When is a 4-0 thumping at home really not that bad?

[Pukki Bear 1]

After Man City thumped Sporting LIsbon 5-0 in Lisbon, all of a sudden it puts our humbling last week in perspective. Maybe we should apply to join the Portuguese League. I'd fancy our chances of getting a Champions League spot that way, especially after we beat the best Portuguese team, aka Wolverhampton Wanderers. OTBC! 

[cambridgeshire canary 4,744]

Sadly the gap in money and teams is way to far now. Much as losing to Man City hurts I think its just the fact that we as two teams are so far apart we might as well be on different planets that stings the most. Modern day football really sucks sometimes.

[Capt. Pants 2,573]

It was a slightly weakened Man City team against us that hardly got out of 2nd gear.

Next up Liverpool who've scored as many Premier League goals as Man City!

All will be forgotten when we beat Brentford though.

 

[......and Smith must score. 919]

25 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

It was a slightly weakened Man City team against us that hardly got out of 2nd gear.

Next up Liverpool who've scored as many Premier League goals as Man City!

All will be forgotten when we beat Brentford though.

 

It's sad but true that we have to call a team without both Grealish and DeBryne ' slightly weakened '

[Jambomo 215]

27 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

It was a slightly weakened Man City team against us that hardly got out of 2nd gear.

Next up Liverpool who've scored as many Premier League goals as Man City!

All will be forgotten when we beat Brentford though.

 

I am actually at the point where I feel teams such as Man City don’t have weakened teams, they simply have a big enough squad to field two separate teams of equal or very near equal, quality. 

[Bluefloyd 58]

Just now, Jambomo said:

I am actually at the point where I feel teams such as Man City don’t have weakened teams, they simply have a big enough squad to field two separate teams of equal or very near equal, quality. 

This is true, there was nothing weakened about the side they put out on Saturday. Nothing. 

[KiwiScot 971]

Not when it's at Portman Road

Edited February 16, 2022 by KiwiScot

[hertfordyellow 416]

51 minutes ago, Bluefloyd said:

This is true, there was nothing weakened about the side they put out on Saturday. Nothing. 

This is true, they were forced to play out of form Sterling… it’s a different world. We’ve had two all England finals in the champions league in the last 4 years, I’m not betting against another one this year.

[lake district canary 3,745]

It was simply the better team that won on the day, none of this "they are on a different planet" stuff, please.  We were holding our own until Max's mistake - and also came close to scoring too - could have been very different.

The more we put these teams on a pedestal, the more we are building an aura around them that is not healthy for competition. Any team is beatable on any given day and had Hanley's header gone in instead of hitting the post, it would have changed the match, or at least given MC a bit more to think about.  

Get really cheesed off with the eulogising if these teams - they may be good, but that doesn't excuse thumpings at home - however good and however rich they are. It was a bad loss and no excuses!

Edited February 16, 2022 by lake district canary

[TESCO 70]

1 hour ago, ......and Smith must score. said:

It's sad but true that we have to call a team without both Grealish and DeBryne ' slightly weakened '

Their subs were a bit odd too. Felt like they were taking the p*ss out of us.

[cambridgeshire canary 4,744]

36 minutes ago, TESCO said:

Their subs were a bit odd too. Felt like they were taking the p*ss out of us.

Did have a 'and here comes 14 year old Smith for his first ever appearance on a football pitch' feel to it

[Jambomo 215]

1 hour ago, lake district canary said:

It was simply the better team that won on the day, none of this "they are on a different planet" stuff, please.  We were holding our own until Max's mistake - and also came close to scoring too - could have been very different.

The more we put these teams on a pedestal, the more we are building an aura around them that is not healthy for competition. Any team is beatable on any given day and had Hanley's header gone in instead of hitting the post, it would have changed the match, or at least given MC a bit more to think about.  

Get really cheesed off with the eulogising if these teams - they may be good, but that doesn't excuse thumpings at home - however good and however rich they are. It was a bad loss and no excuses!

I actually do agree with you. I find the eulogising of them (and other teams like them) annoying as well.

I think there’s a place between recognising that the cash has bought the best players and it shows in their results, but not fearing them as some kind of untouchable force. 

[Dean Coneys boots 925]

6 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Sadly the gap in money and teams is way to far now. Much as losing to Man City hurts I think its just the fact that we as two teams are so far apart we might as well be on different planets that stings the most. Modern day football really sucks sometimes.

Yes but that is also why we will go down- and until we learn how to deal with the problem we won’t move forward. I would suggest ‘self funding’ isn’t working 

[Jambomo 215]

20 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Yes but that is also why we will go down- and until we learn how to deal with the problem we won’t move forward. I would suggest ‘self funding’ isn’t working 

It’s not really a problem that can be dealt with, unless a country decides it wants to invest in you.

If you look at the fans of mid to top of the league on social media, they are saying similar things to what we do - wishing they had more investment, that they could be more competitive, the players aren’t good enough for where they want to be.

Nobody is happy because everyone is kind of stuck where they are and the best most teams can play for is being the best of those around them.

[Midlands Yellow 2,730]

If we play well against Liverpool but take an even bigger thumping I for one will be delighted. 

 

[Dean Coneys boots 925]

59 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

It’s not really a problem that can be dealt with, unless a country decides it wants to invest in you.

If you look at the fans of mid to top of the league on social media, they are saying similar things to what we do - wishing they had more investment, that they could be more competitive, the players aren’t good enough for where they want to be.

Nobody is happy because everyone is kind of stuck where they are and the best most teams can play for is being the best of those around them.

