Why aren't we Brentford?

[chicken 2,624]

7 hours ago, king canary said:

I'm not sure why Norwich fans resent Brentford so much.

If anything the fact they've managed to stay up (yeah I'm happy to call that now) without huge spending after promotion and working on a 'sustainable' model in the Championship should at least give us some hope that it can be done, even if just for one season. 

I mean, they spent a fair amount...

Ajer - £13.5m
Onyeka - £8m
Wissa - £8.5m
Peart-Harris - £1.4m

Plus some other undisclosed too. They didn't particularly raise a lot of funds selling players either. But even a rough tot up of the above players is £30m+. 

As I have pointed out elsewhere, I actually think Brentford are another example of getting the investment right in the Championship. And what is as frustrating this season as the new signings is the new signings from the season before.

Placheta, Dowell, Giannoulis, Gibson, Sorensen, Soto, Sinani, Hugill etc... 

I get some of those will have the line of defence that they were investments. I can't see the argument that Sinani and Placheta were signed for the Championship, just doesn't make sense when they essentially bet that we'd get promoted with Gibson's signing if we were promoted.

Either way, at least two of those were signed with the knowledge they wouldn't impact our squad - perhaps ever and were just to make money - fine.

But the others haven't improved. Dowell has been a big disappointment in terms of kicking on. All that talk of Everton fans being gutted he'd been allowed to go. Gibson is ok, but not as effective as Hanley who we signed for less than half the price... Hugill looks like he was signed to get us promotion and nothing else... for £3m rising to £5m... What?

I honestly think, in hindsight, which is no real help I know, that it was that summers transfers that cost us. If we knew that Buendia was already gunning to go, we needed to find someone who, like him, could flower with a season in the Championship. Likewise, with Tettey on his way out we should have found a more permanent solution, as well as Skipp.

You need to have that core of a side to supplement when you reach the premier league. Otherwise you are relying on instantly bedding in players into a club that needs results quickly in the toughest league in the world.

[Danke bitte 965]

All Brentford are guilty of are adding 2/3 key players to positions they needed to strengthen and not over spending.

They perfectly succeeded.

We relied on the ego of a DoF that has spectacularly failed in the Premier League and we’ve bought into his vision that has improved our clubs infrastructure but not the 11 on pitch. 

Brentford have managed both. Whilst being just another “London Club”. Hats off to them. Norwich just plain suck.

[Dr Greenthumb 749]

Decent owners

[aBee 151]

8 hours ago, Danke bitte said:

All Brentford are guilty of are adding 2/3 key players to positions they needed to strengthen and not over spending.

They perfectly succeeded.

We relied on the ego of a DoF that has spectacularly failed in the Premier League and we’ve bought into his vision that has improved our clubs infrastructure but not the 11 on pitch. 

Brentford have managed both. Whilst being just another “London Club”. Hats off to them. Norwich just plain suck.

Our training ground is currently a load of portacabins with a marquee for a gym. We have planning permission for something more appropriate which the club said it would put on hold if we got relegated this season. We’ve had a similar strategy to Norwich in many respects but the on field stuff has come first and slowly- gradual squad/playing style improvement since 2011 so each season’s been incrementally better than the last (with a blip in 15-16 when they realised they tried to do too much all at once to build on 5th place) in the ways needed for success. It was probably easier doing that from a low base than being a regular top 6 team who had promotion always in grasp- selling Benrahma and Watkins after our highest finish since 1947 and play off defeat and holding nerve to still believe in going again for promotion took balls of steel. 

[Jim Smith 2,317]

I will openly admit to being jealous. They have shown up our pathetic lack of ambition (again) and recruitment (again). 

[Midlands Yellow 3,980]

Great documentary on the Bees, they deserve their current success. 

[Midlands Yellow 3,980]

1 hour ago, aBee said:

Our training ground is currently a load of portacabins with a marquee for a gym. We have planning permission for something more appropriate which the club said it would put on hold if we got relegated this season. We’ve had a similar strategy to Norwich in many respects but the on field stuff has come first and slowly- gradual squad/playing style improvement since 2011 so each season’s been incrementally better than the last (with a blip in 15-16 when they realised they tried to do too much all at once to build on 5th place) in the ways needed for success. It was probably easier doing that from a low base than being a regular top 6 team who had promotion always in grasp- selling Benrahma and Watkins after our highest finish since 1947 and play off defeat and holding nerve to still believe in going again for promotion took balls of steel. 

Who’s in the running for your player of the season award? 

[norfolkngood 1,087]

58 minutes ago, Jim Smith said:

I will openly admit to being jealous. They have shown up our pathetic lack of ambition (again) and recruitment (again). 

