Farke vs Smith

[Daz Sparks 1,151]

10 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Dean Smith drinks a mug of tea

Enough said.

[Ken Hairy 3,770]

27 minutes ago, hogesar said:

You clearly didn't read Twitter or listen to Canary Call last night, because apparently fans don't know we started slowly under Farke.

Perhaps you should argue that point on CC or Twitter then 😉

[hogesar 9,657]

2 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

Perhaps you should argue that point on CC or Twitter then 😉

Oh no, there's plenty on here too. They've just gone quiet for a bit, can't possibly think why 🙂

 

[Mr Apples 1,318]

Can we please establish a Daniel Farke Memorial Day where those that wish to pay their tributes/reminisce/fondly rewrite history/fondle their bratwurst/listen to Einsturzende Neubauten on loop, etc. (or all of the mentioned) can let it all go for 24 hours and after that return to the here and now. 

If you want candles for the day you better be quick, the hoarders are already emptying the shelves for winter. 🤣

Apples

[Ken Hairy 3,770]

Just now, hogesar said:

Oh no, there's plenty on here too. They've just gone quiet for a bit, can't possibly think why 🙂

 

Hold on if they've gone quiet, then why is this whole debate still a hot topic? 

I agree re Farkes starts etc by the way, but yet like I've said personally I just can't take to Smith, nothing to do with personality but I just don't think we have a good style of play, to compare it slightly to Farke (I know), it's like Farkeball in very slow motion. 

Smith is doing the bare minimum against opposition we have played so far, it doesn't excite me. Let's see where we are after the Watfords, Burnleys, and Sheffields of the division. 

I don't think he's getting, or will get the best out of this crop of players, and I'm not inspired one little bit by the thought of another season of him in the top flight. 

I doubt my opinion on him will sway much until the moment he's kept us in the top flight for more than a season, and yes I admit that's my problem not his. 

[norfolkngood 1,086]

5 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Oh no, there's plenty on here too. They've just gone quiet for a bit, can't possibly think why 🙂

 

One thing i am starting to like about Smith is he plays players on form this season not just big names

Sargent is the prime example many were saying drop him for Pukki straight away but smith has stuck with the players who are playing well and winning 

of course Sargent might stop scoring like last night then pukki comes back but it is more a even playing field i think with smith than maybe Farke 

Not saying Farke did much wrong he did wonders of course but i think smith maybe more open to playing different players this season 

[wheres my rebate gone? 85]

40 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

Hold on if they've gone quiet, then why is this whole debate still a hot topic? 

I agree re Farkes starts etc by the way, but yet like I've said personally I just can't take to Smith, nothing to do with personality but I just don't think we have a good style of play, to compare it slightly to Farke (I know), it's like Farkeball in very slow motion. 

Smith is doing the bare minimum against opposition we have played so far, it doesn't excite me. Let's see where we are after the Watfords, Burnleys, and Sheffields of the division. 

I don't think he's getting, or will get the best out of this crop of players, and I'm not inspired one little bit by the thought of another season of him in the top flight. 

I doubt my opinion on him will sway much until the moment he's kept us in the top flight for more than a season, and yes I admit that's my problem not his. 

This 100%

[TheGunnShow 5,937]

Well, Smith seems to be pulling out a Farke by not having a great start to a Champs season, slowly getting the team up the league with the odd decent performance here and there (Millwall), and all with a litany of injuries at left-back. Heck, even our Lungi-brand multi-purpose gap filler went and got injured this time.

EDIT: I shall call this phenomenon "Lungifilla" in future.

Edited August 31, 2022 by TheGunnShow

[Rock The Boat 1,329]

At the time I thought the wrong man was sacked but Smith has got us into second place and there is no reason not to support him now. 

As far as scrappy wins go, well that's the Championship for you and there were plenty of scrappy games under Farke. Not because that's the way Farke wanted the game to be played but because that's what the opposition brought to the table. 

Farke will always be loved but at the end of the day it's results that matter. 

[hogesar 9,657]

28 minutes ago, wheres my rebate gone? said:

This 100%

hahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahah

[wheres my rebate gone? 85]

9 minutes ago, hogesar said:

hahahahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahah

Odd? why is that funny? Ken is 100% spot on in my opinion.

[Van wink 2,994]

2 hours ago, ricardo said:

This is true but much of it is about personalities. As a rule of thumb I've  often advocated not getting too close  to any manager or even player because in the end, if they are good enough, they move on or a crisis happens and they are moved out. Sadly I must confess  that I broke  my own rule  with Daniel  Farke. I doubt I will ever feel the same way about Dean Smith but perhaps thats a good thing and I can return to a more settled  feeling  of ambivalence.

