Our new thuggery

[canarybubbles 1,915]

Some people on here are very happy about our recent attempts at sh*thousery. IMO, it's having a disastrous effect.

Yesterday we were 2-0 up, their fans were quiet, and their players looked resigned to defeat. We needlessly started time-wasting, diving and kicking the opponents (with at least 30 minutes to go!), their fans woke up, their players responded, and a victory melted before our eyes. All we had to do was hang on to the ball and pass it around - we didn't even need to attempt to get a third - but someone thought it was a better plan to turn the game into a war.

Yesterday we had no one to go LB so we had to put Giannoulis in earlier than we would have wished. Why? Because of McLean's needless aggression in the previous game. Likewise, Hanley could easily have got an automatic red both yesterday and in an earlier game for kicking an opponent. Since Omobamidele is injured, this would have led to a centre-back crisis and really scuppered our hopes for the next few games. As well as his antics in the opposition's box possibly costing us a point against Preston.

Think of that play-off final against Middlesbrough. Alex Neil killed off the game through organising and utilising his players, not by telling them to dive and kick lumps out of the opposition. Farke did it in 20/21 by simply hanging onto the ball and not giving the opposition much chance to counter. Is it a coincidence that we are now descending to thuggery instead of trying to impose ourselves on games through organising our side to make the most of their superior quality?

You employ sh*thousery when your players are poorer than your opponent's, not when you believe you have the superior squad. Then sh*thousery merely drags you down to their level.

Edited October 23, 2022 by canarybubbles

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

A lot of Sheffield United fans on their forum seem to think that we let them back in the game because we were so focused on trying to get Sheffield United players sent off, instead of trying to finish the game with a 3rd goal, and I can't really disagree.

[Midlands Yellow 3,984]

1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

A lot of Sheffield United fans on their forum seem to think that we let them back in the game because we were so focused on trying to get Sheffield United players sent off, instead of trying to finish the game with a 3rd goal, and I can't really disagree.

That sums it up. Sheffield were just about shot but our play acting galvanised their fans and the players. 

[canarydan23 4,060]

It was embarrassing. Tactical ineptitude. 

[Coneys Knee 953]

Like it or hate it, there’s a place for s**housery in any team’s armoury, but that time is with minutes/seconds to go, not with 40 minutes left on the clock.
 

Not good to see, and it has backfired on teams countless times. The one thing we shouldn’t have done yesterday, is exactly what we did do and that was turn it into messy battle. We threw that game away and the penalty should have been meaningless by that point. Silly city.

[lake district canary 4,531]

It was partly the ref's fault, not controlling the players well and it got out of hand - both sides' players trying it on.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

3 hours ago, canarybubbles said:

Some people on here are very happy about our recent attempts at sh*thousery. IMO, it's having a disastrous effect.

Yesterday we were 2-0 up, their fans were quiet, and their players looked resigned to defeat. We needlessly started time-wasting, diving and kicking the opponents (with at least 30 minutes to go!), their fans woke up, their players responded, and a victory melted before our eyes. All we had to do was hang on to the ball and pass it around - we didn't even need to attempt to get a third - but someone thought it was a better plan to turn the game into a war.

Yesterday we had no one to go LB so we had to put Giannoulis in earlier than we would have wished. Why? Because of McLean's needless aggression in the previous game. Likewise, Hanley could easily have got an automatic red both yesterday and in an earlier game for kicking an opponent. Since Omobamidele is injured, this would have led to a centre-back crisis and really scuppered our hopes for the next few games. As well as his antics in the opposition's box possibly costing us a point against Preston.

Think of that play-off final against Middlesbrough. Alex Neil killed off the game through organising and utilising his players, not by telling them to dive and kick lumps out of the opposition. Farke did it in 20/21 by simply hanging onto the ball and not giving the opposition much chance to counter. Is it a coincidence that we are now descending to thuggery instead of trying to impose ourselves on games through organising our side to make the most of their superior quality?

You employ sh*thousery when your players are poorer than your opponent's, not when you believe you have the superior squad. Then sh*thousery merely drags you down to their level.

No, you employ it to destabilise and disrupt your opposition's gameplan and try to prevent them playing the way they.want to. It's part of most team's game in the Championship, and we've had players out injured for long spells because of it. I would like teams to face us mindful of the fact that if they want to go down the road of dirty tricks, then we can go there too, so I'm wholly supportive of our players being willing to take the gloves off to try and get a result. 

