So is Putin going to invade Ukraine anytime soon or..?

[Yellow Fever 3,763]

34 minutes ago, 1902 said:

Honestly, what's the point, the man could be shot in the stomach by Putin himself and his dying words would be "why did you...... do this to......me ...... Zelenskiy."

 

16 minutes ago, kirku said:

"Goddamn.....NATO.....east.....ward.....expaaaaaannnnnsssssiiiiiooooon"

He'd only believe if it was in the 'unfree' Russian press.

 

[Yellow Fever 3,763]

'Russia 'to reduce activity around Kyiv and Chernihiv'

Call me a cynic but it seems the Russians might be accepting they can't take these cities by force and are now trying to 'bank' what they've got before the Ukrainians push them back. 

It's noticeable but there is an unspoken feeling that the tide is turning.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[nevermind, neoliberalism has had it 159]

19 hours ago, It's Character Forming said:

Ummm, it's fine to question what you're told "without any evidence" but that's not the same thing as dismissing evidence because it's produced by the side you disagree with.  It's hard to be clear exactly how many died in a theatre that collapsed on people sheltering in a basement in a war zone.  That doesn't somehow mean it didn't happen.

Can you apply this standard to Putin propaganda ?

Producede evidence is the right term. No photos, videos or graves, just words from Intelligence bogs. there is no evidence.

Just as in Douma and in Salisbury, a lot of questions left open.

[nevermind, neoliberalism has had it 159]

20 hours ago, 1902 said:

 

no evidence no points, just speculative propaganda.

 

[ricardo 7,380]

1 hour ago, Yellow Fever said:

'Russia 'to reduce activity around Kyiv and Chernihiv'

Call me a cynic but it seems the Russians might be accepting they can't take these cities by force and are now trying to 'bank' what they've got before the Ukrainians push them back. 

It's noticeable but there is an unspoken feeling that the tide is turning.

Time will tell but in a slugging match the heavyweight usually wins.

I still feel the ultimate goal is to take all Ukraine. If not this time then they will eventually be back for round two. Sorry to sound negative.

[Yellow Fever 3,763]

Just now, ricardo said:

Time will tell but in a slugging match the heavyweight usually wins.

I still feel the ultimate goal is to take all Ukraine. If not this time then they will eventually be back for round two. Sorry to sound negative.

I'm in agreement Ricardo. Putin wants to recreate a Russian empire... or client states such as Belarus.

What really worries me is the Russian Z nationalism he's whipping up at home. Ignorant people yes but echoes of the swastika and 1930s Germany ring out loud.

The lesson from history is such people need stopping sooner rather than later... but then we never learn.

[Foxy2600 300]

Ukraine crisis: Why India is buying more Russian oil - BBC 14 Hrs ago

Foreign aid farce as Britain's aid to India RISES by third and UK will still send millions to China - despite foreign aid budget cuts - Mail

Hashtags like #IStandWithPutin and #istandwithrussia trended on Indian social media, and the Indian government demonstrated – perhaps most notably by refusing to support UN resolutions condemning the invasion. Since the beginning of Russia’s all-out invasion of Ukraine on February 24, the Indian government, and large segments of the Indian public, have firmly been on Putin’s side - Al Jazeera

Funny old world - INNIT?

[Foxy2600 300]

And this just sickens me... 

[Herman 9,746]

2 hours ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said:

Producede evidence is the right term. No photos, videos or graves, just words from Intelligence bogs. there is no evidence.

Just as in Douma and in Salisbury, a lot of questions left open.

Other than the victims, the chief suspects and the trail of evidence, left either deliberately or incompetently, that leads directly back to Moscow, there is no evidence that Russia was involved in the Salisbury poisonings.

[ricardo 7,380]

8 minutes ago, Herman said:

Other than the victims, the chief suspects and the trail of evidence, left either deliberately or incompetently, that leads directly back to Moscow, there is no evidence that Russia was involved in the Salisbury poisonings.

Who knew that cathedral tours were so popular among KGB staff?

I am sure they will be welcome at Norwich Cathedral, minus the Novichok of course.

[It's Character Forming 1,160]

4 hours ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said:

Producede evidence is the right term. No photos, videos or graves, just words from Intelligence bogs. there is no evidence.

Just as in Douma and in Salisbury, a lot of questions left open.

You mean like the lack of photo evidence of Ukraine shelling Donetsk which Putin alleges was going on for 8 years, compared to the massive damage to Kharkiv in the short time since Russia invaded, or Mariupol being almost completely devastated.  Do you deny those are happening or just try to hide behind saying e.g. the exact numbers who died in the theater still haven't been confirmed, in a city under attack in the middle of a war !

