Farke at Krasnador

[TheGunnShow 5,909]

4 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

So?

What's that got to do with their achievements.

If we're judging managers on their loyalty to Norwich then Neil Adams is our greatest ever manager. 

Except it isn't completely to do with their achievements. The original question was this, below. We're also not just judging them on their loyalty to Norwich City either. 

 

5 hours ago, Coneys Knee said:

Why is there always a bitter undertone with those that decided they no longer like Farke, despite the fantastic things he did achieve with us.

Amazes me really. So unnecessary.

Precisely. Farke was genuinely sad to leave, doesn't seem to have indulged in any self-aggrandisement afterwards (unlike Lambert), and as was mentioned earlier in the thread, we consistently played some of the best stuff seen at Carrow Road in year - all with a far higher proportion of young players than you normally see in such a notoriously grinding, attritional league as the Champs.

Edited February 27, 2022 by TheGunnShow
Getting Lampard and Lambert (which was the needed one) is an amusing mix-up.

[hogesar 9,610]

12 minutes ago, king canary said:

Not for me Clive. In the championship sure but Farkes football in the Premier League was painful, Lamberts was exhilarating. 

Lambert's was certainly more effective, although in a Premier League where the disparity hadn't yet grown to the ridiculous amount we see today (between the top and bottom, or even middle and bottom)

[Creative Midfielder 1,985]

24 minutes ago, king canary said:

Not for me Clive. In the championship sure but Farkes football in the Premier League was painful, Lamberts was exhilarating. 

You didn't enjoy beating Man City at Carrow Road then?

[Disco Dales Jockstrap 1,891]

1 minute ago, Creative Midfielder said:

You didn't enjoy beating Man City at Carrow Road then?

WTF. Come on now!

OTBC

[Creative Midfielder 1,985]

1 minute ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

WTF. Come on now!

OTBC

Not really, that may have been the standout game but as I remember it anyway, there were quite a few games in the first half of Farke's Premiership season where we played some b****y good football - Spurs at Carrow Road on Boxing Day is the next that comes to mind but there were others as well.

I don't think that KC's description of ourfootball as 'painful' is remotely fair or accurate.

[daly 499]

As for Farke going to Russia he was either ill advised by his agent or he went for the money despite knowing the situation in Russia/ Ukraine which has been brewing for ages

Can’t really feel much sympathy for him he’s obviously gone for the money but who in their right mind would put their family at risk working under a Putin regime 

Edited February 27, 2022 by daly

[A Load of Squit 5,111]

1 hour ago, daly said:

As for Farke going to Russia he was either ill advised by his agent or he went for the money despite knowing the situation in Russia/ Ukraine which has been brewing for ages

Can’t really feel much sympathy for him he’s obviously gone for the money but who in their right mind would put their family at risk working under a Putin regime 

Do we know if he's taken his family to Russia?

 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

3 hours ago, Coneys Knee said:

He brought on our own players in a way no other city manager ever has. 
 

He galvanised the support (with the exception of you it seems), gave us all the connection to our club back. 

He gave us the scintillating football I’ve ever seen by a Norwich side and won TWO titles in the process.

He respected our club, city and county showed loyalty throughout and has left without bitterness. 
 

Some of that stuff may mean nothing to you but I thank Daniel Farke for what he gave this club. 

Who said that I don't thank Farke for what he has done for this club? 

I'm the one who is defending his move to Russia on here as a possible route to a bigger club via European qualification with Krasnador (unlikely that could happen now).

I'm just pointed out that people seem to talk down Lambert's achievement. You can capitalise TWO titles, I can capitalise DOUBLE promotion.

And if you don't think that Lambert didn't galvanise the support then I have to ask whether you went to any games between 2009 and 2012, it remains the most enjoyable period I've experienced as a Norwich fan, some brilliant away days across 3 divisions, and the most unforgettable games against the scum,

This isn't a problem of me talking down Farke, its a problem with others not giving Lambert his dues. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Except it isn't completely to do with their achievements. The original question was this, below. We're also not just judging them on their loyalty to Norwich City either. 

Precisely. Farke was genuinely sad to leave, doesn't seem to have indulged in any self-aggrandisement afterwards (unlike Lampard), and as was mentioned earlier in the thread, we consistently played some of the best stuff seen at Carrow Road in year - all with a far higher proportion of young players than you normally see in such a notoriously grinding, attritional league as the Champs.

Completely lost me at the point you mentioned Frank Lampard I'm afraid, haven't a clue what you are on about, but I personally thought he displayed a fair bit of class in the aftermath of his sacking at Chelsea. 

[TheGunnShow 5,909]

1 minute ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Completely lost me at the point you mentioned Frank Lampard I'm afraid, haven't a clue what you are on about, but I personally thought he displayed a fair bit of class in the aftermath of his sacking at Chelsea. 

LOL, yeah, meant Lambert. 🙂

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

LOL, yeah, meant Lambert. 🙂

Oh I know, but the opportunity to deflect was too good to pass on 🤣

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

Lambert getting double promotions, playing the way we did and getting performances out of players that probably weren’t good enough for the PL is definitely my favourite era of NCFC.

