasons, but high expectations are not the same as a sense of entitlement.

Yeah, maybe.

Last time we came down with Farke the general concensus between fans was discussing how difficult it would be to get back, how hard it is for relegated teams to bounce back at the first attempt etc.

This time round its "top 2 or dismal failure" and even on our good winning run we weren't winning "how we want to win". To me that's a bit entitled because winning in this league is difficult.

That doesn't apply to everyone obviously. 

[Creedence Clearwater Couto 1,251]

Norwich fans, traditionally, are not the most vociferous or tribal, and Carrow road has never been an intimidating place for visiting teams or supporters. We’re also quite placid and accepting. It’s just how it is… but generally, always support the team, and do it well.

I do feel there is an element of entitlement at play, and that’s generating frustration and anger. But there’s much more to it. Post Farke hangover, the disconnect between club officials, fans and local press, and a squad not fully motivated and driven to succeed. All this os contributing to poor football and a poor atmosphere. 

The club needs freshening up. It wouldn’t take a lot to get the fans back on side, and the atmosphere to lift. But pathetic club run interviews with bean counters ain’t going to cut it. 
 

[kenfoggo 247]

According to our finance director, Richens, there is NO disconnect between the club and the Supporters. He does,  however , criticise the fans for not cheering when the players need a lift. Difficult to cheer the dross that is being served up. No attempt on goal until the 39th minute when we scored. Constant walking around the pitch, passing square  or passing backwards, no real endeavour and certainly no leadership on the pitch from our Captain. Yes, we won, but like most of the performances that I have witnessed under Dean Smith it left me feeling bored, not excited or entertained. Where was the effort, where was the commitment, where was the engagement?  The performance on the pitch was reflected in the silence from the stands. The season ticket holders sitting next to me said at the final whistle that they would not be bothering to attend on Wednesday, they had seen enough. I can see their point, I will not bother either, it is on the TV and if it sucks I can switch channels.

Edited October 30, 2022 by kenfoggo

[Well b back 3,190]

1 hour ago, East Rider said:

Agreed. The home support is generally terrible, (thank god for the snake pit and  Barclay at times) and I don't feel it's due to entitlement, though it may play a part to some degree.

Our season tickets are expensive, the demographic of our support is older than it use to be, the younger element are unable to afford season tickets and many of the older element simply do not join in the encouragement of the team, no matter what's happening on the pitch.

Even when we beat Manchester city a few seasons ago, many around me just sat with arms folded, quite incredible. But not unusual. Some of us try and start a chant in the river end and the vast majority will simply not join in

We need an injection of younger support (16 -35) in our fan base and this will only come when we increase our capacity and reduce the cost of tickets for this age group

Yet again yesterday, there were about 1000 seats unsold. Tickets are available but perhaps an incentive is needed again. That and some excitement on the pitch would help.

Getting the flags out would help. 

But yes, the atmosphere at home at the moment is pretty poor.

 

 

Going by our youngest lads season ticket, tickets are very cheap until you are over 21.

[Ulfotto 623]

Lots of the issues I feel are a hangover from last season. It was so dreadful and the only person who seemed to take a fall for it was Farke.

Personally I’ve drawn a line under it and look to see this season in isolation as this is much more enjoyable than seeing this as part of a larger narrative or project as that died last season.

 

Edited October 30, 2022 by Ulfotto

[Besthorpe-48 102]

I don't think any fan wants our team to lose.

I do think we are used to being entertained which is why we all love Onel. I also think most of us expected to challenge for promotion but forget what a slog the championship is. Saturday was the first time only 2 players from 2019 and 2021cstarted the match. So no longer so much of a hangover for the players. On the other hand I sit in the barclay and think and so we go up then what ..... Twice bitten twice shy and all that can we survive a third beating.

Which leads me to conclude that we don't think this team and this manager will break the mould.

After all doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result is a sign of a psychotic episode. So maybe the fans are in a collective psychosis. I know there's a name for that be I can't remember what it is.💔💔💔

 

[nutty nigel 7,512]

Demographic 🤷‍♂️😂 

There's noisy kids

Whining kids 

Leary youngsters 

Sullen youngsters 

Miserable old duffers

Daft old duffers 

etc etc ....

Whatever it is it's not an age thing. 

😂

 

 

 

 

[Midlands Yellow 3,946]

14 minutes ago, Besthorpe-48 said:

I don't think any fan wants our team to lose.

I do think we are used to being entertained which is why we all love Onel. I also think most of us expected to challenge for promotion but forget what a slog the championship is. Saturday was the first time only 2 players from 2019 and 2021cstarted the match. So no longer so much of a hangover for the players. On the other hand I sit in the barclay and think and so we go up then what ..... Twice bitten twice shy and all that can we survive a third beating.

Which leads me to conclude that we don't think this team and this manager will break the mould.

After all doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result is a sign of a psychotic episode. So maybe the fans are in a collective psychosis. I know there's a name for that be I can't remember what it is.💔💔💔

 

Quite right, we’re scared of the thought of being promoted again because we basically can’t/ won’t compete. 

