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Winning 25

A DISASTROUS mistake to sack Farke

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I know he was probably still reeling from the 10 straight defeats at the end of the 19/20 season, but I can't help but wonder what position we'd be in if we stuck with last season's squad with Rashica replacing Emi and Sorenson taking Skipp's place, plus an upgrade on the dreadfully out of depth McLean (maybe Mowatt from Barnsley? Surely he'd have preferred a crack at the Prem with us over WBA?). Add Normann and a domestic loan or two that weren't dreadful and I think Farkeball, with the superior defence we had compared to two years ago, keeps us up.

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1 hour ago, Danbury Yellow said:

Imagine if he hadn’t been sacked.  I suspect the results would be pretty similar to where we are now, and Daniel would be getting a torrid time at the matches and certainly on here.  
He has left with his head held high and that is probably the best outcome we could have wished for, for a much loved manager. 
 

Can't disagree with this. If we kept Farke on it would not have been pretty. 

Aso, I assume you're from Danbury near Chelmsford?

 

 

 

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Farke had run out of steam and the squad needed a different voice to listen to. The squads not good enough whoevers in charge, this season all about building for the future and trying to avoid unwanted records.

 

Had Farke not been sacked the current toxic atmosphere would be partly directed at him so for a man who made a brilliant impact on this club, getting let go when he did was for the best.

 

I think a lot of the problems are due to Webbers poor recruitment and maybe its come time to consider messrs Smith and Jones think about selling out to suitable persons who can take the club to the next level.

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Farke (loved the guy) was sacked quite rightly and the timing was perfect in my opinion, just after that win allowed him a great send-off.   
 

Farke had to go, couldn’t set up the team to be at least competitive…. Basics when your fixtures are Liverpool and Man City is to park the bus, make it difficult and frustrate…. He didn’t do that so we’re 0-8, no points, already bottom and demoralised… and don’t forget, he pretty much wrote those first 4 games off, what did he expect to happen.   He just wasn’t ready for this level of cut throat competition and consequently the players are all too naive!

If you’ve said we should have kept Farke on here, why?    Had we kept him, his reputation right now (as some sensible poster has said - @danburyyellow) would be destroyed.   
 

Some fans, dear oh dear!  

Edited by ged in the onion bag
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Webber has in hindsight made some pretty disastrous mistakes, giving Farke a 4 year contract being one of them. 

I don’t think sacking him was, he’d proven he couldn’t get this squad to punch above its weight and he went at the right time for both him and the club IMO. He wasn’t a fall guy, he was just a single part of the wider problem.

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Apart from Webber's initial wave of recruitment when Farke first arrived, the rest have been woeful. Who is scouting these players? Who on earth thought that the players we got in this summer would be able to cut it? Only Norman is anywhere near the level we need.

I know we all look through our yellow and green tinted glasses, but let's be honest, apart from maybe 2 or 3 exceptions, the team that got us promoted are no better than squad player level in the Prem, oh and we sold the best of them before we kicked a ball.

Farke was on a hiding to nothing again, as is Smith now.

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1 hour ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Webber is no fraud, Mr Wrong!   He’s done some magnificent work here.   He’s made some mistakes, some big mistakes and it hasn’t worked how we’d all hoped.   He’s no fraud though, you’re out of order…. ? Did you pick up that phrase on here and copy it or was it you that thought of it?   Bet you can’t justify that statement with evidence…. You’ll might try and someone will then tell you that’s not fraud!     

Mr Right is always right unlike onion boy! 
 

The comment below you explained everything in crystal clear detail and Mr Right thanks him for that 

 

Mr right suspects Stuart Webber has no need for toilet role when bag of onions is around....

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6 minutes ago, Mr right said:

Mr Right is always right unlike onion boy! 
 

The comment below you explained everything in crystal clear detail and Mr Right thanks him for that 

 

Mr right suspects Stuart Webber has no need for toilet role when bag of onions is around....

Classic - all the hallmarks of an idiot, couldn’t articulate an answer so straight to insults!     

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2 minutes ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Classic - all the hallmarks of an idiot, couldn’t articulate an answer so straight to insults!     

Mr Right suspects you’ve been chopping onions..... as you can’t stop crying.

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I really don’t think it would be any different if we had or had’t sacked farke. I fully believe we didn’t do enough to retain emi, I feel we should of given him what he wanted in wages and said keep us up, prove yourself and go in January or end of summer depending on our position in the league. We have done a spurs with our money when they sold Bale.

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Definitely think Farke ended up a bit of a fall guy, but I remember writing before that arguably the saddest bit about Farke going, if we ignore the fact he left on a win, or indeed was sacked in Brentford's away dressing room was that for a man who had given us so much good football in four years (well, three, we'll ignore that first season) he'd really earned an opportunity to stay for ages but seemed congenitally unable to take it.

He kept managing to get the door down, but couldn't get through to the other side. And he did it when getting the team to play some of the most consistently entertaining, technically excellent football we've seen in decades, and with plenty of our own youth lads playing key roles in there.

We bought him in to carry out a radical overhaul, selling off expensive players who had basically failed, cutting the wage bill so we had financial room to breathe (and even then we had to sell Maddison at the end of his first season otherwise we were close to administration and therefore a Derby County). He demonstrated a talent for quickly integrating young talent and forming a functional team out of them. And when he quickly stepped in for the likes of Grant Hanley after we got honked by Millwall, he'd shown he was a quick learner. Maddison went? No problem, Buendia steps up. Got to the Premier League - Cantwell stepped up after looking like a classic loan candidate. And he's got Omobamidele through late.

In terms of consolidating us, making us a choice destination for young players to join, and putting us on a far more solid financial footing, Farke's been wonderful for us. The fact most of us found his football so enjoyable and entertaining was the icing on the cake.

