****The Official Lapps Match Thread v Spurs (PL) *****

[City 2nd 191]

2 minutes ago, KernowCanary said:

It’s no wonder why the Covid thread on this board will not go away and do one, while on the message boards of most clubs, they are like at least on the second page of the non-football forum.

Its like a distraction towards our poor results and league position, so the thread stays on the top page. If we actually started winning and made a habit of it, most posters would keep away from it and actually talk about the club and not Covid. I personally see moaning about our season a distraction towards talking about Covid.

With all that said, we need some perspective here guys. Matches like today are not the ones we are expected to win in order to survive, they are nice to win, but are just bonuses if we do. It was never winnable from the start and the scoreline proved that.

Its all about beating those teams that we can beat and I for one believe that when those games come along, we have the team to win them. Of course, winning today would have taken off the pressure when those matches come along, but it was never going to be.

Surely there has to be an expectation from every manager that EVERY match is a win expectation!

[chicken 2,604]

41 minutes ago, Fuzzar said:

Unfortunately Skipp demonstrated exactly what we're missing this season. 

A central midfielder worth £30m+ minimum?

[McWrighty 52]

Some plank on Canary call telling us to go for Origi who apparently we could get for £10-£15m 😅🙃

[Block Y Seat 176 80]

13 minutes ago, Virtual reality said:

 

I suppose if Pukki had placed the ball closer to Sargent where he was anticipating rather than away from him we might have had an attempt on goal rather than another stick to beat Sargent with.

[chicken 2,604]

1 minute ago, City 2nd said:

Surely there has to be an expectation from every manager that EVERY match is a win expectation!

No. You'd lose the players pretty fast. Especially after you have that mentality and get multiple goals put past you. That's pretty much what happened to Alex Neil. We can beat anyone... gets stuffed Vs Liverpool because we were far, far too open. 

[Robert N. LiM 4,246]

6 minutes ago, KernowCanary said:

Of course, winning today would have taken off the pressure when those matches come along, but it was never going to be.

I think that's where the frustration lies, though. We had a great chance to take the lead in the first few minutes, and a great chance to equalise shortly after half-time. Of course, we might have still gone on to lose, but we could have got something today, which, as you say, would take a bit of pressure off the games against those we're more directly competing with.

I think when the frustration wears off, people will realise that we played alright today, and certainly were much more competitive than in away games under DF. But ugh, those missed chances at crucial moments...

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

5 minutes ago, chicken said:

A central midfielder worth £30m+ minimum?

Gilmour is probably rated at that kind of money, so it is possible, it’s just his signing has not come off sadly

[Alex 26]

49 minutes ago, WD40 said:

Deans has improved from where Farke got to with these players but the limitations in the squad are clear. Farke had to go but the ultimate outcome will be the same (relegation)

I think the jury is still out on Smith. Yes, the squad isn't fantastic but I am not convinced Dean Smith is all that as he was sacked by Villa after losing 5 in a row with a strong squad.  He would need to be an exceptional manager to keep our squad up and I am not sure he is if I am honest.

Edited December 5, 2021 by Alex

[ricardo 7,348]

Buendia scores for Villa

[Hairy Canary 668]

1 minute ago, Block Y Seat 176 said:

I suppose if Pukki had placed the ball closer to Sargent where he was anticipating rather than away from him we might have had an attempt on goal rather than another stick to beat Sargent with.

Laughable. Pukki wins the ball, holds it up, draws his man and sets up Sargent three yards from goal only for him to totally miskick it and it’s all Pukki’s fault because it’s a fraction misplaced!

This is the PL we are talking about here, you can’t expect better chances than that!

[chicken 2,604]

Perspective:
We're still 3points off Watford in 17th. 6 points from 15th with four teams on 16pts from 12th to 15th.

It could well be a very, very tight season this year. 

[Virtual reality 706]

5 minutes ago, Block Y Seat 176 said:

I suppose if Pukki had placed the ball closer to Sargent where he was anticipating rather than away from him we might have had an attempt on goal rather than another stick to beat Sargent with.

You’re having a laugh. That’s bread and butter to any half decent striker. 

[chicken 2,604]

2 minutes ago, Hank shoots Skyler said:

Gilmour is probably rated at that kind of money, so it is possible, it’s just his signing has not come off sadly

I think whatever Gilmour may be valued at, Skipp is worth more. Right now, Gilmore is not showing that he can impose himself on a game. His passing is meant to be his strength but you wouldn't find a solid argument to say he had a good range of passing at the moment in games. 