[Pockthorpe 528]

I’m in the Snakepit. I think a lot of people were more ready for disappointment/ defeat. Not wanting it exactly, ( benefit of doubt ? ) but having decided how to react if it happened. Going 3-0 up was confusing to some. Bloody sad . I was buzzing - 3-0 up at home, Jesus , have spent most of my 50+ years of going to Carrow Road dreaming of that. 
I’m also lucky enough to be able to go to a lot of away games. Our away support is something to be genuinely proud of. But where is the atmosphere at other grounds ?Are we any worse than them ? Not in my opinion. It’s a general malaise . Premier league grounds -  home to Norwich - atmosphere pretty much nothing. Championship - more as we’re seen as a scalp and one of the big games. But mostly still only sporadic. 
At least we pretty much sell out. Although bizarrely that’s part of the problem. In my teens and 20s I used to go with a load of mates , nothing planned, all stand together and make a lot of noise . Can’t do that now. Even if you all decide to get season tickets, you’ll never get any near each other as a group.

It’s just how football has gone - money is everything if you want success - and actually that is so f*cking boring .Again so sad . I also think we’re on the sharp edge. We’ve had a few promotions to the Premier League and been absolutely battered. But smashing the Championship under Farke has without doubt left a hangover of entitlement. It’s bloody tough to get going again , especially after losing the big connect Farke gave us ….. however winning games will as always do it . 

OTBC !!!!!!! 💛💚
 

Edited October 30, 2022 by Pockthorpe

[Gordon Bennett 780]

What I find pathetic (and its certainly not just ncfc) is that some supporters can call managers and players every name under the sun yet can't take a bit back when atmosphere is mentioned.

Also while I'm on my soapbox Graham Potter didn't deserve what he got at Brighton and Newcastle fans booing when Martinez was quite clearly suffering from a (delayed?) head injury. Have a word with yourselves. 

[SwearyCanary 1,179]

I’m not keen on the repeated accusations of some on here that fans are being entitled. If fans are expecting us to be promoted it’s largely because that’s what we’ve been told is our expectation as a club in order to maintain our sustainable model. A top 26 club I believe is the line, which means playoffs should be our worst case scenario, but seeing as these are by no means a given if you get in them to obtain promotion it’s understandable that a few fans expect auto promo as a minimum target. We are all at least partly aware of the lack of financial clout we hold in reserve, it’s a great justification for why we don’t and can’t splash on big money signings. To then expect us as fans that care about the club’s future to not have concerns about losing out on the £100 million promotion delivers is a bit of double standards. If they can use it as a reason to cut their cloth, we can surely use it as a reason to expect the aim to be top 2. If it’s looking like a way off top 2 performance wise and consistently so, then fans can grumble without me feeling they’re being entitled. 

[Graham Paddons Beard 2,424]

12 hours ago, Sjb said:

Yes we may think our manager is dire, dull and boring. There's something been amiss at Carrow Road since covid hit. But where is the support for the team?

1-0 up hardly a song or cheer afterwards until we went 2 up. Then at 3-0 when the place would previously be rocking fans where leaving in their droves from the 85min mark, why? What message and encouragement can that give to the players? 

We have absolutely no right to think we'd thrash everyteam, we're not going to. What is going on? The players probably need a lift from the fans but we're sitting quiet, and the claps make me think we're watching a game of snooker. 

 

We are all relying on you SJB. Give it your all. Those of us quiet , entitled , snooker loving , early leaving , previous rockers need you to personally jump out of your seat and lead us in song ! Bring a drum . Bring your own flags . 
We need you now more than ever . I would do it on Wednesday night but I’ll need to be having a nap on about 60 mins . Some of us aren’t getting any younger you know. I’ve only been going since 1972 so I need you to tell me EXACTLY how to behave at Carrow Road . 
 

Looking forward to hearing you . Just keep the noise down . 
 

GPB. 

Edited October 30, 2022 by Graham Paddons Beard

[Nuff Said 5,092]

27 minutes ago, SwearyCanary said:

I’m not keen on the repeated accusations of some on here that fans are being entitled. If fans are expecting us to be promoted it’s largely because that’s what we’ve been told is our expectation as a club in order to maintain our sustainable model. A top 26 club I believe is the line, which means playoffs should be our worst case scenario, but seeing as these are by no means a given if you get in them to obtain promotion it’s understandable that a few fans expect auto promo as a minimum target. We are all at least partly aware of the lack of financial clout we hold in reserve, it’s a great justification for why we don’t and can’t splash on big money signings. To then expect us as fans that care about the club’s future to not have concerns about losing out on the £100 million promotion delivers is a bit of double standards. If they can use it as a reason to cut their cloth, we can surely use it as a reason to expect the aim to be top 2. If it’s looking like a way off top 2 performance wise and consistently so, then fans can grumble without me feeling they’re being entitled. 

You’re not keen on being told that fans are behaving as if they’re entitled to success and then go on to say why you/we/they should expect it?