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Seriously thinking we should get Farke back!

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17 hours ago, Petriix said:

Farke gave us the two best seasons in the club's history. What has Smith given us? Abject failure. No coherent plan. The same tactical mistakes over and over again. He's a fraud.

The part time genius is the fraud. His ego is far to massive. The quicker he dissappears into the 🌇 sunset the better.

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9 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said:

Daniel Farke believed in keeping the ball, we are desperate to do that now. 

Being fair here, we have to say that Farke struggled to get us to do that as much this season as he went for a slightly different approach himself.

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3 minutes ago, chicken said:

Being fair here, we have to say that Farke struggled to get us to do that as much this season as he went for a slightly different approach himself.

I'm thinking we need a mixture of them both

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1 hour ago, The Great Mass Debater said:

 

I personally, at this point dont see it either. Smith doesnt seem an upgrade on Farke, far from it. And whilst he has a low bar at present in terms of matching/exceeding Farke's performance, if he is still our manager next season its about to get a hell of a lot harder for him to match or exceed Farke.

Farke not only won the Championship twice, the second time he did it after a crushing relegation. Farke changed a team used to losing into a team of winners again. He re-instilled the winning mentality. No mean feat at all. 

Smith's bar for next season is about to get as high as it gets. I dont see how he could possibly do anything next season that could surpass Farke - which will leave many a canary still unconviced he is an upgrade.

And he did it with 94 and 97 points.

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16 hours ago, Monty13 said:

Two best seasons in our history? 

Very short memory.

I'd certainly disagree with that - my memory stretches back to (just about) the 1959 cup run although I'm not going to count that as I was very young at the time and can't actually remember much about it - I went to the home games but the only real memories I have of that time are about the huge crowds and the noise rather than the actual games.

So leaving 1959 aside, I would say that the two Champoinships wins under Farke were certainly the most enjoyable (therefore to me the best) seasons in 60 years of watching city. There have been plenty of other highlights, especially our first promotion to Div 1 under Ron Saunders and of course our exploits in the UEFA Cup.

But if we are taking about complete seasons which is the point I think Petrix was making then I'd agree with him - Farke's time here has been the most enjoyable and produced the best football in my time watching NCFC.

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4 hours ago, Mr Angry said:

Maybe Smith isn't up to the job-but if the job is trying to keep us in the Premier League, neither was DF-why would you want him back? Outstanding in the Championship, outstandingly bad in the PL. If he got us promoted next year we'd have to replace him for the next crack at survival the following season.

Isnt Smith also outstandingly bad in the Premier League. When do we sack him?

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4 hours ago, astro said:

Surely you’ve just contradicted yourself in the first and third sentences? If the squad wasn’t good enough, why did we sack the manager? 

The question most Farke fans asked. Thinking someone else will wield a wooden sword better than than the previous guy is faulty logic. But does provide a convenient scapegoat. You know how a minister f*cks up, and so the head of one of his minions rolls?

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4 hours ago, kingsway said:

Also the unsavoury atmosphere at Palace just after Xmas and other games around that time would have seen Farke absolutely slaughtered by some fans which would have been a sad way for a guy who gave us 2 fantastic League winning campaigns to finish. An away win for Farke was a class wasy to bow out!

Yes, sacking Farke in the away dressing room after his first win of the season, not even being allowed to return home on the team bus or be afforded the comforts of his home after receiving bad news was a really classy gesture by the board which Im sure Farke welcomed. What a thoughtful and respectful way to say thank you for everything he achieved with the club.

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DF’s failure in the PL may be partly down to a lack of resources, but it’s also down to his stubbornness in continuing to play the same way in the PL as we did in the Championship. Insisting that the players play the ball out of defence against teams that press high up meant that we lost possession deep in our own half. That happened DF’s first season in the PL, yet astonishingly he persisted with it at the start of this season.

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13 minutes ago, The Great Mass Debater said:

Isnt Smith also outstandingly bad in the Premier League. When do we sack him?

Don’t know, but there is no reason to get Daniel back.

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2 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

DF’s failure in the PL may be partly down to a lack of resources, but it’s also down to his stubbornness in continuing to play the same way in the PL as we did in the Championship. Insisting that the players play the ball out of defence against teams that press high up meant that we lost possession deep in our own half. That happened DF’s first season in the PL, yet astonishingly he persisted with it at the start of this season.

So you think playing hoofball is the way to stay in the EPL - fantastic!!

Except Smith has tried it and that didn't work either.

Personally I'd much rather watch us play decent football irrespective of whether we stay up or not.

