Roe v Wade

[Yellow Fever 3,749]

How anybody in the Western World can think to tell a woman what she can and can't do with her own body is beyond me.

It's also all but unenforceable with back street clinics and the misery and damage that may cause.

Frankly, those on the religious right in US politics are no different in this regard than the Taliban and should be lampooned as such.

[Herman 9,718]

I am definitely not the only one that doesn't understand the contradictions of these people. Pro-life for the unborn but also highly likely to be pro-gun, pro-death penalty with an added dislike of an NHS style health service. It's all very odd.

 

[1902 1,167]

Tbh, this will be a tragedy for many women in the US, but banning abortion is miles from the political mainstream and will be a millstone around republican necks for a generation at least.

Previously it was almost an academic exercise in proving how conservative they are. Now they will have to lie in the bed that they made.

[Daz Sparks 1,151]

It's difficult to comprehend that this is happening in the present time, 1822 seems more appropriate for this sort of bullshine.

The orange idiot has directly and indirectly caused a tremendous amount of suffering in his wake, how anyone with a modicum of humanity or understanding could contemplate voting him defies belief.

[littleyellowbirdie 2,514]

Consciousness is the key thing for me: when does a human actually gain consciousness? For me, that's the tipping point where it stops being just the mum. Before that, though, the foetus is just a lump of meat. 
 

Scientific evidence seems to say between 24 and 28 weeks, so the UK limit of 23 weeks and 6 days seems bang on to me. 

Edited May 4, 2022 by littleyellowbirdie

[horsefly 4,288]

The people who demand that every foetus be brought to birth are the very same people who then tell that mother and baby they can fu*ck right off if they think it is the state's responsibility to provide them with the support they need for their health care.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

I'm expecting to see an amendment that blacks and hispanics can still have abortions.

[Icecream Snow 761]

Seems messy. I was trying to read up on it, as the crux of the matter was the Supreme Court ruling on Mississippi being allowed to reduce abortion limits to 15 weeks. So the Supreme Court ruling appears to hand powers back to the individual states to decide, but that seems to trigger an even bigger can of worms.

[Yellow Fever 3,749]

30 minutes ago, Icecream Snow said:

Seems messy. I was trying to read up on it, as the crux of the matter was the Supreme Court ruling on Mississippi being allowed to reduce abortion limits to 15 weeks. So the Supreme Court ruling appears to hand powers back to the individual states to decide, but that seems to trigger an even bigger can of worms.

I have no real problem in putting a normal limit at 16 weeks (possibly longer with sound exceptional medical reasons) but what we're hearing is really 6 weeks or not at all. 

Codify it as a basic right.

Edited May 4, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[nevermind, neoliberalism has had it 159]

Its difficult to imagine that it took 15 years for the problems at UK hospital maternity services to be taken for full, where is the thread for that?

[dylanisabaddog 4,877]

The sooner America accepts that it's 2 countries and puts a border on the Mason Dixon line the better. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

1 hour ago, dylanisabaddog said:

The sooner America accepts that it's 2 countries and puts a border on the Mason Dixon line the better. 

I think the US is very similar to the UK. All the Metropolitan areas in both countries vote Labour or Democrat. Not right wing anyway.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,680]

2 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

The sooner America accepts that it's 2 countries and puts a border on the Mason Dixon line the better. 

Balkanization of the United States is at some point inevitable is something I have often thought. Just split the country in half already, it's clearly far too torn at this point. Can't help but wonder what would the world would be like today had the American civial war resulted in the US being split in half as two different countries, like North and South korea..

[horsefly 4,288]

2 hours ago, dylanisabaddog said:

The sooner America accepts that it's 2 countries and puts a border on the Mason Dixon line the better. 

They had a go at that in 1861. Didn't turn out too good.

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

They're not "pro-life". That's what sounds good. What they are is pro-forced birth. Louisiana seems to be drafting up laws that would put IUDs into question so even though who are trying to avoid getting pregnant in the first place with birth control could still end up coming a cropper.

They basically see women as breeding stock.

Anyone can pretend to care about the unborn. They don't make any demands. When they're actually born, on the other hand....

Edited May 7, 2022 by TheGunnShow

[Badger 2,405]

Trump has still to pronounce on the Roe vs Wade issue - apparently he thought it was all about different ways of crossing a narrow river.*

 

*Stolen from Radio 4's New Quiz. 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Badger

[dylanisabaddog 4,877]

6 hours ago, horsefly said:

They had a go at that in 1861. Didn't turn out too good.

It's now 2022 FFS! 

Actually, hang on a minute. This is America we're talking about. Sorry, you're probably right..... 

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

54 minutes ago, Badger said:

Trump has still to pronounce on the Roe vs Wade issue - apparently he thought it was all about different ways of crossing a narrow river.*

 

*Stolen from Radio 4's New Quiz. 

Probably thought you could do it in a Ford. 😉

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

Not sure if I've chucked this into convo before, but to hell with it, in it goes.

[Yellow Fever 3,749]

What a mess.

A country going backwards.

Guns, loss of Liberal values and Trump.

Basket case.

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

Good news, Germany repealed a ridiculous law on the advertisement of abortion services.

German lawmakers vote to end Nazi-era ban on ‘advertising’ abortions | Euronews

As for the shytehole across the Atlantic, this cartoon will do.

[Bert 236]

Had they been British these judges would also have been brexiteers

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

I posted on the Trump page that I wondered what our two nations had in common anymore.

[Midlands Yellow 3,946]

I’m pretty much pro life with clauses all other the place. That said, If you gave me an opportunity to live again I’d cross my fingers not to. Life is hard even for the lucky few. 

 

[benchwarmer 624]

It all comes down to what we believe human beings really are.  If we believe that we're just rather clever animals, abortion doesn't really matter.  If however we believe that the real 'me' is not something disposable but existed before conception, before even the world began and will continue to do so for all eternity, but came into this world in a certain time and place for a specific purpose in the greater scheme of things, it's a different story. 

This is what lies at the root of the abortion debate, but there are many on both sides of the fence who have lost sight of the underlying principle or have never grasped it in the first place.

You don't have to believe in a Supreme Being (though in my experience it does help by giving shape to the intangible, and above all because it happens to be true).  Schools of psychology draw a distinction between what they call the 'false self' and the 'true self' which is another way of saying the same thing, up to a point.  We are not who we think we are; we live in a world of delusion and call it 'reality'.

Edited June 26, 2022 by benchwarmer

[dylanisabaddog 4,877]

Jacob Rees-Mogg (Minister of Earthquakes and Vacuum Cleaners) believes that women who become pregnant as a result of rape should be legally forced to give birth. These nut jobs are everywhere, not just in the USA. 

[Baracouda 47]

My understanding of the ruling was, it is not a ban on abortions but moreover a legal clamity. The supreme court ruled that it was not within the constitution. Therefore, it cant be ruled at the federal level and must be enforced at the state level.

[Herman 9,718]

It's the beginning of an erosion of rights for American citizens. A Supreme Court filled with religious zealots will lead to future backward steps. And don't think we won't follow along with the dark maneuvers. A handful of right wingers were quick to congratulate the decision so be wary.

[ricardo 7,349]

Religious fundamentalism of whatever brand, usually  leads to a dark place.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

41 minutes ago, Herman said:

It's the beginning of an erosion of rights for American citizens. A Supreme Court filled with religious zealots will lead to future backward steps. And don't think we won't follow along with the dark maneuvers. A handful of right wingers were quick to congratulate the decision so be wary.

The same court rules its legal to openly carry a hand gun. Save a life, take a life.