New Board Director Confirmed - Mark Attanasio

[TIL 1010 4,722]

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

..and if he picked up the Old Trust and the Turners as has been suggested he would be only 395 short at that point.

Nobody has suggested the Turners anywhere unless you can tell me otherwise but i mentioned RG Carter a couple of times which came from my source.

[GMF 736]

9 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Thanks, GMF. As I said, I wasn't in a position to work out all the figures. Now I know some people have queried the point of the Canaries Trust buying the old Archant stake. That is to ignore its strategic significance.

Of course you cannot admit this publicly but if there comes a point at which Attanasio needs 3,000 or so more Ordinaries to hit the 30 per cent mark or the 90 per cent mark then the Trust will be able to drive the hardest of bargains and either make a whacking profit or demand a seat on the board, or both...🤩

Behave yourself @PurpleCanary 😉 That’s probably a conversation for another day and not the decision of one individual.

Ultimately, I’m not unduly worried about the 30% threshold, it just means that an offer is likely to be made to other shareholders. It’s then up to them whether or not they accept.

[shefcanary 2,390]

12 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Thanks, GMF. As I said, I wasn't in a position to work out all the figures. Now I know some people have queried the point of the Canaries Trust buying the old Archant stake. That is to ignore its strategic significance.

Of course you cannot admit this publicly but if there comes a point at which Attanasio needs 3,000 or so more Ordinaries to hit the 30 per cent mark or the 90 per cent mark then the Trust will be able to drive the hardest of bargains and either make a whacking profit or demand a seat on the board, or both...🤩

As I read it, the text of the C Preference share issue is set up with the ultimate transaction being Smith & Jones selling their shares to Attanasio once they have had a good look at him during the 7 year period mentioned in the paperwork. The trigger points clearly map out its either this, or they find someone else and Attanasio gets his £10m back plus interest. By the end of that 7 year period Smith & Jones will both be 88, an age not best suited to the rigours of professional football. If all goes to plan, and Smith & Jones like the cut of Attansio's jib(!), Attansio buys their shares adding to those he is buying at the moment and converts his C shares thus taking full control of the club in all practical sense apart from the acquisition of the small shareholders should he choose.

Anything else now is just noise as Webber, who seems now to be taking credit for all this, would say.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

Thanks, GMF. As I said, I wasn't in a position to work out all the figures. Now I know some people have queried the point of the Canaries Trust buying the old Archant stake. That is to ignore its strategic significance.

Of course you cannot admit this publicly but if there comes a point at which Attanasio needs 3,000 or so more Ordinaries to hit the 30 per cent mark or the 90 per cent mark then the Trust will be able to drive the hardest of bargains and either make a whacking profit or demand a seat on the board, or both...🤩

Behind every good joke…..👍🏽
 

Parma 

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

1 hour ago, shefcanary said:

As I read it, the text of the C Preference share issue is set up with the ultimate transaction being Smith & Jones selling their shares to Attanasio once they have had a good look at him during the 7 year period mentioned in the paperwork. The trigger points clearly map out its either this, or they find someone else and Attanasio gets his £10m back plus interest. By the end of that 7 year period Smith & Jones will both be 88, an age not best suited to the rigours of professional football. If all goes to plan, and Smith & Jones like the cut of Attansio's jib(!), Attansio buys their shares adding to those he is buying at the moment and converts his C shares thus taking full control of the club in all practical sense apart from the acquisition of the small shareholders should he choose.

Anything else now is just noise as Webber, who seems now to be taking credit for all this, would say.

Indeed. It all falls more neatly into place if one accepts all of the current mechanisms as a pre-cursor to a full buyout following a reasonable period of ‘internal due diligence’.

Much will melt away once-if Delia and Michael are satisfied and ‘time, dear boy, time’ (sic) creates a sense of fait accompli in the fan base (and shareholders).

Parma 

 

*mechanisms that had to be built upon the existing framework structure of course. Not a neat, clean piece of paper. 
The EGM amendments et al are thus ‘Mr Right  now’. They also necessarily provide for elegant exits in either direction, whilst endeavouring to not make it look like a closed-shop between D&M and MA. Not all easy circles to square. 

Edited September 6, 2022 by Parma Ham's gone mouldy

[GMF 736]

1 hour ago, TIL 1010 said:

Nobody has suggested the Turners anywhere unless you can tell me otherwise but i mentioned RG Carter a couple of times which came from my source.

