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Tzolis should start

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Tzolis needs game time to recover form and confidence. There is no reason not to play him to season end just to give him much needed minutes. How else will he develop to help us recoup the fee? 

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It's all about next season for Tzolis. I'm not sure being in a team getting hammered by Leicester and Spurs will be much of a confidence boost. 

Tell him to get fit and ready over the summer, ready to smash it in pre-season. Hopefully he can hit the ground running and rediscover performances like we saw vs Bournemouth. 

It's certainly not over for Tzolis. He's one who may well pay dividends.

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Just now, Yellow and Green said:

It's all about next season for Tzolis. I'm not sure being in a team getting hammered by Leicester and Spurs will be much of a confidence boost. 

Tell him to get fit and ready over the summer, ready to smash it in pre-season. Hopefully he can hit the ground running and rediscover performances like we saw vs Bournemouth. 

It's certainly not over for Tzolis. He's one who may well pay dividends.

Exactly that. You gain confidence by good performances, and they're more likely to come against weaker sides when you're fully fit. Get a full pre-season in, and this applies to the whole team when it comes to Smith's methods, and work from there.

But FFS, no loan signings on clauses where the loan fee depends on the appearances made.

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I'm not sure he should start just because he needs game time. If Rowe and Springett are showing more in training, there's no way the manager should be playing Tzolis ahead simply because of the fee we paid for him. It goes completely against our development of youth and is a slap in the face to those performing in the youth setup.

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The fully fit bit gets me, so we signed a player for a lot of money by our standards and he now needs the summer to get fit. Yes he may have had a couple of knocks throughout the season but nothing major that I can recall? To me he just appears to be not in the best shape physically, don’t know if it’s diet, discipline or commitment to training? Just a tad frustrating. I do agree nothing to be gained by playing him in the last three games which all have the potential for heavy defeats.

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Tzolis is one of our youth prospects though. He needs at least a run out in the next couple of games or he’s going to be rusty going into next season.

No excuses come August for him really, playing at a level below he was employed to play at with a full season of adapting and a full preseason behind him.

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4 minutes ago, Channon’s Windmill said:

The fully fit bit gets me, so we signed a player for a lot of money by our standards and he now needs the summer to get fit. Yes he may have had a couple of knocks throughout the season but nothing major that I can recall? To me he just appears to be not in the best shape physically, don’t know if it’s diet, discipline or commitment to training? Just a tad frustrating. I do agree nothing to be gained by playing him in the last three games which all have the potential for heavy defeats.

Difference between match fitness and just being physically fit. Can only get match fit/match sharp by playing games, but if his confidence is shot putting him in potential no-win situations with a relegated side against strong opposition then it is not going to help matters.

As @hogesar said, if others are training better at the moment, then they should get the gig, but pre-season is all about starting afresh.

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The fee is irrelevant. He’s played both Rowe and Springett before him. This tells me he’s either really bad in training or he’s unhappy here and wants to leave. Think he’ll be off in summer. 

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100% 

He needs to be put into competitive football, doesn't matter who's doing what in training - Grant Holt was one of the worst performers in training.

Tzolis will only take confidence playing and we need to see what he can do with a run of games at this level.  Being sat on the bench of a losing team is far worse than being able to go out there and make a difference.  Most likely demoralised and feeling useless, I would be.

People should be contemplating what he could bring something to the team instead of being so defeatist?  Chin up lads - remember the minutes we've given Cantwell & Sargent this season.

 

Edited by Google Bot
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1 hour ago, Mello Yello said:

Who is this Tzolis person you talk of?....

He's the one we reportedly paid £10m for but 2 teenagers from the youth set up are now ahead of him, just about sums our recruitment up! Lol

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Smith doesn't want to finish bottom. He'll play our strongest team possible so I would imagine the same starting line-up as Sunday with possibly Giannoulis for Williams. An outside chance Gunn may get a run out.

Edited by Capt. Pants
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1 minute ago, Capt. Pants said:

An outside chance Gunn way get a run out.

