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Pugin

EPL just a snout-fest around the trough of global TV rights

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Those of us that lived through the glory days of top level football should be very grateful. Saudi involvement draws a line under a time when it was possible to truly love football at the highest level.

There will be many who love the mirage of reflected glory, but none that love the competition itself. It is unloveable.

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2 hours ago, Pugin said:

Those of us that lived through the glory days of top level football should be very grateful. Saudi involvement draws a line under a time when it was possible to truly love football at the highest level.

There will be many who love the mirage of reflected glory, but none that love the competition itself. It is unloveable.

To those that bask in it, reflected glory is not a mirage Pugino, if it were, they would eventually realise it. To them it is real, it makes them feel good about themselves......it is this 'need' that will allow them to get behind pretty much anyone who will fund their 'ambition '.

'We won the league'.......no you fecking didnt, you bought it. 

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A very principled stand from the first 2 posters, but the simple fact is that although money doesn’t guarantee success in the Prem, no money guarantees failure.

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There are huge questions which should rightly re emerge in light of the Newcastle take over . Once again Football ignores the elephant in the room. Money from dubious / immoral sources equals ambition. Money from self funding is roundly mocked by the media . 
 

Im getting quite depressed by all of this . 

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15 minutes ago, Graham Paddons Beard said:

There are huge questions which should rightly re emerge in light of the Newcastle take over . Once again Football ignores the elephant in the room. Money from dubious / immoral sources equals ambition. Money from self funding is roundly mocked by the media . 
 

Im getting quite depressed by all of this . 

That’s the way of the world.  Even when all animals are equal, some will be more equal than others.

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Increasingly, it's not the people's game any more. It's been a plaything for the super-rich for years. All this takeover basically did was highlight the extent to which it has become the case.

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7 hours ago, Pugin said:

Those of us that lived through the glory days of top level football should be very grateful. Saudi involvement draws a line under a time when it was possible to truly love football at the highest level.

There will be many who love the mirage of reflected glory, but none that love the competition itself. It is unloveable.

lol as if this is the part where we crossed the line... that line was crossed years ago!

Now the only way to catch up the rest of the football league would be to better market it and get more people interested in spending money following it. The prem is hardly going to part with its money and there's too much pressure on to stop all 20 clubs competing to be left out from the pot so now the rest need to catch up.

I'd personally love a sort of netflix of football for the football league as I'd probably pick and choose the odd game to watch and maybe pay a subscription for it. Unless that gets sorted it will just get harder and harder to get to and compete in the prem without selling your soul or risking your club going bust.

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On 08/10/2021 at 08:11, Naturalcynic said:

A very principled stand from the first 2 posters, but the simple fact is that although money doesn’t guarantee success in the Prem, no money guarantees failure.

This is different. This level of money does guarantee success. In fact, it could guarantee that Newcastle win absolutely everything. Technically, they could breach FFP by hundreds of millions, suck up the fines and points deductions and still win everything they enter.

Suddenly the biggest clubs in Europe don't win stuff; unless they get bought by a Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk consortium.

This one is a game changer. Liverpool/Man City and the rest cannot compete. They will get a little idea of how clubs like Norwich have been feeling  for the last 25 years and they won't like it.

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4 hours ago, sgncfc said:

This is different. This level of money does guarantee success. In fact, it could guarantee that Newcastle win absolutely everything. Technically, they could breach FFP by hundreds of millions, suck up the fines and points deductions and still win everything they enter.

Suddenly the biggest clubs in Europe don't win stuff; unless they get bought by a Jeff Bezos and Elon Musk consortium.

This one is a game changer. Liverpool/Man City and the rest cannot compete. They will get a little idea of how clubs like Norwich have been feeling  for the last 25 years and they won't like it.

No way this will all happen. The player transfer budget (initially at least) is rumoured to be c£190M. So that gets you just under two Jack Grealish's. Thing is though would he have gone there if this takeover had happened in July? Of course not.

If they make a bid for Salah, Lukaku, Greenwood, Diaz, Mount etc. would any of them jump on the first train? Doubt it. Why go to a  club that could get relegated  and won't be playing any European football next season?

Their best bet is to go for exciting young talent like Bellingham who might see it as a step up. Other than that they will simply buy 'has been's just for the 'name'. I heard Couthino  may be the first. Sure a new manager and a chequebook may push them up the league but the notion that 'silverware is inevitable' (Shay Given yesterday) may well be much harder to achieve than many think. When did the money roll into Man City? Only got to a single, solitary Champions League Final and then they still lost!