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11 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

DF’s failure in the PL may be partly down to a lack of resources, but it’s also down to his stubbornness in continuing to play the same way in the PL as we did in the Championship. Insisting that the players play the ball out of defence against teams that press high up meant that we lost possession deep in our own half. That happened DF’s first season in the PL, yet astonishingly he persisted with it at the start of this season.

He probably persisted with it because Webber said this: "Last time I sent Daniel to war without a gun. Now he's got a gun, a few grenades and a bazooka"

Essentially...

'Last time you didnt have the players to make your system work. But dont worry, I've signed you a load of players who've just been relegated from the Bundesliga, a player struggling with an injury, and I've spunked millions on a new keeper to warm the bench and a Greek teenager for the future'.

Edited by The Great Mass Debater

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2 minutes ago, The Great Mass Debater said:

He probably persisted with it because Webber said this: "Last time I sent Daniel to war without a gun. Now he's got a gun, a few grenades and a bazooka"

Essentially, last time you didnt have the players to make your system work. But dont worry, I've signed you a load of players who've just been relegated from the Bundesliga, a player struggling with an injury, and I've spunked millions on a new keeper to warm the bench and a Greek teenager for the future.

…and I’ve assembled a modern-day version of the Krankies for us to all enjoy in midfield…

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1 minute ago, A Load of Squit said:

At a comparable time in Farke's first season (14th in the Championship) people were saying much the same as they are about Smith.

But Farke solved his then conundrums, and I believe given time he would have solved them again. He’d already seen the lack of ability of a number of players, and was turning to other avenues (Idah for instance). I’m just not sure Smith can do the same. 

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1 minute ago, astro said:

But Farke solved his then conundrums, and I believe given time he would have solved them again. He’d already seen the lack of ability of a number of players, and was turning to other avenues (Idah for instance). I’m just not sure Smith can do the same. 

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

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Just now, A Load of Squit said:

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

That’s very true 

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22 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

At a comparable time in Farke's first season (14th in the Championship) people were saying much the same as they are about Smith.

Not really, I went to a fair few games Farkes first seasons and you could see he was definitely changing the game we were playing, in parts that first season you could see where we were heading on a tight budget!

I can’t see anything under Smith, no particular style of play, not much in terms of improvement nor much optimism. But that’s my judgement and like I said I don’t buy into this not being his team, he’s got these players and he’ll have to get more out of them next year as not too many will be going anytime soon!

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32 minutes ago, astro said:

…and I’ve assembled a modern-day version of the Krankies for us to all enjoy in midfield…

'Wont I need that guy who created most of Pukki's goals and provided all the creativity in the team?'

'No, you'll have Billy Gilmour!'

'OK so what will you be doing with the £30-odd million you got for him?'

'I told you! We've bought you an American striker who doesnt score and has experience of a relegation battle (well, losing one), his Kosovan team-mate, who, before he lost form lots of other teams were looking at, remember how we stole RvW from under the noses of the big boys, well we've pulled off another coup, just like we have with this Greek lad we've got. £10m each, bargain! Tzolis might not be ready to y'know, actually help you this season, but Im sure one of your successors will be grateful I blew a fifth of our transfer outlay on him. Eventually... And dont forget our new substitute keeper! He's ready to make an instant impact on the pitch. Should he ever get on it.'

'OK, so thats Buendia's fee taken care of. What about the money we get for being in the Premier League? Wont I need the defensive midfielder I've been asking for?'

'Are you mad? You have Kenny McLean! I've also got you some French bloke who used to play for Dijon'

'The mustard place?'

'Yeah, he'll fit right in'

'Werent there doubts about his physique at one point in his career?'

'Dont worry, I've got you this Norweigan bloke, he's injured, but I've seen his picture on Instgram - he looks ripped!'

'OK, what about defence then?'

'Well, along with finalising the £6m signing of your Greek left back,  and £8m signing of a championship defender Burnely saw as not good enough to play for them in the PL, I've loaned you some players to replace them - a kid from Man Utd, who's actually right footed, and this unfit Turkish chap from another relegated Bundesliga side who played a bit for Liverpool last season'.

'And Liverpool thought he was good enough right?'

'No, but like all our other signings he has one shining attribute'

'And what's that?'

'He's young, so we might be able to sell him for money at some point in the future. And that's what this club is all about, not effective players now, but building for the future! Im sure you understand that.'

'And am I part of this future?'

'Oh yes Daniel, here's a 4 year contract'

'What's this in the small print about a fixed £1m compensation fee?'

