EXCLUSIVE: US tycoons in Norwich City investment talks

[hogesar 9,618]

4 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

Maybe thats right, maybe its not. We will never know. I don't think we're such a rank awful investment as you tend to suggest. On the face of it we look as good a bet as virtually any other English football team and better than 95% of them.

Again, you're failing to see the grey or have any doubts that Delia's motives are anything but pure.

I honestly think Delia has been good for Norwich but Norwich has been incredible for Delia. Its been the most amazing investment beyond anything she could have ever dreamed of. Maybe I'm just a cynic but I don't think Delia's motives have always been whiter than white and have been very much financial at times, equally she has done a great job 80% of the time as an owner and we could have done WAY worse. What i would say is both the Delia outers and the Delia lovers both have points which are valid.

If Delia had financial motives and we were such a good purchase prospect as you state then she could have happily sold the club say, when Lambert had us in the prem and walked away with £100 million or whatever. So that doesn't hold water.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,510]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-61617418

The BBC's take: we may be abandoning the self-funding approach in favour of the 'more traditional' approach of a wealthy sugar daddy. 

[hogesar 9,618]

What we've also seen is how quickly fans take to a media story relating to investment.

Further proving the point that all any potential billionaire owner had to do was tell the media they were interested and the board would suddenly be under pressure.

The counter argument was that no one would bother because the club isn't "up for sale"

But then these guys are potentially interested. So even that doesn't hold water.

[Worthy Nigelton 1,037]

5 minutes ago, hogesar said:

If Delia had financial motives and we were such a good purchase prospect as you state then she could have happily sold the club say, when Lambert had us in the prem and walked away with £100 million or whatever. So that doesn't hold water.

That's like saying someone who holds bitcoin would have sold it in April 2021 if they really believed in bitcoin and not held on until now. Nobody knows the right time to sell.

[hogesar 9,618]

37 minutes ago, Worthy Nigelton said:

That's like saying someone who holds bitcoin would have sold it in April 2021 if they really believed in bitcoin and not held on until now. Nobody knows the right time to sell.

The point is she could have sold at literally any time, even in League One, and significantly financially benefited far more than she has done.

[essex canary 491]

7 hours ago, PurpleCanary said:

 

The American investors could buy enough new ordinary shares (say around 20,000) at a very high price to give themselves a 29.8 per cent holding. That puts money into the club and just about keeps S&J as majority owners without triggering the 30 per cent rule that would mean they would have to offer to buy out the other 70 per cent, and at that very high price. Still unlikely, not least because that price might be a problem if they went to 30 per cent.

 

 

Not sure about the maths here. The Club currently has 617,000 ordinary shares issued so how does the acquisition of 20,000 shares equate to just under 30%? More like just over 3%.

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

52 minutes ago, king canary said:

What we will likely never know is has this season changed their thinking? I do think DS & MWJ genuinely believed they fight against the tide and make the team competitive at the top level despite budgetary restrictions. With how this season has gone, have they maybe decided that actually isn't possible? 

I have reason to believe they were seeking outside investment before this latest season, which suggests they already knew they could not go on swimming against the tide, but this miserable season  may have concentrated their minds.

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

1 minute ago, essex canary said:

Not sure about the maths here. The Club currently has 617,000 ordinary shares issued so how does the acquisition of 20,000 shares equate to just under 30%? More like just over 3%.

Hmmm. Doesn’t look quite right, does it. I will have my staff in tomorrow to see if I missed out a zero…

[king canary 7,580]

11 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Hmmm. Doesn’t look quite right, does it. I will have my staff in tomorrow to see if I missed out a zero…

Probably forgot to carry the one.

[Icecream Snow 761]

14 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

Hmmm. Doesn’t look quite right, does it. I will have my staff in tomorrow to see if I missed out a zero…

Seems harsh to make your staff work on Sunday just for this 😛

[Icecream Snow 761]

I'm wondering if the proposed FFP changes, with only 70% of revenue being allowed on wages and transfers by 2025 has had any bearing on the American interest. The changes would certainly make it easier to make a profit out of a football club.