 

Plenty of photos of the chemical attack in Douma.  The evidence that the Russian FSB carried out the attack in Salisbury is overwhelming.

Saying "plenty of questions left open" is classic conspiracy theory nonsense.  In the real world, there are always areas where our knowledge is less than complete AKA "questions left open" that's called real life.

The difference with the Russian fantasy ideas you quote (but never attempt to put forward any evidence for them whatsoever) is that there is no credible evidence for them that would satisfy any fair minded person..

[How I Wrote Elastic Man 1,186]

 

[Herman 9,746]

They went to protect the ethnic Russian population. In a majority ethic Russian city. They're not telling the truth are they?

[horsefly 4,296]

14 hours ago, nevermind, neoliberalism has had it said:

Producede evidence is the right term. No photos, videos or graves, just words from Intelligence bogs. there is no evidence.

Just as in Douma and in Salisbury, a lot of questions left open.

Perhaps you would like to specify by what criteria you would accept something as constituting evidence. If you are honestly claiming that we lack evidence of what the Russians have done and are doing, then you need to explain just what would constitute evidence.

[7HAR1980 102]

1 hour ago, horsefly said:

What an appalling individual you are. 

Why? Are you disturbed by this because you should be? It's been happening for the last 8 years but the hypocritical West hasn't said boo to a goose about it! 

[TheGunnShow 5,935]

Ah yes, "save Donbass". 

Yeah, invade a sovereign state, in which the region is located, for no reason whatsoever based on unreasonable demands and false flags.

Putin should be in the Hague.

[Herman 9,746]

22 minutes ago, Van wink said:

Genuine question, do you believe this stuff or are you just hoping to get a reaction?

He's just another useful idiot. A lot of them about. 

[Worthy Nigelton 1,043]

1 hour ago, Herman said:

He's just another useful idiot. A lot of them about. 

He thinks he's being clever and sees something we all don't. The unfortunate truth is that he is brainwashed and stuck down a rabbit hole, which is exactly the criticism he would level at us ironically, so you'll never get through to him, no matter how obvious it all is.

[BroadstairsR 2,149]

This war started in 2014 with the 'Revolution of Dignity' in the Ukraine. This led to the overthrow of the pro-Russian government and the subsequent rejection of the Eurasion Economic Union in favour of the intentions to join EEC, and also the country's desire to join NATO.

It also led to Putin's annexation of the Crimea and the start of the Dunbas "war."

It seems that Putin's answer to the 'Ukraine Problem' was to conquer/destroy the whole country.

That this has been a disastrous campaign for Russia is undeniable. Any 'victory'  that Putin claims will have been of Pyrrhic proportions when considering the loss of man power and weaponry that has resulted from the conflict. This is to say nothing of the immense cost of the sanctions imposed upon his country.

That Russia's military intentions are now to withdraw from Kyiv and concentrate upon the Dunbas gets to the core of the issue. In the meantime, thousands have died. That Putin's withdrawal is to "gain the trust" of the Ukrainians and that both sides are now willing to compromise has proven to be inevitable. 

The costs to both sides of continuing their current stances is far too high.

It now seems likely that the Dunbas will finally achieve autonomy and Zelenskyii will abandon his intentions of his country being affiliated with NATO. 

We have to hope that this is the final conclusion. It has been an horrific three weeks that could worsen if an agreement is not reached. 

Could these wars have been avoided? Could diplomacy have prevented the carnage before it began? Has Zelensky's "Braveheart" approach been appropriate? Has Russian "Z" Nationalism been all smoke and mirrors?

For weeks, there was a build up of Putin's forces on the Ukraine borders. Instead of building barricades should Zelensky  himself have "gained trust" and accepted the inevitable with regard to the unsettled eastern areas of his country. Should Putin have figured out that the cost of full invasion would have been so damaging to his country and countrymen?

The parents of the hundreds of children who have perished, the bereaved of the thousands who have been killed, both Ukrainians and Russians, would likely think that way.

 

 

[kirku 1,332]

34 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

For weeks, there was a build up of Putin's forces on the Ukraine borders. Instead of building barricades should Zelensky  himself have "gained trust" and accepted the inevitable with regard to the unsettled eastern areas of his country. 

"She was wearing a miniskirt, practically asking for it"

[Yellow Fever 3,763]

I struggle to see any negotiated settlement until either Putin achieves his minimum aims (control of Luhansk & Donbass) as client states or annexed into Russia or he suffers a full military defeat.

