Wondering if Sorensen could do all Skipp can do. Better.

[Pugin 601]

OK, ignore 'Better', it was just decoration.

But after yesterday I honestly wonder if we have had a wonderful Premier League player hiding in plain sight. 

I feel euphoric about his display. Dean Smith must have been rubbing his eyes in disbelief.

It seems that the intro to Smith managership is nearly complete and every single player in the squad (with the possible exceptions of Idah and Lees-Melou) are ready to help us win this fight. 

[cambridgeshire canary 6,680]

Think I will judge him after a few more matches. Fair to say he looks solid, and most of all flexable. Might as well try him out as a winger or striker soon and then if Krul gets injured well sorry Gunn..

[Petriix 2,834]

Yes, I totally think Sorensen could be the closest thing to a Skipp replacement that we have. It's baffling how he hasn't appeared in midfield for us.

[Danke bitte 965]

1 minute ago, Petriix said:

Yes, I totally think Sorensen could be the closest thing to a Skipp replacement that we have. It's baffling how he hasn't appeared in midfield for us.

Idah, Cantwell, Placheta and Sorenson all frozen out under Farke. I loved Daniel but he made some odd decisions and we’re now just catching up with their lack of game time. 

[canarybubbles 1,915]

Let's not burden Sorensen with unrealistic expectations. From what I've seen I'm a big fan and think he could possibly be the answer to our DM problem, but let's give him some game time and see how it goes.

[Duncan Edwards 2,223]

Sorensen did really well yesterday and has never let us down wherever he’s been asked to play. However, while the praise coming his way is deserved, I do worry we’re getting a bit ahead of ourselves. Ibrahim Amadou had a great game as a stand-in centre back in the 3-2 against Man City but seem to remember he was pretty awful the next time we saw him.

I’m not suggesting that Sorensen will go the same way, but should he be asked to fill in again on Tuesday, the likes of Ings or Watkins would ask very different questions to an out of sorts Cristiano Ronaldo strutting about and throwing himself on the ground.

The flip side is that it’s easy to argue that a guy deemed very much a squad player in a side bottom of the league put the multi-ballon d’Or winner in his pocket, give him the keys to the city!

I suspect it’s probably somewhere in between. A few more games will tell us more but as I’ve said elsewhere, if we have two specialist centre backs fit on Tuesday, I’d expect them to start over Sorensen. 

Edited December 12, 2021 by Duncan Edwards

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

Sörensen would, in all likelihood, play the defensive midfield role a bit differently to Skipp. Skipp was a good reader of the game, but he was also a tremendous athletic presence, hustling and bustling, looking for tackles, with a splendid engine, then try to get the ball forward with a powerful drive from deep to break a press, then play a simpler ball.

Sörensen looks more like the type that will try to pick the passes off and get ahead of the man it's aimed at, before hitting a longer pass that may not be an assist, but get someone up the pitch faster. He's definitely better in the air than Skipp, so will provide a threat from attacking set-pieces, and a bit more defensive stability in the air on them too.

But he's not got Skipp's pace.
 

[Capt. Pants 4,202]

If Gibbo is available Tuesday then I don't see Sorensen starting. The midfield 3 actually did well, Rupp in particular was outstanding with Kenny and Billy also good. Had Sorensen not already being on the pitch it would have been interesting to see if Jacob would have got the nod before PLM. I like to think he would.

I agree about the comments about him being a bit one paced but he might be deceptive as he didn't strike me as being slow when he played at LB.

[Petriix 2,834]

9 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

If Gibbo is available Tuesday then I don't see Sorensen starting. The midfield 3 actually did well, Rupp in particular was outstanding with Kenny and Billy also good. Had Sorensen not already being on the pitch it would have been interesting to see if Jacob would have got the nod before PLM. I like to think he would.

I agree about the comments about him being a bit one paced but he might be deceptive as he didn't strike me as being slow when he played at LB.

I agree that Rupp was excellent. McLean had some good and some bad moments. Gilmour was pretty poor in the first half and grew into the game at the beginning of the second half, but I'd hardly call his performance 'good'. In my opinion he was our worst player on the pitch until PLM came on. Sorensen would come in for Gilmour for me.

