canarydan23 4,060 Posted December 13, 2021 1 hour ago, KiwiScot said: All the decisions made matter towards the final result. The farce is only because the last decision is so close to the end we all have a picture of how it should end. That first incident in the overall context further highlights bad decision making. The first incident wasn't bad decision making. Hamilton was forced off the track. If there had been a gravel trap there then Verstappen would have been facing a penalty. If there had been a wall there, Verstappen would have been facing a ban. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SwindonCanary 455 Posted December 13, 2021 FIA wanted a new Diving champion, and by twisting the rules they got it, Hamilton will win next year . Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Load of Squit 5,066 Posted December 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, SwindonCanary said: FIA wanted a new Diving champion, and by twisting the rules they got it, Hamilton will win next year . Tom Daley will be dissapointed. 2 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DannyGirl 7 Posted December 13, 2021 (edited) Lewis was robbed. Geri (Horner) looked gorg. And George is. Who will be first to win an F1 GP George or Lando? My money is on Russell, who will make the most of driving for Mercedes, as he so nearly did once before.  Edited December 13, 2021 by DannyGirl Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ricardo 7,239 Posted December 13, 2021 The excuse seems to be "let them race" and decide it on the track. Well they had raced and one driver was clearly superior throughout. Its the equivalent in football of one team being three goals up with five minutes left only for the ref to award the losing team two penalties just so we can have an exciting finish. There were rules to cover the situation, they weren't followed and new ones made up on the fly to contrive a result. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DannyGirl 7 Posted December 13, 2021 This controversy has virtually been talked up for a week now. Masi duly obliged. He has history. Â Â Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Herman 9,586 Posted December 13, 2021 Are you guys saying that something exciting happened in F1?? Blimey.😀 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiScot 1,418 Posted December 13, 2021 Just now, ricardo said: The excuse seems to be "let them race" and decide it on the track. Well they had raced and one driver was clearly superior throughout. Its the equivalent in football of one team being three goals up with five minutes left only for the ref to award the losing team two penalties just so we can have an exciting finish. There were rules to cover the situation, they weren't followed and new ones made up on the fly to contrive a result. They hadn't finishing racing yet and the football equivalent I don't think exists for a safety car bunching the pack Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiScot 1,418 Posted December 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, canarydan23 said: The first incident wasn't bad decision making. Hamilton was forced off the track. If there had been a gravel trap there then Verstappen would have been facing a penalty. If there had been a wall there, Verstappen would have been facing a ban. 100% was bad decision making. Hamilton left a gap where an agressive move was possible and with the title in the balance Verstappen took it. Clearly if there was a wall or a gravel trap that move would not have been made. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
canarydan23 4,060 Posted December 13, 2021 Just now, KiwiScot said: 100% was bad decision making. Hamilton left a gap where an agressive move was possible and with the title in the balance Verstappen took it. Clearly if there was a wall or a gravel trap that move would not have been made. You've got a lot more faith in Verstappen than I have. Guys a liability. The fact is, Hamilton was off the track because of Verstappen's actions. No way does a driver deserve to earn a place driving like that. No way whatsoever. Think of the precedent that sets. Nerf one up the inside and give the car in front an option of driving off the track or taking a collision and you can earn yourself a position? It'd be the end of racing as we know it. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jim Smith 2,291 Posted December 13, 2021 29 minutes ago, canarydan23 said: You've got a lot more faith in Verstappen than I have. Guys a liability. The fact is, Hamilton was off the track because of Verstappen's actions. No way does a driver deserve to earn a place driving like that. No way whatsoever. Think of the precedent that sets. Nerf one up the inside and give the car in front an option of driving off the track or taking a collision and you can earn yourself a position? It'd be the end of racing as we know it. He also knew Lewis couldn’t risk a collision as if they both went out Verstappen would win the title. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
canarydan23 4,060 Posted December 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, Jim Smith said: He also knew Lewis couldn’t risk a collision as if they both went out Verstappen would win the title. Exactly. Basically, a cheat. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Load of Squit 5,066 Posted December 13, 2021 17 minutes ago, canarydan23 said: Exactly. Basically, a cheat. No, just clever driving, knowing what advantages you have and using them. In 2016 when Hamilton needed to outscore Rosberg he deliberately slowed the race to allow other drivers to catch Rosberg, he was told by his team to speed up but he ignored them, he did what he thought would give him the title, it didn't work but that's what racers do.  Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indy 3,232 Posted December 13, 2021 The first corner…..the rule is you have to make the apex and leave at least a car width on track, reality is he over breaker forcing the guy on the racing line off track, the advantage gained in the run off was given back to the same distance pre Verstappen lunge, that’s what happened. There’s a clear rule that first lap is a free for all, has been all season and not many penalties awarded to cars in the first corner! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indy 3,232 Posted December 13, 2021 1 minute ago, A Load of Squit said: No, just clever driving, knowing what advantages you have and using them. In 2016 when Hamilton needed to outscore Rosberg he deliberately slowed the race to allow other drivers to catch Rosberg, he was told by his team to speed up but he ignored them, he did what he thought would give him the title, it didn't work but that's what racers do.  Absolutely Perez was brilliant in his slowing up of Hamilton all legal and very well done. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ricardo 7,239 Posted December 13, 2021 Just now, Indy said: Absolutely Perez was brilliant in his slowing up of Hamilton all legal and very well done. The argument is not that the drivers did anything illegal but that the race director made up his own rules during the race. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indy 3,232 Posted December 13, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, ricardo said: The argument is not that the drivers did anything illegal but that the race director made up his own rules during the race. Absolutely agree Ricardo, was just making an observation that Lewis had lots to battle with, deserved to win that race after having to deal with not only one Virtual safety car where Verstappen got new hard tyres for free as Perez then held Hamilton up for 12 seconds, then he powered away got the gap back up and was totally robbed as Masi knew by clearing cars and allowing Verstappen on new soft tyres would breeze past Hamilton he knew exactly what he was doing and he should be sacked for it! Edited December 13, 2021 by Indy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
canarydan23 4,060 Posted December 13, 2021 14 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said: No, just clever driving, knowing what advantages you have and using them. In 2016 when Hamilton needed to outscore Rosberg he deliberately slowed the race to allow other drivers to catch Rosberg, he was told by his team to speed up but he ignored them, he did what he thought would give him the title, it didn't work but that's what racers do.  You don't really believe that there is a similarity in slowing the field to push a rival into the clutches of the cars behind and giving a rival an option between crashing or leaving the track. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indy 3,232 Posted December 13, 2021 Of course you also have to ask the question why weren’t those between Saint and Verstappen allowed to clear as then it would have given Sainz the same chance to take on Verstappen! But nope it was a clear breach of sportsmanship bought on by Red Bull. It’s certainly tainted the sport and from what I’ve read, only the Dutch and those involved inside motor racing are not questioning this last lap, even my cousin in Prague couldn’t believe what he saw and he doesn’t watch it! 😂. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
keelansgrandad 6,679 Posted December 13, 2021 I wonder when footballers will get a hand maiden like Hamilton. Using a scooter to go out onto the pitch as the lady runs behind with a bag containing goodness knows what. Attending to the player's needs after he has been tackled etc. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
A Load of Squit 5,066 Posted December 13, 2021 32 minutes ago, canarydan23 said: You don't really believe that there is a similarity in slowing the field to push a rival into the clutches of the cars behind and giving a rival an option between crashing or leaving the track. What makes them similar is that neither were examples of cheating which is what you said.  Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indy 3,232 Posted December 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said: I wonder when footballers will get a hand maiden like Hamilton. Using a scooter to go out onto the pitch as the lady runs behind with a bag containing goodness knows what. Attending to the player's needs after he has been tackled etc. They do don’t they, they’re called WAGS! 😉 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
canarydan23 4,060 Posted December 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said: What makes them similar is that neither were examples of cheating which is what you said.  Forcing a driver to choose between leaving the track or crashing isn't cheating? Had Hamilton re-entered the track as soon as possible, thereby letting Verstappen have the place, it's almost certain he would have been forced to give it back or face a penalty. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newtopia 513 Posted December 13, 2021 8 hours ago, KernowCanary said: Going to be controversial here….. As if Hamilton don’t always get on the wrong side of the stewards decisions anyway, there was an incident at the start of the race in which he hit Max and got let off, he should have been sanctioned for that so this evens things out. Not really, I am not saying I agree, but the stewards basically told Lewis to slow down, for a period to repay the advantage he got by cutting the corner, the issue was that he was nearly half a second faster than Max, so it just slowed how quickly he pulled into a led. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Newtopia 513 Posted December 13, 2021 21 hours ago, KiwiScot said: Congrats Max Verstappen. I wonder how Max feels? Â He is such an aggressive driver he will hate the fact he was completely out performed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiScot 1,418 Posted December 13, 2021 22 minutes ago, Newtopia said: I wonder how Max feels? Â He is such an aggressive driver he will hate the fact he was completely out performed. True champions grind out the result even when not doing well. He's looking forward to next year. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lee Marshall 4 Posted December 15, 2021 Hamilton was robbed on the final lap, that's for sure. The referee should be sacked for that decision with the saftey car. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Well b back 3,140 Posted December 15, 2021 FIA now having an enquiry https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59675264 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KiwiScot 1,418 Posted December 15, 2021 (edited) Just now, Well b back said: FIA now having an enquiry https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59675264 It's nice to have a fall guy while getting free advertising with basically what I'm saying is if it's all very well to play innocent when you have a culture of the wild west decision wise. Edited December 15, 2021 by KiwiScot Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
littleyellowbirdie 2,412 Posted December 17, 2021 On 13/12/2021 at 14:25, Indy said: Of course you also have to ask the question why weren’t those between Saint and Verstappen allowed to clear as then it would have given Sainz the same chance to take on Verstappen! But nope it was a clear breach of sportsmanship bought on by Red Bull. It’s certainly tainted the sport and from what I’ve read, only the Dutch and those involved inside motor racing are not questioning this last lap, even my cousin in Prague couldn’t believe what he saw and he doesn’t watch it! 😂. The Dutch and the closet racists who just plain have it in for Hamilton. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites