Cantwell rumours

[kingsway 94]

17 minutes ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

I really dont see who would be paying £10m + add odds for him at the moment

We'd be lucky to get £5m +add ons to bring it closer to 8...and a sell on clause

I was being very very overly optimistic which I hinted on in my post when I suggested I'd be gutted if we paid £10M for a player of a similar Cantwell level!

 

In fact given Cantwells complete lack of end product this season, the fact he can't get in our current s hite team and his seemingly bad attitude, I'd be happy with £5M!

[Samwam27 519]

For me bottom line is he hasnt been fancied by two managers this season which we're half way through. Something is amiss and doesn't look like it will be resolved.

If he went we wouldn't miss him, and maybe if a good deal can be struck, it will benefit all parties. Its disappointing as the platform was laid for him to take a starring role, and for reasons we dont know it just hasnt happened 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

9 minutes ago, Samwam27 said:

For me bottom line is he hasnt been fancied by two managers this season which we're half way through. Something is amiss and doesn't look like it will be resolved.

If he went we wouldn't miss him, and maybe if a good deal can be struck, it will benefit all parties. Its disappointing as the platform was laid for him to take a starring role, and for reasons we dont know it just hasnt happened 

He's a write off at this point.

If we can get a few million for him and bring in Hourihane or somebody else who may chip in with a couple of goals this season and then help us put up a promotion challenge next season then we should do.

 

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

23 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

If a player can allow themselves to be played like a puppet by advisors who blow smoke up their ars*s but who won't return their calls as soon as they hang up their gloves then it isn't the advisors themselves that are the problem... but a lack of intelligence of the footballer.

Gary Neville did ok for himself as somebody who negotiated all of his own contracts didn't he, didn't let somebody mug him for 10%. Employs 600 people now in Manchester.

Think Neville may have been somewhat more educated/intelligent academically than Cantwell, not to mention that he'd have been earning plenty and then some at Man Utd as a key player there for years. Some degree of victim-blaming the manipulated there, assuming of course that Todd's advisors are indeed the problem. Then again, if Cantwell ends up getting a move and doubling his money, no doubt it'll be considered good in his world. Just annoying as **** for us.

By definition, "blowing smoke up their a-rses" is manipulation. That's the lookout of the manipulator, not the victim.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 minute ago, TheGunnShow said:

Think Neville may have been somewhat more educated/intelligent academically than Cantwell, not to mention that he'd have been earning plenty and then some at Man Utd as a key player there for years. Some degree of victim-blaming the manipulated there, assuming of course that Todd's advisors are indeed the problem. Then again, if Cantwell ends up getting a move and doubling his money, no doubt it'll be considered good in his world. Just annoying as **** for us.

By definition, "blowing smoke up their a-rses" is manipulation. That's the lookout of the manipulator, not the victim.

Are we saying different things?

I'm saying that Cantwell is thick, and you appear to be saying the same. 

[lake district canary 4,531]

I wouldn't mind betting that Cantwell needed Farke more than he realised - that Farke was the one that would bring out the best in him, if he had only listened.  But as he said in his tweet a while ago "we didn't always agree" - and that is a big clue as to why it hasn't worked out.  Farke had left him out once before and told him to get focussed and to his credit he did, but this season he didn't get himself right, for whatever reason - ego probably - and Smith has plainly seen nothing to warrant bringing him back in either.

 

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

15 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Are we saying different things?

I'm saying that Cantwell is thick, and you appear to be saying the same. 

I'm saying he might not be as well educated, or at least not as academically minded. Neville always struck me as being pretty sharp considering that many professional footballers tend to be relatively less well schooled. His writing and punditry also strikes me as being pretty well put-together, thoughtful, and analytical even if I don't always agree with him.

Still doesn't detract from the main issue, which is that if it does indeed boil down to bad advice from mercenary advisors, the blame's more on them than the player. Would be nice if the player could see through it, but we are dealing with football agents, who basically sell BS for a living.

[glory.win or die. 270]

As far as I can tell this all stems from him sitting on the pitch 2 seasons ago in the prem which Webber called out in the media.

I gave him benefit of the doubt then, perhaps naively but everything he seems to do know seems to be about image over performance.

It's a shame because he has talent, but is wasting it, and has had almost 2 years now of contributing virtually nothing other than a handful of games last season. That goal v sheff wed was sublime.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

9 minutes ago, glory.win or die. said:

As far as I can tell this all stems from him sitting on the pitch 2 seasons ago in the prem which Webber called out in the media.

I gave him benefit of the doubt then, perhaps naively but everything he seems to do know seems to be about image over performance.

It's a shame because he has talent, but is wasting it, and has had almost 2 years now of contributing virtually nothing other than a handful of games last season. That goal v sheff wed was sublime.

Well it was 10 days after the pitch sitting incident that I called out him doing his pre-match warm up like this....

But got heavily criticised on here, because apparently him being local means that he should get a free pass, with a few frequent posters claiming I was "jealous". 

(Pitch sitting was Brighton at home, 4th July, this really professional warm up was Chelsea away 14th July).

Edited December 29, 2021 by TeemuVanBasten

[The Bristol Nest 513]

The Cantwell ship has seemingly sailed. It's a shame but so many players shine at youth level but don't mature into top players. 

[WD40 720]

3 minutes ago, The Bristol Nest said:

The Cantwell ship has seemingly sailed. It's a shame but so many players shine at youth level but don't mature into top players. 

Skilful player at a lower level, but not so much that it disguises his lack of pace or physicality to be a top player. 24 now, and well and truly stalled. Vardy was a later bloomer but he had bags of pace, physicality and determination to get to the top. And he did. 

[kingsway 94]

Nail hit firmly on the head WD40!

 

The lack of pace and physicality means he will not do ought in the Prem! - Add to that a very suspect attitude and hes no loss!

Edited December 29, 2021 by kingsway

[Newtopia 517]

3 hours ago, Jersey Canary said:

If we put some of the rumours together, Villa interested in Toddwell, we’re interested in El Ghazi and Hourihane. Maybe a straight swap plus us having a sell on clause. 
 

Our team could look like this…

                        Pukki

Rachica      Hourihane     El Ghazi

                 Normann  Sorensen

Williams   Gibson   Hanley   Byram

                      Krul

That looks a far better, more potent team. 

 

I like the idea of an experience play maker coming in, (I watched Lallana with real jealousy against Chelsea) really do not see the point of El Ghazi (We already have Placheta, Tzolis, Rashica, plus Rowe from the U23’s for pace).  If we sell Todd, (and possibly Max) for any meaningful cash, I would bring in 2 strong and disciplined central defensive midfielders, make ourselves hard to breakdown in the middle.  
I agree Idah needs to go somewhere and play lots of matches.
If we are definitely giving up on staying up would Pukki want to stay?

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

2 minutes ago, Newtopia said:

I like the idea of an experience play maker coming in, (I watched Lallana with real jealousy against Chelsea) really do not see the point of El Ghazi (We already have Placheta, Tzolis, Rashica, plus Rowe from the U23’s for pace).  If we sell Todd, (and possibly Max) for any meaningful cash, I would bring in 2 strong and disciplined central defensive midfielders, make ourselves hard to breakdown in the middle.  
I agree Idah needs to go somewhere and play lots of matches.
If we are definitely giving up on staying up would Pukki want to stay?

El Ghazi scored 10 Premier League goals last season from the right wing, where we are currently playing Josh Sargent, how could you possibly "not see the point" in him coming in?

[Newtopia 517]

Just now, TeemuVanBasten said:

El Ghazi scored 10 Premier League goals last season from the right wing, where we are currently playing Josh Sargent, how could you possibly "not see the point" in him coming in?

If we are going to spend cash (on wages or transfers) on bringing in new players, I would sign players where we have holes in the squad.  Currently we lose the ball too easily in transition and do not win it back in critical areas.  So I would bring in 2 strong central defensive midfielders.

We have lots of options on the wing, trickery and speed.  I am not against El Ghazi as a player, but there are few concerns I would have; firstly I think if someone was feeding the existing wide men better we would be scoring more goals, secondly I would have thought El Ghazi’s wages would cause problems in the squad, and finally we need to evolve the squad not ripe it apart, I think bringing El Ghazi in would mean Placheta, Dowell, and / or Tzolis needing to leave either permanently or on loan.

All just opinions, I wonder what DS thinks

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

4 minutes ago, Newtopia said:

If we are going to spend cash (on wages or transfers) on bringing in new players, I would sign players where we have holes in the squad.  Currently we lose the ball too easily in transition and do not win it back in critical areas.  So I would bring in 2 strong central defensive midfielders.

We have lots of options on the wing, trickery and speed.  I am not against El Ghazi as a player, but there are few concerns I would have; firstly I think if someone was feeding the existing wide men better we would be scoring more goals, secondly I would have thought El Ghazi’s wages would cause problems in the squad, and finally we need to evolve the squad not ripe it apart, I think bringing El Ghazi in would mean Placheta, Dowell, and / or Tzolis needing to leave either permanently or on loan.

All just opinions, I wonder what DS thinks

El Ghazi apparently on £30k a week, which isn't ridiculous money.