Farke was brilliant too and the football thrilling and a joy to watch. Except when we lost the confidence to play it in the Premier League and teams worked us out. Probably let down by recruitment though tbf.

They both operated in vastly different situations. The Premier League, even towards the bottom, is vastly improved compared to ten years ago.

Edited February 27, 2022 by (Hoola)Han Solo

[king canary 7,562]

2 hours ago, Creative Midfielder said:

Not really, that may have been the standout game but as I remember it anyway, there were quite a few games in the first half of Farke's Premiership season where we played some b****y good football - Spurs at Carrow Road on Boxing Day is the next that comes to mind but there were others as well.

I don't think that KC's description of ourfootball as 'painful' is remotely fair or accurate.

If we're splitting hairs then 'mostly' painful. 5 wins in 49 games sort of tells that story.

Yes the Man City game was fun. So was beating Man U under Worthy or Alex Neil. One game doesn't erase the rest of the frankly awful football.

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

Chris Hughton had a better record in the Premier League than Daniel and he was vehemently disliked by a lot of the fan base. Just saying.

Personally I’ll always consider 18/19 to be an absolutely classic and bonkers season and I’ll always remember DF for that.

[canarydan23 4,060]

9 minutes ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Chris Hughton had a better record in the Premier League than Daniel and he was vehemently disliked by a lot of the fan base. Just saying.

Personally I’ll always consider 18/19 to be an absolutely classic and bonkers season and I’ll always remember DF for that.

Achieved a higher PL finish than Lambert too.

[Coneys Knee 940]

I seem to have inadvertently opened a Farke Vs Lambert thread. For the record, I respect Lamberts achievements here, but not the man. I also respect Farke’s achievements here as well as the man. It’s that simple on that one. 

But that wasn’t my point. My point really was about how I find it a little sad and unnecessary that there are people that still seem to have to take bitter swipes at Farke. I’m baffled as to why? 
 

[Christoph Stiepermann 1,131]

6 minutes ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Chris Hughton had a better record in the Premier League than Daniel and he was vehemently disliked by a lot of the fan base. Just saying.

Personally I’ll always consider 18/19 to be an absolutely classic and bonkers season and I’ll always remember DF for that.

Yeah, for that reason you could argue that Hughton has been our best manager since 1993, it's such a pointless argument. It all depends on what style of football you prefer, what players we had, who signed the players, how long the manager was here and most importantly what era they were in. It's pointless and I prefer to just separate them into good, poor and mediocre. Lambert did great things, but what he did would be impossible in this era, likewise Walker, Farke hit a lower ceiling than the others but had his hands tied and competed in a stronger era, Hughton achieved the best finish but had the best team etc. All the names mentioned will be remembered favorably in the future (So long as Putin decides there is one) but none of them have earned the right to be considered truly exceptional beyond the others, they were all great for us, let's leave it at that. 

As for Farke right now, I suppose the ethical dilemma of working in Russia depends on whether the owner has any links to Putin and his regime. Russia and it's people are not an enemy, it's their evil government and Putin. I don't think his safety is an issue either, if he's in any danger in Russia then we all are regardless of the country we're in. I don't blame him for taking the job, it's not his job to be deep into politics, he's a football manager and as he's shown before he likes to take on unusual challenges. 

[canarybubbles 1,914]

7 hours ago, Christoph Stiepermann said:

I don't blame him for taking the job, it's not his job to be deep into politics, he's a football manager and as he's shown before he likes to take on unusual challenges. 

Exactly. We can't expect a sportsperson to second-guess history. 

Imagine he'd gone to Turkey (I think he was offered a job there and turned it down?), and then Turkey implodes into civil strife as Erdogan clings onto power at any cost (not a ridiculous possibility). Would the same people who are criticising him for going to Russia be criticising him instead for going to Turkey?

[daly 499]

5 hours ago, canarybubbles said:

Exactly. We can't expect a sportsperson to second-guess history. 

Imagine he'd gone to Turkey (I think he was offered a job there and turned it down?), and then Turkey implodes into civil strife as Erdogan clings onto power at any cost (not a ridiculous possibility). Would the same people who are criticising him for going to Russia be criticising him instead for going to Turkey?

Putin has been a time bomb ready to explode for ages 

Would have thought someone would have explained the situation to him and the consequences of what could happen 

This situation can only get worse 

 

[yellowrider120 761]

13 minutes ago, daly said:

Putin has been a time bomb ready to explode for ages 

Would have thought someone would have explained the situation to him and the consequences of what could happen 

This situation can only get worse 

 

Correct. The stupid, useless Western governments and media have turned a blind eye to this for years. We have been obsessed with trivia like 'LGBT, taking the knee, 'institutionalised racism' here there and everywhere in the UK, racing to eradicate fossil fuel without proper planning for energy capacity etc. Now the stuff is really hitting the fan. Currently I think we have far more to worry about and deal with than that sort of garbage.     