Good shout that actually, if Gibbo was dropped for Byram then the same should apply to Krul as there's been some howlers and a proper like for like change.

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1 minute ago, Google Bot said:

Good shout that actually, if Gibbo was dropped for Byram then the same should apply to Krul as there's been some howlers and a proper like for like change.

I Agree play Gunn and Tzolis 

they need Experience / Game time the boys should want to play on the biggest stage in the world 

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...his engine and drive far away from Carrow Road if he knows what's good for him?

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17 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Pukki and Idah up top with Tzolis/Rowe and Sargent on the wings behind them? What do we think?

In my mind Tzolis needs to be central, he may do well at Championship level wide but we need to establish pace in those positions to cause problems beyond that.  We're lacking athleticism and drive - Sargent could be the man, but he lacks football IQ and many times turns back.

It's hard to judge Tzolis on his actual performances as we've seen very little, but he just looks lost out wide to me, certainly at this level.

Stocky lad, as he matures will become very hard to take the ball off and has great control/first touch.  If he shows vision and ability to feed a killer ball, and reasonable finisher himself then we have a winner on our hands.  I'm thinking he's more of a Wayne Rooney type of player, but not necessarily a false 9 - more behind a striker like Pukki.

I'm finding it hard to see how he gets into the team at this point, which is why these remaining games are a free look to see what he can offer.  If he's as good as the Greeks say then you have to seriously consider building the system around him, he's not a player you can just throw out wide (imo).

I feel that we've become so devoid of character, I don't know who else we can build around if I'm honest. So take these free competitive games at the top level, money can't buy you that experience.  Finishing above Watford is a nothing objective, bouncing back should be number one priority.

Edited by Google Bot

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Hope he stays and comes good but I can’t see any benefit to playing him in these last three games given how poor we are and how shot of confidence he already looks personally. Rather give the kids buzzing from the 23s more of a taste.

Edited by Monty13

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1 hour ago, Yellow and Green said:

It's all about next season for Tzolis. I'm not sure being in a team getting hammered by Leicester and Spurs will be much of a confidence boost.

Exactly this IMO.

Remains to be seen if he has the potential that Webber presumably saw in him but starting next season well is his best (and probably only as far as NCFC is concerned) chance to prove he has what it takes.

 

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There's every chance we will be looking to move him on in the summer. I'm not sure why some believe he suddenly going to be brilliant in the championship.  His card may already be marked. 

 

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It is important to us to finish 19th due to the extra millions it brings to the club, an extra £5 million or so helps towards getting who Smith wants to bring in, so definitely no major changes from me.

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55 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

In my mind Tzolis needs to be central, he may do well at Championship level wide but we need to establish pace in those positions to cause problems beyond that.  We're lacking athleticism and drive - Sargent could be the man, but he lacks football IQ and many times turns back.

It's hard to judge Tzolis on his actual performances as we've seen very little, but he just looks lost out wide to me, certainly at this level.

Stocky lad, as he matures will become very hard to take the ball off and has great control/first touch.  If he shows vision and ability to feed a killer ball, and reasonable finisher himself then we have a winner on our hands.  I'm thinking he's more of a Wayne Rooney type of player, but not necessarily a false 9 - more behind a striker like Pukki.

I'm finding it hard to see how he gets into the team at this point, which is why these remaining games are a free look to see what he can offer.  If he's as good as the Greeks say then you have to seriously consider building the system around him, he's not a player you can just throw out wide (imo).

I feel that we've become so devoid of character, I don't know who else we can build around if I'm honest. So take these free competitive games at the top level, money can't buy you that experience.  Finishing above Watford is a nothing objective, bouncing back should be number one priority.

How about building the team around two young players who we know can perform and hopefully will have long and very successful careers at the club, Andrew Omobamidele and Adam Idah.

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19 minutes ago, Yellow Wal said:

How about building the team around two young players who we know can perform and hopefully will have long and very successful careers at the club, Andrew Omobamidele and Adam Idah.