Yes exactly right 

They play with no fear look far better and stronger 

Eriksen put more effort and looks strong fitter and faster than any of our players and that is incredible considering the problems he has had 

[Indy 3,298]

7 minutes ago, norfolkngood said:

Yes exactly right 

They play with no fear look far better and stronger 

Eriksen put more effort and looks strong fitter and faster than any of our players and that is incredible considering the problems he has had 

I must admit to being confused by Farke at the beginning of this season, he went away from his tried and tested system he’d built for four seasons and tried to sure things up, might have been two fold losing his key weapon in Buendia and not having a key midfielder in Skipp! With the fixture list for the first seven games not being kind….Makes me think he was on a hiding to nothing from the start and he knew it!

We used to play no fear football, even Farkes first season up we did, but really had no squad, it was still young and developing! Brentford must be an example to all clubs coming up, do everything you can to keep the key players and spend that bit extra when the right player is available, buying young players to sell at a profit in the future doesn’t work! Tzolis, & Sargent weren’t ready for this level.

[kingsway 94]

Brentford have made better decisions with their squad, have played with no fear and also didn't have the situation with two of their best players that we did with Skipp and Buendia, where we had next to no hope of keeping them! 

 

Fair play to them and its refreshing to be honest. Although I think they are obvious candidates to suffer the 2nd season syndrome we saw with Sheffield United and Huddersfield in recent seasons!

Edited April 3, 2022 by kingsway

[Bradwell canary 109]

They outbid us by around £2m for a Centre half. All fans knew we needed additions there, that has come back to haunt us.

Out bid by Brentford for goodness sake, that tell us everything. Just 2/3 quality signings would have done, but no we proceeded to sign a whole bunch of “future prospects”. We should have bought experienced PL and Championship players.

most of last years intake will be sold, if we can, at a huge loss.Who is responsible? Well I’m bettering it was not Daniel Farke.

[BigFish 1,986]

2 hours ago, aBee said:

..............selling Benrahma and Watkins after our highest finish since 1947 and play off defeat and holding nerve to still believe in going again for promotion took balls of steel. 

Just imagine the outcry if Webber did something like this

[hogesar 9,666]

2 hours ago, Jim Smith said:

I will openly admit to being jealous. They have shown up our pathetic lack of ambition (again) and recruitment (again). 

Sorry but how have they been more ambitious? They've ignored off the pitch stuff much like the McNally era which was roundly criticised by our fans.

They didn't sell Toney but then they had no offers, Toney was more of an unknown at this level than Buendia also.

We spent comparatively. We just got it wrong.

[hogesar 9,666]

Just now, BigFish said:

Just imagine the outcry if Webber did something like this

This sort of stuff gets ignored because they're "more ambitious" - wonder if we'd be seen as more ambitious had we sold Pukki before the championship season? Would Brentford be heralded had they lost the play off final having sold those sort of players recently?

Shows how thin the line between success and failure is.

[Midlands Yellow 3,980]

2 minutes ago, hogesar said:

This sort of stuff gets ignored because they're "more ambitious" - wonder if we'd be seen as more ambitious had we sold Pukki before the championship season? Would Brentford be heralded had they lost the play off final having sold those sort of players recently?

Shows how thin the line between success and failure is.

You’ve got to be the official PR man for the club surely? Even Doncaster couldn’t take you on for excuses of failure. 

[hogesar 9,666]

Just now, Midlands Yellow said:

You’ve got to be the official PR man for the club surely? Even Doncaster couldn’t take you on for excuses of failure. 

I've not excused anything. If you could stop making things up you might end up a semi-decent poster on here.

[norfolkngood 1,087]

1 hour ago, Indy said:

I must admit to being confused by Farke at the beginning of this season, he went away from his tried and tested system he’d built for four seasons and tried to sure things up, might have been two fold losing his key weapon in Buendia and not having a key midfielder in Skipp! With the fixture list for the first seven games not being kind….Makes me think he was on a hiding to nothing from the start and he knew it!

We used to play no fear football, even Farkes first season up we did, but really had no squad, it was still young and developing! Brentford must be an example to all clubs coming up, do everything you can to keep the key players and spend that bit extra when the right player is available, buying young players to sell at a profit in the future doesn’t work! Tzolis, & Sargent weren’t ready for this level.

Yes you have to keep system and a framework of players to play that system 

making a profit is hand in hand with staying in the PL ,if you stay in the PL and players play well the price of those players go up 

sometimes what is needed is hardworking good strong solid pros maybe just for a season or two

 

[TheBaldOne66 682]

Because under the current ownership, we are, and always will be, little old Norwich 😡

[BigFish 1,986]

1 hour ago, TheBaldOne66 said:

Because under the current ownership, we are, and always will be, little old Norwich 😡

This kind of chippy response is a rejection of reality. We will always be Norwich, and the fundamentals of that mean we will always be relatively "little". Ownership doesn't come into it.