It's also notable that the frequent occasions where it's used against us seems to inspire less outrage from our own support than accusations of it against us from Sheffield.

Edited October 23, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[Coneys Knee 953]

2 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

No, you employ it to destabilise and disrupt your opposition's gameplan and try to prevent them playing the way they.want to. It's part of most team's game in the Championship, and we've had players out injured for long spells because of it. I would like teams to face us mindful of the fact that if they want to go down the road of dirty tricks, then we can go there too, so I'm wholly supportive of our players being willing to take the gloves off to try and get a result. 

But that’s the thing. Yesterday it backfired. It didn’t help us get the result, it cost us the result.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

3 minutes ago, Coneys Knee said:

But that’s the thing. Yesterday it backfired. It didn’t help us get the result, it cost us the result.

If so, and I don't think it's a given, it's only for lack of practise. 

Not enough respect for SU as a footballing side here. They can play football. Disrupting them from playing the way they want to is sensible. 

Edited October 23, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[Danbury Yellow 126]

Great OP.  I totally agree.  No more words required. 

[Clever Farke 64]

Our players were clearly being provoked, which seemed to be the Blades second half game plan. Which is what most teams would do when being outplayed.  It’s easy to say but we needed  to take the heat right out of it. Leadership and cool heads required. 
They need to learn from this fast! 

[Capt. Pants 4,234]

If you are to revert to ****housery then expect to get it back. It played right into Sheff Utd's hands, sparked up Billie Sharp who gets Hanley and Giannoulis booked. It was a truly pathetic attempt.

Our whole game management of that 2nd half was highly unprofessional.

What we don't want to do is turn matches into battles, because we are lightweight and won't win them.

 

 

[Coneys Knee 953]

4 minutes ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

If so, and I don't think it's a given, it's only for lack of practise. 

Not enough respect for SU as a footballing side here. They can play football. Disrupting them from playing the way they want to is sensible. 

But the evidence yesterday is plain for everyone to see. The game was practically won a 2-0, their fans were silent and resigned to defeat. Then the s**thousing began, their fans responded, in turn, so did their players, and we turned it into a slog fest (which we’re not good at), and no surprise, they claw it back.

In an alternate world, we could’ve used intelligent substitutions and in game management and took the stuffing out of the game and coasted to a 2-0 win.

We made the wrong choice. As I said before, there is a time and a place for s**thousing, but with 40 minutes to go that isn’t it. 2 minutes to go, maybe, but it’s the fact it starts so early that causing it to backfire so often.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

So just to recap, everybody else in the Championship can play as dirty as they like in the assurance that any disruption to our gameplay wil not be considered in the evaluation of the 'clueless clowns' at Norwich,, but if Norwich ever employs these tactics themselves then it's an absolute disgrace that brings shame on the county. 

Unbelievable. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

1 minute ago, Coneys Knee said:

But the evidence yesterday is plain for everyone to see. The game was practically won a 2-0, their fans were silent and resigned to defeat. Then the s**thousing began, their fans responded, in turn, so did their players, and we turned it into a slog fest (which we’re not good at), and no surprise, they claw it back.

In an alternate world, we could’ve used intelligent substitutions and in game management and took the stuffing out of the game and coasted to a 2-0 win.

We made the wrong choice. As I said before, there is a time and a place for s**thousing, but with 40 minutes to go that isn’t it. 2 minutes to go, maybe, but it’s the fact it starts so early that causing it to backfire so often.

Sheffield United are a good footballing side, and they also are  also happy to use dirty tricks. Seems to me you all want Norwich to take spoons to knife fights. 

Edited October 23, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[Coneys Knee 953]

1 minute ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

So just to recap, everybody else in the Championship can play as dirty as they like in the assurance that any disruption to our gameplay wil not be considered in the evaluation of the 'clueless clowns' at Norwich,, but if Norwich ever employs these tactics themselves then it's an absolute disgrace that brings shame on the county. 

Unbelievable. 

I don’t think anybody has said that no.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,548]

Just now, Coneys Knee said:

I don’t think anybody has said that no.

Well that's how it reads to me. 

[Monty13 2,234]

I said it on another thread but IMO we really do seem to have a lack of discipline and it’s costing us. I’m all for passion, but it needs to be tempered by professionalism.

