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**Official lappinitup match thread Cardiff v Norwich**

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4 minutes ago, The Great Mass Debater said:

Did Farke get time to integrate Normann and PLM into the team?

I thought the narrative there was that they are both crap and that's why Webber should have been sacked? 

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9 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Yes it's an overreaction to a first game defeat, but you have to ask yourself why so many are thinking that way? The answer is very few on here wanted Smith as manager and very few trust him to get it right and can't wait for the first opportunity to get shot of him.

I'm struggling not to tbh, it's just the same old ****e every effing week.

Right, so "so many on here" are all stuck in October 2021. A great endorsement don't you think?

We expect the team and coaches who were around last season to reset over the summer, get over last season. But an angry minority insist on returning to not getting what they wanted in October 2021... yeesh. 

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21 minutes ago, The Great Mass Debater said:

If he only gets 11 games grace, why should Smith get more?

 Nice little paradox there. Looks like you're arguing it was wrong to only give Farke 11 games. In which case, it's wrong to only give Smith 11. No reason to make the same mistake just to be fair to Daniel...

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It's always difficult playing against cloggers, and we tend to find it more difficult than most. For once, today, I don't even think we can feel aggrieved at the ref, who looked after us reasonably well. But with all our attacks continuously broken up by niggling fouls, we really needed a good stream of chances if we were to finish enough. And that is my concern.

I know it's heresy to suggest it, but I'm not sure it will have been wise not to recruit a Pukki replacement this season.  Even last time in the champs, and despite the golden boot, Pukki squandered more one-on-ones than I have ever seen in a season - but fortunately Buendia created them with such regularity that it didn't matter. But with Buendia gone, it's hard to see who will replace his 15 goals and 17 assists (which should have been on 30). Also, Pukki is a couple of years older and a yard slower now (it was a caution to see how easily Cardiff's massive centre backs were able to nullify Pukki, and even to outpace him to the ball).  Whilst I've got my tin hat on, I'll also mention that Hugill is a real nuisance in the box, and I'd probably play him ahead of Pukki for the lack of anyone else. This was evidenced in pre-season - he could easily have had a hat-trick against Cambridge United, for example - and was harrying defenders in possession furiously (somethink Pukki has lacked even in his heyday). OK, I know it was 'only' Cambridge United, but they outplayed us in the first half - a half in which Pukki had only one long-range chance.

OK, I'll get my coat.  I know it's only the first game and so very early days.  Things might gel yet, and I really hope they do - and that I will be back with my tail between my legs to congratulate Pukki on another golden boot!

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6 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

we should have got someone who played the Farke way i thought that was the way the club said it would work with a DOF 

we ripped up all Farke's work when we got smith ,

 

 

 

 

The signings last summer were meant to facilitate a change to a more counter attacking style, Farke ripped up most of his own work in those first games last season. We were doing what we thought was needed to keep us in the PL.

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Personally I’d have brought Hugill and Onel on much sooner, no point playing Pukki if you’re not going to pass it on the deck to him.

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8 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

we should have got someone who played the Farke way i thought that was the way the club said it would work with a DOF 

we ripped up all Farke's work when we got smith ,

 

 

 

 

100% agree with this. 
Absolutely disgusting that we have thrown everything away that had been achieved over previous years. It’s not just even the style of play, its the ethos and togetherness.

club seems a total mess and we’ve lost our way again

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I have just walked out of the ground bewildered by an awful game, a powder puff Norwich display and unbelievable tactics from the coach.

The ref was dreadful but he had an excuse. We had one shot on target and hit the post.

We looked clueless. And why the supporters get excited when we get a set piece is beyond me. It's just giving the ball back. 

Oh and Hanley? To echo Truss. Disgrace.

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Just now, repman said:

The signings last summer were meant to facilitate a change to a more counter attacking style, Farke ripped up most of his own work in those first games last season. We were doing what we thought was needed to keep us in the PL.

I would like to know who made the signings 

was it more Farke or more webber or 50/50 like i thought it was 

they were terrible and proved the same today 

but Smith has never played football like farke 

Farke might wanted to change things to try to stay in PL but his style was what we enjoyed and he of played that style today i am sure 

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7 minutes ago, horsefly said:

Indeed he should! The simple truth is Smith will not be sacked after one game of the new season, so I really don't get the point of all this doom after just one crap result. I might add that those decrying replacing Farke with Smith are frequently the same suspects who were demanding Farke's sacking (happy to say I never did).

Are they really? I for one never wanted Farke replaced with a sacked failing manager! Not sure you’ll find many who demanded Farke to be sacked and happy with Smiths appointment, but feel free to find them from threads at the time!

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8 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

we should have got someone who played the Farke way i thought that was the way the club said it would work with a DOF 

we ripped up all Farke's work when we got smith ,

With all due respect, if we were to go down the like for like replacement, as in styles, we needed someone better than Farke at what we called Farke-ball. I say that because he could win Championship titles but struggled badly with getting the team to step up a level.