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It perhaps won't happen this season, but it will next. Newcastle will win the Premier League in 2022-23. That is inevitable. Or do you think an owner worth £320bn is getting involved not to spend much money? A few big sponsorship deals to increase turnover to the level needed and they will be able to spend £500m next summer, or £600m, or £700m - however much they need to. No one can compete with them.

All of the players you mention will join whoever is prepared to pay them the most.

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I think the days of being cute and selling to survive with our current 'model' in the football future will be a bit of a struggle.... To sell any of our home produced 'rough diamonds' for an exceptional profit to those club's with ridiculous finance and funding, will certainly be a challenge. Whoever we put on the market won't be touted to go to the likes of the top half-dozen Premier League sides, they'll be just hoovering up the prima donna flair players from here and overseas.....That's unless our saleable assets prove they're really exceptional and truly gifted, then we may be lucky......

Although if we're in the Championship and are able to flog a player or two to those sides that are in the nether regions of the Premier league, we might make a tidy profit?....Here's hoping.....    

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4 hours ago, sgncfc said:

It perhaps won't happen this season, but it will next. Newcastle will win the Premier League in 2022-23. That is inevitable. Or do you think an owner worth £320bn is getting involved not to spend much money? A few big sponsorship deals to increase turnover to the level needed and they will be able to spend £500m next summer, or £600m, or £700m - however much they need to. No one can compete with them.

All of the players you mention will join whoever is prepared to pay them the most.

Not sure if you're on a wind up or trying to be serious!.

assume you're happy to put your money where your mouth is? If so I'll wager £100 that your prediction does NOT Happen. I don't want the winnings. Simply agree to the bet and nominate the charity of your choice should you lose. I will do likewise.

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It took three years after the Abu Dhabi takeover of Man City for them to win the PL on the last day of the season so I just can't see Newcastle doing it inside 18 months. 

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1 hour ago, DraytonBoy said:

It took three years after the Abu Dhabi takeover of Man City for them to win the PL on the last day of the season so I just can't see Newcastle doing it inside 18 months. 

I think you're right, but Abramovich's money turned things around at Chelsea pretty promptly. They'd finished 5th, 6th, 6th, 4th and then along came Roman and they instantly went 2nd and reached a Champions League semi-final. They then won back-to-back Premier League titles in the next two seasons. They also reached two more Champions League semi-finals and a final in years 2-5 of the Abramovich era.

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I just wonder what the owners will do if they don't win anything. There is no guarantee they will win even with lots of top players.

Loved watching them under Keegan but they won FA.

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18 hours ago, yellowrider120 said:

Not sure if you're on a wind up or trying to be serious!.

assume you're happy to put your money where your mouth is? If so I'll wager £100 that your prediction does NOT Happen. I don't want the winnings. Simply agree to the bet and nominate the charity of your choice should you lose. I will do likewise.

I agree, all Newcastle have done is ensured they can compete for a top ten finish, with potential of getting a European qualification on a regular basis.  The geographical restrictions, the fact that the big six have a lead on them, means it's going to be a long term project before they get anywhere near competing for the title.  2033 maybe.

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On 09/10/2021 at 21:16, yellowrider120 said:

No way this will all happen. The player transfer budget (initially at least) is rumoured to be c£190M. So that gets you just under two Jack Grealish's. Thing is though would he have gone there if this takeover had happened in July? Of course not.

If they make a bid for Salah, Lukaku, Greenwood, Diaz, Mount etc. would any of them jump on the first train? Doubt it. Why go to a  club that could get relegated  and won't be playing any European football next season?

Their best bet is to go for exciting young talent like Bellingham who might see it as a step up. Other than that they will simply buy 'has been's just for the 'name'. I heard Couthino  may be the first. Sure a new manager and a chequebook may push them up the league but the notion that 'silverware is inevitable' (Shay Given yesterday) may well be much harder to achieve than many think. When did the money roll into Man City? Only got to a single, solitary Champions League Final and then they still lost!

I suspect that they will smash £190 million over the next season or so. It depends on whether they are prepared to flout the FFP regulations in spirit (my guess is that they will be).