McClean has no one to blame but himself, completely unnecessary and I’m surprised we had the gall to challenge what to me seemed such an obvious red card.

We are getting yellows for petulant behaviour, it’s unnecessary and detrimental.

Every team needs to be street smart, far too often in the PL we were too nice and it cost us.
But professional fouls are just that, professional.

Time wasting is also an unfortunate part of game management but some of our antics yesterday were embarrassing.

[Ken Hairy 3,772]

****housery, just yet another thing Dean Smith is no sodding good at. 

[raunds canary 215]

Sadly this has crept into football. Used to just be heading into the corner in injury time. No it's players feigning injury if the team is ahead , taking ages over a thrown in , goalkeepers falling on the ball after a routine catch and surrounding the ref at every opportunity. Spoiling the game for all

[Naturalcynic 631]

Some big assumptions being made here, such as it cost us the game, tactical ineptitude, it backfired etc.  How can anyone possibly know what the outcome would have been if we’d employed different tactics?  For all we know we might have lost 5:2.  

[nutty nigel 7,533]

It hasn't really just crept in. It's just evolved to fit how the game has evolved. Back in the day some clubs made an art of getting in front and spending the rest of the game passing back to the keeper who could pick the ball up and then spend time faffing about before getting rid and then often getting it back and go through the whole process again. For those who remember how frustrating was that?

[Canary Jedi 579]

I’ve given Smith a lot of stick recently, but in his defence Smith was also not happy about our players getting involved in skirmishes because it allowed the home fans to wake up and get involved again. Time and a place, yesterday was neither. 

[Capt. Pants 4,234]

5 minutes ago, raunds canary said:

Sadly this has crept into football. Used to just be heading into the corner in injury time. No it's players feigning injury if the team is ahead , taking ages over a thrown in , goalkeepers falling on the ball after a routine catch and surrounding the ref at every opportunity. Spoiling the game for all

Well that's how you do it correctly; run the clock down, take the sting out of the game and stop the opposition having momentum. It's part and parcel of the game, has been for years.

What you do is draw the fouls not the other way round. Norwich seemed to get wound up by their own ****housery.

At the end of the day it cost us 2 points.

[corbs 147]

As some who was at the game I don’t recognise this description of our tactics. I was hoping the players would calm down and pass it, but it’s not so easy in front of 30,000 angry fans. I instinctively felt at 2-0 the game wasn’t won, we all knew there would be a spell when they came back into it, there always is. I honestly didn’t see some of the incidents clearly with Dimi, but I’m prepared to accept we made a few bad calls. 
I thought Josh had a clear pen at 2-0. Overall I disagree with Conner et al, I thought it was ‘good enough’; and something to build on. It’s hard to complain when youve  witnessed a damn good football game, if I see a few more of those I’d happily finish 8th. Noticed Bellers was not demanding they go up this season (Burnley). 

[Chelm Canary 404]

I was surprised by the behaviour. Hanley booting Billy Sharp when he was on the deck was the beginning of riling them up to get something out of it.

OP is spot on - It did nothing but wake up the Sheffield United fans and spark a reaction from their players. 

Also worth noting that the ref was very poor and played into the hands of those that wanted to employ silly tactics.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Chelm Canary

[TIL 1010 4,746]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

It was partly the ref's fault, not controlling the players well and it got out of hand - both sides' players trying it on.

Get used to it Lakey as this division is stacked out with less than competent referees and we will see them in virtually every single game.

[Dr Greenthumb 749]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

So just to recap, everybody else in the Championship can play as dirty as they like in the assurance that any disruption to our gameplay wil not be considered in the evaluation of the 'clueless clowns' at Norwich,, but if Norwich ever employs these tactics themselves then it's an absolute disgrace that brings shame on the county. 

Unbelievable. 

The other teams are just better at it. Look at the Hanley kicking of Sharp and McLean swinging his arm against Luton. Just not a smart way of doing it.

[Michael Starr 519]

It all boils down to the same thing. WE -- DID -- NOT -- CONTROL -- THE -- GAME. The fans were turning on their team and coach. All we had to do was stay focused, stay calm... ride out the final fight.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Michael Starr

[canarydan23 4,060]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

Well that's how it reads to me. 

That's called cognitive dissonance.