Many of the folks who said to keep Farke argued that at least he would be likely to get us to bounce back up. Again, whilst that is true, if after 10games - people say 11, but the decision to sack him was made after the tenth - you are saying we are relegated, then what sort of mentality is that? 

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1 minute ago, El Convento said:

It's always difficult playing against cloggers, and we tend to find it more difficult than most. For once, today, I don't even think we can feel aggrieved at the ref, who looked after us reasonably well. But with all our attacks continuously broken up by niggling fouls, we really needed a good stream of chances if we were to finish enough. And that is my concern.

I know it's heresy to suggest it, but I'm not sure it will have been wise not to recruit a Pukki replacement this season.  Even last time in the champs, and despite the golden boot, Pukki squandered more one-on-ones than I have ever seen in a season - but fortunately Buendia created them with such regularity that it didn't matter. But with Buendia gone, it's hard to see who will replace his 15 goals and 17 assists (which should have been on 30). Also, Pukki is a couple of years older and a yard slower now (it was a caution to see how easily Cardiff's massive centre backs were able to nullify Pukki, and even to outpace him to the ball).  Whilst I've got my tin hat on, I'll also mention that Hugill is a real nuisance in the box, and I'd probably play him ahead of Pukki for the lack of anyone else. This was evidenced in pre-season - he could easily have had a hat-trick against Cambridge United, for example - and was harrying defenders in possession furiously (somethink Pukki has lacked even in his heyday). OK, I know it was 'only' Cambridge United, but they outplayed us in the first half - a half in which Pukki had only one long-range chance.

OK, I'll get my coat.  I know it's only the first game and so very early days.  Things might gel yet, and I really hope they do - and that I will be back with my tail between my legs to congratulate Pukki on another golden boot!

TBH you have it about spot in. Pukki looks stale. It might be just as well to let him have August off and really recharge his batteries. He had just over a fortnight off this summer after pretty much constant football for the past three years. He went off today with cramp, his body was kicked to shreds in the game, he needs a proper break. Sure, it means reverting to Hugill, but with a lack of a discernible style from Deano, that may be a blessing.

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1 minute ago, Indy said:

Are they really? I for one never wanted Farke replaced with a sacked failing manager! Not sure you’ll find many who demanded Farke to be sacked and happy with Smiths appointment, but feel free to find them from threads at the time!

I think I am right in saying that of the managers we were linked with, only one wasn't "sacked and failing"?

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1 minute ago, chicken said:

With all due respect, if we were to go down the like for like replacement, as in styles, we needed someone better than Farke at what we called Farke-ball. I say that because he could win Championship titles but struggled badly with getting the team to step up a level.

Many of the folks who said to keep Farke argued that at least he would be likely to get us to bounce back up. Again, whilst that is true, if after 10games - people say 11, but the decision to sack him was made after the tenth - you are saying we are relegated, then what sort of mentality is that? 

All of this.

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Just now, chicken said:

With all due respect, if we were to go down the like for like replacement, as in styles, we needed someone better than Farke at what we called Farke-ball. I say that because he could win Championship titles but struggled badly with getting the team to step up a level.

Many of the folks who said to keep Farke argued that at least he would be likely to get us to bounce back up. Again, whilst that is true, if after 10games - people say 11, but the decision to sack him was made after the tenth - you are saying we are relegated, then what sort of mentality is that? 

that was the system that webber put in place 

yes i agree not exact the same but should be very similar but better 

like swansea did when they were successful  

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1 minute ago, norfolkngood said:

 Farke might wanted to change things to try to stay in PL but his style was what we enjoyed and he of played that style today i am sure 

I think under Farke we would always fail in the PL because he wasn't a good enough coach defensively,. 

I'm not convinced Smith is a good enough one either, but he is better than Farke at it. The question is whether Smith is a good enough coach offensively to get us out of this division.

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Just now, chicken said:

I think I am right in saying that of the managers we were linked with, only one wasn't "sacked and failing"?

Not from a team two places above us at the time, sacked a week later! Some on here we’re hoping we would appoint a new coach who was employed and bought success to a small club through limited funds, Robins type!

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2 minutes ago, Indy said:

Are they really? I for one never wanted Farke replaced with a sacked failing manager! Not sure you’ll find many who demanded Farke to be sacked and happy with Smiths appointment, but feel free to find them from threads at the time!

You seem to have plenty of time for that so I'll let you indulge yourself, since you seem to have unilaterally decided to set yourself up as a board monitor with control over what can be said by other posters (now follow your own advice and actually say something relevant to the game).

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1 minute ago, repman said:

I think under Farke we would always fail in the PL because he wasn't a good enough coach defensively,. 

I'm not convinced Smith is a good enough one either, but he is better than Farke at it. The question is whether Smith is a good enough coach offensively to get us out of this division.