 

Edited March 30, 2022 by Yellow Fever

[BroadstairsR 2,149]

21 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

I struggle to see any negotiated settlement until either Putin achieve his aims (control of Luhansk & Donbass) as client states or annexed into Russia or he suffers a full military defeat.

 

Is that possible when the prospect of that is when he could get even more dangerous? Chemical warfare and the use of mercenaries and hit-squads have already been employed. The threat of making it nuclear was made early on.

If the latest concessionary moves by Russia are to be believed, then he has had military defeat enough, surely?

The general view is that the penny has finally dropped that full conquest of Ukraine by conventional means is impossible. 

However, he is a wounded animal who seems to have scant regard for human life.

Edited March 30, 2022 by BroadstairsR

[horsefly 4,296]

10 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

The general view is that the penny has finally dropped that full conquest of Ukraine by conventional means is impossible. 

However, he is a wounded animal who seems to have scant regard for human life.

A few weeks ago you posted on this site calling for the appeasement to all of Putin's demands. Thank God the Ukrainians are not so craven.

[BroadstairsR 2,149]

Just now, horsefly said:

A few weeks ago you posted on this site calling for the appeasement to all of Putin's demands. Thank God the Ukrainians are not so craven.

It looks highly likely that Putin's demands that I was referring to, ie. the abandonment of intentions to align with NATO and autonomy of the Dunbas will have been achieved.

At least we have to hope so as a result of the latest concessionary talks.

Otherwise, even more of those "not so craven" Ukrainians will be going to their graves.

[kirku 1,332]

19 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

If the latest concessionary moves by Russia are to be believed, then he has had military defeat enough, surely?

The general view is that the penny has finally dropped that full conquest of Ukraine by conventional means is impossible. 

However, he is a wounded animal who seems to have scant regard for human life.

The "latest concessionary moves" never existed

Kyiv and Chernihiv were hit very hard last night

[horsefly 4,296]

4 hours ago, 7HAR1980 said:

Why? Are you disturbed by this because you should be? It's been happening for the last 8 years but the hypocritical West hasn't said boo to a goose about it! 

Brain dead and pathetic repetition of Putin propaganda. The Russians have been using the dispute over Donbas, sovereign Ukrainian territory, to militarily attack the Ukraine and support terrorist groups doing so. If you are so keen to save the lives of children then you should be calling for Russia to stop its illegal invasion and its bombing of another country's sovereign territory. 

[BroadstairsR 2,149]

2 minutes ago, kirku said:

The "latest concessionary moves" never existed

Kyiv and Chernihiv were hit very hard last night

I'm on BBC World News at the moment and noted this morning that some military expert commented that there was only limited withdrawal. I also note that Boris Johnson amongst others has said that any Russian concessions have to be viewed with suspicion.

We have to hope otherwise. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

Get your troops out of the way and then bomb it heavily.

[Yellow Fever 3,763]

13 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

I'm on BBC World News at the moment and noted this morning that some military expert commented that there was only limited withdrawal. I also note that Boris Johnson amongst others has said that any Russian concessions have to be viewed with suspicion.

We have to hope otherwise. 

I'm sure what Putin hopes is that he can hold his positions around Kyiv etc with reduced troops (any Ukrainian advances he will paint as a loss of trust in the negotiations) while he redeploys what remains to the East.

Frankly the Ukrainians have done far better than anybody expected and with the slightly more offensive 'stand-off' weapons from the West I suspect are capable of retaking the East too.

This is now a proxy war between the forces of authoritarianism and liberal democracies. Putin has to be seen to fail.

[horsefly 4,296]

32 minutes ago, BroadstairsR said:

It looks highly likely that Putin's demands that I was referring to, ie. the abandonment of intentions to align with NATO and autonomy of the Dunbas will have been achieved.

At least we have to hope so as a result of the latest concessionary talks.

Otherwise, even more of those "not so craven" Ukrainians will be going to their graves.

The idea that these were the only demands of Putin you were "referring to" in your previous posts suggests you haven't re-read them.  You seem to have forgotten you said the following: 

"Zelensky has got it wrong. His stance costs thousands and may be millions of his fellow countrymen's lives, the eventual destruction of his country and the risk of WW3. He should give way to Russian demands" (12/03/22) ( Feel free to remind us what the full list of Russian demands were at that time).

"The only victory in all this will result from appeasement and not dying bravely in the streets." (12/03)

"My view is that the majority of Russians do not want to return to the days of the USSR.. Putin is a relic. A dangerous relic that can only be dealt with by appeasement because he has managed to assume ultimate power of a country with undeniable powers." (12/03)

 

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