NHS to sack up to 80,000 unjabbed employees...

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10413305/More-60-000-unvaccinated-NHS-workers-face-sack.html

I suspect a proportion will get jabbed when they realise the government is serious, but isn't that an insane number of employees for the NHS to lose?

And will the subsequent shortage of staff simply be a convenient excuse to push more resources towards third party / outsourced provision? 

Edited January 18, 2022 by TeemuVanBasten

[KernowCanary 214]

The BBC News website even went as low as using the word “Refusenik” yesterday when mentioning the similar Austrian laws.

This decade sucks, stupid made up words and a virus and we are only two years in. Bring me back to the 90s, much better times until everything fell to sh*t.

As for this, it’s ridiculous to lose that many staff, there are enough shortages as there already are. Hopefully they’ll realise how serious this is and get their jabs.

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

How can anyone be working in the NHS and not willing to have one? It doesn't make sense. Why else are you working in the NHS if it isn't to help with health matters?

[Surfer 1,547]

Well a couple of points here - the first is there are many types of people (job types) employed by the NHS, this does not mean they are all nurses or doctors. The second is the outcome is in their hands. This is their choice, and it is their choice, not their employer - the NHS’s duty of care is not to them, it is to patients health. 

[littleyellowbirdie 2,510]

1 hour ago, keelansgrandad said:

How can anyone be working in the NHS and not willing to have one? It doesn't make sense. Why else are you working in the NHS if it isn't to help with health matters?

We have doctors here in France who warn people off vaccination, and doctors and nurses who give unvaccinated people genuine vaccine certificates for a fee. I can't get my head around actual health professionals who are paranoid about science and medicine. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

21 hours ago, keelansgrandad said:

How can anyone be working in the NHS and not willing to have one? It doesn't make sense. Why else are you working in the NHS if it isn't to help with health matters?

Well I'll judge on a case-by-case basis, but one nurse was in the paper saying that she didn't want the jab because she currently has heart inflammation.

Now, I actually got heart palpitations from my second jab. If I knowingly had heart inflammation I would not have had my booster jab, so I'll just people on their own merits and reasoning.

I'd be surprised if she couldn't get a medical exemption though?  

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

21 hours ago, Surfer said:

Well a couple of points here - the first is there are many types of people (job types) employed by the NHS, this does not mean they are all nurses or doctors.

This only applies to patient-facing employees though, you can be unvaccinated without losing your job if you have no patient contact.

The 80,000 are the unvaccinated who have contact with patients, whether that is as a doctor, nurse, ward clerk, radiographer, or porter.

It doesn't apply to those who work in office buildings doing scheduling or HR or whatever, it only applies to frontline staff.

[Surfer 1,547]

Well, that's an even more reasonable requirement then. 

[Iwans Big Toe 312]

Lets just hope none of you championing 80,000 people losing their jobs require specialist treatment in the near future, just to find the NHS unable to provide it as they've sacked all the specialist doctors because they refused to take a 'vaccine'.

 

 

 

[Rock The Boat 1,325]

I would ask myself what do the medical staff know about the vaccine that makes them refuse to get vaccinated. What are we not being told about the vaccine?

[Capt. Pants 4,195]

We'll never know of course but it would be ironic if the loss of valuable NHS jobs causes more deaths than the actual virus itself. 

Seems really out of step with the announcement today.

[Surfer 1,547]

Maybe health care workers who don’t care about the health of their patients should find another occupation…. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

20 hours ago, Iwans Big Toe said:

Lets just hope none of you championing 80,000 people losing their jobs require specialist treatment in the near future, just to find the NHS unable to provide it as they've sacked all the specialist doctors because they refused to take a 'vaccine'.

 

 

 

Nobody is championing the sacking of staff. Merely questioning why anyone wouldn't have the jab when they work in the health system. Answer that one instead of your assertion.

And it was never going to happen. Thanks to continued bullshine about the NHS being the jewel in the Crown, successive Governments have done nothing to bring it up to date both financially and employment wise. So the NHS is probably already 80K short let alone sacking more.

