A Dean Smith Team

[YoussefSafriFromDistance 5]

I'm just wondering if anyone with more tactical knowledge than me knows how a typical Dean Smith team is set up? Or even what sort of players fit his system/philosophy?

I understand he wants more physicality and players with a winning/fighting mentality but so would any manager after watching last season. I know very little about his Brentford days, I could never really see a clear playing style from his Villa side and it felt like he was just trying to piece together anything to get a result last season with us.

Maybe I've been spoiled by Farkeball and the idea of having an established and obvious philosophy?

 

[lake district canary 4,531]

It's less the tactical changes and more the philosophy imo. The football Farke wanted to play was geared to the highest of ideals. Togetherness, humility, gratefulness, respect, even love. Like I say, high ideals, which allied to the total football he wanted, dominating posession and quick passing in attack was a powerful mix, at least at championship level.  

Some of that philosophy will not be aired so overtly as when Farke was here - he constantly referred to those ideals in interviews and when talking about our football.  We have replaced it with more pragmatic English approach . A simpler, more physical and direct kind of football - nothing wrong with that as long as it gets us promoted again, but it will be different. Smith had an attractive team at Brentford, how much of that was down to him is open to question, but the main criteria is getting results.

I say "English" because that is what it is.....I prefer the continental coaches - the good ones definitely bring something extra in to our game that English coaches don't quite get. Heck, even Scottish coaches generally have something extra that they bring to our game than English ones.

[Duncan Edwards 2,231]

4-4-2.

Big man/little man up top, two quick wingers and two runners in the middle. No nonsense centre halves, full backs that like a tackle and a psychopath in the nets.

Get it to the byline and get crosses in. 👍

[komakino 272]

Certainly has to be a more physical approach as we are too easy to play against. 

Smith needs to find a system/s that work not only at Championship level, but in the EPL too as Farkeball needed personnel that the club were never going to afford to play his Champagne football in a successful way. 

Dean needs time and Farke was given a lot of time before things started to gel. The club might give him that, but not so sure about us fans....

[king canary 7,603]

From my knowledge he likes to play attacking football, press high and work quickly on the counter. The concerns some seem to have about long ball football is generally unfounded but he's also not likely going to want his team to **** about at the back so much. His teams will work hard, try and win the ball high up the pitch and catch opponents out when they turn the ball over. His big challenge is going to be how much he adapts to Pukki. He usually wants a forward who can hold the ball up and bring others into the game which will help Idah and maybe Sargent but he'll either have to play two up top and sacrifice some midfield solidity, drop Pukki deeper or ask Idah to play wider to accommodate Teemu + someone more fitting his usual type of forward. 

[king canary 7,603]

27 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

It's less the tactical changes and more the philosophy imo. The football Farke wanted to play was geared to the highest of ideals. Togetherness, humility, gratefulness, respect, even love. Like I say, high ideals, which allied to the total football he wanted, dominating posession and quick passing in attack was a powerful mix, at least at championship level.  

Some of that philosophy will not be aired so overtly as when Farke was here - he constantly referred to those ideals in interviews and when talking about our football.  We have replaced it with more pragmatic English approach . A simpler, more physical and direct kind of football - nothing wrong with that as long as it gets us promoted again, but it will be different. Smith had an attractive team at Brentford, how much of that was down to him is open to question, but the main criteria is getting results.

I say "English" because that is what it is.....I prefer the continental coaches - the good ones definitely bring something extra in to our game that English coaches don't quite get. Heck, even Scottish coaches generally have something extra that they bring to our game than English ones.

 

[Google Bot 3,273]

I see him as a pragmatist, so it's hard to call what his plan will be - obviously depends on playing staff, and who we're up against.

At Villa he had the likes of Grealish who grew into a player who was able to make up the gaps, as Emi was for us. 

Whereas Farke had a possession fetish, Smith seems to be more willing to take a chance with the mindset that you can press and win it back. I don't think we'll have such a fear of losing the ball, and if the opportunity presents itself I think he'll turn the screw rather than the very patient approach Farke had.

Man management and progressing players will be his key objectives, I honestly don't know if he has any ambitions in creating an identifiable play style other than developing an ethic of us pressing as a unit, utilising hardworking more athletic types.  Keep it simple and let the cream rise.(?)