Crystal Palace were level with us not too long ago. So too Southampton. And Burnley. And Brentford. Oh and Leicester. But all of them moved beyond a 1990s provincial model and embraced new ownership and a global model of investment. Meanwhile we continue to stand still and watch others progress. It really is time we moved into 21st century - our whole model is outdated imho 

[Making Plans 833]

7 hours ago, Pukki Bear said:

After Man City thumped Sporting LIsbon 5-0 in Lisbon, all of a sudden it puts our humbling last week in perspective. Maybe we should apply to join the Portuguese League. I'd fancy our chances of getting a Champions League spot that way, especially after we beat the best Portuguese team, aka Wolverhampton Wanderers. OTBC! 

Having lived in Portugal for an extended period I can tell you that the Portuguse Primeria League is similar to all the other leagues in Europe in as much that it's not really that competitive for the top 3 places.

Three teams, Benfica, Sporting and Porto dominate everything. Occassionally there will be a surprise team but that is very rare.

All the Clubs, other than the above 3, struggle with attendances.

The top 3 average is 25,000 to 30,000 but the rest can only manage to attract crowds between 1,000 and 10,000 if they're lucky.

Virtually everybody in the whole Country supports one of the "big 3" with Benfica having the most support Nationally.

There are 3 daily newspapers that are 100% football (i.e. no other news) and these sell in their millions.

There is a nightly 20 minute slot on the main news (on 2 seperate channels) that is devoted to football.

The Portuguse are the Worlds best armchair supporters. Everyone in Portugal loves football and is an avid football supporter but very few of them ever bother to actually go to a game.

Success on the pitch depends on getting decent, but cheap, Brazillian and African imports plus the occassional home grown gem.

Finally, players in Portuguse teams are the biggest load of cheats anywhere.

Edited February 16, 2022 by Making Plans

[mrD66M 32]

12 hours ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Sadly the gap in money and teams is way to far now. Much as losing to Man City hurts I think its just the fact that we as two teams are so far apart we might as well be on different planets that stings the most. Modern day football really sucks sometimes.

Yes there is a money differential, but the structure is the critical factor, just look at ManU and see how they blow themselves up... It's a franchise.

 

[Nuff Said 3,685]

12 hours ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Crystal Palace were level with us not too long ago. So too Southampton. And Burnley. And Brentford. Oh and Leicester. But all of them moved beyond a 1990s provincial model and embraced new ownership and a global model of investment. Meanwhile we continue to stand still and watch others progress. It really is time we moved into 21st century - our whole model is outdated imho 

This rubbish again? I can’t be bothered to list them but there are at least 20 teams who were level with us at one point in the last 20-30 years who are *nowhere* near our level now. Many of which regularly spend tens of millions more than their income.

[DraytonBoy 66]

Just having wealthy owners willing to 'spend big' has never been a guaranteed route to consistent success and there are so many current examples of that in the Championship and League One.

What a billionaire owner does give you is a chance of creating a setup that will keep you in the PL and challenge for trophies but that takes years and often the owner is not willing to be patient. 

 

[Dean Coneys boots 925]

5 hours ago, DraytonBoy said:

Just having wealthy owners willing to 'spend big' has never been a guaranteed route to consistent success and there are so many current examples of that in the Championship and League One.

What a billionaire owner does give you is a chance of creating a setup that will keep you in the PL and challenge for trophies but that takes years and often the owner is not willing to be patient. 

 

This is true. Just having money is no guarantee of success- but it does at least give you a good chance of it. Odds are in your favour. Meanwhile not having money is a guarantee of failure at this level- wages matter more than fees in this regard. Ergo we need to get some money to make a better fist of stabilising in this division else we will continue to stagnate or else, more likely, suddenly reverse. The real worry for me is that we are not far off a couple of poor seasons and then, when parachute money runs out, we will discover where our actual self funding level currently places us on the football ladder. I assure you it is not in the top half of the championship anymore. Football has moved on whilst our board has not. 

[Greavsy 2,026]

1 hour ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

This is true. Just having money is no guarantee of success- but it does at least give you a good chance of it. Odds are in your favour. Meanwhile not having money is a guarantee of failure at this level- wages matter more than fees in this regard. Ergo we need to get some money to make a better fist of stabilising in this division else we will continue to stagnate or else, more likely, suddenly reverse. The real worry for me is that we are not far off a couple of poor seasons and then, when parachute money runs out, we will discover where our actual self funding level currently places us on the football ladder. I assure you it is not in the top half of the championship anymore. Football has moved on whilst our board has not. 

I'm sure of you ask anyone from lower champs downwards if our club is a failure, and they would all disagree, and be more than happy to swap with us. 

[Badger 2,105]

22 hours ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Yes but that is also why we will go down- and until we learn how to deal with the problem we won’t move forward. I would suggest ‘self funding’ isn’t working 

Yawn 

The rich owner model is working really well for Barnsley, Birmingham, Stoke etc etc.

It is hard for any newly promoted club, you only have to look at Fulham to see that. Loading up with debt has caused teams far more problems, with only a small number benefiting and even then it is often just a temporary gain.

Oh well, I guess we will have that chap complaining that we travel to games in airplanes soon.

[Greavsy 2,026]

ferk that! 

[shefcanary 1,265]

1 hour ago, Greavsy said:

ferk that! 

I'm watching Big Jet TV now on another screen, showing live landings at Heathrow.  A mad bonkers bloke runs this you tube station and literally commentates on the landings.  I would say one in three are aborting and having to go around again at the moment.  You have to admire the skill of most pilots, but there's one from Qatar who has aborted 3 times!

[shefcanary 1,265]

The Qatar Jet final landed on its fourth attempt!  Glad I'm not going to the World Cup later this year.