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

39 minutes ago, yellowrider120 said:

Correct. The stupid, useless Western governments and media have turned a blind eye to this for years. We have been obsessed with trivia like 'LGBT, taking the knee, 'institutionalised racism' here there and everywhere in the UK, racing to eradicate fossil fuel without proper planning for energy capacity etc. Now the stuff is really hitting the fan. Currently I think we have far more to worry about and deal with than that sort of garbage.     

Yep, those hugely trivial subjects such as homophobia, racism and climate change 🙄

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

15 hours ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

They both operated in vastly different situations. The Premier League, even towards the bottom, is vastly improved compared to ten years ago.

Any evidence to back this up? 

In terms of likelihood of a promoted team to survive in their first season in the Premier League following promotion, is there any data at all to support this assertion, or is it entirely anecdotal? 

[......and Smith must score. 1,331]

15 hours ago, A Load of Squit said:

Do we know if he's taken his family to Russia?

 

I doubt he has. His family never came over here in his time at Norwich.

[1902 1,167]

I'm a teacher, and if I was out of work and asked to teach in Russia sometime in the summer I'd have done so. Just like the thousands of gas engineers, teachers, artists, architects and the rest who have worked for perfectly legitimate businesses in Russia.

The situation is very different to when Farke took the job, and any boycott and sanctions are about hitting the Kremlin and it's war machine. I feel sorry for normal Russians who just want to run a company or watch their football club. What Farke does now is up to Farke, but the idea he has done anything wrong before this point is ludicrous.

Krasnaodar is legitimately Russian, it was never a part of Ukraine and no one is claiming it was, it really doesn't matter if it's 40km inside the border or 4000.

Edited February 28, 2022 by 1902

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 hour ago, daly said:

Putin has been a time bomb ready to explode for ages 

Would have thought someone would have explained the situation to him and the consequences of what could happen 

This situation can only get worse 

I watch Bald and Bankrupt videos on YouTube, he goes all over Russia and the former Soviet countries.

Whole region fascinates me and I'd definitely take up the opportunity to live and work there, if I were childless (pre-Putin meltdown of course, not in past four or five weeks).

Rememeber that Farke has a team of 3 coaches who all have families to feed and mortgages to pay, perhaps the money was just too good to turn down for the lot of them as a collective, it isn't just Farke with a fresh £1 million sitting in the bank, you'd expect the coaches to need to get back to work pretty quickly.

Also, we can debate whether Farke was a good manager or not (I think tactically he was pretty poor personally), I fail to see how or why anybody can or should expect his geopolitical knowledge to be on-point, he was paid to watch football games not bloomberg. 

Edited February 28, 2022 by TeemuVanBasten

[Budapest Canary 152]

Just re-read the thread from mid-January on his joining to Krasnodar. No one seemed to have moral/political concerns at the time. Why should Farke have had any? 

 

[(Hoola)Han Solo 324]

6 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Any evidence to back this up? 

In terms of likelihood of a promoted team to survive in their first season in the Premier League following promotion, is there any data at all to support this assertion, or is it entirely anecdotal? 

I was referring to the style of football. The teams towards the bottom (barring maybe Burnley, and even us) do on the main try and play some good stuff. It’s unlikely you’ll get an Allardyce or Pulis type team in this division anymore. The clubs likely to get promoted in Fulham and Bournemouth play an attractive type football. I’m not saying it’s always effective, as the table shows, but gone are the days where teams just hoof it up to a big man.

Edited February 28, 2022 by (Hoola)Han Solo

[Michael Starr 519]

The club he joined pre-attack on Ukraine was a really forward thinking up and coming football club lead by a multi billionnaire. Why would he NOT go there?

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

21 hours ago, Coneys Knee said:

I seem to have inadvertently opened a Farke Vs Lambert thread. For the record, I respect Lamberts achievements here, but not the man. I also respect Farke’s achievements here as well as the man. It’s that simple on that one. 

But that wasn’t my point. My point really was about how I find it a little sad and unnecessary that there are people that still seem to have to take bitter swipes at Farke. I’m baffled as to why? 
 

There are some who  just have to be taking a swipe at someone, it's what gets them through the day. 

Sad conts.  

[Creative Midfielder 1,985]

On 27/02/2022 at 21:18, king canary said:

If we're splitting hairs then 'mostly' painful. 5 wins in 49 games sort of tells that story.

Yes the Man City game was fun. So was beating Man U under Worthy or Alex Neil. One game doesn't erase the rest of the frankly awful football.

Ok but if we're splitting hairs, then failing to win doesn't always equate to 'awful football' - I would still maintain that there were many games in the first half of that season where we played some very good football without necessarily getting the points we deserved.

But it does seem in the EPL that for many people winning is the only thing that matter and the manner of it is irrelevant - trying play exciting, entainting football is irrelevant unless it is also winning football because the Prem is primarily about money, prestige and most of all staying in the 'elite' club.

Playing football which is good to watch is a luxury that only the super rich clubs can afford in the Prem, as both Farke and now Bielsa have found to their cost.

That they stuck to their principles rather than attempt to switch to the standard negative & cynical Premier League dross in a desparate (& doomed) attempt to stay up increases rather than diminishes my respect for them.