What do people want in replacing Delia??

[essex canary 496]

29 minutes ago, Badger said:

So how is this going to work when the new FFP rules (Profit and Sustainability) get passed and clubs are limited to a maximum of 70% of turnover on wages and amortisation?

Indeed. No point in wishing for our own Tony Bloom anymore.

[Midlands Yellow 3,978]

1 hour ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

I don’t think we should ever change owner; even letting young Thomas take control is far too dangerous. Change is bad. If baby Jesus was picking an owner for a football club back in the day, he’d of picked Delia.

Even when Delia pops her clogs, we should endeavour to reanimate her ala Dr Frankenstein. Maybe Webber can use himself as some kind of lightning rod at the top of Everest, discharging his electrical splurge towards Carrow Rud to fry Delia to keep her going for the next 3 thousand years or so?

 

OTBC

The majority on here are giving this idea a big thumbs up. 

[Badger 2,405]

3 hours ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

The idea is that with each season of incoming premier league money, it would then put you at a head start over newly promoted clubs until such time as your'e then operating just above the relegation zone each season...i.e Brighton

We were possibly in the verge of getting ourselves into that position having survived for 2 seasons under Lambert/Hughton but then in the third season made some horrific summer signings , top of which being Van Wolfswinkel

There is some truth behind this GLJ, but ultimately any club our size is a few bad signings away from relegation.

Because they have stayed up for a few years, everybody wants to be Southampton or Palace at, but at some stage in the future they too will be relegated.

Twenty years ago, some City fans wanted to be like Blackburn, Charlton, Bolton or Sunderland - "they've given it a go and show what you can do with a bit of ambition."

Ten years ago it would have been Stoke, Sunderland, Wigan etc and it is easy to demonstrate that it is harder to stay up now than it was then.

There is "no model" that keeps you up, as we can see from every club our size that has been promoted since the Premier league started. But if we were looking to improve our chances historically of staying in the League for a few years there were a few options that we should have considered:

1. Playing ultra-defensive pragmatic and often long ball football a la Stoke, Burnley, Palace.

2. Buying our place in the league for a few years and then sinking and being dragged down by debt - a la Portsmouth, Bolton, Ipswich, Sunderland etc.

3. Going into administration and allowing new owners to buy us at well below a true market value and then gain by selling their cheaply bought shares to investors (a la Palace and Southampton)

4. Getting a rich donor willing to pump endless tens of millions into the club - a la Brighton, Bouremouth (atm anyway) or Leicester.

If we want to be a permanent fixture in the Premier League though, we will need to swallow our scruples and attract some sports-washing billions.

Of course, I should add, that all of this is backwards looking. It is very likely that the future will be different to the past!

Edited April 10, 2022 by Badger
Added last sentence

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

1 hour ago, Badger said:

So how is this going to work when the new FFP rules (Profit and Sustainability) get passed and clubs are limited to a maximum of 70% of turnover on wages and amortisation?

Sustainability? The new rules are just about maintaining the status quo, nothing more, just like the last lot of regulations were; it will indeed become harder for any club to break the various glass ceilings in football. Quelle surprise!

So Badger, I guess your argument would be: Why bother changing ownership when it's going to have little chance for uplift with potential for downshift? 

Which brings me back to my Delia Re-animation Project. Purple's on-board - can I count you in?

OTBC

[Badger 2,405]

5 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Which brings me back to my Delia Re-animation Project. Purple's on-board - can I count you in?

 

Didn't her mum live to be 99?

I think that the sensible approach would be to start the reanimation project but with an eye to the future not invest too heavily in it at this stage as 15 years from now the technology available is likely to be considerably better.

There are also other possibilities - with AI developing so quickly it might be possible to develop a "virtual Delia" which is programmed with all her same thought patterns which can be manifested as a 3D hologram. I would judge my proposal to be a more realistic option within the 20 year likely time scale.

The other consideration is the price of electricity which is rising so much in privatised energy markets - this could make the cost of reanimating prohibitively expensive and take us into breach of the new FFP regulations?

[yellowrider120 762]

2 hours ago, BroadstairsR said:

Why should aspiring to change at the top necessarily mean that the so-called "model" needs to be abandoned?

We currently have an aged couple who are set in their ways, risk-averse and unambitious presiding over the club. If the "What Delia says goes" rumours are to be believed, and the 'take it or leave it' attitude to the 'keeping it in the family' intentions would confirm that they are, then this somewhat hegemonic control has become totally out of tune with the status of NCFC, and it's place within the modern game, and even within the game it'self.