El Ghazi was a regular under Dean Smith for his entire tenure at Villa, so I should imagine he'd quite like him here.

Surely Cantwell leaving makes the room in the squad for his arrival.

[Jersey Canary 143]

27 minutes ago, Newtopia said:

I like the idea of an experience play maker coming in, (I watched Lallana with real jealousy against Chelsea) really do not see the point of El Ghazi (We already have Placheta, Tzolis, Rashica, plus Rowe from the U23’s for pace).  If we sell Todd, (and possibly Max) for any meaningful cash, I would bring in 2 strong and disciplined central defensive midfielders, make ourselves hard to breakdown in the middle.  
I agree Idah needs to go somewhere and play lots of matches.
If we are definitely giving up on staying up would Pukki want to stay?

I agree 100%. I said about buying 2 DM with the Max money to make us more solid.

[AJ 1,218]

29 minutes ago, WD40 said:

Skilful player at a lower level, but not so much that it disguises his lack of pace or physicality to be a top player. 24 now, and well and truly stalled. Vardy was a later bloomer but he had bags of pace, physicality and determination to get to the top. And he did. 

Possibly, but players like Hoolahan, Lalana, or even Maddison don't have a massive amount of pace but have still been very effective in AM positions. I think Cantwells issue was he looked quite good centrally in our last prem season but we've been playing him as a winger since then. Maybe the answer is to try him in the CAM/SS position which could in turn stop Pukki being so isolated

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

13 minutes ago, Newtopia said:

If we are going to spend cash (on wages or transfers) on bringing in new players, I would sign players where we have holes in the squad.  Currently we lose the ball too easily in transition and do not win it back in critical areas.  So I would bring in 2 strong central defensive midfielders.

We have lots of options on the wing, trickery and speed.  I am not against El Ghazi as a player, but there are few concerns I would have; firstly I think if someone was feeding the existing wide men better we would be scoring more goals, secondly I would have thought El Ghazi’s wages would cause problems in the squad, and finally we need to evolve the squad not ripe it apart, I think bringing El Ghazi in would mean Placheta, Dowell, and / or Tzolis needing to leave either permanently or on loan.

All just opinions, I wonder what DS thinks

Yep, I'd agree with the defensive midfielders as well. I think we've enough attacking firepower in theory with Rashica, Pukki, Sargent, Placheta, etc., the problem is we don't provide a good enough platform for them to consistently attack as we're lacking a bit defensively to consistently repel the opposition.

[Branston Pickle 3,635]

1 hour ago, Samwam27 said:

For me bottom line is he hasnt been fancied by two managers this season which we're half way through. Something is amiss and doesn't look like it will be resolved.

If he went we wouldn't miss him, and maybe if a good deal can be struck, it will benefit all parties. Its disappointing as the platform was laid for him to take a starring role, and for reasons we dont know it just hasnt happened 

those are pretty much my thoughts - it does seem that it’s decision time for Todd; if we aren’t using him and aren’t going to we might as well cash in whatever value he has left before we get to the summer and (effectively) his last 12 months.

It’s a huge shame as there’s clearly a good player in there and we’d obviously benefit if he were to regain his mojo with us, but the signs aren’t promising.  He was given chances by Smith but didn’t take them, and appears to have lost ‘something’.  

[Newtopia 517]

18 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

El Ghazi apparently on £30k a week, which isn't ridiculous money.

El Ghazi was a regular under Dean Smith for his entire tenure at Villa, so I should imagine he'd quite like him here.

Surely Cantwell leaving makes the room in the squad for his arrival.

All good points, I would replace Cantwell with an experienced play maker, so I would look to move out at least one more of the other wingers if we brought in El Ghazi, although possibly more as need space for Rowe to get involved.

I guess the critical question is what formation does Dean Smith want to play?  To play that formation what mix of players does he want in the squad.  I liked 4 2 3 1, and currently I can’t see anyone to play CDM in our squad except Normann, so I think we need 2 of them.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Newtopia

[Danke bitte 965]

2 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Are we saying different things?

I'm saying that Cantwell is thick, and you appear to be saying the same. 

I don’t disagree with your posts often but calling Cantwell “thick” is a bit much. How you do categorise “thick”? Because he doesn’t have a BA in football? Reminds me of your chastisement of Placheta who you referred to as a player that should work in retail. I worked in retail, I also have a BA. Todd’s family is smart and hard working, just because, as a young man, he posts pretty mind numbing social media content, doesn’t quality him as stupid. Just someone who’s desperate to play the attention seeking media game most of us subscribe to. 

