Bassong interview

[Monty13 2,234]

5 minutes ago, Badger said:

Again, I don't disagree in principle .. but context is important. A direct challenge at your first team meeting in the notoriously "macho" atmosphere with millionaire football players who feel they are more important than you, the club etc. I don't think managing a group of football players in a short-term relegation battle is a similar context to an office environment where you have time to build relationships etc.

Badger, thought I was being pretty clear, I agree what he did in the dressing room if true was unprofessional and rash. I’m not talking about this incident other than to agree and then to say in this context that Adam’s perhaps held a grudge or couldn’t make their relationship work as he was shipped out in the close season.

My point was regardless of this incident and the fall out with Adam’s he came back and played for 18 months under Neil in a promotion and harder fought relegation than the last two.

The handshake and dinner stuff, regardless of any incident years before when Bassong was in the wrong (which I don’t see any reason for a connection personally), if true are petty and pretty inexcusable treatment of a player in my opinion.

[LaUnionCanary 86]

3 hours ago, Danke bitte said:

I’m inclined to take this with a pinch of salt. Kind of feels like everyone wants a pound of flesh from Webber right now and wheeling out Bassong to stick his boot in after nearly 5 years where he’s had the opportunity to raise his voice about how he was treated in that period seems a little trite. 

Bassong himself is rumoured to have once said to Neil Adams “who are you??” when he took charge post Chris Hughton as well as coming across a little bitter in this article / podcast. Let it go mate, it was then. 

 

I believe from memory it was "are we supposed to know who you are?" . 

[Badger 2,405]

47 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

Badger, thought I was being pretty clear, I agree what he did in the dressing room if true was unprofessional and rash. I’m not talking about this incident other than to agree and then to say in this context that Adam’s perhaps held a grudge or couldn’t make their relationship work as he was shipped out in the close season.

My point was regardless of this incident and the fall out with Adam’s he came back and played for 18 months under Neil in a promotion and harder fought relegation than the last two.

The handshake and dinner stuff, regardless of any incident years before when Bassong was in the wrong (which I don’t see any reason for a connection personally), if true are petty and pretty inexcusable treatment of a player in my opinion.

Sorry Monty. I was probably splitting hairs - I don't think that there is much difference between us on this - if any.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

i See him around Norfolk now and then strange how he was not offered a contract by another club when he was released 

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

1 hour ago, Monty13 said:

Not saying there is one at all, rash, impetuous and unprofessional. A highly charged environment isn’t an excuse.

My point was people in leadership are meant to be the bigger ones, to deal with the situation in a professional way. Adam’s seems to have dealt with it by removing him in his first full season in charge, maybe the right call, I don’t know how bad the blood was. However the fact Alex Neil came along and quickly reinstated him does indicate something.

Like I said this is all irrelevant to the handshake and dinner stories which if true I just can’t see any reason for but pettiness personally, from leaders in positions of power who should act better.

Dunno re. the bit in bold, I'd be inclined to think any new manager worth his salt will start from zero without previous infringements/matters from previous incumbents gumming up the works unless leaders within the playing staff have said so early on.

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

I don't disagree in principle Monty, but in the context of a guy taking charge with 5 games to save us from relegation, I don't think an open challenge from a senior player is very helpful. I don't see the good side of his action?

100% agree but then not giving the guy a table at the end of season bash sems petty and unprofessional.

I have had to do disciplinary meetings with people but I didn't then exclude them from the Xmas lunch.

What it does show, is those that thing Adams is too soft to be DoF are wrong...

 

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

Also, the Dof could give the clubs side of the argument if he hadn't decided to take his ball home...

[GodlyOtsemobor 2,309]

The bit that made me laugh was he apparently saying to David McNally that yellow is not a strong colour so we wouldn't attract players????? Erm... Dortmund do alright.. 

[AJ 1,218]

1 hour ago, Monty13 said:

Badger, thought I was being pretty clear, I agree what he did in the dressing room if true was unprofessional and rash. I’m not talking about this incident other than to agree and then to say in this context that Adam’s perhaps held a grudge or couldn’t make their relationship work as he was shipped out in the close season.

My point was regardless of this incident and the fall out with Adam’s he came back and played for 18 months under Neil in a promotion and harder fought relegation than the last two.

The handshake and dinner stuff, regardless of any incident years before when Bassong was in the wrong (which I don’t see any reason for a connection personally), if true are petty and pretty inexcusable treatment of a player in my opinion.

It's been a common theme of shutting players out before eventually shipping them out;

Leitner, Drmic, Trybull, Heise, Oliveira a few I can think in recent years under Webber/Farke that have just been completely frozen out until they've been terminated. We know Drmic and Leitner were training away from the club for example, pretty poor treatment but we don't know the full stories I guess.