We need freshness at the top rather than the quaint, dated outlook of an owner who seems content with second best to the point of seeming indifference to the likes of this season's embarrassing shambles. Quite frankly, we need more ambition, whether this emanates from a new face, a consortium or some valid  interest from overseas need not be any more risky than the current stale malaise that could see us back onto that slippery slope that led to League One ignominy.  That this change might provide more financial back-up that would see the club removed from its perpetual pauper status would likely be an inevitable bonus.

The club desperately needs younger, more vibrant ownership, wherever that might come from. Countless takeovers of countless clubs have taken place since the Smiths first graced the upper echelons of our club yet NCFC has supposedly been an uninviting prospect for even the chanciest of venturers.

It's not quite 'anybody but Delia' at the moment, but surely a change of some sort is vital. NCFC seems to stand still whilst the footballing world forever evolves. That much of this change is disagreeable cannot invite detachment because that's the way it is. 

Norwich City Football Club no more deserves perpetual Premier League status than a host of other clubs, and probably a lot less than many who currently sit in lower leagues. This doesn't mean we should give up on that ambition.

 

 

Brilliant post and sums up very neatly the issues that fans are too timid to address and that the owners simply persist with in their desperation to 'hang on to their toy'. People bang on relentlessly about 'money'. In some respects it's eff all to do with 'money'. The changes you have identified and the proposals outlined would massively enrich the whole club and give us a much better chance of seriously competing. 

[Ken Hairy 3,771]

I think it's just got to the point where I'm utterly bored of Delia. 

[Ken Hairy 3,771]

2 hours ago, BroadstairsR said:

Why should aspiring to change at the top necessarily mean that the so-called "model" needs to be abandoned?

We currently have an aged couple who are set in their ways, risk-averse and unambitious presiding over the club. If the "What Delia says goes" rumours are to be believed, and the 'take it or leave it' attitude to the 'keeping it in the family' intentions would confirm that they are, then this somewhat hegemonic control has become totally out of tune with the status of NCFC, and it's place within the modern game, and even within the game it'self.

We need freshness at the top rather than the quaint, dated outlook of an owner who seems content with second best to the point of seeming indifference to the likes of this season's embarrassing shambles. Quite frankly, we need more ambition, whether this emanates from a new face, a consortium or some valid  interest from overseas need not be any more risky than the current stale malaise that could see us back onto that slippery slope that led to League One ignominy.  That this change might provide more financial back-up that would see the club removed from its perpetual pauper status would likely be an inevitable bonus.

The club desperately needs younger, more vibrant ownership, wherever that might come from. Countless takeovers of countless clubs have taken place since the Smiths first graced the upper echelons of our club yet NCFC has supposedly been an uninviting prospect for even the chanciest of venturers.

It's not quite 'anybody but Delia' at the moment, but surely a change of some sort is vital. NCFC seems to stand still whilst the footballing world forever evolves. That much of this change is disagreeable cannot invite detachment because that's the way it is. 

Norwich City Football Club no more deserves perpetual Premier League status than a host of other clubs, and probably a lot less than many who currently sit in lower leagues. This doesn't mean we should give up on that ambition.

 

 

Or to put it more elegantly this...... 👍

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

13 hours ago, Nexus_Canary said:

I guess from my perspective to sell out for the big money we need and require to compete in the Prem we have to sell the most important part of our club which is our soul. Some might find it mental but i would rather be in our position and being passionately furious than sat at the top of the Prem celebrating another meaningless whatever win with a team full of mercenaries.

"Sell our soul"

"Mercenaries"

Is all money bad Nexus? Delia and Michael have got quite a few quid compared to the average punter; does that make them 'bad' as well? What's the threshold where you transform from benevolent caretaker to a megalomaniac despot? £5? £1000? 36.1 million? 50 million? 500 million? 1 Billion? 100 Billion?

I only ask as the other day I had a £20 note in my pocket and bizarrely started thinking about invading Wales. Luckily, I bought a white Magnum and bag of sprouts and my urges subsided; I just burnt down my neighbour's garden shed instead.

P.S. Can you add a 'Delia Re-animation Project' option to your poll please? I feel it's gaining traction. Purple is a yes and Badger is defo on-board with adjustments to make it financially viable.

OTBC

[Danke bitte 965]

I feel more distant from the club than ever recently. In that vein I don’t really care if a faceless owner came in with more money. What id hope is continued community consultation. Other bigger clubs do this so I don’t really understand the trepidation from fans who think that a new owner would cut ties with the community focus. 

[nutty nigel 7,531]

So can Wynnie stay?

And could I have the Leicester model clarified. Is it an option or pie in the sky?

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

5 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

I think it's just got to the point where I'm utterly bored of Delia. 

It seems more about her than the actual team these days... meanwhile people leaving the club left right and centre, the DoF is taking time off to climb a mountain and set up his own sporting foundation despite the fact the club already set one up and our squad is shot to pieces with key players (Krul, Hanley, Pukki) all linked with moves away... still we hit our top 26 target.

