All In Bed Together

[A Load of Squit 5,135]

15 minutes ago, Big Vince said:

There are limits as to how far you can go with capitalism and socialism.

You cannot for instance be sub-contracting the armed services or the intelligence agencies to private companies because the defence of the realm has to be the number one priority for any elected government and people expect that elected ministers will act in the best interests of the whole nation in protecting it. Only a government has the resources to mobilise a whole nation. War strategy is a matter for a select few acting on behalf of a great many. When every man, woman and child is under threat for their very existence you cannot have state secrets and sensitive information being held by private companies. If Hitler was going to invade and a private company was beholden to its shareholders or its balance sheet as to whether it would be bothered to stop Hitler, then you can imagine the public outcry. Governments necessarily rack up a large debt in wartime because you can't put a price on freedom. 

Socialism goes too far when you have tax payers supporting jobs in the coal-mining sector. If the mines are not economically viable then they should be closed. It is not the responsibility of every tax payer to support coal mining communities. Why should they? Miners are not indispensable. They don't have a god-given right to a job just like no one else has. The same applies to steel workers, shipyard workers and all the other heavy industries that became economically unviable by the 1980s. 

We've just had two examples of the current Government supporting jobs in the car industry.

Some of the mines that were closed by the Thatcher government were still viable.

 

[Big Vince 318]

4 minutes ago, A Load of Squit said:

We've just had two examples of the current Government supporting jobs in the car industry.

Some of the mines that were closed by the Thatcher government were still viable.

 

Well, Johnson is the reddest Conservative in living memory.

Thatcher and Scargill were out to defeat each other. Downing Street was on a war footing. It wasn't just an industrial dispute. It was about who governed Britain - the miners or the elected government.

[Beefy is a legend 224]

On 22/08/2021 at 08:15, dylanisabaddog said:

That is the biggest issue and it's a cause for concern on a wider level. It should be possible for a very small well run club to survive in the top division on merit and in fact that was possible until relatively recently. Personally I don't want my club to be a toy for a billionaire of any nationality but the sad fact is that's it's probably impossible to survive without that sort of backing. Unless you're Manchester United. And whether we want it or not, we're not going to get it. The current owners won't sell and they don't have to. 

Ok but someone needs to explain how we stayed up for two seasons a decade ago.

[Big Vince 318]

3 minutes ago, Beefy is a legend said:

Ok but someone needs to explain how we stayed up for two seasons a decade ago.

The talismanic qualities of Grant Holt. End of.

We've never had that kind of player since.

[dylanisabaddog 4,876]

1 hour ago, Big Vince said:

Well, Johnson is the reddest Conservative in living memory.

Thatcher and Scargill were out to defeat each other. Downing Street was on a war footing. It wasn't just an industrial dispute. It was about who governed Britain - the miners or the elected government.

That's absolutely laughable. The only reason you think Johnson is moderate is because he says what his wife tells him to. He is not intelligent enough to have his own political views. 

[Beefy is a legend 224]

On 23/08/2021 at 13:22, Big Vince said:

The talismanic qualities of Grant Holt. End of.

We've never had that kind of player since.

In other words, we recruited well.

It can be done. It has been. We can do it again.

By the way, in the second season we stayed up under Hughton, Grant Holt scored 8 goals. A solid contribution but I couldn't pin our survival on him alone. Snodgrass scored 6, Pilkington 5. The defence did well that year. 

[Jersey Canary 143]

On 23/08/2021 at 13:00, A Load of Squit said:

We've just had two examples of the current Government supporting jobs in the car industry.

Some of the mines that were closed by the Thatcher government were still viable.

 

The funny thing is Labour shut many more mines than Maggie ever did. 

[A Load of Squit 5,135]

29 minutes ago, Jersey Canary said:

The funny thing is Labour shut many more mines than Maggie ever did. 

Yes, but they shut mines that were not viable anymore.

[BobLoz3 492]

On 22/08/2021 at 06:47, Big Vince said:

As nobody connected with the club wants to be in this league, is it any surprise the players went out and delivered the kind of performance we saw yesterday?

The fans don't want to be in this league because you get people coming on here stating as much and accusing the league of being plastic and admitting they are only here for a tour of the grounds, etc.

The board don't want to be in this league because they are led by the fans and they are only here to pick up the broadcasting cash to keep the self-funding model ticking over nicely with a soft landing back in the Championship. And everyone at the club knows the goal is top 26, not top 17.

Webber is not bothered whether they are in this league or not because he is working to top 26, not top 17 and, personally, if it weren't for Covid he would be off by the end of the season anyway. The guy is just marking time here.

Farke is not bothered about the EPL because he's got his 4 year contract now and he has stated over and over that the Socialists have practically given him the safest job in Europe and he too knows the goal is top 26, not top 17.

The players are not bothered about being in this league because they take their cues from all of the above and they still get paid the same money every week. So why should they bust a gut to play for the shirt by closing down every player and every space?

So as you can see, the relationship between all of the above is extremely incestuous at Norwich. They are all in the same bed at the same time.

The result? All the national pundits and opposition fans are saying the same things about how easy Norwich are, how they are there for the taking, tactically naive, not learnt anything from two years ago, no signings with EPL experience, etc. Even pundits closer to home are saying these things, eg. Iwan and Dion. Norwich City are quickly becoming a national laughing stock. The numpty club. You try the same things over and over expecting a different result. In fact, every opposition fan is now desperately checking the fixture list to see when they can bank the 6 points against Norwich. Along come Norwich, etc.