Well, you don't need to build around AO as he fits in at CB whatever we play, and Idah seems to be best in a support role to me?

I think of 'building' around someone who can drive the game but to utilise them at their best may mean concessions elsewhere.  Players such as Hoolahan & Huckerby spring to mind, those who pull the strings.   (i.e. defines the character of the team).

If we built with Idah as sole striker then there's a massive concession in that we relegate Pukki to the bench - and most likely would have to let him go.  I just don't think he's prolific in front of goal based on club and country performances to logically stick our necks out like that when we already have a proven scorer.

What we do need to establish is that midfield and general distribution.

Edited by Google Bot

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There isn't always sense to this logic these days, but Rowe seems to be the featured player in the pre-match club media interview this week. Generally I would say that's an indicator they'll be involved, so wouldn't be surprised to seem him get the nod tonight 

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8 minutes ago, Google Bot said:

Well, you don't need to build around AO as he fits in at CB whatever we play, and Idah seems to be best in a support role to me?

I think of 'building' around someone who can drive the game but to utilise them at their best may mean concessions elsewhere.  Players such as Hoolahan & Huckerby spring to mind, those who pull the strings.   (i.e. defines the character of the team).

If we built with Idah as sole striker then there's a massive concession in that we relegate Pukki to the bench - and most likely would have to let him go.  I just don't think he's prolific in front of goal based on club and country performances to logically stick our necks out like that when we already have a proven scorer.

What we do need to establish is that midfield and general distribution.

In the last few matches Adam played before his injury he was playing with Teemu. The massive difference being that he was the focal point and Teemu worked off him, I felt this worked very well and that he was most suited to this role. Teemu was able to link in well with our poor midfield and that gave me a lot of hope for next season especially if that midfield could be improved. I certainly would not expect to see him playing as a sole striker, especially as this isn't when he looks his best.

I am afraid you have far more hope of Tzolis becoming a good player than I do. A Huckerby or a Hoolahan he certainly isn't and I would be exceptionally surprised if he ever became as good.

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1 hour ago, Yellow Wal said:

I am afraid you have far more hope of Tzolis becoming a good player than I do. A Huckerby or a Hoolahan he certainly isn't and I would be exceptionally surprised if he ever became as good.

His touch is class, he's natural with the ball, great feel for the weight of the ball, low centre of gravity, high in confidence and looks very solid already. 

If he plays regular for us next season I have no doubts we'll be talking about 20m+ price tag on his head at the end of the season.  There's a reason clubs like PSV were interested and why there's so much love in his home country.  2 Champs League Qualifier goals vs Besiktas, 3 in Europa League (PSV scored and assist in both legs).

He's only just turned 20, Buendia is 25 - I think in those 5 years he could be at least as good personally. We've done **** all to advance his career to this point, and it's sad.  Anyone can see he needs to be involved with the ball at his feet to shine.

Edited by Google Bot
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2 hours ago, kinggoblin said:

It is important to us to finish 19th due to the extra millions it brings to the club, an extra £5 million or so helps towards getting who Smith wants to bring in, so definitely no major changes from me.

Why do you say 5m? I've read that it's worth 2m. Which is correct?

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24 minutes ago, canarybubbles said:

Why do you say 5m? I've read that it's worth 2m. Which is correct?

The club that finishes bottom in the Premier League this season, either Norwich City or Watford, will receive just £2m in merit payments. From there, every position you climb is worth an extra £2m. So 19th place will receive £4m, 10th place will receive £22m and the champions will receive £40m.

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Just now, Terminally Yellow said:

No one should be a guaranteed start for any reason. If he has trained well, he should be given a go. If not, he shouldn't. 

So 28 minutes of football since Mid January sits ok with you? :-

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It's an absolute joke when you look at the lack of creativity we've displayed, amazed his head has gone completely.   It's the job of the head coach to keep these players motivated and encourage them to train well.

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