How many games before we have to ask...

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,748]

5 minutes ago, Commonsense said:

No you’re wrong. Quite clearly it’s you!!

For asking a question?

I've merely proposed it...for debate, without giving any answer. So what am I 'wrong' about?

...please dont be one of them too

...unless you actually are

....are you?

 

Edited September 11, 2021 by GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary

[sonyc 5,511]

6 hours ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

Or you could answer the queston

I did. I suggested some more patience. There are loads of areas for improvement....our play from the back, the midfield mix, the number of chances we're creating, the final ball, Pukki's form, the timing of subs, the starting line up. Lots of concerns. The point I'm making is that suggesting another manager after playing the four teams we have is an over-reaction. I'm not averse to criticism of tactics or our performances. It's dispiriting to lose games the way we are at the moment. Your argument for considering change would hold more weight for me after a lot more games and after we see how we fare against more of the teams around us.

You could argue we deserved a point against Leicester and today. We have competed.

We've blooded more young players. We try and play decent entertaining football. We've spent more in a season than I've known in my supporting days.

We've developed the infrastructure, the whole management structure, the financial base. It's a question now of seeing how all of this pans out.

We have an honest coach in DF. He's not perfect but nor is anyone. It's an over-emotional reaction in my opinion after another disappointing loss. I hate losing probably as much as you do. But now is not the time to be calling for new management (imho). It's the time to wait and see how the team begins to take shape. Next week is the start of the season for me. I might have hoped for 1 point if I'm being realistic from those 4 games. 

Win next week and I think we ought to be out of the bottom 3. I know it's a worrying time but I'm holding on for now. We need 10 points by the 10th or 11th game. 

[Sideshow Tim 110]

I've never been a Farke fan at this level, but with the investment, the depth in the squad this season and the performances (especially in the past 2 games) we are not in a bad position, especially when you look at the league after 4 games. 

We all moaned about out first 4 games when the fixtures were released.

The season starts now. If after 10 games we are still in this position then who would take over?? Big Sam??

Be careful what you wish for!! 

[non-scoring strikers 113]

12 hours ago, Hardhouse44 said:

It’s not about today really. It’s about this season and the last premiership season. It’s about being toothless, naive, the fact we can’t keep a clean sheet. The selections, the substitutions the constant records of failure at this level that we rack up. It’s about confidence, momentum,    being lightweight and frankly about can the guy change anything enough to arrest what could possibly be even worse than last time.

you can level it all at the Club the owners or to Farke but it has to stop soon or we’re going to become the worst premiership club ever!

100% this. 

We have such an inferiority complex at this level. 

[Herman 9,754]

Thank you @sonyc and @Sideshow Tim for a bit of calm thinking and sense on this thread.👍

[BroadstairsR 2,161]

First and foremost, any frustration from the results so far and any suggestion of change at the top is to refute our yo-yo status.

I do not, and see it as having the best of both worlds. A taste of being the top dog in the Championship alternating with a meal at the top table.

There's also a regular parachute income. Yummy!

We have, as a self-sustaining club, managed to create our own little niche in a corner of a field dominated by multi-millions. 

Some want us to be owned by a billionaire. They could be on the right track, but it's along, long shot. 

Of course, we would all like a pro-longed stay up there, and it gets frustrating and slightly humiliating when we cannot achieve this seemingly as a matter of course. Being constantly dismissed by the punditry gets to  you after all. 

Lots of our detractors, and there is much churlishness and glee down the road, would swap our current status at the drop of a hat, we play the role of also-rans so well. The travails of the likes of Derby, Forest, Wednesday etc. when brought into focus belie the fact that this thinking is just 'Lil 'ol Norwich.' 

At the very least we are always there with a chance of demolishing a big boy, to say nothing of the fact that we could well pull a surprise anytime by climbing that table, sooner rather than later.

I'm reasonably happy the way things are. Not 100%, what football supporter ever is? The talent in our young squad, the youth we started at the Emirates yesterday indicates a massive positive surely? Farke is fundamental to that, and I remember times when we could never dream of such a luxury.

I certainly wouldn't want to lose Farke whatever. I love the man.

We could also do with the rub of the green occasionally. Arsenal had it yesterday, although the result was fair.

Edited September 12, 2021 by BroadstairsR

[komakino 272]

While we all want to see things improve, I can't see anything so far that will suggest that we will stay in the EPL. 

We do not carry the momentum through from The Championship and that is the most important thing for any side that gets promoted to the EPL. Our starting XI is arguably weaker than last season. 

Some fans think its fine to get promoted one season and then get relegated this next, but this simply is not good enough. You need to stay there and tough decisions have to be made. 

One scenario is getting rid fo Farke. He'e shown he is an excellent Championship manager, but there facts currently are that he is out of his depth with the squad/s he has had. He hasn't got enough quality players to play his type of football, so do you get someone in who can 'do a job' with limited resources? Lambert was probably the last manager we had in this respect. 

