Heart and soul ripped out of squad.

[rock bus 850]

I can almost live with the defeats and the embarrassing league position and points but what really hurts at the moment is the loss of the love for the team over the last few months.

Farke for all his faults was a man of charm and love, he also established a squad with some character and style. 
now we have a group of misfits who offer us no joy or excitement. Honestly when you see the team sheet who gives you that feeling of someone you want to cheer on? Pukki if old maybe, Krul with the dream of penalty save but none of the new players or the quite pathetic loan signings.

im not just talking about the likes of Maddison or Buendia…I’d give anything now just for a Vrancic or Stiepermann despite all their faults.

If I ever see another starting line up with McLean and Gilmour together with I will instantly forget about that game until the end.

This team is just bland and pathetic at the moment. No blame for Smith for that (although he is also a bit meh) but fault is on Webber who I am also now seeing as a charlatan.

Edited December 26, 2021 by rock bus

[YorkOTBC 2]

You're right, there is no passion or application at the moment, we seem to have completely lost our way. Not sure how we come back from this.

[lake district canary 4,531]

2 minutes ago, rock bus said:

Farke for all his faults was a man of charm and love, he also established a squad with some character and style.

I like this sentence and sums it up for me. Mistake to let him go and should have been given the authority over the players that he needed to see off the rumblings in the squad about players being left out. He was right about Cantwell and Gilmour. We lost a big character when he left. 

[TheBaldOne66 681]

1 minute ago, lake district canary said:

I like this sentence and sums it up for me. Mistake to let him go and should have been given the authority over the players that he needed to see off the rumblings in the squad about players being left out. He was right about Cantwell and Gilmour. We lost a big character when he left. 

For Gods sake get over him, he’s gone and not coming back! He had a pi55 poor record at this level yet you still wish he was here?

Geez.

[Petriix 2,834]

Absolutely. We entered the summer needing to replace Skipp, upgrade McLean and Dowell and provide some competition for Pukki and in central defence.

Letting Vrancic and Stiepermann go was catastrophic. The squad is vastly weaker now than at any point in the last 3 years.

[rock bus 850]

I’m not suggesting we bring Farke back or even suggesting we shouldn’t have sacked him. But Smith isn’t an inspiring replacement and I’m struggling to see if he has the character to change things. 
It’s not really about Farke, it’s the rubbish uninspiring signings that Webber has bought. 

[daly 500]

With this mid table Championship side can’t be expected to compete in this league

Worst part all the bickering in the team after the 5 minute goal

Another season in the Championship coming up

 

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

6 minutes ago, Petriix said:

Absolutely. We entered the summer needing to replace Skipp, upgrade McLean and Dowell and provide some competition for Pukki and in central defence.

Letting Vrancic and Stiepermann go was catastrophic. The squad is vastly weaker now than at any point in the last 3 years.

Agree with the first para, but not the bit in bold at all. Vrancic and Stiepermann were two textbook definitions of "couldn't make the leap". If we accept a main issue is a lack of power and pace in the middle of the park, then for all his technique and composure, Vrancic is never the answer. Stiepermann had more of that, but even then he looked a little anaemic in the Premier League and a shadow of his Championship self last season, with the mitigating circumstances of Epstein-Barr syndrome and then a dose of long Covid (which, I'm lead to believe, was why his contract was terminated so he could go back home for treatment).

The strongest criticism is the overreliance on Buendia for creativity and Skipp for defensive structure in the middle of the park.

[Michael Starr 519]

9 minutes ago, Petriix said:

Absolutely. We entered the summer needing to replace Skipp, upgrade McLean and Dowell and provide some competition for Pukki and in central defence.

Letting Vrancic and Stiepermann go was catastrophic. The squad is vastly weaker now than at any point in the last 3 years.

Vrancic and Stiepermann are not the answer dear lord

[rock bus 850]

2 minutes ago, Michael Starr said:

Vrancic and Stiepermann are not the answer dear lord

Correct they are definitely not the answer but really worryingly  I’d take either of them over Gilmour!