The point to remember here, when MF decided to sell his shares, it was done with the Club largely controlling the process. The same cannot be said for the Jones family, who are using an outside broker to act on their behalf. That’s their entitlement and perfectly understandable in the circumstances, especially given the history.

That broker has also taken it upon themselves to reach out to a number of other large shareholders, I’d be very surprised if that didn’t include the Turners too. 

[essex canary 492]

29 minutes ago, Parma Ham's gone mouldy said:

Indeed. It all falls more neatly into place and f one accepts all of the current mechanisms as a pre-cursor to a full buyout following a reasonable period of ‘internal due diligence’.

Much will melt away once-if Delia and Michael are satisfied and ‘time, dear boy, time’ (sic) creates a sense of fait accompli in the fan base (and shareholders).

Parma 

 

*mechanisms that had to built upon the existing framework structure of course. Not a neat, clean piece of paper. 
The EGM amendments et al are thus ‘Mr Right  now’. They also necessarily provide for elegant exits in either direction, whilst endeavouring to not make it look like a closed-shop between D&M and MA. Not all easy circles to square. 

Fair enough. 7 years is a long time in football so realistic must hope it develops quicker than that.

[A Load of Squit 5,142]

Anyone still hanging onto this discussion before sending in their vote(s)?

I didn't get SAE in my pack so I had to fork out on an envelope and a stamp, I'm expecting some kind of future discount for my outlay.

 

[BigFish 1,986]

1 hour ago, GMF said:

The point to remember here, when MF decided to sell his shares, it was done with the Club largely controlling the process. The same cannot be said for the Jones family, who are using an outside broker to act on their behalf. That’s their entitlement and perfectly understandable in the circumstances, especially given the history.

That broker has also taken it upon themselves to reach out to a number of other large shareholders, I’d be very surprised if that didn’t include the Turners too. 

Interesting @GMF. You know more about this than anyone on here, or at least most. My understanding is the Archant adminstrators failed to get a decent offer on the shares they were trying to dispose of, which led them to the Trust in the end. Not disrespecting your efforts.

Is there any scenario you can envision where the Jones family can actually sell their shares, at a reasonable price, to anyone who is not MA?

[Nuff Said 5,093]

20 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

Anyone still hanging onto this discussion before sending in their vote(s)?

I didn't get SAE in my pack so I had to fork out on an envelope and a stamp, I'm expecting some kind of future discount for my outlay.

 

In perpetuity or just for your lifetime?

[GMF 736]

2 hours ago, BigFish said:

Interesting @GMF. You know more about this than anyone on here, or at least most. My understanding is the Archant adminstrators failed to get a decent offer on the shares they were trying to dispose of, which led them to the Trust in the end. Not disrespecting your efforts.

Is there any scenario you can envision where the Jones family can actually sell their shares, at a reasonable price, to anyone who is not MA?

Given that this thread is about Mark Attanasio joining the board, together with the proposed c-preference issue, I’ll focus on those issues.

The broker acting for the Jones family reached out to the Trust, as they already had to other large shareholders. This seems to be already well known in certain quarters, and, yes, I did have a lengthy conversation with them covering a range of NCFC issues. That conversation was private and will remain so.

Suffice to say, that broker seems highly credible, with an extensive range of contacts. It is possible, but by no means certain, that there’s more than one show in town. Time will tell, I guess. 😉

[PurpleCanary 5,555]

4 hours ago, Parma Ham's gone mouldy said:

Indeed. It all falls more neatly into place if one accepts all of the current mechanisms as a pre-cursor to a full buyout following a reasonable period of ‘internal due diligence’.

Much will melt away once-if Delia and Michael are satisfied and ‘time, dear boy, time’ (sic) creates a sense of fait accompli in the fan base (and shareholders).

Parma 

 

*mechanisms that had to be built upon the existing framework structure of course. Not a neat, clean piece of paper. 
The EGM amendments et al are thus ‘Mr Right  now’. They also necessarily provide for elegant exits in either direction, whilst endeavouring to not make it look like a closed-shop between D&M and MA. Not all easy circles to square. 

A very good point. It may eventually start to look inevitable - in a good way.

[ncfcstar 287]

Not sure if anyone has noticed that Tom Werner's (Liverpool Chairman) son is a VP at the Brewers.  So I'm sure that will have played a part in Attanasio's interest.  The Brewers also have a lot of links to the Bucks (NBA) so we're talking about some serious sport and brand experience coming to the club.