[Attleborough_Canary 65]

1 hour ago, littleyellowbirdie said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-61617418

The BBC's take: we may be abandoning the self-funding approach in favour of the 'more traditional' approach of a wealthy sugar daddy. 

No, it's Rob Butler speculating with absolutely no idea whatsoever of anyone's intentions 

[shefcanary 2,388]

1 hour ago, essex canary said:

Not sure about the maths here. The Club currently has 617,000 ordinary shares issued so how does the acquisition of 20,000 shares equate to just under 30%? More like just over 3%.

The 20,000 is about the maximum a new investor could take up but still leave Delia & Micheal with a majority share.  30% for the investor is a completely different scenario, it has to remove majority status from Smith & Jones.  The math on this is simple.

[essex canary 491]

2 hours ago, shefcanary said:

The 20,000 is about the maximum a new investor could take up but still leave Delia & Micheal with a majority share.  30% for the investor is a completely different scenario, it has to remove majority status from Smith & Jones.  The math on this is simple.

Indeed but why would we be very excited about somebody buying 20,000 shares.

[Mat McGoo 0]

Please be a full buy out PLEASE,  change and a bit of "hambishun" well over due 

[hertfordyellow 460]

9 hours ago, Drinkellsrightfoot said:

A lot has been said about this 23 billion capital fund, there is no indication that part of his business life is involved in this deal as the other owners aren’t mentioned to be involved towards NCFC.

as for the Stowmarket 2 doing their due diligence, let’s be honest the last eighteen months worth of business decisions haven’t been great, what makes you think this is going to be any better? When Burnley took their investment I’m sure they had belief everything was hunky dory after their due diligence, why are we immune from it going sour the same as Burnley.

Bare facts are, if they will be investing money to take control of the club is one thing, if they are investing in the club but not for control then the only motive is to make a profit on their investment (I.e. take money out the club) whatever league we are in and if we had made the money or not. These are business men who probably didn’t even know where Norwich was on a map before this deal.

This is it. To be honest, plenty of people knew the Burnley deal was bad when it was signed. I’m not saying not to investigate into it, but the fans must go into it with open eyes and if MWJ and DS turn down the deal, there might be good reasons not that they want to cling on to the club.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,510]

On 27/05/2022 at 17:53, HazzaJet said:

Maybe Delia has now given up on her dream of achieving PL survival as a self funded club, to try and prove breaking the bank isn’t always the solution for PL survival. I don’t like to say it but in actual fact I’m horribly nervous about this going ahead, as although my heart says we might become an established PL team, my head says we’ll be in huge debt they’ll be just like the Glazers, which I don’t want 

If new shares are created and he buys those shares, then it's still a self-funded club, just with more capital to play with regarding building a squad to contend in the Premier League. 

I saw a figure somewhere that puts the total value of Norwich, accounting for assets and liabilities, at about £150 million, so that would be the ballpark figure he'll be investing if he's going for a majority shareholding and for all other investors to be present as a minority. 

Edited May 29, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[benchwarmer 624]

On 27/05/2022 at 20:43, HazzaJet said:

There’s an article about this on the ITV website - apparently the club has said that any investment would not lead to a change in status of Delia and Michael as joint majority shareholders https://www.itv.com/news/anglia/2022-05-27/american-millionaire-visits-norwich-city-to-weigh-up-investment

No one in their right mind would put in significant investment on those terms. They want their cake and eat it.  My suspicion grows that our media-savvy owners are manipulating the local press yet again.  This thread was started by Pete Raven of Archant.  They know exactly what they're doing but sadly most fans don't, or don't want to.

Edited May 29, 2022 by benchwarmer

[hogesar 9,618]

Just now, benchwarmer said:

No one in their right mind would put in significant investment on those terms. They want their cake and eat it.  My suspicion grows that our media-savvy owners are manipulating the local press yet again.  

[Trevor Hockey's Beard 526]

I have some belief in Delia and MWJ trying to do their best for the club, while at the same time taking their position into consideration.

I doubt that they will agree to something which might harm the club - unlike the situation at Burnley. At least we've already had our relegation before they invest.

[Monty13 2,229]

8 hours ago, shefcanary said:

The 20,000 is about the maximum a new investor could take up but still leave Delia & Micheal with a majority share.  30% for the investor is a completely different scenario, it has to remove majority status from Smith & Jones.  The math on this is simple.