[Mello Yello 2,293]

2 hours ago, Badger said:

This is just total "Apologist" nonsense. We all know that the "happy clappers" put this about as cover for the fact that no multi-billionaire owners have offered to buy Norwich when the reality is that there are loads of them, but they are frightened of Delia!

As for this stuff about Norwich not having a sophisticated enough night-life to attract young millionaire players - total rubbish: have they never heard of Wetherspoons? (Spoons to the cognoscenti 😉)

I luv the Spoons.....I can't abide them pretentious an' trendy wine bars or City pubs with a hip name charging almost £6.00 for a Pint o' Guinness...and flogging a G & T in a tin cup or cocktails that if they didn't quench your thirst they'd clean your teeth....

 

[Danke bitte 965]

46 minutes ago, LaUnionCanary said:

I believe from memory it was "are we supposed to know who you are?" . 

Wow… even more abrasive than I first thought! 😳

[Monty13 2,234]

2 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Dunno re. the bit in bold, I'd be inclined to think any new manager worth his salt will start from zero without previous infringements/matters from previous incumbents gumming up the works unless leaders within the playing staff have said so early on.

My point was only that he was a capable player who clearly could still be integrated into the squad but it took a change of manager. So while Bassong was at least half responsible could Adam’s have done better with him rather than cutting him out. 

[alex_ncfc 662]

2 hours ago, Kenny Foggo said:

100% agree but then not giving the guy a table at the end of season bash sems petty and unprofessional.

I have had to do disciplinary meetings with people but I didn't then exclude them from the Xmas lunch.

What it does show, is those that thing Adams is too soft to be DoF are wrong...

 

I don't know about that, I think it was more of a case of having his pride hurt for doing what he did re: Bassong. But then none of us were there and I guess we don't know what happened.

One of the things I noticed stand out from the interview is that things started going wrong for him when Hughton made him captain, and it seemed to be suggested that it was people above Hughton who didn't like this. What was that all about? Unless I missed it I don't think he went over it.

[Icecream Snow 761]

1 hour ago, alex_ncfc said:

I don't know about that, I think it was more of a case of having his pride hurt for doing what he did re: Bassong. But then none of us were there and I guess we don't know what happened.

One of the things I noticed stand out from the interview is that things started going wrong for him when Hughton made him captain, and it seemed to be suggested that it was people above Hughton who didn't like this. What was that all about? Unless I missed it I don't think he went over it.

I'd forgotten about that. Didn't we end up with something weird like Russell Martin as club captain and Bassong as captain?

[Icecream Snow 761]

3 hours ago, Kenny Foggo said:

100% agree but then not giving the guy a table at the end of season bash sems petty and unprofessional.

I have had to do disciplinary meetings with people but I didn't then exclude them from the Xmas lunch.

What it does show, is those that thing Adams is too soft to be DoF are wrong...

 

But is that one of those events where the public pay to go to a dinner and have a footballer sit at their table and talk to them?

[TheGunnShow 5,940]

1 hour ago, Monty13 said:

My point was only that he was a capable player who clearly could still be integrated into the squad but it took a change of manager. So while Bassong was at least half responsible could Adam’s have done better with him rather than cutting him out. 

Possibly, but you could have the same argument re. any cut-out case, so with Farke you could say Leitner, Drmic, etc. On top of that, I don't think it's necessarily about how capable a player is, but also on his impact in the dressing room under that leadership.

[chicken 2,624]

11 hours ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

Well he was right. He was just pointing out what everyone else already knew, Adams should never have been given the manager's job

So so really. Adams actually brought in a number of players that served us well and tried to get us playing more progressive, forward football after Houghton went.

For example, he brought Josh and Jacob Murphy into the team, signed Jerome, Grabban, O'Neil, Lafferty to an extent too. He didn't quite do enough with our defence, but we weren't doing too badly. Alex Neil came in for the 2nd half of the campaign and the rest is history.

For a rookie manager, he certainly did a lot better than many we've had with much more 1st team coaching/management experience. Had he been appointed when Farke was, I think people would have been willing to give him more time to see where it went. As it was, people wanted that immediate bounce back.

Edit: As for Bassong, quality on his day. One of the best defenders we'd had since Mackay/Fleming/Jackson. However, he could also be incredibly ropey at times, and the fact that he has struggled to have much of a career since, despite only being 35 and having left us at aged 30, suggests he probably wasn't all that great. 18mths after leaving us he was signed by no one. As a freebie you'd have thought someone would have wanted him.