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

There will no doubt be numerous factors as to why we didn't do as well as Brentford, a team we finished comfortably above the previous season, but I think the fact they improved their first 11, while we weakened ours, might have something to do with it.

OTBC

[aBee 151]

3 hours ago, hogesar said:

This sort of stuff gets ignored because they're "more ambitious" - wonder if we'd be seen as more ambitious had we sold Pukki before the championship season? Would Brentford be heralded had they lost the play off final having sold those sort of players recently?

Shows how thin the line between success and failure is.

If we’d been you we’d have taken maximum value for Buendia a season earlier and bedded a set of players in in the Championship rather than gamble on strolling it and doing so afterwards. But if we’d missed out last season again it would have been less of a disaster for us than it might have been for you. I actually laughed when I saw you bought Hugill. For relatively little less than Toney. 

[BigFish 1,986]

1 hour ago, aBee said:

If we’d been you we’d have taken maximum value for Buendia a season earlier and bedded a set of players in in the Championship rather than gamble on strolling it and doing so afterwards. But if we’d missed out last season again it would have been less of a disaster for us than it might have been for you. I actually laughed when I saw you bought Hugill. For relatively little less than Toney. 

Good point this, the fans of this club have rather obsessed over what we players we have rather players we need. Brentford have built on player sales as a model that our fans would reject. The obsession last time we went down on our rather over rated "crown jewels" and the wailing this year over Buendia are examples of this.

We may have recruited badly, but we have also sold badly.

.

 

Edited April 3, 2022 by BigFish

[Indy 3,298]

16 minutes ago, aBee said:

If we’d been you we’d have taken maximum value for Buendia a season earlier and bedded a set of players in in the Championship rather than gamble on strolling it and doing so afterwards. But if we’d missed out last season again it would have been less of a disaster for us than it might have been for you. I actually laughed when I saw you bought Hugill. For relatively little less than Toney. 

You weren’t the only one! I laughed so much I cried when the figure for Hugill was revealed! How much did you pay for Tony?

Edited April 3, 2022 by Indy

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

On 02/04/2022 at 17:33, Kenny Foggo said:

Keeping their best players.... Weirdoes

..in every good joke….

Parma 

[aBee 151]

46 minutes ago, Indy said:

You weren’t the only one! I laughed so much I cried when the figure for Hugill was revealed! How much did you pay for Tony?

£5m plus add ons up to £10m and a sell on (I think 15-20%). Broke our transfer record at the time, seems like peanuts after Forest knocked us back at £18m for Brennan Johnson in January (board actually approved it but Cooper put his foot down to say no, probably threatening to walk) and Hull’s new owner said they wouldn’t sell Keane Lewis-Potter even for £25m. 
 

Last season’s bargain buy is still Janelt at £500k- Bochum apparently laughed at our DoFs because they couldn’t see why we’d pay that much  

 

[nutty nigel 7,533]

1 hour ago, aBee said:

If we’d been you we’d have taken maximum value for Buendia a season earlier and bedded a set of players in in the Championship rather than gamble on strolling it and doing so afterwards. But if we’d missed out last season again it would have been less of a disaster for us than it might have been for you. I actually laughed when I saw you bought Hugill. For relatively little less than Toney. 

You're welcome here buddy. But I hope you stick around and don't suddenly disappear like those blades from 2 years ago. Make sure you enjoy what you have while it lasts.

[Badger 2,405]

21 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Oh Ajer.. what could have been. but no, Webber could not be bothered to pay just a little extra on the wages so we ended up with cabbage Kabak instead

It was nothing to do with wages: Brentford offered more than us.

[aBee 151]

19 minutes ago, nutty nigel said:

You're welcome here buddy. But I hope you stick around and don't suddenly disappear like those blades from 2 years ago. Make sure you enjoy what you have while it lasts.

I try not to give it large too much- so didn’t ahead of either of our games. Those Blades were delusional all the way. They weren’t that great going up or really in their first season. Amazing that they still rely on Billy Sharp up top and spent £50m on Brewster and McBurnie. 

[Badger 2,405]

22 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Oh Ajer.. what could have been. but no, Webber could not be bothered to pay just a little extra on the wages so we ended up with cabbage Kabak instead

It was nothing to do with wages: Brentford offered more than us.

[Badger 2,405]

I am not sure that many of us resent Brentford. I for one am pleased that they managed to find a way of playing that works.

My impression has been that it's been a bit long ball and pragmatic, but this might not be fair.

In all our discussions this season we have not really considered whether we need to adopt a more pragmatic method if we are to survive. All we seem interested in is the desperate need for a multi billionaire.