What a poor window it was

[El Convento 14]

51 minutes ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Williams is a decent player - but with hindsight I wish we had used the Sargent money plus loan option to get a premium quality striker for the season. Lack of goals is what worries me most 

This.  But might have needed to repurpose more cash than that.  Perhaps the Gunn money...

Edited December 2, 2021 by El Convento

[Uncle Fred 526]

I said half what through the window we are having a shocker, I was jumped upon 

we now know once again Fred got it spot on!!!

[Gordon Bennett 780]

It's been said plenty of times but we won't know until May how successful the window was, I certainly wouldn't be writing any players off after so few games. 

[Nuff Said 5,089]

1 hour ago, Duncan Edwards said:

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

I’m now picturing DCB clutching his throat and struggling to breath. 😆

 

[ROBFLECK 132]

Just be fair...only a few of these signings are really good enough for the Premier League ... not moaning, stating facts...you and I can see it week in week out. Best signing : Normann by a mile 

DS has already shown what was needed at management level 

I you think our team is genuine PL material at the moment , I feel you are thinking with your heart and not with your head

Edited December 2, 2021 by ROBFLECK

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

The Vrancic love in is baffling to me. Championship is very much his level. Turns up and plays like prime Zidane for ten games a season and the rest is dead weight. Loved the guy - but time to move on.

Hindsight is a fantastic thing of course. But I can't help but wonder whether we should have looked to buy three or four rather than spread our resources as we did. I agree Sargent has yet to prove himself. Also think Tzolis has been a disappointment. PLM, Kabak and Gilmour can be questioned too. Williams I like what I see from time to time but that lack of consistency hurts.

Normann and Rashica seem decent signings. But like I said it's really easy me sitting here typing this because at the time of their signings, I genuinely thought Williams, Kabak and Gilmour were great signings. 

What I don't get is the noise from the club about wanting height and power. Even Normann, who has shown himself to be pretty strong, has been out muscled at times. 

Still, it's early days in the Dean Smith era. Maybe some of these signings will go on to show their quality. 

[Cantiaci Canary 556]

The biggest error of the last window ...

 

Leaving us with ONE defensive midfielder in the squad (Sorensen).

Normann, Gilmour, Rupp and McLean ain't DMs like Skipp and Tettey were.

 

Where are the destroyers, suffocators and nullifiers???

That and a scorer will surely be on Smith's wish list for Christmas.

[hepphep 175]

1 hour ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Williams is a decent player - but with hindsight I wish we had used the Sargent money plus loan option to get a premium quality striker for the season. Lack of goals is what worries me most 

I am bit curious when reading these wishes of getting quality striker. Is it due thinking that Pukki should be replaced or that we should play with two strikers? Getting another quality EPL striker to sit on bench behind Pukki sounds like hard buy to justify.

When thinking other EPL teams and their main strikers, I'd say that Pukki would be number one striker in most of the clubs. So therefore I see it as it would be someone to hire to warm bench and sub in when we are trailing and switch to two up front. Of course, I'd love to see Salah here but he is more wing forward than striker as well.

[Move Klose 303]

3 hours ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Newcastle was, for me, a game which summed up how had the transfer window was. 

Kabak looked decent on paper but is currently not an upgrade on Hanley or Gibson. 

Normann the exception to the rule. A great signing. We need him back.  Upgrade on ageing Tettey

Sargent seems a total waste of money. He’s young and might develop but nowhere near ready for premiership football. Not an upgrade on hugill - who wasn’t good enough! 

Same with Tzolis who looks raw and in need of a loan- I think Onel would have given us more.

Gilmour is beloved of the media but looks lightweight and ineffective a lot of times. I think leitner was as good had we not alienated him 

Rashica is starting to show quality - but had big boots to fill in Emi. A good player but not an upgrade on what we had last year therefore.

Gunn- cost a pretty penny for a reserve goalkeeper. I think fans would have been outraged if he wasn’t linked to club by his dad. Arguably not an upgrade on Nyland.

PLM- decent signing but championship quality. Not an upgrade on Vrancic - similar quality but less flair. 

Brandon Williams- waste of a loan. We have Gianoullis who is just as good and no striker back up??! 
 

Dean Smith- I was attacked for suggesting Farke had taken us as far as he could, but the change since Smith arrived has proved it. An upgrade 

Bottom line- a very poor window leaving us with little to spend in January but obvious needs in the starting XI. We need another goal scoring striker and another CDM to cover Normann when injured. (As Sorenson can’t buy a game for some reason) 

 

 

 

Most of these signed are an upgrade in terms of quality in what we had. 

Smith wants us hard to beat and felt in his first few games he would go with Hanley and Gibson as they are experienced and have played together. Kabak on paper could be a very good signing, his chance will come.

Rashica is clearly a very good player, a winger that we haven't seen the likes of since Huckerby, Eadie etc.

Tzolis has all the potential but maybe is still a little raw, but the potential is there.

Sargent I agree has a lot to prove and needs to improve quite a lot to cut it at this level but I wouldn't write him off just yet.

 

[Yobocop 1,095]

33 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

I said half what through the window we are having a shocker, I was jumped upon 

we now know once again Fred got it spot on!!!

If spot on now means ‘catastrophically wrong’ then you are bang on lol  

[Nuff Said 5,089]

Can I remind people Sargent is 21, only 12 months older than Idah and was put straight into the first 11. Yes, he has a lot to work on, but cut him a little slack, he is one of our own now.

[Dean Coneys boots 1,398]

44 minutes ago, Robert N. LiM said:

I have seen lot of criticism of our business in the summer, some fair, some a little harsh imo.

What I haven't seen are any convincing suggestions of who we should have bought instead. 

I think it's very likely that the £20 million signings that people have expressed a desire for (with their accompanying wages) simply wouldn't have come to a club who were favourites to go down. I suspect we were in the market for £10 million players for a reason. And if you are in that market, better to buy potential, since the finished article at that price isn't good enough for the Prem. 

That is a fair assessment which, of course, brings us full circle to the real cause of our inability to compete In this division. Our current level of investment under this ownership 

[Dean Coneys boots 1,398]

28 minutes ago, ROBFLECK said:

Just be fair...only a few of these signings are really good enough for the Premier League ... not moaning, stating facts...you and I can see it week in week out. Best signing : Normann by a mile 

DS has already shown what was needed at management level 

I you think our team is genuine PL material at the moment , I feel you are thinking with your heart and not with your head

That was my point really. It was a poor window in that we didn’t really improve on the championship quality of our starting XI

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

I think it is good for the soul to have new threads where posters openly reassess earlier predictions and conclusions, no matter how embarrassing.

In that spirit I would like to confess that the first time I saw Keith O'Neill play I thought we had a future international star on our hands. Not so much.

And that I took Robert Chase at his word when he announced that if Chris Sutton wasn't at Carrow Road for the next season then he wouldn't be either. But to be fair I didn't for a moment believe Bill Clinton when he swore he'd never had s*x with Monica Lewinski...

[Uncle Fred 526]

58 minutes ago, Yobocop said:

If spot on now means ‘catastrophically wrong’ then you are bang on lol  

Binner 

[TIL 1010 4,722]

4 minutes ago, Uncle Fred said:

Binner 

He is actually far closer to being a Hatter.

[Herman 9,713]

3 hours ago, Branston Pickle said:

DCB, your village wants its idiot back….

No we don't. We've been trying to get rid of the **** for years. 😉

[king canary 7,578]

3 hours ago, Robert N. LiM said:

I have seen lot of criticism of our business in the summer, some fair, some a little harsh imo.

What I haven't seen are any convincing suggestions of who we should have bought instead. 

I think it's very likely that the £20 million signings that people have expressed a desire for (with their accompanying wages) simply wouldn't have come to a club who were favourites to go down. I suspect we were in the market for £10 million players for a reason. And if you are in that market, better to buy potential, since the finished article at that price isn't good enough for the Prem. 

I think its very difficult for fans to say who we should or shouldn't have bought as we don't know who is available. 

I do question some areas of this window though- £5m for Gunn when plenty of teams bought in backup keepers for significantly less was a strange choice, along with using our Premier League loan slots to bring in a midfielder who looks lost when his team doesn't dominate the ball and a back up full back. 

 

[Nuff Said 5,089]

23 minutes ago, king canary said:

I think its very difficult for fans to say who we should or shouldn't have bought as we don't know who is available. 

I do question some areas of this window though- £5m for Gunn when plenty of teams bought in backup keepers for significantly less was a strange choice, along with using our Premier League loan slots to bring in a midfielder who looks lost when his team doesn't dominate the ball and a back up full back. 

 

We keep getting this argument trotted out that posters aren’t expert scouts and don’t know who is available as alternatives to the players we did buy.

Which begs the question - they are also not expert coaches or managers, yet they seem to believe they have the knowledge and experience to do better than the professionals at our club - why?

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

30 minutes ago, king canary said:

I do question some areas of this window though- £5m for Gunn when plenty of teams bought in backup keepers for significantly less was a strange choice

He's a bit better than just a back up in fairness, he'll most definitely become our number 1 in the next season or two. 

[pete 318]

Currently and in the future we will buy players we can afford.  And they are young and promising, experience costs and we cannot afford.  Buendia was just one example and it paid off.  We shall need to wait to see if we can produce another Buendia, only time will tell.

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

7 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

Which begs the question - they are also not expert coaches or managers, yet they seem to believe they have the knowledge and experience to do better than the professionals at our club - why?

But being able to lead a team and make proactive decisions is clearly a very different skillset to being able to poke out holes in retrospect.

I would hope that anyone criticising our coaching / management / leadership with the benefit of hindsight would not be arrogant enough to think that they could actually do a better job though sometimes I do wonder... 

[Well b back 3,190]

Not everyone agrees with the op, EDP now changing its opinion.

https://www.edp24.co.uk/sport/norwich-city/david-hannant-ncfc-column-williams-gilmour-8530972

[king canary 7,578]

35 minutes ago, Nuff Said said:

We keep getting this argument trotted out that posters aren’t expert scouts and don’t know who is available as alternatives to the players we did buy.

Which begs the question - they are also not expert coaches or managers, yet they seem to believe they have the knowledge and experience to do better than the professionals at our club - why?

Because if nobody gave their opinion on anything this forum would be pointless?

[king canary 7,578]

28 minutes ago, Hank shoots Skyler said:

He's a bit better than just a back up in fairness, he'll most definitely become our number 1 in the next season or two. 

Maybe- however I don't think spending £5m of a limited (by Premier League standards) on a player who you don't expect to be in the team for 12-24 months isn't a great use of it.

[NCPFC 11]

5 hours ago, hepphep said:

I have to actually disagree. I think many will come good, but as EPL is likely the highest tempo league of all the top leagues, it really takes some time to learn its tricks.

Kabak - Good taking ball forward, and we need ball playing defenders. However, can also take some unnecessary risks due to that. Would not write him off yet, but have to compete really hard for his spot. Of course, question is if we need four central defenders now as Omobamidele has shown he could do it in this level as well. However, we are only one injury away from being in trouble if he would not be here.

Sargent - Having real trouble with finishing and the first touch can be awful. However, his work rate is really important when we are pressing high (which we have often seen lately). He is actually pretty good finding positions off the ball. Currently he is a role player. Sort of improved version of Stiepi and we do need him in team (hard to think who would replace him in pressing if we would not have him). Also in his age, there is good chance that he will improve his weaknesses in years to come as well.

Tzolis - I think Farke was right when he told that he is one that is more to future. He has some flair and eagerness to get to the scoring positions. However, currently it seems that he cannot keep up with tempo that is required in this level. I expect that he was bought more for development and to play some part as sub already and might well fill that slot during season.

Gilmour - I was quite strong critic of his early this season, mainly due to the fact that he didn't seem to be willing to put himself into the game and do backtracking and such. However, my opinion has changed some amount. However, he is not that defensive midfielder that we have in Normann and now that he has to cover that position, he is clearly not playing with his strengths. I think he might prove very useful player when he has Normann to support him.

Rashica - Had a slow start. Once again, adjusting to tempo and requirements of EPL is something that takes time. Good in pressing, very hard working. Now also starts to look real threat when challenging opponents in attacking zone. Main complaint of him is his bad final decision making, often throwing totally useless balls in the box. However, this happens most often when he becomes tired, so I think it is something he is now learning to change in his game and keeps on reverting mostly to it when tired. I think he is already really important player.

Normann - Excellent. One of the most important players we have already. Great long range passing and really excellent defensive positioning. Not just decent EPL player, but really good one. If we can keep him for permanent, it's a steal.

Gunn - Not really impressed of what I've seen from him. Difficulties playing with feet and not very convincing otherwise either. Would be worried how he can manage if Krul would get injured. On the other hand, we have been in same situation before with McGovern so time will tell.

PLM - Not really sure what I think of him. He is sort of all around midfielder who has his moments but not really standing out with anything. I consider him as decent squad player, which is likely what he is meant to be. Does not do much wrong when playing so good in filling the position when required. Even though failed to score from his chance against Newcastle, he did so well to create the chance for himself.

Williams - Young guy who has good and bad days. I think they are quite evenly competing that position with Giannoulis at the moment. I really like his attitude and his fearless thrusts forward. However, he seems pretty limited when we control the ball. But I think quite often we will give possession to opponents and counter press, in which case he is likely better choice than Giannoulis so in that sense he is best option to that position.

Most of them are not some top level EPL players (at least for now) that is for sure. However, most of them have earned their position in starting lineup for a reason. It is really hard to see who would take their position if we would not have them (in most cases). Hiring ready made EPL player who could be considered someone who could step into starting eleven of top 10 teams is extremely hard and expensive. So expensive that it just is out of our budget. We would likely need to pay similar prices for them than what we got for selling Emi. I actually think that mostly the summer window seems like pretty promising for both short and long term. Yes, there are weaknesses on most of the signings, but they are improving and there is reason why most of them is getting big minutes.

 

NCFC needs a ruthless striker and front row. Do we need to hire some of our great ex NCFC' strikers and front row men to coach our current guys? Cause at the moment, NCFC isn't scoring goals. NCFC could've won the last several games if NCFC had an in-form and front row with confidence. You'll get confidence by scoring goals and being coached by some of the best in the business to learn their tricks of the trade will give them the confidence to score the much-needed goals and points to survive.

Practice taking thousands of long throws at the training ground. So when NCFC is awarded a throw-in in an area near the corner flag on match day, our player can lob the ball as far as possible towards the opposition goal, just like a corner but more accurate and use it as a killer set-piece. (try different scenarios to score goals)

I'm surprised Dean Smith didn't do this; If the game isn't going to plan, switch the players and make subs. How many substitutes have scored this season and changed the game and won? Of course, it could go the other way, but it's worth a go. Be brave.
 

[KiwiScot 1,436]

6 hours ago, Nuff Said said:

The players who have just got us 8 points from the last four games?

Yes. We've done well, but it doesn't feel yet like this is the Premier League squad to keep us up yet. Still time for them to improve though.

[TeemuVanBasten 3,327]

8 hours ago, Dean Coneys boots said:

Newcastle was, for me, a game which summed up how had the transfer window was. 

Kabak looked decent on paper but is currently not an upgrade on Hanley or Gibson. 

Stopped reading here, as Kabak didn't feature against Newcastle.

Can I have the number for your drug dealer? 

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

1 hour ago, TeemuVanBasten said:

Stopped reading here, as Kabak didn't feature against Newcastle.

Can I have the number for your drug dealer? 

Why? Do you have a penchant  for IQ  reducing  drugs, as it seems that's  what DCB gets.

[Inch High aka Inchy.. 405]

DCB flip flops as much as our beloved old Wizard used to.

Gawd rest his soul.