[Christoph Stiepermann 1,131]

I see pro's and con's for playing him at either CB, FB or CM. At CB he's a good defender, a good reader of the game and is excellent at the ball playing side of things but he lacks height and experience, he's good at full back again for a lot of the same reasons but doesn't have the pace to provide the ball carrying outlet we need and in CM he isn't really able cover enough ground (According to the thoughts of people at the club as some journo's have insinuated) to be that ball winning midfielder that we need. 

 

He's such a strange player, on the rare occasion he did play CM last year I though the player he most closely resembled was Vrancic in that although he had a languid style and played at his own pace he always seemed to have more time and space than other players when he got the ball and loved playing through balls, long passes and wasn't afraid to shoot but he can also play as a defender weirdly. It's no wonder no coach has been able to nail down a position for him, he has an unusual mix of strengths.

[Taverham_Ticket 1]

8 hours ago, Petriix said:

I agree that Rupp was excellent. McLean had some good and some bad moments. Gilmour was pretty poor in the first half and grew into the game at the beginning of the second half, but I'd hardly call his performance 'good'. In my opinion he was our worst player on the pitch until PLM came on. Sorensen would come in for Gilmour for me.

This is a poor analysis. Gilmour’s performance was a lot better than you claim. Over the whole game he was one of the best midfielders. 

The spaces he was in weren’t a fluke, they were his ability to float into areas that protected the whole team. He was there to receive the ball free from danger. That is why Man Utd couldn’t create anything. It is not spectacular, it is a level of footballing talent that goes under appreciated .
 

His simple passes that’s seem simple or sideways are not a limitation of his ability, rather it is preference to recycle and wait for better opportunities. Wingbacks, advanced players and strikers lack the intelligence and movement he needs to make those killer passes. That’s not his fault. Just look at this performances for Chelsea and Scotland.  
 

He would always be one of the first names on the team sheet.

[Paul101 93]

13 hours ago, Danke bitte said:

Idah, Cantwell, Placheta and Sorenson all frozen out under Farke. I loved Daniel but he made some odd decisions and we’re now just catching up with their lack of game time. 

Placheta large portions of the fanbase wanted him gone which I found weird as he has huge raw talent but then they love to hate someone

Sorenson is excellent but again raw

Cantwell who knows with him doubt it was just him maybe like Holihan who got frozen out by nearly every manager for a bit

Idah needs to go on loan and play games he must show everything in training but doesnt have the minutes on the clock for the premier league

[canarydan23 4,060]

2 hours ago, Taverham_Ticket said:

rather it is preference to recycle and wait for better opportunities

We're still waiting for them.

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

12 hours ago, Christoph Stiepermann said:

I see pro's and con's for playing him at either CB, FB or CM. At CB he's a good defender, a good reader of the game and is excellent at the ball playing side of things but he lacks height and experience, he's good at full back again for a lot of the same reasons but doesn't have the pace to provide the ball carrying outlet we need and in CM he isn't really able cover enough ground (According to the thoughts of people at the club as some journo's have insinuated) to be that ball winning midfielder that we need. 

 

He's such a strange player, on the rare occasion he did play CM last year I though the player he most closely resembled was Vrancic in that although he had a languid style and played at his own pace he always seemed to have more time and space than other players when he got the ball and loved playing through balls, long passes and wasn't afraid to shoot but he can also play as a defender weirdly. It's no wonder no coach has been able to nail down a position for him, he has an unusual mix of strengths.

You simply mean he's a very balanced, all-round midfielder. Not remotely saying he's our Lothar Matthäus (or if we're going to go Danish, Morten Olsen), but both of those were liberos who started in midfield.

I remember saying in a much earlier thread that the fun thing with Sörensen is working out where he will end up as you could make an argument for anywhere across the defence or midfield line, and even number 10 at a push due to his passing range and ability to find space. But I am increasingly beginning to think libero is his position.

[AJ 1,218]

Sorensen strikes me as the kind of player that probably needs a run of games to get his confidence up, he's certainly a very well composed and articulate footballer, and very versatile because of it. The one thing I can't see him doing is controlling games like Skipp could do last season

[curious yellow 184]

He came to the club before Skipp, he looked to be the natural successor to Tettey but plans were changed. Perhaps Farke thought he wasn't good enough at this level and would never usually even put him on the bench, while playing defenders that weren't fit. Most fans thought he was worth playing but he didn't get the chance. 