I'm not advocating we sack Farke - yet - but no manager can have a free pass if the results are not forthcoming. I want us to stay in this league and the club should do whatever it takes to stay there. 

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,813]

16 hours ago, sonyc said:

This opening post is one of the top reasons it's best to stay away from this forum after a disappointing result.

Yeah, this. After the Man City and Arsenal games, I think I popped on here on the Saturday evening for about two minutes, read the thread titles, opened one or two, and left again.

But knee jerk reactions are part and parcel of football. Giannoulis was the second coming after a decent-but-not-brilliant performance against Liverpool, and then ready for the scrap heap after Man City.

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,813]

And in answer to the question posed in the opening post, I'd give him another 34.

Progress isn't linear and we're clearly making lots of it under Farke and this structure, so I'd definitely continue it even if we went down. If we sacked Farke and went down anyway, we'd be up **** creek. We'd be there without a paddle if Webber left as well.

[cambridgeshire canary 6,705]

2 minutes ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

And in answer to the question posed in the opening post, I'd give him another 34.

Progress isn't linear and we're clearly making lots of it under Farke and this structure, so I'd definitely continue it even if we went down. If we sacked Farke and went down anyway, we'd be up **** creek. We'd be there without a paddle if Webber left as well.

Given Farke has said he would not take 17th this season and that he would view finishig  17th as a failure I do feel that should we go down and Webber leaves Farke will be leaving too. By then he would have known he's done all he could with us and it's still not worked.

[Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man 3,813]

4 minutes ago, cambridgeshire canary said:

Given Farke has said he would not take 17th this season and that he would view finishig  17th as a failure I do feel that should we go down and Webber leaves Farke will be leaving too. By then he would have known he's done all he could with us and it's still not worked.

We can cross that bridge if it comes to it.

Farke has always been adamant that he doesn't break contracts, and if we go down again, he may become less palatable for bigger clubs anyway.

But then again, if a Bundesliga side came in for him and he wanted to leave, then he'd go with my blessing and gratitude for what he's done here.

It would leave us in a tricky situation though unless we can find a new DS and/or head coach to work miracles like Webber and Farke have done.

[Wardogz 72]

We expected to lose the first 4 games, we lost the 4 games. It's going to plan. 

We'll beat Watford and then the season starts

[Herman 9,754]

17 minutes ago, Wardogz said:

We expected to lose the first 4 games, we lost the 4 games. It's going to plan. 

We'll beat Watford and then the season starts

Rather "amusing" that those that adamantly predicted we'll lose those games are now also very upset that we lost those games. Ho hum. Let's beat Watford hopefully and see where we go from there.

[komakino 272]

4 hours ago, Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man said:

We can cross that bridge if it comes to it.

Farke has always been adamant that he doesn't break contracts, and if we go down again, he may become less palatable for bigger clubs anyway.

But then again, if a Bundesliga side came in for him and he wanted to leave, then he'd go with my blessing and gratitude for what he's done here.

It would leave us in a tricky situation though unless we can find a new DS and/or head coach to work miracles like Webber and Farke have done.

That could go either way, though the likelihood would be that the self funding model would be on borrowed time.

Realistically if Farke cannot take us any further, then it is his own interest to move on. If he had a decent budget at a bigger club, then who knows what he could achieve? I've often felt Farke's style is beyond the quality of our squad, so it would be very interesting to see what he could do elsewhere. 

[keelansgrandad 6,679]

21 hours ago, ricardo said:

I expect Farke to be here next season to pilot us to a third Championship title.

I think that is spot on. Top 24.

[komakino 272]

26 minutes ago, keelansgrandad said:

I think that is spot on. Top 24.

Would not make any sense for him, career wise. He would be in a Hamster Wheel.

[yellowrider120 762]

33 minutes ago, komakino said:

Would not make any sense for him, career wise. He would be in a Hamster Wheel.

Exactly - only way Farke will be here next season is if he keeps us up. Forget the fanciful notion about ........'not breaking a contract'.

If he left to take up an offer back in The Fatherland and it coincided with us 'wanting to make a change' it would simply get dressed up as 'by mutual agreement'.  

It's simply not realistic to see a THIRD promotion under same manager.  

[nutty nigel 7,528]

1 hour ago, keelansgrandad said:

I think that is spot on. Top 24.

Why do you people write us off after 4 games?

I could understand the young uns doing it but you and @ricardo have been around the block enough times to know its foolhardy 🙃

[Ken Hairy 3,771]

31 minutes ago, yellowrider120 said:

Exactly - only way Farke will be here next season is if he keeps us up. Forget the fanciful notion about ........'not breaking a contract'.

If he left to take up an offer back in The Fatherland and it coincided with us 'wanting to make a change' it would simply get dressed up as 'by mutual agreement'.  

It's simply not realistic to see a THIRD promotion under same manager.  

