Sargent

[Penelope Catchpole 32]

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

[lake district canary 4,531]

4 minutes ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

We won  today in case you hadn't noticed with him playing a big part in that, but don't let me spoil your argument.....

[Nora's Ghost 157]

There is something about the lad that I like and a few decent team performances will bring the best out of him.

 

 

[Rock The Boat 1,324]

59 minutes ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days ofIf  Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

If you want to know how important it is to press our opponents, compare our first half performance to our second half.

[ron obvious 1,498]

1 hour ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

I've only seen him technically deficient on a couple of occasions, once when he missed that open goal & another when a team mate smashed a ball hard at him. His pace is average. I don't think he's generally any worse than the rest.

On the other hand I've seen him get past the opposition with a mixture of strength & skill that few of our team possess. 

Overall I think he's an asset.

[Capt. Pants 4,195]

1 hour ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

Totally nullified their left WB 2nd half resulting him in being yellow carded when he resorted to persistent fouling as he couldn't beat him.

Webber signs the players, not Farke or Smith.

[yellowrider120 761]

21 minutes ago, Capt. Pants said:

Totally nullified their left WB 2nd half resulting him in being yellow carded when he resorted to persistent fouling as he couldn't beat him.

Webber signs the players, not Farke or Smith.

Not true - Webber gives Farke / Smith a list of players who would appear to fit the bill of a player in the position / role required. The final decision is down to the manager. We do not operate (heaven forbid) in an environment where a player simply rolls up to Coney and the manager says ...........'who the hell are you'? To which the reply is..........'I'm your new striker' (or whatever). It doesn't work like that.

However, re Sargent - I totally agree with what you say. Two players were instrumental in that stunning second half improvement. Gilmour and Sargent. The latter was immense with his work rate and commitment. Could be a long way back for the Dereham boy now. 

[Midlands Yellow 3,924]

Just needs a goal now, the confidence will ooze then. I like him and he never hides. 

[The Great Mass Debater 1,076]

When he puts himself about a bit he has a big impact on the games. Looking a bit like Wilbrahamovic at the moment but he offers way more on the right than up front.

When he decides to put in the effort in and we get a full work rate Sargent he really helps the team. I particularly remember when he lost the ball but ran the entire way back to get goal side of him again, which got a round of applause.

Has had a number of games where he has disappeared though. If he can be more consitent then he ha much to offer. 

Any comparison with Craig Mackail-Smith?

[The Great Mass Debater 1,076]

8 minutes ago, yellowrider120 said:

Not true - Webber gives Farke / Smith a list of players who would appear to fit the bill of a player in the position / role required. The final decision is down to the manager. We do not operate (heaven forbid) in an environment where a player simply rolls up to Coney and the manager says ...........'who the hell are you'? To which the reply is..........'I'm your new striker' (or whatever). It doesn't work like that.

However, re Sargent - I totally agree with what you say. Two players were instrumental in that stunning second half improvement. Gilmour and Sargent. The latter was immense with his work rate and commitment. Could be a long way back for the Dereham boy now. 

 

Cantwell needs to get back to basics. He needs to stop believing his own hype that he is the next big thing destined for the top. He strikes me as someone who feels he should be at a bigger club and is superior to his team-mates, and his image is very deliberate, to make him look like he is on another level and Norwich are lucky to have him.

Personally he'd be the player Id miss least if we moved him on.

[Jambomo 215]

I did wonder if he might be better thought of as a wide player or winger, rather than an outright striker. He looks a lot better out wide, his strengths seems to be his running and holding up of the ball but I do agree that he doesn’t seem to be particularly effective in front of goal so far, though it may change as he goes on and gets used to the league. He is still young.

Anyway, I thought he was brilliant today and deserves a lot of praise, he was central to the massive improvement in the second half.

 

[lake district canary 4,531]

Just now, Jambomo said:

I did wonder if he might be better thought of as a wide player or winger, rather than an outright striker. He looks a lot better out wide, his strengths seems to be his running and holding up of the ball but I do agree that he doesn’t seem to be particularly effective in front of goal so far, though it may change as he goes on and gets used to the league.

He and Rashica played exactly the roles they did today at Werder Bremen, with Rashica on the left and Sargent on the right.

[Nora's Ghost 157]

Let the players play and forget the over coaching of the Farke era. First half they were terrified of moving away from the old structure. An encouraging half time talk and they relaxed.

 

They aren't going to run away with the league but for once I feel things are about to improve.

[CornedBeef 7]

He’s our Dirk Kuyt 

[Dr Greenthumb 746]

17 hours ago, TheGunnShow said:

Arguably the best compliment you could give Sargent from a Norwich perspective is that he's a Stiepermann upgrade but on a wing. He's got a fair few similarities to Stiepi, but at a higher level, that willingness to make a complete and utter nuisance of himself, a style of running with the ball that's best described as idiosyncratic, and is decent at carrying the ball forward whilst generally leaving players scattered all over the gaff.

Stiepermann? I’d say Stieps was utilised more centrally and drifted out to the left

[TheGunnShow 5,925]

26 minutes ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

Stiepermann? I’d say Stieps was utilised more centrally and drifted out to the left

That's precisely why I added "but on a wing". Stieps was at number 10, but both he and Sargent have that similar awkwardness when running with the ball. I'll also point out that a fully fit Stieps of the 2018-9 Championship-winning season was pretty good for chasing things down and getting a foot in high up the field. The later one clearly had lost a fair bit due to long Covid and looked more listless.