His reading of the game and calmness under pressure stood out and, I think, would have bought us extra points at the start of the season when we couldn't defend. He is also useful at set pieces, Gilmour, Rashica and Placheta are all good at delivering and this is where we looked the most dangerous on Saturday. Sorensen's form was the best thing to come from the Man U game but it also showed why Kabak was good enough for Liverpool. 

[Robert N. LiM 4,247]

14 hours ago, Christoph Stiepermann said:

It's no wonder no coach has been able to nail down a position for him, he has an unusual mix of strengths.

Good post. He seems quite an old-fashioned player to me (as did Vrancic). Really good footballing brain, it seems to me, but probably a bit short in the 'metrics' of strength and pace that everyone seems to care about at the moment. They're probably right to care, but I do miss the days when you didn't have to be a monstrous athlete to compete at the top level. Imagine Wes in our 1990s team...

[sonyc 5,492]

8 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Good post. He seems quite an old-fashioned player to me (as did Vrancic). Really good footballing brain, it seems to me, but probably a bit short in the 'metrics' of strength and pace that everyone seems to care about at the moment. They're probably right to care, but I do miss the days when you didn't have to be a monstrous athlete to compete at the top level. Imagine Wes in our 1990s team...dare 

Agree with this. He even reminds me of Martin Peters or dare I say, he has a certain Bobby Moore about him. Just seems to me as a footballer with a brain who is able to buy that extra second in position or anticipating a block, thinking about a pass. 

Hope we see a lot more of him. He's been dropped in to left back, a brief stint in midfield and now at CB. 

Someone said a good year ago that he looked like a proper Norwich City player (Ron O I think?) and I think I know exactly what he meant. 

[pete 318]

On the evidence of just his lengthy introduction he looks composed not a description you can apply to many Norwich midfielders or CB's.  We won't know how good he can be without seeing him over a reasonable time.  With Normann missing it would be criminal not to fit him in as DM next.  Farke has proved to be a flawed genius and had no idea of man management in freezing out so many, maybe Leitner and Drmic were not so bad.  

[Orly 277]

Reads game well, but doesn't have the same engine as Skipp, who was / is lightning over first 2 yards.

[Petriix 2,834]

6 hours ago, Taverham_Ticket said:

This is a poor analysis. Gilmour’s performance was a lot better than you claim. Over the whole game he was one of the best midfielders. 

The spaces he was in weren’t a fluke, they were his ability to float into areas that protected the whole team. He was there to receive the ball free from danger. That is why Man Utd couldn’t create anything. It is not spectacular, it is a level of footballing talent that goes under appreciated .
 

His simple passes that’s seem simple or sideways are not a limitation of his ability, rather it is preference to recycle and wait for better opportunities. Wingbacks, advanced players and strikers lack the intelligence and movement he needs to make those killer passes. That’s not his fault. Just look at this performances for Chelsea and Scotland.  
 

He would always be one of the first names on the team sheet.

I've never questioned his work on the ball. Although he played a number of slightly dubious passes backwards into dangerous positions, I'm more in favour than most of passing sideways and backwards where necessary. I also tend to agree that taking up good positions without actually touching the ball is important, but this is where our views diverge: it's not about what a player generally does, it's about the frequency and severity of when they get it wrong.

There were several occasions in the first half where Gilmour got caught out of position, allowing players to drive into the space in the middle of the pitch. Thankfully these came to nothing as the defence were very good at covering off the danger. Gilmour was by far the worst offender in our midfield while Rupp was pretty much faultless and McLean had just one headless chicken moment that I can recall.

There was a marked improvement in the second half, as if he'd had a bit of a bollocking at halftime. Suddenly he was tracking runs with real energy and generally working much harder defensively. He still needs to learn when to put the boot in and risk giving away a minor foul in a safe area to prevent a more dangerous overload from playing out.

You're not wrong that he's the first name in the team, but that's more an unfortunate reflection of our poor summer transfer business than credit to Billy. He's still a liability and yet to show any significant attacking contribution. I want to see him at least attempting a few early through-balls for Pukki.