[rock bus 850]

I’d also question if there is harmony or team spirit in the squad, talk was of Farke losing the players but actually I’d imagine that they have lost all self belief in the squad as well. 

[canarybubbles 1,915]

1 hour ago, Michael Starr said:

Vrancic and Stiepermann are not the answer dear lord

Maybe not, but Vrançic made the difference in a number of games while he was here. He is the kind of player who is always underestimated in the English league because he turns a game with a moment of class rather than huffing and puffing and covering every blade of grass while achieving very little. Gilmour hasn't come close to making a difference in any of the games he's played for us, unless we count mistakes which swung a couple of games in the opposite direction.

[Petriix 2,834]

11 minutes ago, canarybubbles said:

Maybe not, but Vrançic made the difference in a number of games while he was here. He is the kind of player who is always underestimated in the English league because he turns a game with a moment of class rather than huffing and puffing and covering every blade of grass while achieving very little. Gilmour hasn't come close to making a difference in any of the games he's played for us, unless we count mistakes which swung a couple of games in the opposite direction.

Exactly this. But it's also about team cohesion. We changed too many players in a short time and lost any semblance of togetherness. 

[kingsway 94]

Sad to say its hard to disagree!

 

The squad is nowhere near up to Premier league standard and they know it now cause after the initial 3 match new manager syndrome they have lost all heart.

 

All Gilmour does is pass sideways or backwards and doesn't want to take any responsibility by pushing forward with the ball or looking to play Pukki through. So over rated its painful. 

 

Yes the team has very poor balance and cohesion. A lot of the trouble going forward is that they get into the final 3rd but are reluctant to cross the ball into the box cause theirs normally only Pukki in the box and heading in crosses is not his game. Pukkis game is running onto through balls but the team don't do that either!

 

The 21 point total of 2 seasons ago was pitiful but we don't look capable of getting near that!

 

 

Edited December 26, 2021 by kingsway

[Monty13 2,229]

2 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Agree with the first para, but not the bit in bold at all. Vrancic and Stiepermann were two textbook definitions of "couldn't make the leap". If we accept a main issue is a lack of power and pace in the middle of the park, then for all his technique and composure, Vrancic is never the answer. Stiepermann had more of that, but even then he looked a little anaemic in the Premier League and a shadow of his Championship self last season, with the mitigating circumstances of Epstein-Barr syndrome and then a dose of long Covid (which, I'm lead to believe, was why his contract was terminated so he could go back home for treatment).

The strongest criticism is the overreliance on Buendia for creativity and Skipp for defensive structure in the middle of the park.

I don’t agree on Vrancic personally. He averaged 30 mins a game in our prem season, I don’t think he started more than 6 games. Not sure he ever proved himself either way. I think he would have been a decent squad option for this year looking at our midfield and allowed some money to be spent elsewhere. 

[Capt. Pants 4,195]

2 hours ago, daly said:

With this mid table Championship side can’t be expected to compete in this league

Worst part all the bickering in the team after the 5 minute goal

Another season in the Championship coming up

 

I saw McLean and Kabak having a right go. Sad to say it's a very unhappy camp at the moment and I can see a lot of deadwood and dross leaving in the summer. Which is most of it.

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

29 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

I don’t agree on Vrancic personally. He averaged 30 mins a game in our prem season, I don’t think he started more than 6 games. Not sure he ever proved himself either way. I think he would have been a decent squad option for this year looking at our midfield and allowed some money to be spent elsewhere. 

The obvious question then, is why? What games did he start?

Throw in some fairly inconsistent showings in the Champs last season (in a partial defence, there were occasions when he was pushed into the #10 slot both in the Champs and indeed in our previous Premier League season, and he's more dangerous in the deep) and for me it was clear he wasn't making the step up consistently. Vrancic might have given us more threat with balls from deep than Gilmour, arguably the finest example being the one disallowed against Spurs when he hit Pukki from 50 yards away, but his relative lack of physicality was always evident from early days.