[king canary 7,603]

45 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

I see him as a pragmatist, so it's hard to call what his plan will be - obviously depends on playing staff, and who we're up against.

At Villa he had the likes of Grealish who grew into a player who was able to make up the gaps, as Emi was for us. 

Whereas Farke had a possession fetish, Smith seems to be more willing to take a chance with the mindset that you can press and win it back. I don't think we'll have such a fear of losing the ball, and if the opportunity presents itself I think he'll turn the screw rather than the very patient approach Farke had.

Man management and progressing players will be his key objectives, I honestly don't know if he has any ambitions in creating an identifiable play style other than developing an ethic of us pressing as a unit, utilising hardworking more athletic types.  Keep it simple and let the cream rise.(?)

Personally I'm looking forward to watching a team be a bit more proactive in winning the ball back and getting on the front foot. Some of the build up under Farke was beautiful but if it wasn't working it could be pretty painful. 

[TheBaldOne66 682]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

It's less the tactical changes and more the philosophy imo. The football Farke wanted to play was geared to the highest of ideals. Togetherness, humility, gratefulness, respect, even love. Like I say, high ideals, which allied to the total football he wanted, dominating posession and quick passing in attack was a powerful mix, at least at championship level.  

Some of that philosophy will not be aired so overtly as when Farke was here - he constantly referred to those ideals in interviews and when talking about our football.  We have replaced it with more pragmatic English approach . A simpler, more physical and direct kind of football - nothing wrong with that as long as it gets us promoted again, but it will be different. Smith had an attractive team at Brentford, how much of that was down to him is open to question, but the main criteria is getting results.

I say "English" because that is what it is.....I prefer the continental coaches - the good ones definitely bring something extra in to our game that English coaches don't quite get. Heck, even Scottish coaches generally have something extra that they bring to our game than English ones.

God, you spout some garbage sometimes! If you love continental coaches that much, especially Farke, why not go and support MG? 

[The Great Mass Debater 1,084]

 

[lake district canary 4,531]

6 minutes ago, TheBaldOne66 said:

God, you spout some garbage sometimes! If you love continental coaches that much, especially Farke, why not go and support MG? 

I'll be following them with interest - if he gets them playing, we could be looking at next year's Bundesliga winners, champions league winners the following season. His achievements at Norwich were limited only by the quality of player we could afford and he will prove it in the mext couple of years.

[Nuff Said 5,120]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

It's less the tactical changes and more the philosophy imo. The football Farke wanted to play was geared to the highest of ideals. Togetherness, humility, gratefulness, respect, even love. Like I say, high ideals, which allied to the total football he wanted, dominating posession and quick passing in attack was a powerful mix, at least at championship level.  

 

[Inch High aka Inchy.. 405]

He likes an old fashioned style team, strong, runners on the wings and beefy defence. Problem is that football is more skilful than strong these days and the old fashioned teams tend to be mediocre as opposed to league winning. Expect a 5th or 6th place(if we're really lucky) rather than 1st/2nd. 

Personally I feel with Smith in charge we'll get around 8th/9th.

[lake district canary 4,531]

We failed because the players weren't good enough. Simples.

6 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

 

We failed in the PL because the players weren't good enough.

[king canary 7,603]

18 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

We failed because the players weren't good enough. Simples.

We failed in the PL because the players weren't good enough.

Were the new players not filled with enough unity, humility and love?

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

It's less the tactical changes and more the philosophy imo. The football Farke wanted to play was geared to the highest of ideals. Togetherness, humility, gratefulness, respect, even love.

Christ on a bike Lakey; this is just getting super weird now.

He was just a football coach - not bl00dy Gandhi.

OTBC

Edited June 10, 2022 by Disco Dales Jockstrap

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

9 minutes ago, king canary said:

Were the new players not filled with enough unity, humility and love?

How Daniel Farke looks to everyone apart from Lakey:

How Daniel Farke looks just to Lakey:

OTBC

[hogesar 9,657]

57 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

I'll be following them with interest - if he gets them playing, we could be looking at next year's Bundesliga winners, champions league winners the following season. His achievements at Norwich were limited only by the quality of player we could afford and he will prove it in the mext couple of years.

Farke's a good manager but you have spouted a lot of rubbish in this thread. This is up there.

[king canary 7,603]

26 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Christ on a bike Lakey; this is just getting super weird now.