I hope Smith does well but he will never be loved in the way we loved Farke.

Completely agree with this, Farke seemed to capture a special place in my heart as well, as he did for many of us, I will always remember him with fondness and regret deeply that he left and the way in which he left, I will never be convinced it was the right decision at the right time.

But moving on, some like to keep poking the wasps nest with a stick though don't they, for reasons best known to themselves.

 

[Van wink 2,994]

1 hour ago, Mr Apples said:

Can we please establish a Daniel Farke Memorial Day where those that wish to pay their tributes/reminisce/fondly rewrite history/fondle their bratwurst/listen to Einsturzende Neubauten on loop, etc. (or all of the mentioned) can let it all go for 24 hours and after that return to the here and now. 

If you want candles for the day you better be quick, the hoarders are already emptying the shelves for winter. 🤣

Apples

On that day I shall bring my bobble head out and stroke it fondly 😀

[Ken Hairy 3,770]

1 hour ago, Rock The Boat said:

At the time I thought the wrong man was sacked but Smith has got us into second place and there is no reason not to support him now. 

As far as scrappy wins go, well that's the Championship for you and there were plenty of scrappy games under Farke. Not because that's the way Farke wanted the game to be played but because that's what the opposition brought to the table. 

Farke will always be loved but at the end of the day it's results that matter. 

There's a difference between not taking to his managerial style or ability and not supporting him. 

[C.I.D 302]

Perhaps a change of name to Dean Schmidt would help win over the Daniel lovers 😀

[Rock The Boat 1,329]

3 hours ago, Ken Hairy said:

There's a difference between not taking to his managerial style or ability and not supporting him. 

Could you explain a little bit more what the difference is, I'm not really getting it?

[hogesar 9,657]

1 hour ago, C.I.D said:

Perhaps a change of name to Dean Schmidt would help win over the Daniel lovers 😀

Oh 100% that would change everything, look at the amount on here who persisted with claiming Dean Smith's style of football was hoofball, despite years of managerial evidence to the contrary.

Not shocked to see us right up there in terms of possession retention in this league, as it's typically how a DS side has always played.

[Robert N. LiM 4,320]

6 minutes ago, hogesar said:

Dean Smith's style of football was hoofball, 

I've got really bad news for you about last night's winner

[Capt. Pants 4,225]

I didn't want Smith here in the first place so I guess from my perspective he has a bit of catching up to do. At the end of the day it doesn't make any difference if you like the manager or not so long as they get results.

Deano seems a thoroughly decent bloke and seems more rounded than Farke who was intransigent towards certain players. Farke had great engagement with the fans but his time had been and gone, and he was rightly sacked.

As it stands the football isn't always great but we've dominated virtually all of the games. You can see a game plan of seeking to win games in the 2nd half, which is fair enough.

Hopefully we are equally as successful when we play a top half team as they will be the defining moments.

 

[corbs 147]

Totally agree Ricardo, I wouldn’t say Farke was even my favourite Ncfc football manager (I go back to Ron S era) but my fondness for him on a personal level was in a different category. I loved the fact that he wasn’t one of us, he was foreign and free of all the detritus we’ve been inculcated with. 

[Ken Hairy 3,770]

2 hours ago, Rock The Boat said:

Could you explain a little bit more what the difference is, I'm not really getting it?

Simple, I can want him to win games but still not be impressed with the style of play or performance level. 

It's like when my eldest was younger and played netball, hated the sport didn't enjoy it, but always went and supported 🤷

[Ken Hairy 3,770]

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

Oh 100% that would change everything, look at the amount on here who persisted with claiming Dean Smith's style of football was hoofball, despite years of managerial evidence to the contrary.

Not shocked to see us right up there in terms of possession retention in this league, as it's typically how a DS side has always played.

I haven't seen anyone claim it to be hoofball, quite the contrary. He's trying to emulate Farkeball, we just don't do it with any pace or clever movement now. 

I've continually said it's Farkeball in slow motion, in fact I've only ever seen you mention hoofball on here. 

[ged in the onion bag 855]

Seems to me the club has a certain playing philosophy that Webber and Farke engineered as the blueprint and the idea is that future managers (Smith at present) operate within that philosophy.  

So the Farke v Smith debate is irrelevant (as the poster is advocating).... its about managing the players in the parameters of the philosophy and if Smith wasn't on board with that then he wouldn't be here..... those that lazily and foolishly suggest he's a long ball merchant haven't a clue.   