[Robert N. LiM 4,246]

Just now, chicken said:

I think whatever Gilmour may be valued at, Skipp is worth more. Right now, Gilmore is not showing that he can impose himself on a game. His passing is meant to be his strength but you wouldn't find a solid argument to say he had a good range of passing at the moment in games. 

The comparison between Skipp and Gilmour today was just cruel.

[Ken Hairy 3,760]

3 minutes ago, chicken said:

Perspective:
We're still 3points off Watford in 17th. 6 points from 15th with four teams on 16pts from 12th to 15th.

It could well be a very, very tight season this year. 

Perspective, 6 points is 60% of the total we've acquired all season, we're unlikely to get those 6 points by the end of the year, whilst those above us will gain further points. 

Unless Newcastle can do something amazing in January I expect the bottom 3 to be the same in May. 

[Foxy2600 297]

Firmly back on the bottom of the EPL with a -23 GD.

says it all really. 
Can Deano sort it ? I would doubt it… 

Skipp just proved what we are missing 

 

[chicken 2,604]

2 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

The comparison between Skipp and Gilmour today was just cruel.

People honestly need to give up on the "Skipp" thing. Clearly Spurs rated him very highly when he came on loan to us, he proved how good he was with us, helped us to promotion.

You'd have to say that he can't be far off the England team now and is worth the vast majority of the money we spent in the summer and he was never available for loan again.

That's all there is to it really. Saying that he was showing us what we don't have... I mean, Kane, Son, Moura... 

[chicken 2,604]

2 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

Perspective, 6 points is 60% of the total we've acquired all season, we're unlikely to get those 6 points by the end of the year, whilst those above us will gain further points. 

Unless Newcastle can do something amazing in January I expect the bottom 3 to be the same in May. 

Then why not not bother following us for the rest of the season and just come back in the summer? 

Perspective, again, 5 games ago we had 2 points. We have since gained 8 points in 5. 5points in the last four games that Smith has overseen. There are 8 teams at least, in the dog fight. In other words we have gained 80% of our points in 1/3 of the games we have played. The most recent games.

[Robert N. LiM 4,246]

5 minutes ago, chicken said:

People honestly need to give up on the "Skipp" thing.

Oh, completely. I just meant in terms of the relative quality of the loans. The Skipp loan was a great deal for all parties. Gilmour's looks as though it's benefitting him and Chelsea, but us, not so much.

[Ken Hairy 3,760]

1 minute ago, chicken said:

Then why not not bother following us for the rest of the season and just come back in the summer? 

 

Nonsense comment chap, of course ill remain hopeful until its mathematically impossible, but you've got to put some realistic glasses on if you're trying to show perspective. 

I massively hope my prediction is wrong and my gambling history shows that's often the case 😂

[Fuzzar 1,702]

15 minutes ago, chicken said:

People honestly need to give up on the "Skipp" thing. Clearly Spurs rated him very highly when he came on loan to us, he proved how good he was with us, helped us to promotion.

You'd have to say that he can't be far off the England team now and is worth the vast majority of the money we spent in the summer and he was never available for loan again.

That's all there is to it really. Saying that he was showing us what we don't have... I mean, Kane, Son, Moura... 

I don't think people are saying we should have got Skipp, as he was obviously not available. 

But that doesn't mean we should have gone into the season without a player with his attributes. That's not Gilmour or Normann. 

[chicken 2,604]

2 minutes ago, Fuzzar said:

I don't think people are saying we should have got Skipp, as he was obviously not available. 

But that doesn't mean we should have gone into the season without a player with his attributes. That's not Gilmour or Normann. 

This too has always baffled me though. He is clearly a player of quality. If you want a player that does what Skipp does, then you buy Skipp. We can't.

Skipp represents a player that is real central midfielder with a bit of steel about him. He can play defensive even though his stature isn't that of a player like Viera or for us Johnson or Tettey. He can pass the ball well, and move and pass the ball well. Almost like Howson but with the tenacity of someone like Ball or Strachan. The more diminutive defensive midfielders. Some might say he is similar to Kante - which is probably true.

But those players are not ten a penny. Hence why they are so valuable. At the moment you have Rice and Philips who play that role for England, both of whom are taller, though Philips is only by an inch. Most other midfielders tend to be more of one than the other or more true CM's - not all rounders like that.