Edited May 5, 2022 by chicken

[glory.win or die. 270]

7 hours ago, Badger said:

I don't disagree in principle Monty, but in the context of a guy taking charge with 5 games to save us from relegation, I don't think an open challenge from a senior player is very helpful. I don't see the good side of his action?

You would also think if taking over a team in trouble the first thing you do is call and speak to the team captain and senior players.

I don't know the truth, but I can't recall any other stories of Bassong causing trouble with any other clubs.. but there's a few cases of players being treated badly by the club over many years, and for whatever reason Adams seemed to lose trust and respect quickly 

[Monty13 2,234]

1 hour ago, TheGunnShow said:

Possibly, but you could have the same argument re. any cut-out case, so with Farke you could say Leitner, Drmic, etc. On top of that, I don't think it's necessarily about how capable a player is, but also on his impact in the dressing room under that leadership.

I mean I don’t disagree at all, you definitely could say that about Farke. I think you hit the nail on the head it’s under that leadership. While a disruptive player is unlikely to be entirely caused by the leader, it is their job to manage it m. Cutting that player out is effectively or should be the last resort.

[shefcanary 2,407]

7 hours ago, GodlyOtsemobor said:

The bit that made me laugh was he apparently saying to David McNally that yellow is not a strong colour so we wouldn't attract players????? Erm... Dortmund do alright.. 

Brazil are usually pretty **** mind! 😉

[Ray 111]

TBH, NA had some guts considering SB was not adverse to posing with firearms!

[lake district canary 4,531]

Started off listening to this interview thinking Seb was a big ego and was the cause of his own problems - and still think that - but it was a good insight to the way he was thinking throughout the period he was at Norwich. 

French players have a reputation for arrogance and being difficult - anyone remember the farce of their international team falling apart a few years ago with personality clashes and strife?  It's a macho thing with them - and we had Neil Adams, English, reserved, well mannered - and a French ego that was plainly used to dealing with stuff, how shall we say..."man to man".   No wonder Seb got on with Alex Neil - could look each other in the eye and see a kindred spirit - and it worked to get him playing again.

Talk of other players not looking after him is just puerile imo. Talks about being a man and being passionate, but really?  Worrying about what other players said or didn't say?  Mithering that they didn't cover his back?  How petty is that?  Disrespects the new manager, going off (however good the reason was) and expecting players to cover for him, then taking it personally when things didn't work out.

Bad mouthing some players in the squad and liking others is EXACTLY the kind of player you don't want at a club. It has to be an all or nothing thing - total togetherness.  That is what Farke expected too - and he was right over every player he had a problem with too and it helped get us promoted twice.

I ended up the interview quite liking Seb, seems an honest and passionate guy - and he was a good player, no doubt - but if a player is prone to being disruptive and needing to have that "us against them attitude" within a club, rather than a unified "us against the world" attitude, then that clearly is not helpful.  His attitude to Adams was disrespectful and that was the problem - the catalyst for everything that followed. He'd lost his ally and friend Hughton and showed his annoyance by being rude about the new man....but perhaps if he had played a bit better that season, his mentor, Hughton, wouldn't have needed to be sacked.

Lets not forget we had other disruptive egos in the team that PL season too.....dare I say the word Snodgrass.....and there were stories that season of cliques within the team - and it is clear Seb, from what he said in the interview - was in the middle of that.

The dinner stuff if true, is not a good look, but if you disrespect management like he clearly did, then maybe it was not a surprise....but on the other hand the story of the Wembley final shows the other side of him.  A difficult time for him and us, but the result was promotion!  So happy days......if not for him....for us.

Edited May 6, 2022 by lake district canary

[ged in the onion bag 855]

21 hours ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Also, the Dof could give the clubs side of the argument if he hadn't decided to take his ball home...

... but Bassong decided to make those statements, doesn't mean the other side have a duty to respond!    All people have to do is be rational!    Bassong wasn't happy and puts his point from his perspective (has he missed anything out conveniently?) but there are usually two sides to it!   He does come across as headstrong.

[Michael Starr 519]

On 05/05/2022 at 12:32, GodlyOtsemobor said:

The bit that made me laugh was he apparently saying to David McNally that yellow is not a strong colour so we wouldn't attract players????? Erm... Dortmund do alright.. 

and Brazil do alright too.

[PurpleCanary 5,558]

On 04/05/2022 at 23:37, alex_ncfc said:

Anyone else watched it yet?

I know there are two sides to every story, but sounds like the club treated him pretty badly. And Neil Adams comes across as a bit of a w*nker. Our new sporting director, folks.

 

There probably is another side to this story but no chance of getting with that kind of celebrity non-interview. Not one question challenging his account of how he was treated by Adams and later on by Webber. Just a grinning acceptance of everything he said.