[Feedthewolf 4,844]

25 minutes ago, ncfcstar said:

Not sure if anyone has noticed that Tom Werner's (Liverpool Chairman) son is a VP at the Brewers.  So I'm sure that will have played a part in Attanasio's interest.  The Brewers also have a lot of links to the Bucks (NBA) so we're talking about some serious sport and brand experience coming to the club.

Wonder if we could part-exchange Jordan Hugill for Giannis Antetokounmpo in the January window...?

[king canary 7,580]

16 minutes ago, Feedthewolf said:

Wonder if we could part-exchange Jordan Hugill for Giannis Antetokounmpo in the January window...?

A revenue booster if we still charge by the letter I guess.

[Diane 500]

6 hours ago, GMF said:

The point to remember here, when MF decided to sell his shares, it was done with the Club largely controlling the process. The same cannot be said for the Jones family, who are using an outside broker to act on their behalf. That’s their entitlement and perfectly understandable in the circumstances, especially given the history.

That broker has also taken it upon themselves to reach out to a number of other large shareholders, I’d be very surprised if that didn’t include the Turners too. 

So if they buy Fougers families shares, Jimmy Jones, the Old Trust, Turners, R G Carters am i right in thinking they will have 145k shares so around 23% plus the c shares for which they might be investing 10m ? So our top 2 shareholders will have 75% between them?

Am i on the right track please ?

[BigFish 1,986]

8 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

Thanks, GMF. As I said, I wasn't in a position to work out all the figures. Now I know some people have queried the point of the Canaries Trust buying the old Archant stake. That is to ignore its strategic significance.

Of course you cannot admit this publicly but if there comes a point at which Attanasio needs 3,000 or so more Ordinaries to hit the 30 per cent mark or the 90 per cent mark then the Trust will be able to drive the hardest of bargains and either make a whacking profit or demand a seat on the board, or both...🤩

 

8 hours ago, GMF said:

Behave yourself @PurpleCanary 😉 That’s probably a conversation for another day and not the decision of one individual.

Ultimately, I’m not unduly worried about the 30% threshold, it just means that an offer is likely to be made to other shareholders. It’s then up to them whether or not they accept.

 

2 hours ago, GMF said:

Given that this thread is about Mark Attanasio joining the board, together with the proposed c-preference issue, I’ll focus on those issues.

The broker acting for the Jones family reached out to the Trust, as they already had to other large shareholders. This seems to be already well known in certain quarters, and, yes, I did have a lengthy conversation with them covering a range of NCFC issues. That conversation was private and will remain so.

Suffice to say, that broker seems highly credible, with an extensive range of contacts. It is possible, but by no means certain, that there’s more than one show in town. Time will tell, I guess. 😉

Most of our shareholders do so for sentimental reasons, and I include S&J in that. The point is owning minority stakes in unlisted companies offers little or no strategic leverage. Should MA, S & J decide to move there is little or nothing that will stop them. There is a possibility of squeezing extra value, but stopping no chance. Kroenke took seven years to smoke Usimov out od Arsenal but he got there in the end.

[GMF 736]

8 minutes ago, Diane said:

So if they buy Fougers families shares, Jimmy Jones, the Old Trust, Turners, R G Carters am i right in thinking they will have 145k shares so around 23% plus the c shares for which they might be investing 10m ? So our top 2 shareholders will have 75% between them?

Am i on the right track please ?

Near enough, but yes. 👍

[GMF 736]

6 minutes ago, BigFish said:

 

 

Most of our shareholders do so for sentimental reasons, and I include S&J in that. The point is owning minority stakes in unlisted companies offers little or no strategic leverage. Should MA, S & J decide to move there is little or nothing that will stop them. There is a possibility of squeezing extra value, but stopping no chance. Kroenke took seven years to smoke Usimov out od Arsenal but he got there in the end.

At last, the penny has dropped 😉

[ncfcstar 287]

1 hour ago, Feedthewolf said:

Wonder if we could part-exchange Jordan Hugill for Giannis Antetokounmpo in the January window...?

