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Pyro Pete

The Cost Of Living Crisis

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Electricity prices in France: 15p per kWh. Monthly standing charge £7.4. (Macron capped the price increase to 4%)

UK charges from Oct: 46p per kWh, monthly standing charges £14.

Johnson and Zahawi : It’s all Russia’s fault, nothing we can do (except prolong the war by pumping in arms).

So their inability to follow Macron’s lead is all Putin’s fault? Hmm..not ideological dogma or lack of will to nationalise energy companies and start controlling prices. I'm sure that they will not want to leave such a lucrative market full of people willing to impoverish themselves for their profits.

 

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40 minutes ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said:

Electricity prices in France: 15p per kWh. Monthly standing charge £7.4. (Macron capped the price increase to 4%)

UK charges from Oct: 46p per kWh, monthly standing charges £14.

Johnson and Zahawi : It’s all Russia’s fault, nothing we can do (except prolong the war by pumping in arms).

So their inability to follow Macron’s lead is all Putin’s fault? Hmm..not ideological dogma or lack of will to nationalise energy companies and start controlling prices. I'm sure that they will not want to leave such a lucrative market full of people willing to impoverish themselves for their profits.

 

We must not forget that there are 650 families dependent on the BIG trough of government !

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19 hours ago, SteveN8458 said:

Hmm.

So 'dishing out' contract to china for Solar panels is different to 'dishing out' contracts to Chine for nuclear power stations!!

Let me know when the Chinese bought Rolls Royce and I'll bother to read the rest of your post.

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Amongst all this gloom I note there is a very bright silver lining.

We, with the rest of the world are going to, albeit painfully,  go 'green' much faster now than anybody a year ago would have thought possible. That has to be good for climate change.

Russia will also rapidly find that they will have permanently lost their European customers never to return.

 

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1 hour ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said:

Electricity prices in France: 15p per kWh. Monthly standing charge £7.4. (Macron capped the price increase to 4%)

UK charges from Oct: 46p per kWh, monthly standing charges £14.

Johnson and Zahawi : It’s all Russia’s fault, nothing we can do (except prolong the war by pumping in arms).

So their inability to follow Macron’s lead is all Putin’s fault? Hmm..not ideological dogma or lack of will to nationalise energy companies and start controlling prices. I'm sure that they will not want to leave such a lucrative market full of people willing to impoverish themselves for their profits.

What you have failed to mention is that France generates 75 percent of its electricity through nuclear power. 

And people like SteveN8458 are the reason why we don't. 

Then he wants to blame me for his grandchildren facing poverty.

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Just now, TeemuVanBasten said:

What you have failed to mention is that France generates 75 percent of its electricity through nuclear power. 

And people like SteveN8458 are the reason why we don't. 

Then he wants to blame me for his grandchildren facing poverty.

The funniest thing is that France (and Sweden) then sells it nuclear electricity to Germany that decided to close down its nuclear stations. Duh!

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3 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

What you have failed to mention is that France generates 75 percent of its electricity through nuclear power. 

And people like SteveN8458 are the reason why we don't. 

Then he wants to blame me for his grandchildren facing poverty.

What you have failed to mention is that the French electricity generator and supplier is largely (and shortly completely) state-owned whereas in the UK we have private companies performing the same role and ripping us all off whilst making huge profits and that is why the French electricity price has risen 4% whilst the UK price has tripled.

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48 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Let me know when the Chinese bought Rolls Royce and I'll bother to read the rest of your post.

Where have I stated that?

If you can show me where I posted such a load of trip maybe I won't blame you for my grandchildren poverty. (i'm not sure I actually said that either)

 

Oh and while I'm posting, today my solar system has produced 15Kw of power (as of 14:24)

Do you remember your statement:

"Don't know if you've ever done a calculator to estimate your potential energy bill saving with a 4kw system but it will barely scratch the surface of our domestic energy needs"

My background load is a shade over 250w, the rest is exported (at 5p/kw). How does 5p/kw stack up against nuclear?

That unused power could be used for heating/cooking/hotwater, all effectively free, that is why I feel that these should be installed on every home. Pretty they are not. Yes they are limited to daylight hours. Go ask one of the millions of families who are struggling to choose between heating the house or buying food?? Oh I know wait 30 years for a new nuclear power plant to be built and come on line for the utility companies to still charge them the stupid prices we are seeing. I'm sure I know what their choice will be, do you?