  • They could have sponsorship deals with other companies they own a la Man City and then tie the matter up in courts for years, again like Man City.
  • They could sell the ground to another of their companies/ training ground etc.

There are so many ways around this with the EPL version of FFP. They would find it harder in Spain and may struggle a little with UEFA.

Personally, I would enjoy it if the investors like the Liverpool and Man U owners end up with a bloody nose.

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A lot of commentators are saying this is an attempt by Saudi to improve the way people view their human rights record.  I don't understand how, hasn't it just brought their human rights record into the spotlight and reminded people about the murder of Khashoggi and so on ?  Aside from Newcastle fans feeling positive about them (which could change in time - just ask Mike Ashley) is it going to improve their image with anyone else ?

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25 minutes ago, It's Character Forming said:

A lot of commentators are saying this is an attempt by Saudi to improve the way people view their human rights record.  I don't understand how, hasn't it just brought their human rights record into the spotlight and reminded people about the murder of Khashoggi and so on ?  Aside from Newcastle fans feeling positive about them (which could change in time - just ask Mike Ashley) is it going to improve their image with anyone else ?

you would think not spending 300m on Newcastle and maybe 700m+ on transfers/facilities over the next 5 years (random number). Instead spending that 1bn on human rights in Saudi, changing policies and finding a peaceful resolution in Yemen. Would have more impacting on improving their image. 

Personally I don't think these people care about their image, but more so want publicity about their wealth and power.

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The Premier League was created for money and the purchase of Newcastle is a continuation of that. I don't understand the outcry as the league has been going since 1992 and nothing fundamentally has changed, except that it gets bigger and bigger. 

Will Newcastle succeed? Maybe, maybe not, but essentially they have nothing to lose as they haven't won anything for decades. Bruce will get a huge pay-off and the fans are happy. Let's see what happens next. 

 

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3 hours ago, Baracouda said:

you would think not spending 300m on Newcastle and maybe 700m+ on transfers/facilities over the next 5 years (random number). Instead spending that 1bn on human rights in Saudi, changing policies and finding a peaceful resolution in Yemen. Would have more impacting on improving their image. 

Personally I don't think these people care about their image, but more so want publicity about their wealth and power.

It would cost a lot more than a billion to sort out the situation in Yemen and that implies that sorting out isn't just the Saudis finding a way to screw over the Iranians (not that that only goes one way but still). 

Newcastle won't take 12 years to win the premier league, that's clearly rubbish. It also won't happen in 18 months. Ultimately there are only a few players capable of propelling you up to the title, and most of them are owned by the direct rivals of Newcastle. It will take 4 or 5 years probably, by then the revolving door of ageing players and new blood coming in, plus a few seasons of investment will see them win it.

The league's a lot more competitive than when Chelsea did it, and they were far from useless to begin with. Whereas Newcastle are terrible at the moment.

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5 hours ago, 1902 said:

It would cost a lot more than a billion to sort out the situation in Yemen and that implies that sorting out isn't just the Saudis finding a way to screw over the Iranians (not that that only goes one way but still). 

Newcastle won't take 12 years to win the premier league, that's clearly rubbish. It also won't happen in 18 months. Ultimately there are only a few players capable of propelling you up to the title, and most of them are owned by the direct rivals of Newcastle. It will take 4 or 5 years probably, by then the revolving door of ageing players and new blood coming in, plus a few seasons of investment will see them win it.

The league's a lot more competitive than when Chelsea did it, and they were far from useless to begin with. Whereas Newcastle are terrible at the moment.

I think this may be why Potter is in the frame, wasn't Mark Hughes ( relying on my brain, not Google, so high chance I'm wrong) Man City's first manager after  the Money came? Young,upcoming,,seemingly  tactically  astute , yet easily disposed of ..... to see through  the progression  until the job becomes ' too big ' and can attract a ' bigger name'  manager,  who,  in turn,  along with dosh,  can attract ' bigger players'. 

 

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On 10/10/2021 at 19:29, keelansgrandad said:

I just wonder what the owners will do if they don't win anything. There is no guarantee they will win even with lots of top players.

Loved watching them under Keegan but they won FA.

FA Cup? 

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On 08/10/2021 at 13:41, robert choice said:

I'm still enjoying the EFL highlights on Quest watching the likes of Barrow and Cambridge playing for pride.

I am passing on our away days in order to go to the Abbey Stadium. 

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