And of course any criticism is met with the hysterical  go support blah blah blah shutting down any discussion... 

On for a statement of intent and ambition!

All I have left is total apathy because if all you can hope for is ongoing relegation / promotion / relegation then.... I grew up hoping to win the FA Cup, challenging for Europe... now we have settled for TOP bl**dy 26! 

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

So can Wynnie stay?

And could I have the Leicester model clarified. Is it an option or pie in the sky?

I'd rather we looked to stopping key staff on both the playing side & backroom staff from leaving... 

[nutty nigel 7,531]

Just now, Kenny Foggo said:

I'd rather we looked to stopping key staff on both the playing side & backroom staff from leaving... 

So can Wynnie stay?

And could I have the Leicester model clarified. Is it an option or pie in the sky?

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

I am sure an intelligent man like yourself can get all the info you need on Leicester from the internet. 

Meanwhile as a supporter of our club I hope,  we look to stopping key staff on both the playing side & backroom staff from leaving... 

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

Just now, nutty nigel said:

So can Wynnie stay?

Who's Wynnie? A horse?

2 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

And could I have the Leicester model clarified. Is it an option or pie in the sky?

It's an option alright - over 1000 bricks needed Nutty. Get on it!

OTBC

[Midlands Yellow 3,978]

Just now, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

Who's Wynnie? A horse?

It's an option alright - over 1000 bricks needed Nutty. Get on it!

OTBC

Extension on the way, we talk about it and they’re doing it. So, 300 more bricks needed Nutty. 

[Nexus_Canary 1,016]

19 minutes ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

"Sell our soul"

"Mercenaries"

Is all money bad Nexus? Delia and Michael have got quite a few quid compared to the average punter; does that make them 'bad' as well? What's the threshold where you transform from benevolent caretaker to a megalomaniac despot? £5? £1000? 36.1 million? 50 million? 500 million? 1 Billion? 100 Billion?

I only ask as the other day I had a £20 note in my pocket and bizarrely started thinking about invading Wales. Luckily, I bought a white Magnum and bag of sprouts and my urges subsided; I just burnt down my neighbour's garden shed instead.

P.S. Can you add a 'Delia Re-animation Project' option to your poll please? I feel it's gaining traction. Purple is a yes and Badger is defo on-board with adjustments to make it financially viable.

OTBC

The sell our soul is more about selling to ethically bad money. - oil, drugs, crime, human rights etc
But then define ethically bad money i guess?  - amazon, "big business"

Have added "Delia Re-animation Project"

[Badger 2,405]

5 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

So can Wynnie stay?

And could I have the Leicester model clarified. Is it an option or pie in the sky?

The Leicester "option" is easy enough - all we have to do is find a multi-billionaire who wants to give us hundreds of millions of pounds - how hard can that be?

Just two slight caveats though:

1. Not sure why Leicester escaped the "screw the ethics" option. Most of their money came following some very close links with some pretty dodgy regimes.

2. After we have obtained our multi-billionaire, new FFP proposals are likely to mean that we are limited to spending 70% of our turnover on wages and amortisation,

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

2 minutes ago, Nexus_Canary said:

Have added "Delia Re-animation Project"

Top man! Can I count on your vote?

OTBC

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

1 minute ago, Badger said:

The Leicester "option" is easy enough - all we have to do is find a multi-billionaire who wants to give us hundreds of millions of pounds - how hard can that be?

Just two slight caveats though:

1. Not sure why Leicester escaped the "screw the ethics" option. Most of their money came following some very close links with some pretty dodgy regimes.

2. After we have obtained our multi-billionaire, new FFP proposals are likely to mean that we are limited to spending 70% of our turnover on wages and amortisation,

1. Increase the stadium as that will help with the new FFP proposals.... oh they can't as they have no money to invest. 

[nutty nigel 7,531]

5 minutes ago, Kenny Foggo said:

I am sure an intelligent man like yourself can get all the info you need on Leicester from the internet. 

Meanwhile as a supporter of our club I hope,  we look to stopping key staff on both the playing side & backroom staff from leaving... 

I'll be Leicester them Kenny. How will I know I won't be Ipswich though? And what are the odds we get better than Wynnie?

Enjoy the game👍💛⚽💚

[Badger 2,405]

Just now, Kenny Foggo said:

1. Increase the stadium as that will help with the new FFP proposals.... oh they can't as they have no money to invest. 

Yes they could easily. IMO we should have done so years ago.

Assuming the extra seats are filled, it would increase our turnover and profitability from the first year it was completed.

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

1 minute ago, nutty nigel said:

I'll be Leicester them Kenny. How will I know I won't be Ipswich though? And what are the odds we get better than Wynnie?