Last season was simply a write off and this season, Smith is still establishing his best formation / first XI which obviously changes by the game through form or injury!     Farke had a whole season and some to achieve progress and whilst the philosophy is there, Smith needs time to work out what he thinks is best given the quality of player he has.... he needs time for that.    He's finding out who can play consistently, who struggles away from home (it seems Dowell whose always been inconsistent and Sinani at present are struggling away) and whether we can be bold or as the last two games suggest, he's keeping it tight and hoping to win it late on which has worked, fair play to him. 

I'm still not sure if he is right but he does need time and he needs the injuries to stop.    Certainly no reason to suggest any other manager could do better at this stage.   That said, no idea why he plays the Villa lad when we have such competition with our own players - the lad is only 19, has little experience and really can't offer any more than our own talent who are bench warming or moving to Barnsley.   

 

Edited August 31, 2022 by ged in the onion bag

[ged in the onion bag 855]

8 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

I haven't seen anyone claim it to be hoofball, quite the contrary. He's trying to emulate Farkeball, we just don't do it with any pace or clever movement now. 

I've continually said it's Farkeball in slow motion, in fact I've only ever seen you mention hoofball on here. 

You may have said that but sure enough, plenty on here have cheaply called him a 'dinosaur' cos they know no better!

[canarybubbles 1,915]

9 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

I haven't seen anyone claim it to be hoofball, quite the contrary. He's trying to emulate Farkeball, we just don't do it with any pace or clever movement now. 

I've continually said it's Farkeball in slow motion, in fact I've only ever seen you mention hoofball on here. 

I accused him of hoofball many times but have admitted in a thread I began about two weeks ago that I was wrong on that count. I still think last season was a mix of hoofball and totally shapeless God-knows-what ball, but I now accept that was due to the extreme situation of having such a woeful midfield that the only sensible option was to cut it out. This season Smith is not playing hoofball and he gives no sign that he wants to.

Having said that, I still think we are underperforming given the talent we have in comparison to most of the other teams in the league and I think the only thing that has changed is the quality of our opponents, not the standard of our own football. I still think Smith has everything to prove here and I personally wish we had a different manager.

[hogesar 9,657]

19 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

I haven't seen anyone claim it to be hoofball, quite the contrary. He's trying to emulate Farkeball, we just don't do it with any pace or clever movement now. 

I've continually said it's Farkeball in slow motion, in fact I've only ever seen you mention hoofball on here. 

If you've only seen me mention it, you've not done a great job of reading this forum.

[Mason 47 1,376]

I wouldn't say Smith is creating some sort of facsimile of Farkeball, the latter was an ultra-high discipline purpose built siege machine hell bent on dominating possession. Super effective and great to watch UNLESS! you're playing sides who are good enough to break the system (which most PL sides are unfortunately). For example, see Farkes record without Buendia- a very specific approach.

I feel like Smith is trying to rebuild us into a side that is more adaptable. This may be more 'generic' in approach and not feel quite as saucy but might stand us in better stead in the long run.

We've made clear moves to try and sort out our weaknesses at both ends for set pieces, for example. Or we have the curious situation that Pukki is the only striker at the club yet to score this season, unthinkable for the past few years.

It's not perfect yet but I see the moving parts. I think Smith deserves time to try and get them working in sequence.

[Big Vince 318]

19 hours ago, hogesar said:

Your last point is relevant. We are currently winning without a recognised left back, a holding midfielder and without Pukki having scored a goal.

Winning to what purpose? Promotion to the EPL again? Don't be daft. That is way, way out of reach and the really poor quality of this league will falsely lull you into believing we are ready for another crack.

[Daz Sparks 1,151]

7 minutes ago, Big Vince said:

Winning to what purpose? Promotion to the EPL again? Don't be daft. That is way, way out of reach and the really poor quality of this league will falsely lull you into believing we are ready for another crack.

Not sure many believe that vinny boy...

[mrD66M 99]

12 hours ago, Ken Hairy said:

I've barely mentioned Farke for ages. I just haven't taken to Smith yet, I doubt I will. 

A blind monkey should get this squad into the higher reaches of what appears to be one of the poorest quality 2nd tiers on record..... Yes Hogstar I haven't forgetten our bet 😀, I fully expect to lose that now whoever the manager is. 

The thought of Dean Smith bumbling through another Premier campaign concerns me. 

I just can't take to the bloke, is that a crime? Then boohoo consider me guilty. 

My take is that a big part of Farke's charm was his agreeableness and connection to the fans. I think he cared that people viewed him and his squad in a positive way, but in some respects that went against him in the end. Smith is a bit more business like, and I doubt he loses sleep about being liked or not - he's far from being as divisive as Mourinho but his main concern is performances/results rather than nice optics.