Then read-up about 'Chernobyl' and 'Three Mile Island' Now add Putin into the mix and what his forces are currently doing at Zaporizhzhia then you might get a understanding on why I dislike nuclear power.

Just look here for a glimpse into the safety of these plants

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_nuclear_power_accidents_by_country

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29 minutes ago, Creative Midfielder said:

What you have failed to mention is that the French electricity generator and supplier is largely (and shortly completely) state-owned whereas in the UK we have private companies performing the same role and ripping us all off whilst making huge profits and that is why the French electricity price has risen 4% whilst the UK price has tripled.

From memory:

The system here used to be that the companies extracting the gas from the wells were contracted to sell the gas to British Gas (a nationalised company at the time) hence the price you & I paid was fixed (in principle). Then one government decided to sell off British gas as it felt the 'private' sector could do a better job and instantly lost control of the price we pay.

The gate was open and the horse named 'control' bolted only to be captured by those now making money at our expense.

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2 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

But it’s people like you and me that use internet banking who are responsible for the lack of footfall in local branches, ultimately resulting in their closure due to lack of demand.  

Why? There is no reason for the branch to close. People still use it. Not as many of course but they have reduced staff to minimum levels and there are no investment staff left at a local branch. The cost of running a branch in a place like Redruth is minimal. 

Its just another way to make more money without regard to the customer. I am lending Lloyds a decent amount of money to get .75% interest (it doesn't bother me about interest by the way) only for them to lend it to someone for 5%. They can afford a certain amount of goodwill to keep a branch open.

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4 minutes ago, SteveN8458 said:

From memory:

The system here used to be that the companies extracting the gas from the wells were contracted to sell the gas to British Gas (a nationalised company at the time) hence the price you & I paid was fixed (in principle). Then one government decided to sell off British gas as it felt the 'private' sector could do a better job and instantly lost control of the price we pay.

The gate was open and the horse named 'control' bolted only to be captured by those now making money at our expense.

Apparently we were too much dependent on the state and private enterprise would do it more efficiently also.

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6 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Apparently we were too much dependent on the state and private enterprise would do it more efficiently also.

Yea, and now we are in the position where private enterprise is making so much money the we are going to be dependent on the state to help out.

What goes round comes around!!!

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Just for TVB:

All that waste from nuclear plants has to go somewhere, but where

"Explanation:

Half life is just the time it takes for half of a radioactive substance to decay (turn into something new). Since this is a first order process, the time it takes for this to happen is independent of the starting concentration.

Different radioactive elements have different half lives, so you can't say it is generically some specific time. Rather, you need to know which radioactive elements you have to help you determine how long it will take your "waste" to decay.

Nuclear waste is stuff like radioactive daughter nuclei from a fission reaction, leftover U235, U238, Plutonium, various other nuclei.

If you only have daughter nuclei, most of their times required to decay are much shorter (still long time) compared to Uranium and plutonium.

The amount doesn't matter. If you have 100kg of C-14, it will take approximately 5200 years for half of it to decay, so that you'll still have 50kg of radioactive C-14.

If you started out with 100g of C-14, it would take 5200 years for half of its to decay.

So for waste, you have to isolate it and let it decay for a certain amount of time (when I used P-32 in the lab, I think 5 half lives was the standard). So if you have to wait 5 half lives, for some of this material (daughter products), that'll be close to 250 years before the sample has decayed to sufficiently low levels.

If you have to wait 5 half lives for Uranium and Plutonium, you'll be waiting hundreds of thousands of years."

 

Yes lets build more of these plants, lets have more of this leftover stuff. I assume that you would be happy for this to be put under your house as you are not a 'nimby'

Edited by SteveN8458

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The thing about nuclear waste is that as compared to the toxic waste from other industrial or power generation processes its very compact - we are still storing onsite all of Sellafields plus imports as we determine the best long term underground solution.

If only that could be said for the likes of solar cell, heat pump, or any other industrial or power generation process. Some of the gasses used would terrify you (by comparison cyanide gas you can smell in time  - I have) - If you can smell phosphine or arsine it's too late. I won't even start on coal burning an the heavy (and yes radioactive) metals it releases.

In short the lay-person has a very poor understanding of risk and radiation in particular.

For fun - 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/coal-ash-is-more-radioactive-than-nuclear-waste/

Edited by Yellow Fever

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1 hour ago, SteveN8458 said:

Yea, and now we are in the position where private enterprise is making so much money the we are going to be dependent on the state to help out.