I think it's less about coaches and more about players.

Farke is a far better coach.

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Just now, horsefly said:

You seem to have plenty of time for that so I'll let you indulge yourself, since you seem to have unilaterally decided to set yourself up as a board monitor with control over what can be said by other posters (now follow your own advice and actually say something relevant to the game).

Brilliant! So you have no real posts to back up your claims so you do your normal side track and bull!

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Here’s my honesty perspective of the game.

Norwich- too rigid, but there’s potential for an exciting brand of football:off the ball they were sound,  and added numbers to the centre. The fullbacks came inside to win the ball in the half space often, 

The formation was set up for as high press, with attempted fast transition from font to back, and put the opposition under pressure as soon as possible. Higher risk passing stunted us. 
Look for goals on the break, rather than beating a low block. 
It didn’t work today, it left our players too stretched as they looked to make the pitch wide.

This is an attempt at something akin to Bielsa’s Leeds in the championship. Not bad considering our press was only beaten once in the second half. The result happened, Smith won’t be happy, but the style will come. 

Norwich let themselves down. This match will be a valuable lesson. Too much focus on verticality when a pass to a teammate, sideways, or even backwards Would’ve been more pleasing on the eye. 
 

I saw a bleeding of two styles trying to merge together and not quite clicking. This match was lost by Norwich and not won by Cardiff. 

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1 minute ago, repman said:

I think under Farke we would always fail in the PL because he wasn't a good enough coach defensively,. 

I'm not convinced Smith is a good enough one either, but he is better than Farke at it. The question is whether Smith is a good enough coach offensively to get us out of this division.

oh yes i was one to say Farke had to go but his style was on the right road  but he lacked the Defence side 

he also lacked the players but his style was the right was ish and i am sure a better manager who played Farke way but with a better defence is exactly in my view is who we should of gone for 

Smith is better at defence i admit but the rest is no style at all 

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1 minute ago, Indy said:

Not from a team two places above us at the time, sacked a week later! Some on here we’re hoping we would appoint a new coach who was employed and bought success to a small club through limited funds, Robins type!

Robins is someone I wouldn't mind seeing here, primarily because of fond memories of him as a player. However, look at his CV as a manager, he's not guaranteed success. Arguably, he's best performed as a manager of teams in the lower reaches of the Championship, helping them avoid relegation. It's not always ended well for him either.

That said, at the moment, he's proving he can take the reins for several years and see progress with little investment.

The question is, can he manage a club that aren't seen as the underdogs, that has money to spend and has expectations to meet?

In fairness, Smith does have that on his CV. 
 

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1 minute ago, Indy said:

Brilliant! So you have no real posts to back up your claims so you do your normal side track and bull!

I'll probably get around to it at some point just to prove a prig like you wrong. But I'm afraid I have better things to do tonight, so feel free to fill your void.

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Just now, norfolkngood said:

oh yes i was one to say Farke had to go but his style was on the right road  but he lacked the Defence side 

he also lacked the players but his style was the right was ish and i am sure a better manager who played Farke way but with a better defence is exactly in my view is who we should of gone for 

Smith is better at defence i admit but the rest is no style at all 

The problem is that if you find a coach who is good at both then you probably have one of the best in the world.

It comes down to would you rather stay up playing **** football or go down in style?

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9 minutes ago, rock bus said:

100% agree with this. 
Absolutely disgusting that we have thrown everything away that had been achieved over previous years. It’s not just even the style of play, its the ethos and togetherness.

club seems a total mess and we’ve lost our way again

The point ive been making for some time. The old road was the correct one, it made us distinctive. This road just leads us back to being like everyone else. An important facet of our identity has been thrown away in a moment of panic.

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If it were up to me I’d give Smith up to game 8 and if he’s falling short then get rid. I’d still have preferred Knutson from Bodo. Not sure we’d get him now as a championship club

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1 minute ago, chicken said:

Robins is someone I wouldn't mind seeing here, primarily because of fond memories of him as a player. However, look at his CV as a manager, he's not guaranteed success. Arguably, he's best performed as a manager of teams in the lower reaches of the Championship, helping them avoid relegation. It's not always ended well for him either.

That said, at the moment, he's proving he can take the reins for several years and see progress with little investment.

The question is, can he manage a club that aren't seen as the underdogs, that has money to spend and has expectations to meet?

In fairness, Smith does have that on his CV. 
 

Talk about overegging the pudding. Would Robins be any good not being the underdog?

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20 minutes ago, Kingston Yellow said:

You’re part of the problem pal.  You clearly missed last season, where our squad was weaker than the season before, where Webber’s ego exceeded his competence, where the wrong man got fired and where we’ve signed 3 midfielders who either injured or completely unproven in this country or league.  The jury’s out on Smith but it’s not possible to assess him given the shambles that he’s operating under.

And you’re  part of the solution, mate?

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