The fact is, it doesn't matter who they sign between now and the close of the window. It won't make any difference because the rot is to do with attitude not personnel. Norwich City are in the most competitive league in the world, but they run up the white flag before every fixture by deciding, collectively as a club, that they will not compete. After all, they've got their principles. 

They're all too cosy. What is really needed now is a big man who is going to shake up the club. And to start off by getting those Championship/L1 fans on the transfer list. Everything else should then take care of itself.

Let's face it. So long as Norwich are ahead of Ipswich on the league ladder, that is all the fans are bothered about. If Norwich were in the Bananarama league and Ipswich were in the Bananarama league south, then that would be good enough for around here.

Well, Vincey lad, the aim has been repeated over and over again and it ISN'T to remain a "top 26 team" now but to establish ourselves as a Prem side. 

Which is what I'm happy to let them get on with. 

Nice one. 

[Rock The Boat 1,326]

On 23/08/2021 at 10:37, Badger said:

I have a great deal of time for friendly societies and other forms of "early"* socialism, along with things like the co-operative movement. However, you are naïve if you think that they provided anything like universal cover: they were a patchwork covering some areas and not others and often depended, understandably, on trades union membership, which I am surprised you support. In other cases, they provided benefits to the worker, but not to his family. TBH, I don't know enough about my great grandfather to know if he was a union member and a friendly society subscriber. It is possible that he made "bad economic choices:" if this was the case are you saying that it is therefore appropriate that his wife and six children should be denied healthcare because of his poor choices?

There is little evidence to support this. There was very little private provision available before the NHS. There was a hotchpotch of worker and mutual provision, charitable provision and state provision. It was not universal and left many millions without access. There were some private doctors and hospitals but there was was not a competitive free market in health provision for the vast majority of the population.

If the private sector would make better provision, why don't the govt subcontract out the police, courts and the army to private companies though? They have done it with large sectors of the health service and the prison system, for example. If they truly believed that the market makes better provision they contract it out as they have in other areas of public provision? If we lose a war or crime goes up too much we could ditch one provider and go to Serco or another private provider. I think that it is because they know that provision by private companies would be inadequate.

I too, like the concept of friendly societies. One big advantage they have over socialised provision is that they provide a leverage to the end user by dint of the weight of their economic size, so providers have to compete on price and quality, something that doesn't happen with socialised provision. Continental Europe today has something very similar to the old friendly societies.

Back in your great-grandfathers time, most financial institutions were far more basic than what exists today, so I'm sure that if friendly societies existed today they would be providing a far more comprehensive range of services than what was on offer one hundred years ago.

[Red_Spartan 18]

The strange thing about friendly societies is that they operated to support those that the 'capitalist ' banks would not.

[wcorkcanary 4,329]

On 23/08/2021 at 13:00, A Load of Squit said:

We've just had two examples of the current Government supporting jobs in the car industry.

Some of the mines that were closed by the Thatcher government were still viable.

 

Facts, who needs em?

[CirclePoint 200]

On 22/08/2021 at 00:47, Big Vince said:

As nobody connected with the club wants to be in this league, is it any surprise the players went out and delivered the kind of performance we saw yesterday?

The fans don't want to be in this league because you get people coming on here stating as much and accusing the league of being plastic and admitting they are only here for a tour of the grounds, etc.

The board don't want to be in this league because they are led by the fans and they are only here to pick up the broadcasting cash to keep the self-funding model ticking over nicely with a soft landing back in the Championship. And everyone at the club knows the goal is top 26, not top 17.

Webber is not bothered whether they are in this league or not because he is working to top 26, not top 17 and, personally, if it weren't for Covid he would be off by the end of the season anyway. The guy is just marking time here.

Farke is not bothered about the EPL because he's got his 4 year contract now and he has stated over and over that the Socialists have practically given him the safest job in Europe and he too knows the goal is top 26, not top 17.

The players are not bothered about being in this league because they take their cues from all of the above and they still get paid the same money every week. So why should they bust a gut to play for the shirt by closing down every player and every space?

So as you can see, the relationship between all of the above is extremely incestuous at Norwich. They are all in the same bed at the same time.

The result? All the national pundits and opposition fans are saying the same things about how easy Norwich are, how they are there for the taking, tactically naive, not learnt anything from two years ago, no signings with EPL experience, etc. Even pundits closer to home are saying these things, eg. Iwan and Dion. Norwich City are quickly becoming a national laughing stock. The numpty club. You try the same things over and over expecting a different result. In fact, every opposition fan is now desperately checking the fixture list to see when they can bank the 6 points against Norwich. Along come Norwich, etc.

The fact is, it doesn't matter who they sign between now and the close of the window. It won't make any difference because the rot is to do with attitude not personnel. Norwich City are in the most competitive league in the world, but they run up the white flag before every fixture by deciding, collectively as a club, that they will not compete. After all, they've got their principles. 

They're all too cosy. What is really needed now is a big man who is going to shake up the club. And to start off by getting those Championship/L1 fans on the transfer list. Everything else should then take care of itself.

Let's face it. So long as Norwich are ahead of Ipswich on the league ladder, that is all the fans are bothered about. If Norwich were in the Bananarama league and Ipswich were in the Bananarama league south, then that would be good enough for around here.

C-

Although you’ve managed to reprise and thread together a few common points of angst, you’ve done so with a solid  lack of any real creativity or insightfulness. Your writing comes across as desperate for attention, soft on it’s delivery and simply lacking in anything substantively worthy of real discussion - which is probably something your wife has been trying to tell you for the past decade or two 😜)

Do try harder……or is this really your best?

Edited August 25, 2021 by CirclePoint