'Oh dont worry about that, its just lawyer speak, its not like we're going to sack you a quarter of the way into the season, that would be a shoddy way to treat a manager who's won us the league twice, finally made the academy blossom and brought the most entertaining style of football we've ever seen to the club and whom is loved by the fans. Trust me.'

Edited by The Great Mass Debater
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1 hour ago, Creative Midfielder said:

I'd certainly disagree with that - my memory stretches back to (just about) the 1959 cup run although I'm not going to count that as I was very young at the time and can't actually remember much about it - I went to the home games but the only real memories I have of that time are about the huge crowds and the noise rather than the actual games.

So leaving 1959 aside, I would say that the two Champoinships wins under Farke were certainly the most enjoyable (therefore to me the best) seasons in 60 years of watching city. There have been plenty of other highlights, especially our first promotion to Div 1 under Ron Saunders and of course our exploits in the UEFA Cup.

But if we are taking about complete seasons which is the point I think Petrix was making then I'd agree with him - Farke's time here has been the most enjoyable and produced the best football in my time watching NCFC.

It’s all opinion to be fair, but as someone who’s seen about half that I wouldn’t rank them best, potentially they’d be up there vying for top with most enjoyable I agree.

I do think there’s a fair amount of recency bias involved though.

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Some quotes from 2017.

"Saying it will take time to get players to play his way is not an excuse - if that’s the case then a Farke should adapt his way to get the best out of the players we have instead of going through the same motions at every home game".

"He has to pick up some wins soon. this cannot be allowed to drift too much further."

"I watched Huddersfield v ManC this afternoon. It''s an absolute certainty that we will not be playing like they are 2 seasons from now. What is also certain is that neither Webber of Farke will be here then."

"he has turned some good players into poor ones".

"The whole club is sleepwalking into trouble both on and off the field and the fans are innocent bystanders in all this."

The last quote is particularly funny. 😀

 

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1 hour ago, Creative Midfielder said:

So you think playing hoofball is the way to stay in the EPL - fantastic!!

Except Smith has tried it and that didn't work either.

Personally I'd much rather watch us play decent football irrespective of whether we stay up or not.

So you enjoyed watching us get beaten 5-0 and 7-0 - fantastic!!

It isn’t just a choice between suicidally passing it around our back 4 until we lose possession, or suicidally pumping it long for our forwards to lose out to the opposition’s defenders-there are other ways of playing that lie between the two extremes.

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26 minutes ago, Mr Angry said:

So you enjoyed watching us get beaten 5-0 and 7-0 - fantastic!!

It isn’t just a choice between suicidally passing it around our back 4 until we lose possession, or suicidally pumping it long for our forwards to lose out to the opposition’s defenders-there are other ways of playing that lie between the two extremes.

 

I cant help thinking football has evoloved so much in the last 10 years. Klopp brought Gegenpressing to English football, and with Guardiola bringing Tiki-Taka, we now talk about football in terms few people did even 10 years ago. People talk about beating the press, which just wasnt really a concept in our football until Klopp. 

I think it has evolved beyond a point where players with the right attitude can give teams a bloody nose regardless of the resources of the club.

Lambert's swashbucklers stayed up fairly easily in his first Prem season. I dont think that same team would have the same success in todays Prem.

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I know it fell through, but what did people think about Farke's move to Krasnodar?

He was looking at potentially playing Champions League football, but considering the positives of Farke's reign, and being able to mitigate much of his PL record to lack of resources - was Krasnodar the kind of move we expected him to make?

Was it a step up? Did we expect him to move up the pyramid following his exploits with us, or be snapped up by a championship club hoping to do the same?

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On 03/04/2022 at 16:36, The Great Mass Debater said:

Yes, sacking Farke in the away dressing room after his first win of the season, not even being allowed to return home on the team bus or be afforded the comforts of his home after receiving bad news was a really classy gesture by the board which Im sure Farke welcomed. What a thoughtful and respectful way to say thank you for everything he achieved with the club.

Were the facts you describe above fact or urban myth?

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2 minutes ago, kingsway said:

Were the facts you describe above fact or urban myth?

That he was sacked in the away dressing room immediately after the game? I wasnt aware that was even questioned? I dont think he travelled home on the team bus

Edited by The Great Mass Debater

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Yes we all know he was sacked immediately after leaving the field, the other facts is what I was alluding to!

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He should have been sacked earlier. That said I'd rather have Daniel with us in the Championship but we'd have to sack him again when we get promoted!

Edited by Capt. Pants
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