[The Real Buh 3,423]

Prepare yourself for a weird, intrusive future where free will is an algorithm and you own nothing including your thoughts.

[Yellow Fever 3,747]

37 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

Nobody is championing the sacking of staff. Merely questioning why anyone wouldn't have the jab when they work in the health system. Answer that one instead of your assertion.

And it was never going to happen. Thanks to continued bullshine about the NHS being the jewel in the Crown, successive Governments have done nothing to bring it up to date both financially and employment wise. So the NHS is probably already 80K short let alone sacking more.

There is already at least one vaccine that your need anyway to work in the NHS - hepB for instance. 

[Surfer 1,547]

Buh, that’s quite a jump from requiring specific occupations to have minimum qualifications and vaccination status. 

Edited January 20, 2022 by Surfer

[Rock The Boat 1,325]

14 hours ago, Surfer said:

Maybe health care workers who don’t care about the health of their patients should find another occupation…. 

This is the point we should be asking, Surfer. Have we really been employing 80,000 health care workers who don't care about the health of their patients? If they do care about their patients, what is it about the vaccine that prevents them from having it? As health care workers they should be able to explain. Of course, there is a problem that all anti-vaxxers have been painted as some kind of malevolent, thuggish mob which means we never get the chance to hear their side of the story. And with 80,000 about to lose their jobs and the impact that will have on the health service, we have a right to know all sides of what is going on.

[Surfer 1,547]

I agree we should, and if the explanations start out as "the government will track my movements" or "it's my body, my choice" then we'll know it's a whole load of social media amplified BS.... I bet there are not anywhere near 80,000 front-line staff with genuine medical reasons not to be vaccinated. 

And strangely their issue seems to only be with this vaccine .... 

p.s. the first duty of all medical staff is "do no harm" - knowingly raising the risk of transmitting a highly infectious and potentially deadly disease to vulnerable patients seems to violate that basic principle does it not?

 

Edited January 21, 2022 by Surfer

[Midlands Yellow 3,935]

15 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

There is already at least one vaccine that your need anyway to work in the NHS - hepB for instance. 

Really? First I’ve heard and I work for them. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

4 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Really? First I’ve heard and I work for them. 

My golf mate is a retired male nurse and he told me he had to have the hepatitis jab.

[Yellow Fever 3,747]

6 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Really? First I’ve heard and I work for them. 

Depends if you mean a legal requirement or just the NHS trust (the employers) policy.

Basically if you come into contact with patients you'ld be expected to be vaccinated (with limited exceptions) - or else moved to a place where you wouldn't present a risk to patients (and the trust then get sued!). I'm sure there are back room NHS positions where it wouldn't be so much of problem i.e. accounts.

However the broader salient point is that vaccination is effectively required to fulfil certain jobs - & that rubicon was crossed years ago and accepted by such staff. It's just sensible for all.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Yellow Fever
https://www.workingwellglos.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/Countywide-Staff-Screening-and-Immunisation-Policy.pdf

[Midlands Yellow 3,935]

14 minutes ago, Yellow Fever said:

Depends if you mean a legal requirement or just the NHS trust (the employers) policy.

Basically if you come into contact with patients you'ld be expected to be vaccinated (with limited exceptions) - or else moved to a place where you wouldn't present a risk to patients (and the trust then get sued!). I'm sure there are back room NHS positions where it wouldn't be so much of problem i.e. accounts.

However the broader salient point is that vaccination is effectively required to fulfil certain jobs - & that rubicon was crossed years ago and accepted by such staff. It's just sensible for all.

Certainly never been a requirement in mental health and that’s hands on too like general nursing. 

[Surfer 1,547]

4 hours ago, Midlands Yellow said:

Certainly never been a requirement in mental health and that’s hands on too like general nursing. 

Well maybe in mental health you don't have patients with a physical illness, recent surgery, or other vulnerabilities to consider.