Got to be honest, if we fail miserably again this time, would there even be an appetite to watch us have a 3rd go under this regime? 

As much as I love Farke, and still will do if we go down again, for me that would time to try another approach under someone else, and I think Farke himself would be wanting a different challenge. 

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,748]

6 minutes ago, Ken Hairy said:

Got to be honest, if we fail miserably again this time, would there even be an appetite to watch us have a 3rd go under this regime? 

As much as I love Farke, and still will do if we go down again, for me that would time to try another approach under someone else, and I think Farke himself would be wanting a different challenge. 

Well if you had to try a third time, the manager who had won the league the two previous times of being there would be as safe a bet as any.

...however I think another relegation would fairly unanimously confirn that the 'self funded model' may be able to get you up...but it won't keep you up

[Ken Hairy 3,771]

7 minutes ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

Well if you had to try a third time, the manager who had won the league the two previous times of being there would be as safe a bet as any.

...however I think another relegation would fairly unanimously confirn that the 'self funded model' may be able to get you up...but it won't keep you up

It's not so much that I wouldn't think he'd get us back up again, it's more wouldn't want a 3rd attempt with the same guy should we get back up. Ideally I'd say let Farke get us back up but then look elsewhere, but that's never going to happen. 

[Essjayess 307]

23 hours ago, ricardo said:

I expect Farke to be here next season to pilot us to a third Championship title.

Agree with is.

My own thinking is look at the summer  transfer window...did we just release 1 or 2 guys and bring in 1 or 2 to fill a small gap here or there? It was by far the biggest overhaul of players going in both directions than any other Prem club excluding youth / academy etc..it has been the 2nd big change around since DF and SW came in to the club...by necessity the first one was aligned to the financial  needs at the time hence cheap but decent players who were good enough to get us Champs title.

This second big  change of players is an upgrade on the first but bought at an extremely challenging time, right at the start of a new Prem season where there is zero charity time to get all the new guys playing, gelling,  being accustomed to the Prem etc. DF first time around spoke of needing a miracle to stay up , this time hes said theres a chance...personally i think that chance is slim, i tuly think  it will take 10-15 or more games to find a first eleven that  has gelled and then somehow gained some confidence / momentum to start picking up regular points...by then we will be to far behind to catch up.

But that does not  bother me, i think the real hard moment will come in somehow trying to keep Normann and Kabak here if we are relegated, im sure without those two we will be  to good for the Champs and expect promotion again..then next time hopefully  will have a team whove been together and can really give the Prem a good go from day one, but would likely be better if Normann / Kabak  stayed.

[Carra Rud 17]

Exactly

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,748]

*bump*

Well either these players aren't good enough for this level or Farke isn't or both.

Farke has to come up with something to STOP US LOSING PREMIER LEAGUE FOOTBALL MATCHES, to prove that he at least has something about him in Premier League terms

He has to stop the rot by whatever means necessary and for my money we have to work on 3 at the back this week in preparation for Everton away...and we can start by using the Liverpool cup match as practice. It will be better than any training drill we could do at Colney this week

Thus cant go on week in week out. No manager could surely survive once it gets to 7,8 or 9 defeats on the spin

[Tumbleweed 106]

I think you have your answer GJL. Its 5. According to many, the season started today. Well, what a start. DF is turning the club into a PL embarrasment. He has done great things here, but surely looks as though he has topped out. Once things get to this stage, our historic lack of decisiveness at managerial change has too often ended in an acrimonious downward spiral where hope outweighs hard facts. I just hope it doesn't go that way and his legacy is positive rather than hughton-esque.

[Ken Hairy 3,771]

Don't panic, the season starts at Everton 😁😁😁

[Virtual reality 707]

On 12/09/2021 at 01:14, Sideshow Tim said:

I've never been a Farke fan at this level, but with the investment, the depth in the squad this season and the performances (especially in the past 2 games) we are not in a bad position, especially when you look at the league after 4 games. 

We all moaned about out first 4 games when the fixtures were released.

The season starts now. If after 10 games we are still in this position then who would take over?? Big Sam??

Be careful what you wish for!! 

Who’s wishing for big Sam? I’d have thought Eddie Howe is more likely 

[GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary 1,748]

On 12/09/2021 at 00:12, Commonsense said:

No you’re wrong. Quite clearly it’s you!!

Still want to call me an idiot tonight?....or have you actually got something to contribute

[Sideshow Tim 110]

2 hours ago, Virtual reality said:

Who’s wishing for big Sam? I’d have thought Eddie Howe is more likely 

What makes you think he would come here? He turned down Celtic and does not wish to work with a Director of football! 

[Commonsense 620]

4 hours ago, GJL Mid-Norfolk Canary said:

Still want to call me an idiot tonight?....or have you actually got something to contribute

Yup. Though since I was quoting you I think it was actually f*cking idiot.