When you look around for the likes of Tettey, Johnson or even old Three Lungs, they often come with limitations on the playing side of their game. Tettey at times was great, but usually, like Three Lungs, understood the limitations of his game and would prefer to shuffle the ball 5yrds to someone who could do better with it. The issue with that is your attacks will often slow down and teams will know to pressure the ball back to a player like that and then close down their options. This happened to Tettey in the PL. 

So you are back to trying to uncover a player that is both affordable, hasn't made the step up yet, but who you hope makes the step up based upon their positive stats.

[Samwam27 519]

7 minutes ago, Fuzzar said:

I don't think people are saying we should have got Skipp, as he was obviously not available. 

But that doesn't mean we should have gone into the season without a player with his attributes. That's not Gilmour or Normann. 

Nor was it Billing, who was another attack minded midfielder. Webber spent best part of summer hoping Skipp might return, his failing was not to have targeted a like minded player with defensive attributes. Gilmour is a complete luxury who isn't adding anything. Normann looks quality on anything we have for deeper lying midfielders, but most NCFC fans expected us to get a CDM (as farke seemingly didn't fancy Sorensen)

Maybe there's a little light at end of said tunnel, as Sorensen has been on bench last few games under Smith, and got on the pitch today. So he must be doing something to get picked and hopefully he's progressing on training pitch as he's now now in the squad. If Rupp can be given a starting berth, then Sorensen might also.   

Feels like Smith is giving starts to several players, but none are really taking their chances

[chicken 2,604]

21 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

Oh, completely. I just meant in terms of the relative quality of the loans. The Skipp loan was a great deal for all parties. Gilmour's looks as though it's benefitting him and Chelsea, but us, not so much.

That's always the gamble. Hope that the player is either amazing enough to carry us to our target and/or beyond. Hope that they are "good enough" as in are an important squad member but not so far ahead that we can realistically expect to sign them if we wanted to or hope that they aren't terrible for us. You could suggest Kane falls into that last column when he came to us. Barnett seemed to think he wasn't that great in training at the time either, certainly nothing to write home about. So as you say, benefitted him and Spurs more, like Gilmore and Chelsea may get more from this.

[TheGunnShow 5,933]

Makes me wonder if Sörensen is making the step up now, or at least has recovered from that shot of long Covid.

[Rock The Boat 1,326]

2 hours ago, Disco Dales Jockstrap said:

LOL! Honestly. You've got to laugh at that otherwise you'll probably end up crying.

I'd love to see our scout's assessment of Sargent's ball control skills.

OTBC

 

Someone commented on a Sargant video compilation that he is totally one-footed. That was a very good call and you have to wonder what the scouts saw that encouraged them to sign him

[chicken 2,604]

25 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

Someone commented on a Sargant video compilation that he is totally one-footed. That was a very good call and you have to wonder what the scouts saw that encouraged them to sign him

It wasn't a "good call". Whether he is one footed or not isn't the issue with Sargent at this point. Nor was it the issue with RVW or Drmic.

The old adage is that even a stopped clock is right twice a day. I wouldn't even call it that.

Hoolahan was one of the most one footed players you'll ever see - wasn't an issue. Some strikers are the same. 

[Ken Hairy 3,760]

I'm not so sure he's even one footed 😉

[ron obvious 1,501]

I know he wasn't on for long, but I saw a glimmer of hope when Jacob came on ...

[chicken 2,604]

1 hour ago, Ken Hairy said:

Nonsense comment chap, of course ill remain hopeful until its mathematically impossible, but you've got to put some realistic glasses on if you're trying to show perspective. 

I massively hope my prediction is wrong and my gambling history shows that's often the case 😂

The nonsense is coming from you because you want to put a negative spin on it. I've merely pointed at facts - you've interpreted them as being "positive" and therefore decided that you think they are unrealistic.

To do that you had to ignore form and the fact that we have gained 8pts in 5 games and look infinitely more at it than we did before Smith. Even today, 3-0 flattered Spurs in that before they went 2-0 up we had two guilt edged chances, one to make it 1-0 (Pukki) and another to make it 1-1 (Idah).

Sadly I see this all the time "I'm not being negative, I'm being realistic" - sorry, no.

Realistic/realism/reality.

The reality is that we are 3pts from 17th. 6 from 12th. The way you and others have expressed yourselves is that we are already relegated and have been for some time. The reality of the situation is that we are far from it, yet. Now, you can put a gloomy slant on that. But I haven't said it'll be easy, or that it's even doable, just that in reality, the situation is not as bad as you are painting it to be. Nor is it the "realistic" perspective.

 

Edited December 5, 2021 by chicken