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But posters on here said our medical staff and doctors would pick anything up in medical ?

injured players were not a problem Doctors and Medical staff knew how the injury would heal ? 

 

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55 minutes ago, Nora's Ghost said:

Clubs must rub their hands with glee when they see City come knocking.

 

 

 

 

You lot weren't rubbing your hands with glee when City came knocking for Liam Gibbs were they? 

There were so many tears shed by contributors to TWTD and binners in general when that happened that the Orwell threatened to flood the area. 

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7 minutes ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

🤣 any good DM players in there free for Saturdays and Tuesdays? 

Yeah, but none we could afford... 😉

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3 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

But posters on here said our medical staff and doctors would pick anything up in medical ?

How can they 'pick up' an already known injury?

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12 hours ago, king canary said:

Surgery needed so he's missing the start of the season. Really not great as he's going to playing some serious catch up.

The same will apply to Sara when he arrives. Its safe to say these signings if the latter comes to fruition you wont be seeing at the beginning of the season and fans will have to be patient.

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3 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

How can they 'pick up' an already known injury?

myself and others Pointed out that signing players that had been injured was a high risk 

and other posters stated that the medical staff would pick up any problems 

you can access a known injury 

what is are the chances it will heal chances of full recovery chances it will need another op 

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2 minutes ago, jaberry2 said:

The same will apply to Sara when he arrives. Its safe to say these signings if the latter comes to fruition you wont be seeing at the beginning of the season and fans will have to be patient.

the op with Sara could be slightly different 

as there are many type of Ankle ops 

keyhole to clean it up or fully blown 

little is know what type of op sara had 

Hayden on the other hand we knew he had a serious injury 

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2 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

the op with Sara could be slightly different 

as there are many type of Ankle ops 

keyhole to clean it up or fully blown 

little is know what type of op sara had 

Hayden on the other hand we knew he had a serious injury 

Valid point. But Sara will need time to integrate / adjust to english football. I would be expecting to see them about the same timeframe in starting XI.

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In reality, given this is a loan, if Hayden comes in and plays close to his potential for 30 games it's worth it for us.

IF we have adequate cover.

The second sentence is my concern not that he isn't fit for the first few weeks.

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Just now, jaberry2 said:

Valid point. But Sara will need time to integrate / adjust to english football. I would be expecting to see them about the same timeframe in starting XI.

oh yes you are correct 

yes would have been hard to adjust even if he was fully fit

i am gutted for Hayden a real quality player who we finally got to fill that CDM position 

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22 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

oh yes you are correct 

yes would have been hard to adjust even if he was fully fit

i am gutted for Hayden a real quality player who we finally got to fill that CDM position 

I think we've probably ok with our starting 11 as it stands, but clearly these two players (as and when fit) are expected to take us up a notch. We've all gotta hope injuries will be behind them and they can adjust/contribute quickly. If not, this will be the end of Webbers gambles for the club. As he'll be gone.

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Just now, jaberry2 said:

I think we've probably ok with our starting 11 as it stands, but clearly these two players (as and when fit) are expected to take us up a notch. We've all gotta hope injuries will be behind them and they can adjust/contribute quickly. If not, this will be the end of Webbers gambles for the club. As he'll be gone.

i think my concern is Hayden's Knee has had a problem so early on in pre season ,

i imagine he was only doing light training and a problem has flared up 

time will tell if this is the start of more problems or just a small problem on his way back

hopefully this op might clear up the problem and we and him can enjoy a successful career at the club 

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41 minutes ago, Indy said:

Funny as normal the two sides always take the side of pro club - anti club! The same posters, the ones who don’t like anything bad being said about their club the half full glass and those who have a negative view on most issues the half empty glass brigade.

I’m not sure what your point is here Indy? Are “pro club” or even “anti club” posters not allowed to post unless it contradicts their normal stance? 
 

I’m sure you’ve marked my cards as “pro club” but I would argue I normally/often post when I see biased or simply incorrect statements made on here. 
 

Things like:

”You just know this will be something that will drag off and on all season. ”

“Norwich gamble on crocked player backfires.”

”It’s ok, he’s our saviour that’s what many said on here when I questioned signing a crock, cos that’s what he is, originally.”

”Clubs must rub their hands with glee when they see City come knocking”

All of which are demonstrably false. That’s not pro-club, that’s just pointing out incorrect facts

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Been saying it for 3 years now.... we need 3 CDMs!    Signing Skipp stopped us getting in proper replacements and developing the likes of Sorensen, then left a huge void.... The Hayden loan signing is potentially making the same mistake (we may not get promoted and if we do won't have a back up) and now it seems we've signed a crock.    If the knee needs cleaning out, surely with the technology of scanning equipment now available, that would have been detectable! 

When will they ever learn!       

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22 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

i think my concern is Hayden's Knee has had a problem so early on in pre season ,

i imagine he was only doing light training and a problem has flared up 

time will tell if this is the start of more problems or just a small problem on his way back

hopefully this op might clear up the problem and we and him can enjoy a successful career at the club 

He was already training with Newcastle before we signed him. Doctors and Physio's arent there to 'pick up' an injury but to judge the likelihood of a recurring injury. That he's had a minor OP isn't ideal but it still might be the club's specialists view that it's unlikely to cause a long-term problem.

 

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17 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

I’m not sure what your point is here Indy? Are “pro club” or even “anti club” posters not allowed to post unless it contradicts their normal stance? 
 

I’m sure you’ve marked my cards as “pro club” but I would argue I normally/often post when I see biased or simply incorrect statements made on here. 
 

Things like:

”You just know this will be something that will drag off and on all season. ”

“Norwich gamble on crocked player backfires.”

”It’s ok, he’s our saviour that’s what many said on here when I questioned signing a crock, cos that’s what he is, originally.”

”Clubs must rub their hands with glee when they see City come knocking”

All of which are demonstrably false. That’s not pro-club, that’s just pointing out incorrect facts

Yes you certainly are pro club, that’s my point, those who have made those statements you picked out are generally against the current regime! But not that their comments aren’t valid as it’s certainly true we’ve signed a good player but one who is comming off a bad injury and serious op, so certainly a risk! But I’m of the opinion it’s a player once fully fit will improve our starting 11 If he can find full fitness and form, so a good signing on paper. If he is another Jarvis or Byram then we’re not going to see much of him!

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1 minute ago, hogesar said:

He was already training with Newcastle before we signed him. Doctors and Physio's arent there to 'pick up' an injury but to judge the likelihood of a recurring injury. That he's had a minor OP isn't ideal but it still might be the club's specialists view that it's unlikely to cause a long-term problem.

 

Hog i think i was trying to say pick up' an injury but to judge the likelihood of a recurring injury is the same thing in my book 

( pick up any faults with the knee that might cause problems )

that is what i was trying to say earlier in the week 

if you sign a player who has had a injury and long lay off of not playing greater risk 

then when they break down with a problem so early in training it is a concern 

sorry not great at putting things into words 

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58 minutes ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Been saying it for 3 years now.... we need 3 CDMs!    Signing Skipp stopped us getting in proper replacements and developing the likes of Sorensen, then left a huge void.... The Hayden loan signing is potentially making the same mistake (we may not get promoted and if we do won't have a back up) and now it seems we've signed a crock.    If the knee needs cleaning out, surely with the technology of scanning equipment now available, that would have been detectable! 

When will they ever learn!       

Well no, you need 2 players who out and out DMs plus a player who can fill in. 

In say a 25 man squad you can't have three players to cover all positions, you probably need 3 GKs, so that means 22 for the other 10 outfield positions. 

Would you be happy going into a season with only 2 strikers, or 4 CBs in order to accommodate that desire?

PLM, McLean, Hayden, Sara, Sorenson, Dowell, Cantwell plus one more (in my opinion that needs to be a DM) is enough to cover the three positions in midfield.

If you have 5 injured or suspended then there's literally nothing you can do about that as a club, it's just bad luck.

 

Edited by 1902
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I'm afraid we'll look back at this signing next June as one that could never get a run of games. Great player at this level granted, but too many red flags, I'd be terminating the loan today. 

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Of course its a risk when siging players with an injury history,  but to balance Jarvis /Byram it did also work out with Krul who was struggling after a long absence ,  and going back a bit further, with Pilkington.  

 

With a strong full season Byram could yet move out of the doomed category

 

Hopefully Hayden will be back in contention come early Sept,  which would hopefully mean missing just c7 of the 46 games - given his combative style he may miss more games through suspension!

 

 

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It seems to me Tettey was fitter and stronger than both Normann and Hayden despite having no knees. We're making hardwork of finding a replacement.

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5 hours ago, horsefly said:

What are your medical credentials for claiming that? The surgeon doing the "minor flushing out" had a very different take. For those claiming 6 weeks minimum because it's an op, may I refer you to RugbyCanary's post, and the fact that Dowell has just had an op and is expected to be in contention for the Hibs game. 

Looks like i am far from being the only one concerned albeit with no medical credentials but our track record in recent years for signing players virtually injured from day one is less than impressive if you take Byram and Jarvis as examples. Jarvis never got fit and Byram took 20 months.

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7 minutes ago, TIL 1010 said:

Looks like i am far from being the only one concerned albeit with no medical credentials but our track record in recent years for signing players virtually injured from day one is less than impressive if you take Byram and Jarvis as examples. Jarvis never got fit and Byram took 20 months.

Buendia was injured when we bought him and we very nearly didn't buy Grant Holt due to an injury concern.

 

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Shock news... Norwich city sign a sick note.

Teams must see us coming, as pointed out by another poster how was this not spotted in the medical. And he's had all summer to get this sorted.

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1 hour ago, Indy said:

Yes you certainly are pro club, that’s my point, those who have made those statements you picked out are generally against the current regime! But not that their comments aren’t valid as it’s certainly true we’ve signed a good player but one who is comming off a bad injury and serious op, so certainly a risk! But I’m of the opinion it’s a player once fully fit will improve our starting 11 If he can find full fitness and form, so a good signing on paper. If he is another Jarvis or Byram then we’re not going to see much of him!

But they aren’t valid.
 

We don’t know this will drag on all season,  we haven’t gambled and it hasn’t backfired, no one’s said he’s a saviour on here and we are very clearly not a pushover when we negotiate a purchase or sale with other clubs.

 

Which is my point. I’m not saying the club is always right, I don’t believe that, I’m calling bullsh1t on these sorts of pant wetting. Posters shouldn’t expect to post rubbish and not get called out, it’s being pro-truth, not pro-club.

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5 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

But they aren’t valid.
 

We don’t know this will drag on all season,  we haven’t gambled and it hasn’t backfired, no one’s said he’s a saviour on here and we are very clearly not a pushover when we negotiate a purchase or sale with other clubs.

 

Which is my point. I’m not saying the club is always right, I don’t believe that, I’m calling bullsh1t on these sorts of pant wetting. Posters shouldn’t expect to post rubbish and not get called out, it’s being pro-truth, not pro-club.

The same argument was made when we signed Jarvis! They were right then! I’m not defending their view as given more that the opinion is as valid as he may return to full fitness, he might not! Some work out others don’t, but he’s not our player and if he’s crocked permanently I hope we can ship him back to Newcastle without having to cover his wages.

Edited by Indy

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2 hours ago, norfolkngood said:

myself and others Pointed out that signing players that had been injured was a high risk 

Everyone knows it's high risk. But that's how we've got a player of his credentials at the club.  So let's try and be a bit positive than pointing fingers at our own medical team for somehow missing something which was already known?!

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19 minutes ago, Indy said:

The same argument was made when we signed Jarvis! They were right then! I’m not defending their view as given more that the opinion is as valid as he may return to full fitness, he might not! Some work out others don’t, but he’s not our player and if he’s crocked permanently I hope we can ship him back to Newcastle without having to cover his wages.

Nobody Knows like you said 

but to break down so early in Training is my biggest concern , i imagine he was light fitness no contact ,

the problem on the forum is some say he will never be right ( well that is a total unknown until he starts playing )

some are saying the Doctors and Medical team will know ( again until he has played some game that is also unknown )

Nobody can be sure 

i am sure many times Jarvis / Byram were told we got it right this time to breakdown again 

sometimes these things do not heal , sometimes they do but only time will tell 

 

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There seems to be an equal amount of pant wetting behind the scenes on here that Webber and/or Smith may have ****ed up again. 

None of us are experts and hopefully this is just a tidy up operation after the butcher at Newcastle hacked around with it. Worst case scenario is his knee is disintegrating.

Either way it would be reckless to go into this season without a backup ball winning defensive midfielder.

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1 minute ago, Google Bot said:

Everyone knows it's high risk. But that's how we've got a player of his credentials at the club.  So let's try and be a bit positive than pointing fingers at our own medical team for somehow missing something which was already known?!

i was slated for saying there was a high risk to this injury a couple of days ago before the latest injury

some board members were playing it down little risk saying trust the doctors etc 

so i think it is only fair i can say how these injuries are a total unknown or how they will heal as proved by this 

it was not blaming the staff or club doctors this is bad luck on hayden and the club as we need him and i want to watch the boy as he is good ! 

sometimes they heal sometimes they do not is all i was saying 

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