He was just a football coach - not bl00dy Gandhi.

OTBC

If Lakey wasn't clearly at least in his 60's I'd suggest he's projecting some weird Daddy issues onto Farke. Not only is he bestest football manager ever he's also the bestest person.

[Robert N. LiM 4,330]

I think that some people are confusing Dean Smith's lack of dress sense and his bluff manner with his tactics. Haven't seen anything to suggest he's some English coaching dinosaur. He's certainly more pragmatic than Farke, but we saw the limitations of Farke's idealism at the highest level. 

It's going to be very difficult, but I hope Smith can develop a style that's more suited to the Prem while we're in the Championship. If that takes both of the parachute-payment years, so be it. I love Daniel almost as much as LDC does, but had he stayed, and had we won a third consecutive Championship trophy playing Totaal-Farkeball, there would still be all the questions about our PL prospects. 

We need to try something different.

Edited June 10, 2022 by Robert N. LiM
clarifying that I love DF, not LDC

[Robert N. LiM 4,330]

35 minutes ago, king canary said:

at least in his 60's

Don't think there's any statute of limitations on Freudian issues.

[lake district canary 4,531]

 

1 hour ago, hogesar said:

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

I'll be following them with interest - if he gets them playing, we could be looking at next year's Bundesliga winners, champions league winners the following season. His achievements at Norwich were limited only by the quality of player we could afford and he will prove it in the mext couple of years.

Farke's a good manager but you have spouted a lot of rubbish in this thread. This is up there.

Why is it rubbish?  B MG were top of the table for some weeks last season, so why should they not win that?  If they did, why would they not be likely to do well in the following season's Champion's League? 

[Monty13 2,231]

2 hours ago, lake district canary said:

I'll be following them with interest - if he gets them playing, we could be looking at next year's Bundesliga winners, champions league winners the following season. His achievements at Norwich were limited only by the quality of player we could afford and he will prove it in the mext couple of years.

They finished 32 points behind Bayern, so I doubt it. 

I think you are wrong on the second point personally, it wasn’t the only reason.

[king canary 7,603]

23 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

 

Why is it rubbish?  B MG were top of the table for some weeks last season, so why should they not win that?  If they did, why would they not be likely to do well in the following season's Champion's League? 

No they weren't. 

[lake district canary 4,531]

21 minutes ago, king canary said:

45 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

 

Why is it rubbish?  B MG were top of the table for some weeks last season, so why should they not win that?  If they did, why would they not be likely to do well in the following season's Champion's League? 

No they weren't

My bad, they were top for a while in 19/20.  Also qualified for Champions League that season. 

[Nuff Said 5,120]

You get a lot of unjustified stick Lakey, but you’re really not doing yourself any favours on this thread. 

[Chichcan 148]

Smith normally plays with a 433 or 4231 and likes his teams to press high 

He's definitely not an old school British type manager

Here's a description of his Villa team and his tactical approach 

https://www.footballcoin.io/blog/aston-villa-2020-2021/

[TheGunnShow 5,938]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

 

Why is it rubbish?  B MG were top of the table for some weeks last season, so why should they not win that?  If they did, why would they not be likely to do well in the following season's Champion's League? 

Champions League would be egging the pudding considering the amount of talent sloshing around, even with weaker versions of Barcelona etc. Not to mention Bayern are still pretty damned dominant in Germany.

Sure, get into the Champions League and you'd expect a German side to be competitive at that level, but for it to be enough to do well, I dunno. 

The Europa Conference League looks like the kind of tourney a Mönchengladbach could win if they have a stronger spell. Worked for Roma this year. Worked for Knutsen to some extent as well, as it made him more visible across Europe.

Edited June 10, 2022 by TheGunnShow

[hogesar 9,657]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

My bad, they were top for a while in 19/20.  Also qualified for Champions League that season. 

Because you claimed Farkes only limitations were quality of player.

Well quality of player is still going to likely be an issue when winning the Bundesliga, and comparatively us staying up in the prem with our squad is a more likely achievement than BM winning the champions league in terms of quality of player difference. 

 

[vlad666 203]

I’m hoping smith will surprise us next season with attacking high pressing football. I think this season they identified how weak our midfield was and thought our best bet was to go direct and bypass it.

A managers “style” is dictated by the players he has at his disposal. A few new players and hopefully a more pleasing on the eye approach.