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

1 minute ago, Danke bitte said:

I don’t disagree with your posts often but calling Cantwell “thick” is a bit much. How you do categorise “thick”? Because he doesn’t have a BA in football? Reminds me of your chastisement of Placheta who you referred to as a player that should work in retail. I worked in retail, I also have a BA. Todd’s family is smart and hard working, just because, as a young man, he posts pretty mind numbing social media content, doesn’t quality him as stupid. Just someone who’s desperate to play the attention seeking media game most of us subscribe to. 

If we subscribe to Gardner's theory of multiple intelligence, whether one has a degree or not is a pretty poor way of determine whether somebody is intelligent or not.

Most people have worked in retail, its pretty much a rite of passage. I said that he should work in retail because he wasn't very good at football, not because I think there is a anything wrong with working in retail, just that you don't get paid £10,000 a week or whatever he will be on to work in Next. 

I just think he massively lacks in self awareness and has obviously allowed people with vested interests to blow smoke up his **** and manipulate him, he's ended up thinking that he belongs in the Champions League and the jury is out on whether he's going to be of any use to anybody in the Premier League again. 

[Danke bitte 965]

5 minutes ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

If we subscribe to Gardner's theory of multiple intelligence, whether one has a degree or not is a pretty poor way of determine whether somebody is intelligent or not.

Most people have worked in retail, its pretty much a rite of passage. I said that he should work in retail because he wasn't very good at football, not because I think there is a anything wrong with working in retail, just that you don't get paid £10,000 a week or whatever he will be on to work in Next. 

I just think he massively lacks in self awareness and has obviously allowed people with vested interests to blow smoke up his **** and manipulate him, he's ended up thinking that he belongs in the Champions League and the jury is out on whether he's going to be of any use to anybody in the Premier League again. 

I agree with all of this. That’s exactly how I feel about Todd. It’s just use of language can misinterpret context. With all due respect I think you’re just a bit overly blunt sometimes and people may take it the wrong way just as I did there. 

For me Todd is a great prospect he’s just let himself get too ahead of himself through whatever avenues. I come from Dereham and he’s viewed as a bit of a hero, I also have closer connections than most. Just a bit annoyed he’s not managed to lose that big fish mentality when I know he comes from humble backgrounds. A background that could inspire some of the kids in that backwater town 

[kenfoggo 247]

I would like to see Cantwell leave promptly in January, for any fee to any club willing to take on a disruptive, underperforming, petulant, immature, overrated, lightweight , waster. Perhaps he will find fulfilment with a team and coach who values these qualities. I suspect no club will be good enough for Cantwell, a legend in his own mind only.

[canarybubbles 1,915]

I certainly don't read Cantwell as unintelligent. My personal view FWIW is that he is a narcissist and a manipulator and the dressing room will be much better off without him, but obviously this is just my impression and could be wrong. What is certain is that he doesn't want to be here, so there's no point in keeping him. Sell for whatever we can get, even if the upfront figure is low, but make sure there are lots of add-ons in case he suddenly starts to perform again as soon as he's got what he wants.

[Hoolahoop14 124]

I’d much rather see him going out on loan in all honesty. Send him out to a upper mid-table/Play Off chasing Championship side and see if there’s still a player there at all. If he has a blinder for them, brilliant, it’ll add to his value or may even re-ignite his spark and end up with him being back to his best for us. If it goes terribly, then we know he’s a lost cause and we can sell him to whoever comes calling.

[Jim Smith 2,314]

14 hours ago, shruk4 said:

Normann out for the season. He looks a bit too good for the season. Very sad but we will probably never see him in a Norwich shirt. The only new player I had really fallen in love with 

Via a friend of a friend sort of source but he told someone 8 weeks apparently. 

[Jim Smith 2,314]

10 hours ago, Newtopia said:

I like the idea of an experience play maker coming in, (I watched Lallana with real jealousy against Chelsea) really do not see the point of El Ghazi (We already have Placheta, Tzolis, Rashica, plus Rowe from the U23’s for pace).  If we sell Todd, (and possibly Max) for any meaningful cash, I would bring in 2 strong and disciplined central defensive midfielders, make ourselves hard to breakdown in the middle.  
I agree Idah needs to go somewhere and play lots of matches.
If we are definitely giving up on staying up would Pukki want to stay?

I absolutely agree. We need a defensive midfielder and we also need to get Gibson out of the starting line up as he’s far too slow. 

[Commonsense 618]

11 hours ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

El Ghazi scored 10 Premier League goals last season from the right wing, where we are currently playing Josh Sargent, how could you possibly "not see the point" in him coming in?

Cantwell scored 6 the previous season for a bottom of the table team, but you constantly criticise and demean him.