He's nothing to prove in the Champs and is doing it again at Stoke, but it's that leap that's the issue.

[Monty13 2,229]

7 minutes ago, TheGunnShow said:

The obvious question then, is why? What games did he start?

Throw in some fairly inconsistent showings in the Champs last season (in a partial defence, there were occasions when he was pushed into the #10 slot both in the Champs and indeed in our previous Premier League season, and he's more dangerous in the deep) and for me it was clear he wasn't making the step up consistently. Vrancic might have given us more threat with balls from deep than Gilmour, arguably the finest example being the one disallowed against Spurs when he hit Pukki from 50 yards away, but his relative lack of physicality was always evident from early days.

He's nothing to prove in the Champs and is doing it again at Stoke, but it's that leap that's the issue.

I just feel as a 3rd/4th choice is someone like Lees-Melou proving to be noticeably better? If not we could have kept Vrancic and spent the money elsewhere rather than the huge number of new faces we brought in in the summer.

[Ken Hairy 3,759]

3 hours ago, Michael Starr said:

Vrancic and Stiepermann are not the answer dear lord

But Gilmour and Dowell are?? 

[duke63 541]

We failed to address the one issue we knew was there two years ago and Webber and Farke admitted was there...we are too lightweight.

We do need a couple of big strong DMs. We could do worse than put Kabak in there in all honesty.

 

[TheGunnShow 5,932]

12 minutes ago, Monty13 said:

I just feel as a 3rd/4th choice is someone like Lees-Melou proving to be noticeably better? If not we could have kept Vrancic and spent the money elsewhere rather than the huge number of new faces we brought in in the summer.

Bit harsh on PLM - put it this way, Vrancic needed the whole of his first season to settle into life in the Championship (as indeed did Stiepermann, although in Stiepi's case, this was partially due to being played very much out of position). I'd agree PLM's not shown too much yet, but he's come into a team that's had a rebuild, whilst you're comparing Vrancic's best performances in a team that was far more settled.

If you'd been shown their histories without seeing them much or just scouting off YouTube, I'm pretty sure most of us would have picked Lees-Melou.

[Dean Coneys boots 1,398]

We replaced Buendia with Rashica - downgrade 

we replaced Vrancic with PLM- downgrade 

we replaced skipp with gilmour- downgrade 

we replaced Stieperman with Tzolis- will pay off but currently downgrade

we replaced tettey with Norman - upgrade but sicknote 

we replaced Scandinavian keeper with Gunn- expensive and no better 

we replaced Hugill for Sargeant - like for like minus 8million quid 

it really was a shockingly bad window 

[glory.win or die. 270]

3 hours ago, rock bus said:

Correct they are definitely not the answer but really worryingly  I’d take either of them over Gilmour!

I'd argue Gilmour is just a McLeitner 

[Dean Coneys boots 1,398]

Good one 

[Ken Hairy 3,759]

28 minutes ago, glory.win or die. said:

I'd argue Gilmour is just a McLeitner 

I'd rather have Leitner back any day over Gilmour. 

[kingsway 94]

I wouldn't want either not even in the Championship!

 

Leitner was got rid of cause he was way too lightweight for the top flight, unfortunately "Chelsea whizkid" Gilmour is in the same bracket! 

[WD40 720]

Simple question for you all: who’s your favourite player in this team?

[mannings bandy legs 385]

Gilmour must be the most over-hyped player we have ever seen at Carrow rd. Brings nothing. Ok with a bunch of enforcers around him ,but total sh#t without.

[Sjb 11]

6 minutes ago, mannings bandy legs said:

Gilmour must be the most over-hyped player we have ever seen at Carrow rd. Brings nothing. Ok with a bunch of enforcers around him ,but total sh#t without.

Farke didn't play him for this reason. Yet when Deano came In put him In the media creamed themselves over his backwards sideways passes. He's no fight Lightweight just rubbish he may come good but not what we need. Send him back in a Jan. 

[Sooty57 403]

5 hours ago, daly said:

Another season in the Championship coming up

 

Just the one Mrs. Wembley?