But, sadly, he couldn't take us further forward.

Edited by TheGunnShow

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1 hour ago, yellowrider120 said:

The only mistake in sacking Farke was that it should have been done MUCH SOONER than it was!

How much sooner? Pre season or before we won the Championship with our record points tally? 

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18 minutes ago, Winning 25 said:

How much sooner? Pre season or before we won the Championship with our record points tally? 

You’ve played a blinder there winning25 

 

Mr Right respects this.

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2 hours ago, ged in the onion bag said:

Classic - all the hallmarks of an idiot, couldn’t articulate an answer so straight to insults!     

There's no place for name calling on this thread onion bag. I don't think anyone deserves to be called an idiot. It's not big, it's not clever and it's not what we, as Norwich City supporters do. Can you imagine Daniel Farke calling anyone an idiot? He would never do it. OUT OF RESPECT. Stuart Webber on the other hand would call us all idiots and much, much worse, without any hesitation. That's what we've become is it. Good guys never make it, so we'll be nasty Norwich now? That's very sad

Edited by Winning 25
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38 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:


But, sadly, he couldn't take us further forward.

I agreed with your post up until this conclusion which assumes he was given the tools to "take us forward" - was he?

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Just now, kirku said:

I agreed with your post up until this conclusion which assumes he was given the tools to "take us forward" - was he?

We don't know for sure right now. That's the point - only time will tell.

At best we could only go off previous evidence. I'll argue that the mitigating circumstances were certainly quite hefty, but the more critical can also point out the statistical evidence. But the answer will only come in time. 

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FWIW, I think Webber has an innate desire to be the "special one" who flies in the face of convention and is hailed as a "genius" (which Delia has already done..).

We can see this in his comments regarding McNally - Portakabins, SoccerBots, RvWs, Sargents. Glass houses and all that.

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Wasn’t Daniel Farke head coach when we lost ten consecutive Premier League games after Project Restart, and then another 7 this season to make it 17? And with a PL win % of around 12%? Remember him for the two brilliant Championship seasons and not the awful record he had in the Premier League.

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4 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

We don't know for sure right now. That's the point - only time will tell.

At best we could only go off previous evidence. I'll argue that the mitigating circumstances were certainly quite hefty, but the more critical can also point out the statistical evidence. But the answer will only come in time. 

Personally, I think we've all seen enough to evaluate the summer's business. And it isn't pretty.

 

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1 minute ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Wasn’t Daniel Farke head coach when we lost ten consecutive Premier League games after Project Restart, and then another 7 this season to make it 17? And with a PL win % of around 12%? Remember him for the two brilliant Championship seasons and not the awful record he had in the Premier League.

You could hold Farke culpable if there were concrete evidence that the players at his disposal were clearly capable of better results and performances - do you think they were capable of that?

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Just now, kirku said:

Personally, I think we've all seen enough to evaluate the summer's business. And it isn't pretty.

 

I'd rather hold back a fair bit there to be honest. Prime examples would be the late emergences of Vrancic and Stiepermann. Both of those guys took a long time to get going, but came up smelling of roses when they did.

I'll accept that the trend isn't good as we currently stand, but a season often ebbs and flows. We were rather chirpier as a fan base after that close defeat to Man Utd. We're largely sullen and angry now.

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1 minute ago, kirku said:

You could hold Farke culpable if there were concrete evidence that the players at his disposal were clearly capable of better results and performances - do you think they were capable of that?

Like others have said, he did have a near fully fit squad at the start of the season, and in my opinion we would have picked up more results if Dean Smith had been in charge. I also think Dean Smith might have worked with Webber to bring in different types of players that might have been better equipped for the Premier League. All my opinion of course but I really think the recent disruptions have really impacted on our game plans for the last few matches.

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No one can take us forward as we are! We spent 50 million on players who wanted to come within our structure and we’re still going down!

When / if we get relegated I’d be happier to be going into a championship season with Farke at the helm than Smith!

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2 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

I'd rather hold back a fair bit there to be honest. Prime examples would be the late emergences of Vrancic and Stiepermann. Both of those guys took a long time to get going, but came up smelling of roses when they did.

I'll accept that the trend isn't good as we currently stand, but a season often ebbs and flows. We were rather chirpier as a fan base after that close defeat to Man Utd. We're largely sullen and angry now.

The problem is that we needed signings for the here and now, in order to "learn the lessons from previous windows".

We were promised better athletes who could compete physically. We got Gilmour and PLM.

We expected faster wingers who would help us play better on the break and faster in transition. We got Tzolis and Sargent.

Some of them may come good in time but when you have Emi and Skipp sized holes in the first team, you need players ready today not tomorrow.

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4 minutes ago, (Hoola)Han Solo said:

Like others have said, he did have a near fully fit squad at the start of the season, and in my opinion we would have picked up more results if Dean Smith had been in charge. I also think Dean Smith might have worked with Webber to bring in different types of players that might have been better equipped for the Premier League. All my opinion of course but I really think the recent disruptions have really impacted on our game plans for the last few matches.

Dean Smith took Buendia had a 200 million pound squad and was only three places and four points better off when they both got sacked with far less tough set of fixtures. How anyone can think Smith would have done better is beyond me! But hey ho all see it differently!

Edited by Indy
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2 minutes ago, Indy said:

When / if we get relegated I’d be happier to be going into a championship season with Farke at the helm than Smith!

Completely agree with this. I also think that Farke's credit in the bank would reduce, or at least delay, the amount of vitriol flying about at the moment

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Regarding the start of the season, let's not forget how disrupted by COVID it was and how late in the day some of the signings arrived..

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