I did ask Giannis to visit a month or so ago, he obviously ignored me.  I'm going to see a Bucks game next month though, so I'll try and invite him again then 🤣

[Feedthewolf 4,844]

1 hour ago, ncfcstar said:

I did ask Giannis to visit a month or so ago, he obviously ignored me.  I'm going to see a Bucks game next month though, so I'll try and invite him again then 🤣

Oh awesome! I saw them back in about 2017 when Giannis was still on the way up and they still played at the Bradley Center. Would love to go to the Fiserv some day...

[essex canary 492]

15 hours ago, BigFish said:

 

 

Most of our shareholders do so for sentimental reasons, and I include S&J in that. The point is owning minority stakes in unlisted companies offers little or no strategic leverage. Should MA, S & J decide to move there is little or nothing that will stop them. There is a possibility of squeezing extra value, but stopping no chance. Kroenke took seven years to smoke Usimov out od Arsenal but he got there in the end.

Does that then mean that when other, perhaps similar clubs are apparently changing hands for £100 million plus we will do so for £15 million based on a price base that is a quarter century old disregarding footballs own huge price inflation?

At least let's hope the consolation is that they will invest in the ground extension and some better quality players going forward.

[GMF 736]

10 minutes ago, essex canary said:

Does that then mean that when other, perhaps similar clubs are apparently changing hands for £100 million plus we will do so for £15 million based on a price base that is a quarter century old disregarding footballs own huge price inflation?

At least let's hope the consolation is that they will invest in the ground extension and some better quality players going forward.

Where have you got your £15m from?

MA is (potentially) investing £10m into c-preference shares that are capable of being converted into a 10% stake of the Club. From my distant school days, paying £10m for a ten percent stake, values the club at £100m, but you’re the accountant, not me. 😜

[essex canary 492]

15 hours ago, Diane said:

So if they buy Fougers families shares, Jimmy Jones, the Old Trust, Turners, R G Carters am i right in thinking they will have 145k shares so around 23% plus the c shares for which they might be investing 10m ? So our top 2 shareholders will have 75% between them?

Am i on the right track please ?

An interesting issue here is the example quoted towards the top of page 8 of the Articles of Association. 

Why do they quote 17.5%? Could it be Foulger's shares plus the Old Trust?

Why then quote 27.5%? Have they dissuaded Atannasio from continuing with buying other shares in return for the 7% interest arrangement and 10% conversion further down the line?

Even if that is true there must logically be an understanding with Jimmy Jones etc. because that would be the easy practical way to deliver the 75% needed for the special resolutions.

 

 

 

[TIL 1010 4,722]

Just think only a few more days of what ifs, buts and maybes before the meeting next Monday and then the questions from those who will not be there about what was said about XYZ and was there any mention of ABC etc. 😜

[essex canary 492]

Just now, GMF said:

Where have you got your £15m from?

MA is (potentially) investing £10m into c-preference shares that are capable of being converted into a 10% stake of the Club. From my distant school days, paying £10m for a ten percent stake, values the club at £100m, but you’re the accountant, not me. 😜

Rightly or wrongly I was interpreting investing for 'sentimental reasons' as meaning one would only expect to get back what was originally put in. From an accounting perspective £100 million seems far more reasonable.

[essex canary 492]

21 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

Anyone still hanging onto this discussion before sending in their vote(s)?

I didn't get SAE in my pack so I had to fork out on an envelope and a stamp, I'm expecting some kind of future discount for my outlay.

 

My submission attached.

Perhaps could ask for a glass of champagne at this year's AGM though not my cup of tea?

[essex canary 492]

32 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

Just think only a few more days of what ifs, buts and maybes before the meeting next Monday and then the questions from those who will not be there about what was said about XYZ and was there any mention of ABC etc. 😜

Well done to those who are going and who find it convenient to go. Let's hope for a good turnout.

The Club aren't exactly making it easy by encouraging people not to go and scheduling it for 6pm with no electronic facility. No consistency in their approach.

Will they provide a post event briefing? Probably not - at least that will be consistent with AGM practice.

At least by raising the questions on the proxy form there may be just a chance that they will pick up on issues in advance and discuss amongst themselves. If they get asked a difficult question at an AGM they tend to look at each other then get defensive because they have no conferring opportunity.

Perhaps the more information shared the better the outcome?

 

[A Load of Squit 5,142]

23 minutes ago, essex canary said:

My submission attached.

Perhaps could ask for a glass of champagne at this year's AGM though not my cup of tea?

You have atrocious hand writing.

 

[Nuff Said 5,093]

28 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

You have atrocious hand writing.

 

It was probably delegated to a minion.