Everyone seems convinced D&M need to remain majority shareholders post any investment, maybe that isn’t the case and they are happy to be a large shareholder in a more fractured ownership holding.

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

11 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

Everyone seems convinced D&M need to remain majority shareholders post any investment, maybe that isn’t the case and they are happy to be a large shareholder in a more fractured ownership holding.

It is that the club has supposedly said that is what will happen. So far we have heard only two things - that S&J would remain as majority shareholders and that the investors would buy shares. The problem being that on the face of it those two things are contradictory! But there may be an explanation...

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

15 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

Everyone seems convinced D&M need to remain majority shareholders post any investment, maybe that isn’t the case and they are happy to be a large shareholder in a more fractured ownership holding.

I wonder whether it'll be a phased exit for Delia and MWJ. This season they invest to become shareholders. On promotion, they buy out the club or they increase their holding on a yearly basis until they buy out Delia and MWJ altogether.

Absolute pie in the sky speculation of course, guess we wait and see.

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

33 minutes ago, benchwarmer said:

No one in their right mind would put in significant investment on those terms. They want their cake and eat it.  My suspicion grows that our media-savvy owners are manipulating the local press yet again.  This thread was started by Pete Raven of Archant.  They know exactly what they're doing but sadly most fans don't, or don't want to.

Pete Raven manipulating from the shadows like .... 

Edited May 29, 2022 by Terminally Yellow

[Grando 260]

Well, D&M certainly picked a wonderful match to showcase the Carrow Road experience. If that didn’t put the Americans off then perhaps nothing will…

[essex canary 491]

19 minutes ago, PurpleCanary said:

It is that the club has supposedly said that is what will happen. So far we have heard only two things - that S&J would remain as majority shareholders and that the investors would buy shares. The problem being that on the face of it those two things are contradictory! But there may be an explanation...

If the Milwaukee investors wanted to put £100 million into the Club, a clear way forward would be to buy the £1million shares authorised at last AGM at £100 per share.

The issue would then be what happens to the 617,000 existing shares? One factor that needs to be built in would be Chapter 8 of the Government's Fan Led Review and the Golden Share concept. Is there any value of fans holding shares on an individual basis beyond that? Tom may want some money so may others?

S&J could put themselves in the driving seat in resolving this for themselves and other minority shareholders and build on the Clubs current Trust arrangements. In this way they would be able to create a legacy for the Club going forward and perhaps a template for other Clubs too. Perhaps Delia could then write a book about the 25 years and it's conclusion. I would be happy to buy a copy because it would tell a story of a great roller coaster ride with a very positive conclusion.

 

 

 

Edited May 29, 2022 by essex canary

[Monty13 2,229]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

It is that the club has supposedly said that is what will happen. So far we have heard only two things - that S&J would remain as majority shareholders and that the investors would buy shares. The problem being that on the face of it those two things are contradictory! But there may be an explanation...

I didn’t think the club had said anything? A lot of the noises from the apparent in the knows seem muddled and contradictory 

[Badger 2,405]

11 hours ago, Icecream Snow said:

I'm wondering if the proposed FFP changes, with only 70% of revenue being allowed on wages and transfers by 2025 has had any bearing on the American interest. The changes would certainly make it easier to make a profit out of a football club.

It certainly would be a game changer. It ha not gone through yet, but almost certainly will so it could be a good time to "get in early." I'm still not quite sure why it's City though?

The likes of Sunderland have shares available, who sorry 😳, probably represent a better investment with a much bigger upside and if the changes go through a bigger annual return.

[Cowboy 197]

6 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

I didn’t think the club had said anything? A lot of the noises from the apparent in the knows seem muddled and contradictory 

'Muddled and contradictory' noises are not the sole purview of the club then? 😛

[Badger 2,405]

1 hour ago, PurpleCanary said:

It is that the club has supposedly said that is what will happen. So far we have heard only two things - that S&J would remain as majority shareholders and that the investors would buy shares. The problem being that on the face of it those two things are contradictory! But there may be an explanation...

It could be that they are buying Foulger's shares + some new ones? 🤷‍♂️