[Dr Greenthumb 746]

1 minute ago, TheGunnShow said:

That's precisely why I added "but on a wing". Stieps was at number 10, but both he and Sargent have that similar awkwardness when running with the ball. I'll also point out that a fully fit Stieps of the 2018-9 Championship-winning season was pretty good for chasing things down and getting a foot in high up the field. The later one clearly had lost a fair bit due to long Covid and looked more listless.

I think stieps was used more for his passing ability, Sargent is used more for directness. 

[TheGunnShow 5,925]

1 minute ago, Dr Greenthumb said:

I think stieps was used more for his passing ability, Sargent is used more for directness. 

Dunno, Stieps wasn't bad at getting us up the field quickly when he picked the ball up on the half-turn and started rumbling forward. Agree on the passing side, but Stieps wasn't averse to playing a riskier ball than Sargent though.

[Robert N. LiM 4,237]

19 hours ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

I said when we signed him that he reminds me of Dirk Kuyt,

This is a brilliant comparison. Obviously not at Kuyt's level, but a really good way to understand what he could bring to the team 

 

[canarybubbles 1,915]

I have been one of the posters who has been most damning of Sargent, and I've said some pretty harsh things. But if he can put in more performances like yesterday, I will have to admit my assessment of him has been completely wrong.

My lack of tactical nous, probably. In a team sport, you need all sorts of players and skills on the pitch, not just silky ball players.

I just hope he can repeat yesterday's showing on a consistent basis.

[1902 1,167]

21 hours ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

Did you ever actually watch Grant Holt play the game of football? He was technically deficient, sometimes his first touch was shocking. He was also a brilliant player for us because teams found him hard to combat and because he pressed and harassed defensive lines into making their own technical errors.

Sometimes you don't have to have fantastic close control and touch. You need to be a strong workhorse, with a good footballing brain who puts himself about. 

Also, "good at pressing" is not a feature of the game that I associated with RVW. I also would argue if it's the one trait you have, it's the one least likely to make you look like a passenger in modern football.

[BroadstairsR 2,138]

21 hours ago, Penelope Catchpole said:

Sorry, but he looks technically deficient with a poor first touch, and doesn’t have the luxury of pace to compensate. Can we afford to give a place to a player whose only contribution will be to press the opponents?

I don’t know what problem Farke was trying to solve by signing him, unless he was nostalgic for the glory days of Ricky van Wolfswinkel.

Welcome to the forum, Penny, and thanks for that astute contribution.

Talking of glory days, what went wrong at the Stadium of Light yesterday?

 

[Yellow Wal 314]

Remember at 23, with constant training and coaching, his technical ability will improve and certainly his touch will improve.

He already has the appetite and the ability to work hard. I think he will be a big asset to the team.

[kingsway 94]

Sargeants workrate, strength and general attitude were very useful yesterday. Limited ability wise with the ball at his feet but hes surely got improvement in him?

 

That said someone could of been pulled out of the crowd to replace Cantwell and done just as much as the over rated one!

 

Cantwell needs to realise that if he was good as he thought he was, he would have been sold by now, so needs to get his head down and work!

[lake district canary 4,531]

16 minutes ago, Yellow Wal said:

Remember at 23, with constant training and coaching, his technical ability will improve and certainly his touch will improve.

He already has the appetite and the ability to work hard. I think he will be a big asset to the team.

Josh is only 21.

[Bournemouth Mafiosa 0]

On 20/11/2021 at 19:25, TheGunnShow said:

Arguably the best compliment you could give Sargent from a Norwich perspective is that he's a Stiepermann upgrade but on a wing. He's got a fair few similarities to Stiepi, but at a higher level, that willingness to make a complete and utter nuisance of himself, a style of running with the ball that's best described as idiosyncratic, and is decent at carrying the ball forward whilst generally leaving players scattered all over the gaff.

Spot on assessment. JS seems to be everything Cantwell isn’t - humble, hardworking, and a team player. Really looking forward to him honing his skills over the next few games.

[Yellow Wal 314]

2 minutes ago, lake district canary said:

Josh is only 21.

Even better!

[Bluefloyd 58]

Great for him to get a good 45mins under his belt after what would have been a demoralising couple of appearances. I like him and he's a useful player. Confidence is obvs still lacking in front of goal, he had 1 decent chance which he mis-hit, then one where instead of shooting passed to Pukki who appeared to be in a worse position. Would love him to bag one and really kick on. 

[Terminally Yellow 2,448]

On 20/11/2021 at 19:25, TheGunnShow said:

Arguably the best compliment you could give Sargent from a Norwich perspective is that he's a Stiepermann upgrade but on a wing. He's got a fair few similarities to Stiepi, but at a higher level, that willingness to make a complete and utter nuisance of himself, a style of running with the ball that's best described as idiosyncratic, and is decent at carrying the ball forward whilst generally leaving players scattered all over the gaff.

I've never made this connection - but you're totally spot on.

[Six Pack 91]

On 21/11/2021 at 10:21, The Great Mass Debater said:

 

Cantwell needs to get back to basics. He needs to stop believing his own hype that he is the next big thing destined for the top. He strikes me as someone who feels he should be at a bigger club and is superior to his team-mates, and his image is very deliberate, to make him look like he is on another level and Norwich are lucky to have him.

Personally he'd be the player Id miss least if we moved him on.

Believe in his own hype ??!! You kidding me - he scored 6 goals in the Premier League last time we were here ! He's just got back into the team so is lacking match fitness. We all know what his strengths and weaknesses are !

DS put him straight back in when he took over - wasn't because he believed in any hype ! Give DS & Shakespeare a bit of time with him. Just because he's got a little style doesn't make him a bad player. Yes he can press but players like Sargent are a "dollar a dozen" compared to Cantwell.