What goes round comes around!!!

But she is going to cut taxes rather than helping out. Well that was the latest, its probably changed today. Probably going to cut even more tax now as Rishi is gaining ground.

So give everyone working 2 quid back in tax?

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Just now, keelansgrandad said:

But she is going to cut taxes rather than helping out. Well that was the latest, its probably changed today. Probably going to cut even more tax now as Rishi is gaining ground.

So give everyone working 2 quid back in tax?

Oh and give everyone a tax cut is really going to help those who are on minimum wage. Yea that will help a lot of folk.

How much do you need to earn for a 5% (chosen at random TVB) cut to make up for the £1500 (approximation TVB) quid rise in energy bills ?

That sure will win a lot of voters over.

 

It made me laugh today (sorry I know it was wrong) but they were saying on the TV that those who could not afford the latest rise in energy costs would be put on 'pre-payment' meters. like that will help them put money in the meter. Like, if they can't afford the bill, where does the money come from to put cash on the pre-payment card/key whatever???

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2 hours ago, Creative Midfielder said:

What you have failed to mention is that the French electricity generator and supplier is largely (and shortly completely) state-owned whereas in the UK we have private companies performing the same role and ripping us all off whilst making huge profits and that is why the French electricity price has risen 4% whilst the UK price has tripled.

EDF is a big nuclear operator in the UK, so the rip off of UK customers will go some way to help keep energy costs down in France further. 

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42 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

The thing about nuclear waste is that as compared to the toxic waste from other industrial or power generation processes its very compact - we are still storing onsite all of Sellafields plus imports as we determine the best long term underground solution.

If only that could be said for the likes of solar cell, heat pump, or any other industrial or power generation process. Some of the gasses used would terrify you (by comparison cyanide gas you can smell in time  - I have) - If you can smell phosphine or arsine it's too late. I won't even start on coal burning an the heavy (and yes radioactive) metals it releases.

In short the lay-person has a very poor understanding of risk and radiation in particular.

For fun - 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/coal-ash-is-more-radioactive-than-nuclear-waste/

YF.

I might be wrong, but isn't the store actually old mining tunnels out under the sea?

That link was interesting, any similar for the solar cells?

I need more edumification 🙂

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1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

EDF is a big nuclear operator in the UK, so the rip off of UK customers will go some way to help keep energy costs down in France further. 

Yes indeed, the rip off of UK electricity customers has some home grown elements but is overall largely international in its make up.

Actually very similar picture to some of our other utilies, viz rail, which is largely owned by overseas companies and in some cases state owned companies again meaning that the UK consumers are subsiding continental ones.

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53 minutes ago, SteveN8458 said:

YF.

I might be wrong, but isn't the store actually old mining tunnels out under the sea?

That link was interesting, any similar for the solar cells?

I need more edumification 🙂

Its all still above ground . Proposals to bury it in several places but of course as with everything in the UK it never happens if it can be kicked down the road. A lot of uninformed nimby-ism as usual.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/aug/23/nuclear-storage-plans-for-north-of-england-stir-up-local-opposition

Semiconductor fab plants use all sorts of nasty stuff - but the risks of the gases and chemicals are well known and hardly cause a stir in the minds of the general public but only cause trouble when we have a leak or chemical spill. Heaven forbid a fire!  I recall one place on the South Coast that had it on the top of a tower! Some will recall! 

Nothing we do is risk free but nuclear gets a bad rap simply because it seems exotic. If you want to worry about radioactive waste look no further than your local hospital! I generally think waste is a problem but it is over exaggerated as compared to other sources of energy. Frankly I'd rather have a few large high security power stations with waste than lots of little ones (or zillions of onshore windmills) littering up the countryside. Of course - there are obvious risks with nuclear which is why they are generally well controlled as opposed to the major ill thought through risks with chemical factories and the like (recall Bhopal). That's sadly human nature.  

If you want to laugh then I always recall living and driving through Greenwich (where Liz Truss lives) and the sign would say  - Greenwich - a nuclear free zone - yet in the Engineering mag I would read would be advertisement for a reactor engineer. It wasn't the only one in London either and no secret just not widely publicized!

Oh - you do know that the population of Norwich was DELIBERATELY sprayed with Cadmium in the 1960s? Class action?

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2 hours ago, SteveN8458 said:

Oh and give everyone a tax cut is really going to help those who are on minimum wage. Yea that will help a lot of folk.

How much do you need to earn for a 5% (chosen at random TVB) cut to make up for the £1500 (approximation TVB) quid rise in energy bills ?

That sure will win a lot of voters over.

 

It made me laugh today (sorry I know it was wrong) but they were saying on the TV that those who could not afford the latest rise in energy costs would be put on 'pre-payment' meters. like that will help them put money in the meter. Like, if they can't afford the bill, where does the money come from to put cash on the pre-payment card/key whatever???

This could end up as similar to Poll Tax. We could well see some civil disobedience.

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26 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

This could end up as similar to Poll Tax. We could well see some civil disobedience.

I think it's almost inevitable unless the government have the common sense to instigate a response similar in scope to how it dealt with Covid. This isn't just going to be something that affects people already in poverty, or those who are vulnerable. There will be families with two-working parents in fairly good jobs that are going to wind up struggling for basics. Millions of people absolutely enraged, people who haven't become desensitised to the government taking regular dumps on them.

Add in to the mix that we are about to have a demonstrable moron put in charge of the country by a cult-like group of similarly unintelligent people and it won't take much to ignite the touch-paper.

I'm sharpening my pitchfork, that's for sure.

Edited by canarydan23
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1 hour ago, canarydan23 said:

I think it's almost inevitable unless the government have the common sense to instigate a response similar in scope to how it dealt with Covid. This isn't just going to be something that affects people already in poverty, or those who are vulnerable. There will be families with two-working parents in fairly good jobs that are going to wind up struggling for basics. Millions of people absolutely enraged, people who haven't become desensitised to the government taking regular dumps on them.

Add in to the mix that we are about to have a demonstrable moron put in charge of the country by a cult-like group of similarly unintelligent people and it won't take much to ignite the touch-paper.

I'm sharpening my pitchfork, that's for sure.

The Tories will start by book burning.

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2 hours ago, canarydan23 said:

I think it's almost inevitable unless the government have the common sense to instigate a response similar in scope to how it dealt with Covid. This isn't just going to be something that affects people already in poverty, or those who are vulnerable. There will be families with two-working parents in fairly good jobs that are going to wind up struggling for basics. Millions of people absolutely enraged, people who haven't become desensitised to the government taking regular dumps on them.

Add in to the mix that we are about to have a demonstrable moron put in charge of the country by a cult-like group of similarly unintelligent people and it won't take much to ignite the touch-paper.

I'm sharpening my pitchfork, that's for sure.

I think the point you make about what might be called comfortable middle class families suddenly struggling (in effect an unexpected second mortgage with rates rising on their first let alone normal cost of living rises) and this could turn very toxic, very ugly, very quickly. Essex man in uproar.

For a host of practical questions I think the freeze aka SKS/Davey/Power companies is the only way out..and including SMEs.

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This is a crisis of 40 years plus of neoliberalism which fundamentally lurches from crisis to crisis and this is one too many. A big realignment of nationalisation, regulation and proper taxation will be on the way in the next few years. Business as usual will lead to riots and Liz Truss will virtually guarantee civil unrest. Strap yourself in, its going to be a bumpy ride.

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On 09/08/2022 at 14:47, Thumbbass said:

This is the issue. The companies we directly pay our bills to are not necessarily the ones making the huge profits, this is happening back in the supply line where they are making all sorts of hay. It's why the price cap doesn't work. It is absolutely criminal and genuinely makes me feel sick that we're essentially, and pardon the pun, but powerless.

There are small public protests building like https://dontpay.uk/ I wish we had the togetherness that the French have in these situations. 

I wish we had the togetherness and rebellious nature the French have in most cases. We have Mike Lynch, Martin Lewis and apparently now Judge Rinder and some Unionists, who people seem to have polarising views on. They had the Yellowjackets, tell me which is more intimidating?

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3 minutes ago, CrankyCanary said:

I wish we had the togetherness and rebellious nature the French have in most cases. We have Mike Lynch, Martin Lewis and apparently now Judge Rinder and some Unionists, who people seem to have polarising views on. They had the Yellowjackets, tell me which is more intimidating?

I'm about to head to France, tunnel trouble permitting. I'll see if I can get some tips.

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9 minutes ago, canarydan23 said:

I'm about to head to France, tunnel trouble permitting. I'll see if I can get some tips.

First step, get rid of the royal family. I'm pretty certain it keeps the ridiculous class divide going.

On Class – Gogwit's Blog

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