Enjoy the game👍💛⚽💚

Yes they might screw up an away scheme, lose £4m on a dodgy sponsorship deal, oversee a record 6 relegations and waste over £60m on a pile of sh.... enjoy the game too!

The TOP26 is on!!!!

[Midlands Yellow 3,978]

2 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

I'll be Leicester them Kenny. How will I know I won't be Ipswich though? And what are the odds we get better than Wynnie?

Enjoy the game👍💛⚽💚

Why did you have to spoil that great reply with those last 3 words. 

[Kenny Foggo 1,116]

1 minute ago, Badger said:

Yes they could easily. IMO we should have done so years ago.

Assuming the extra seats are filled, it would increase our turnover and profitability from the first year it was completed.

Had a waiting list for 10 years? The apathy I now see in my friends puts that in danger... great ownership!

[sgncfc 1,227]

We don't need new owners, we need a different funding model. It has been proven time and time again in elite sport that the only financial criteria which stands up to long term scrutiny is the relationship between wages paid and performance - namely, the more you pay, the better the player. I know there are always exceptions, youngsters etc, but basically that rule is the only one to follow. The most successful teams pay the most in wages.

As Badger, me and others have already said we have to increase our turnover so that we can spend as much as possible on wages. I cannot believe that the current executive at NCFC is not addressing this as a matter or urgency. If they are not they should be sacked, quite frankly.

There is, fundamentally, only one way of doing this: sell more stuff.

In order to sell more stuff we must:

1. Increase our ground capacity. Work out a way to invest in the ground - supporter bond or similar. Not really that hard and it should have been done by now.

2. Improve our community links/social media links/overseas following. Partner clubs, youth development in Asia/Africa etc. We are about 10 years behind all those other clubs we get compared with in doing this.

3. Maximise TV and commercial revenue, whatever league we are in. Partnering with local Norfolk or area commercials is just too small - go big, go international. Tampa Bay was, I hoped, the start of this - we haven't used it at all. A decent marketing exec (and I don't mean one being paid £30k a year) would have us all over the place. NCFC is a good story but no one outside of Norfolk has a clue.

Now, it may well be that our current owners no longer have the energy for all of this. Most owners of football clubs are not actively involved in running the club. They employ people who know what they are doing in their fields. That means paying for very good people and letting them do their thing.

I actually have some hope that Nephew Tom might have a clue. Unfortunately I don't think that the Webber/Ward duo do - they started well, but have completely failed to make any progress since 19-20. If they can't step up, it's them who have to move on so we can get some energy back into the club.

 

[Badger 2,405]

30 minutes ago, Kenny Foggo said:

Had a waiting list for 10 years? The apathy I now see in my friends puts that in danger... great ownership!

I'm guessing that your friends are "of a certain age" (late middle age) so their apathy does not worry me overmuch, although I suspect that this fear of apathy has made the owners over timid about ground expansion.

What worries me far more is the generation of future supporters who may never even start the football habit if they have access to games. We need to expand the ground and fill it with many more youngsters - teenage season tickets for less than £100 quid, ditto student tickets etc. The marketing and the match experience for this age group needs to be reviewed etc to make it a better experience for the next generation.

To my mind, this has been a far bigger failure from the current owners than failing to gamble millions on signings and wages that probably would have made little difference.

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

4 minutes ago, Badger said:

I'm guessing that your friends are "of a certain age" (late middle age) so their apathy does not worry me overmuch, although I suspect that this fear of apathy has made the owners over timid about ground expansion.

What worries me far more is the generation of future supporters who may never even start the football habit if they have access to games. We need to expand the ground and fill it with many more youngsters - teenage season tickets for less than £100 quid, ditto student tickets etc. The marketing and the match experience for this age group needs to be reviewed etc to make it a better experience for the next generation.

To my mind, this has been a far bigger failure from the current owners than failing to gamble millions on signings and wages that probably would have made little difference.

I agree that stadium expansion is long over-due.

But where would we get the money from? I'm guessing we are talking in the region of £30-50 million to create a new City Stand.

Massive bank loan? This equals big debt and big interest payments so I guess would be seen as a no-no by most.

Massive bond scheme ala Colney? Could we as a fan base even raise that kind of money? And could the club afford the repayments?

Investment from a third party? From reading many posts on the forum, it seems like we are about as attractive to investors as a shop selling dogsh*t would be.

Steal the cash? The Octogenarian Job? 🎶This is the self-preservation society!🎶 "You were only supposed to keep us out of the bottom three!" 

You seem to know a lot about finance Badger - any other options?

OTBC

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

Even if a new majority shareholder did not have an endless supply of cash, we need new impetus, ideas and vigour. The current set up has gone stale has a small club mentality.